Det/Min

[revprodeji]

**I personally think that MN is waiting for the FA PF to drop and then will trade Al to one of the teams that cleared cap but missed out on the FA PF**

This trade is done with the premise that the draft day trade was conditionally accepted. That trade was

prince+7+wilcox
for
Jefferson+23+16

The condition was that Cousins and Monroe were not available for the 7th pick. Clearly Monroe was there and the trade did not go through.

My counter is this.

Prince+Daye+pick swap
for
Jefferson

[Krapinsky]

I don't like it. I am not high on Daye. Prince does not hold a lot of value to us since he is not in our long term plans. The pick swap seems worthless since Detroit is in the east and adding Monroe and Jefferson. Conclusion: I would prefer cap space (i.e. Eric Dampier) and the opportunity to sign David Lee over this package.

[DetroitPistons]

Yes. Please. Now. i love that trade for detroit. would you rather have jerebko or daye? i prefer daye but i know some people like jerebko more. also, i agree that minny wants to wait to trade jefferson to a team that misses out on the big free agents but you never know.

[vege]

This trade idea is dead already.

Minny don't need prince anymore, they drafted/traded for a crapload of wingers.

Detroit does not need Big Al anymore. They drafted Monroe and as much as i was told that you don't sign or trade bigmans to fit next to Monroe yet, you do need to see him play and see if he will be a PF or a C in the league and what exactly he brings to the table, i think it's pretty safe to say Big Al and Monroe will be terrible defensively you add CV and BG and you got to believe that's not the direction a team should go.

To make things worse for Detroit. They have a lot of money locked on Rip and BG and they would create another insane logjan with Max + CV and now Big Al. Too much money locked in 2 positions, especially because next season Detroit have to extend Stuckey and Jonas.

As if it's not bad enough there is another serious problem, if Detroit trade both Prince and Daye they would be left with Jerebko and Summers to play SF and that is not even close to be enough depth for Detroit.

The time for this trade was before the draft and i think Joe D is glad he didn't pulled the trigger, not sure exactly how minny feel about not doing the trade.

[revprodeji]

I like Daye, I think he can be a very good prospect. I was bothered we did not get him last year.

Prince is an expiring contract with vet value. He could be flipped near the deadline, or be used as a vet mentor now.

Pick-swap is always nice if they get lucky in the lotto.

[DetroitPistons]

Just because dumars trades for jefferson doesn't mean hes done with the offseason. he could still trade rip (and probably would) at the deadline or something. maxiell as well. wilcox is already expriring. if you get at least some expirings for those guys then we could resign stuckey. jerebko's extension wont be much anyways (i prefer we trade him while his stock is relatively high anyways). if that trade went down i would throw the MLE at josh howard.

Stuckey/Bynum/White
Gordon/Stuckey/White
Howard/Jerebko/Summers
Jefferson/Villanueva/Jerebko
Monroe/Wallace

Thats a good playoff team that could do some damage if they commit to the defensive end. excellent bench too.

[shangrila]

Pick-swap is always nice if they get lucky in the lotto.

What are you expecting from them next season? Hell, what are you expecting from the Wolves?

I don't know about you but I don't think we're going to leave the bottom 5 and Detroit will be in the hunt for a playoff spot after adding Jefferson, making a pick swap useless. A top 10 or top 5 protected pick would be good enough.

[revprodeji]

I was mostly putting it in if Detroit gets lucky in the lotto. We know the wolves will never get a top-3 pick, but this way we could swap with Detroit if they did.

[Warspite]

pistons counter with

1. Prince+Daye+2011 pick top 10 protected and the Wolves add Brewer to jefferson.

2. Rip+ Daye + Stuckey+ unprotected 2011 for Jefferson, Brewer, Sessions

[Saltine]

Add jerebko into deal #1 and I think it works

[shangrila]

I was mostly putting it in if Detroit gets lucky in the lotto. We know the wolves will never get a top-3 pick, but this way we could swap with Detroit if they did.

But if they're not worse then us then there's no point in doing it. I'd rather just have a protected first

[shrink]

http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key= ... 3SXc&gid=1

Right now, no team has traded a completely unprotected pick. I think unprotected picks are becoming extinct, and pick swaps without protections will soon follow them. While winning a Top lottery spot in the draft is unlikely, the size of the loss is too much risk for a team's front office.

[princeofpalace]

So Dumars wouldnt give up #7 for Jefferson but now he's willing to give up Daye + a pick swap with no protections on it? Yeah, I dont see that happening

[Swimmer]

So Dumars wouldnt give up #7 for Jefferson but now he's willing to give up Daye + a pick swap with no protections on it? Yeah, I dont see that happening

I don't get it. I'd rather have the #7 than Daye + pick swap. I am pretty confident that Detroit will be better than Minny next year, and REALLY confident that DET + Al Jeff is way better than MIN - Al Jeff. So, you would have to jump Minnesota through the lottery, assuming you fall into the lottery. The pick swap really has very small value, since even in the worst case scenario (extremely unlikely), you are trading a likely top 3 pick for a likely top 5 pick.

[princeofpalace]

So Dumars wouldnt give up #7 for Jefferson but now he's willing to give up Daye + a pick swap with no protections on it? Yeah, I dont see that happening

I don't get it. I'd rather have the #7 than Daye + pick swap. I am pretty confident that Detroit will be better than Minny next year, and REALLY confident that DET + Al Jeff is way better than MIN - Al Jeff. So, you would have to jump Minnesota through the lottery, assuming you fall into the lottery. The pick swap really has very small value, since even in the worst case scenario (extremely unlikely), you are trading a likely top 3 pick for a likely top 5 pick.

I don't believe that Al Jefferson makes Detroit any better in the win column

I expect Detroit to be right back into the lottery, Detroit will not risk a top pick which I think they will have a very good shot at to acquire Jefferson.

The most Joe D offers for Jefferson IMO should be Prince/Daye, no pick swap. And even then, I dont see Dumars having much interest in acquiring Jefferson without somehow managing to move Rips contract.

[[RCG]]

pistons counter with

1. Prince+Daye+2011 pick top 10 protected and the Wolves add Brewer to jefferson.

2. Rip+ Daye + Stuckey+ unprotected 2011 for Jefferson, Brewer, Sessions

1. Jefferson > Prince & Brewer > Daye

2. Jefferson >> Rip & Brewer > Daye & Sessions > Stuckey

Both cases I don't think the 2011 pick evens out the trade

[Warspite]

pistons counter with

1. Prince+Daye+2011 pick top 10 protected and the Wolves add Brewer to jefferson.

2. Rip+ Daye + Stuckey+ unprotected 2011 for Jefferson, Brewer, Sessions

1. Jefferson > Prince & Brewer > Daye

2. Jefferson >> Rip & Brewer > Daye & Sessions > Stuckey

Both cases I don't think the 2011 pick evens out the trade

You might be making an argument talent wise but thats not what we are talking about. Al Jefferson has asked for a trade and T pups have been trying to unload him. He hasnt shown that hes recovered but he is healthy. Jeffersons value drops every day what you trade him for in Sept or Oct will be a fraction of what you can get today. if Kahn waits untill fall he will sending a #1 pick out with Jefferson.

I tried to offer a fair and reasonable deal that at least 50% of Pistons fans would not do. Vege explained why the OP offer just doesnt work. I also dont see any taking into account of Dumars/Kahn and the fact that Dumars always abuses GMs and Kahn is a moron. These 2 are basicly Jerry West vs Babcock/Paxson.

Unlike on RealGM sometimes you have to give to get and sometimes there is addition by subtraction. You just cant unload a player on near max contract thats not 100% healthy and who you dont think makes your team better and you only won 15 games and expect even .50 on the dollar.

Jeffersons value to the Pistons<< Jeffersons value to the avg NBA team<Jefersons value as a player<Jeffersons value on RealGM<<<<<< Jeffersons value to T Wolves fans.

Id like to have Jefferson but I know that adding him w/o dumping Rip means that Stuckey/JJ will leave as a FAs. Trading Prince for Jefferson puts the Pistons 2012 payroll around 70 million.

[revprodeji]

You think Al's value declines and we will include an asset? really?