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Indiana Out: Paul George
Indiana In: No. 1, No. 7

Minnesota Out: No. 7
Minnesota In: Jae Crowder

Boston Out: No. 1, Jae Crowder
Boston In: Paul George

Note: Boston has Tyler Zeller ($8 million unguaranteed) and Minnesota has Jordan Hill ($4.18 million unguaranteed) to help make salaries match, if necessary.

Boston gets its star player its been looking for. Minnesota gets a cheap, young veteran who's a perfect fit in the lineup and in the coach's system. Indiana gets good value for George.

I'm sure somebody will say that Indiana gets too rich of a deal for its unhappy star, but how is that different from Minnesota's Kevin Love trade a few years ago?

If PG agrees to sign in Boston it makes some sense for them. otherwise not close at all value wise.

Does Crowder have that Kind of Value? to get the 7th pick? IDK

from Boston perspective I would pass on this particular version I think.

In my opinion, Paul George is not the solutions for Boston problem.

Wolves need more. I don't think Crowder is worth the 7th pick..

moss_is_1 wrote:Wolves need more. I don't think Crowder is worth the 7th pick..

I agree there is serious sticker shock with that deal and it's not a slam dunk, sure thing that I'd do this deal. But it's something that I think could provide immediate help without destroying the team's future.

What are you, me, and the rest of the Timberwolves fans hoping to get out of the No. 7 pick? To me, we want someone who can help this franchise take the next step and someone who can develop into a starter on a playoff team. Well, Crowder is already a starter on a playoff team and I think he could help this team make an immediate jump, whether he's starting or coming off the bench. He's locked into his contract for three years at dirt-cheap value and he'll still be only 29 in the last year of his deal, so it's not like he's too old for the team's core or that he'll see a sharp decline. And even if he did decline, he's still on a dirt cheap deal.

Mentally, it seems odd to say a No. 7 pick is fair value for a guy who was a 2nd round pick just 5 years ago and isn't exactly a star player. However, I think the deal makes sense.

Honestly as a Pacers fan I don't feel good about trading George for picks.

I don't see why the Celtics would trade for PG and trade away Crowder. They're both win now pieces and Crowder is under contract the longest between him IT, & Bradley.

Klomp wrote:Indiana Out: Paul George
Indiana In: No. 1, No. 7

Minnesota Out: No. 7
Minnesota In: Jae Crowder

Boston Out: No. 1, Jae Crowder
Boston In: Paul George

Note: Boston has Tyler Zeller ($8 million unguaranteed) and Minnesota has Jordan Hill ($4.18 million unguaranteed) to help make salaries match, if necessary.

Boston gets its star player its been looking for. Minnesota gets a cheap, young veteran who's a perfect fit in the lineup and in the coach's system. Indiana gets good value for George.

I'm sure somebody will say that Indiana gets too rich of a deal for its unhappy star, but how is that different from Minnesota's Kevin Love trade a few years ago?

Think the Pacers #18 pick would go to Minnesota.


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Pacers 18 to minny I also agree and Boston might have to give up one future pick here also. Not saying Brooklyn pick , but a future asset and then Indy may be more likely to trade cu ATM, u still need to over pay


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This is an overpay for George. I dont see Ainge giving up the #1 pick let alone add in Crowder to this deal. Ainge is ridiculously frugal, he's not going to pay a premium for George, especially when the Pacers are the one's that need to sell. He has a seemingly limitless pool of resources. He will only bid higher than the best offer on the table, and no deal will come close to the #1 pick that he owns.
So unfortunately the Celtics pass.

The Wolves deal, I think they could make better use of the #7. It makes some sense to add a GREAT 3+D player but this seems like one of those win-now moves that comes back and bites them in the ass. The Wolves were in the bottom 20th percentile in point's allowed in the paint this year. I don't think Crowder brings enough to be able to change that. To me, you really need two things.

1. A big that's a game changer on defense, that can also knock down open 15 footers. Gorgui is not the answer.
2. Another wing like Crowder that you can fit at the 2 or 3, thus moving Lavine to the bench as a super 6th man where he belongs.
The asking price for Crowder is just a bit too high for you to get both 1 and 2.

Ideally, I'd like to see the Wolves make a great offer for Turner, who would be the unicorn that solves their problems. But Pacers fans want the moon for that guy.

I don't mind it for anyone involved though I question BOS moves the pick now that's it's actually #1. They could've made the move at the deadline if they were willing to give it up in conjunction to Crowder (and Brown I believe) but chose not to - so at least that was Danny's thinking at the time and I'm not sure much has changed.

Unless he gets some sort of encouragement from ownership, I doubt he moves the #1 overall.

Maple Green wrote:In my opinion, Paul George is not the solutions for Boston problem.

He can be a big part of the solution, that's for sure.
He's been one of the better players going up against LeBron - he's not scared and he badly wants to beat him.
His teams also had great success against LeBron's Miami squad though I'm not sure that holds too much value now.

Boston needs front court help, yes - but they also need another top dog that's willing to fight tooth and nail against LeBron and there aren't many individuals in the NBA that I'd rather have than George in that regard save Kawhi.

SBM wrote:Honestly as a Pacers fan I don't feel good about trading George for picks.

I guess I understand that in general, but this isn't really a situation where it's a huge unknown. You know you'd have the No. 1 pick and I feel like Fultz would be a great start to the rebuilding process. Add in maybe Isaac as your SF replacement and that's a solid young nucleus of Fultz, Isaac and Turner. You might not end up with the better end of the deal in the long run, but I believe it would be enough for what seems to be a disgruntled star.

Would you personally feel better cutting Minnesota out of it and getting Crowder instead? I guess that would make some sense.

Klomp wrote:

moss_is_1 wrote:Wolves need more. I don't think Crowder is worth the 7th pick..

I agree there is serious sticker shock with that deal and it's not a slam dunk, sure thing that I'd do this deal. But it's something that I think could provide immediate help without destroying the team's future.

What are you, me, and the rest of the Timberwolves fans hoping to get out of the No. 7 pick? To me, we want someone who can help this franchise take the next step and someone who can develop into a starter on a playoff team. Well, Crowder is already a starter on a playoff team and I think he could help this team make an immediate jump, whether he's starting or coming off the bench. He's locked into his contract for three years at dirt-cheap value and he'll still be only 29 in the last year of his deal, so it's not like he's too old for the team's core or that he'll see a sharp decline. And even if he did decline, he's still on a dirt cheap deal.

Mentally, it seems odd to say a No. 7 pick is fair value for a guy who was a 2nd round pick just 5 years ago and isn't exactly a star player. However, I think the deal makes sense.

Crowder might not have the potential upside of whoever is available at 7 but he's a top 10 2-way small forward. I like the logic for the wolves and I think the value is better than some seem to think. I might feel a little bad if Isaac was there at seven.

I think Indy should run with this. Boston might balk- can George get them past the Cavs in the near term? Good trade though.

Kupchak9 wrote:The Wolves deal, I think they could make better use of the #7. It makes some sense to add a GREAT 3+D player but this seems like one of those win-now moves that comes back and bites them in the ass.

Win-now moves come back to bite teams in the ass if a player is old, expensive or a poor fit in the scheme and with the personnel. I don't believe Crowder is any of those things for the Timberwolves.

I_Socrates wrote:I don't mind it for anyone involved though I question BOS moves the pick now that's it's actually #1. They could've made the move at the deadline if they were willing to give it up in conjunction to Crowder (and Brown I believe) but chose not to - so at least that was Danny's thinking at the time and I'm not sure much has changed.

Unless he gets some sort of encouragement from ownership, I doubt he moves the #1 overall.

This is a fair counter-argument. But I think he could realize next year is their last best shot to top the Cavs, with Thomas entering his final year. George will be able to help Boston beat Cleveland next year far more than Fultz or any other rookie could.

Klomp wrote:

Kupchak9 wrote:The Wolves deal, I think they could make better use of the #7. It makes some sense to add a GREAT 3+D player but this seems like one of those win-now moves that comes back and bites them in the ass.

Win-now moves come back to bite teams in the ass if a player is old, expensive or a poor fit in the scheme and with the personnel. I don't believe Crowder is any of those things for the Timberwolves.

I'll go along with this because I do believe Crowder will make a great difference. What if you switched the Pacers out with the Bulls.

Boston gets Butler for Crowder + #1
Bulls get #1 and #7.
Wolves get Crowder + Lopez

I think the C's would pull the trigger on that trade and the value for the Wolves is fair.

Kupchak9 wrote:

Klomp wrote:

Kupchak9 wrote:The Wolves deal, I think they could make better use of the #7. It makes some sense to add a GREAT 3+D player but this seems like one of those win-now moves that comes back and bites them in the ass.

Win-now moves come back to bite teams in the ass if a player is old, expensive or a poor fit in the scheme and with the personnel. I don't believe Crowder is any of those things for the Timberwolves.

I'll go along with this because I do believe Crowder will make a great difference. What if you switched the Pacers out with the Bulls.

Boston gets Butler for Crowder + #1
Bulls get #1 and #7.
Wolves get Crowder + Lopez

I think the C's would pull the trigger on that trade and the value for the Wolves is fair.

So you think Butler carries more value to Boston than George? Is that because of the contract situation or what?

Honestly, this framework could work as well. I don't know if Lopez is the right type of veteran to acquire (he might be), but I'd be open to this as well. I think Cole Aldrich would need to be shipped out though just for money reasons.

Klomp wrote:

Kupchak9 wrote:

Klomp wrote:Win-now moves come back to bite teams in the ass if a player is old, expensive or a poor fit in the scheme and with the personnel. I don't believe Crowder is any of those things for the Timberwolves.

I'll go along with this because I do believe Crowder will make a great difference. What if you switched the Pacers out with the Bulls.

Boston gets Butler for Crowder + #1
Bulls get #1 and #7.
Wolves get Crowder + Lopez

I think the C's would pull the trigger on that trade and the value for the Wolves is fair.

So you think Butler carries more value to Boston than George? Is that because of the contract situation or what?

Honestly, this framework could work as well. I don't know if Lopez is the right type of veteran to acquire (he might be), but I'd be open to this as well. I think Cole Aldrich would need to be shipped out though just for money reasons.

Definitely, contract carries a lot more value. You can argue Butler and George to have the same level of impact, but Butler is locked down for at least another 2 years at a relatively cheap price given his production. Let's say George goes to the Celtics and he makes the All-NBA team next year. Now Ainge is going to be forking up ALOT more money to re-sign him whereas he could have gotten Butler for the same trade while also paying him close to 30% less per year. Its all about the cost-benefit analysis for Ainge. Which conveniently is also CBA.

Expiring PG isn't worth this much. A framework of #7 + Crowder going to IND is more appropriate.

Mystical Apples wrote:Expiring PG isn't worth this much. A framework of #7 + Crowder going to IND is more appropriate.

Minnesota trades #7 straight up for #1? Fine by me!