What's the deal with MKG? Is NY an Option?

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What's the deal with MKG? Is NY an Option? 

Post#1 » by eitanr » Wed Aug 9, 2017 2:30 pm

Hi Gang!

After many failed Melo trade attempts I had the following realizations:
1. Ryan Anderson is the only player Houston would give up
2. Ryno's deal is too much for a team to take on unless the Rockets were either willing to add Ariza or Gordon to the deal or perhaps 2 additional 1st rounders. None of which seem likely

At this stale mate, it may just make more sense for the Knicks to keep Melo. Having said that, they should use him as a 4 with KP at the 5. Obviously such a tandem would need more support on the defensive end. Additionally the hope would be to have Melo play more off the ball, so in essence the Knicks would need a strong rebounding, defensive player who could be a play maker as well.

In short, the perfect fit could be MKG. But then that got me thinking. What's the deal with MKG?

MKG has had an weird start to his career with injuries in play and then fit alongside some post presences in Big Al and slashing with Kemba. Last year seemed like a year he could take the next step, but Charlotte used Walker and Batum more as slashers leaving little room for MKG to be effective in a unique role.

With Dwight in the fold, it seems Charlotte may be looking to gain more spacing around him. So the question becomes, does he even fit in Charlotte and if not, what deal makes sense with him?

One idea is trying to move Courtney Lee maybe with Hernangomez in a deal for MKG. The issue there is Charlotte already has some size in Howard, Zeller, Frank and Marvin Williams to at extent. Is there a need for big Willy? Further, does MKG warrant more in a deal?

His value is tough to gauge, but I'd think Charlotte would like Lee's spacing back and a mediocre asset in return.

In short, I am personally curious at what MKG can do in the right situation. He's only 23 and could still be a real nice player in this league. It just seems Charlotte is not the team for him.

Thoughts?
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Re: What's the deal with MKG? Is NY an Option? 

Post#2 » by Caramel_Anton » Wed Aug 9, 2017 2:39 pm

As a NYK fan - I'd be more inclined to suggest something like ...

Ny sends Melo
Ny receives MKG, Onuaku, Lamb, cha 2nd

Hou sends Anderson, hou 1st, onuaku
Hou receives Melo

Cha sends MKG, Lamb
Cha receives Anderson, Lee, hou 1st

Charlotte could look like
Kemba / MCW
Lee / Monk
Batum / Williams
Anderson / Kaminsky
Dwight / Zeller

Gives spacing that CHA needs and will allow Anderson to be productive in that scheme. Adds a 1st for taking on the contract. Lee for Lamb & 2nd is a fair swap.

New York gets a young defensive SF who fits their timeline, a backup SG & a decent prospect

Houston gets away with the deal they have been trying to get away with this entire time.

Value only works because CHA could actually use Anderson.
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Re: What's the deal with MKG? Is NY an Option? 

Post#3 » by QRich3 » Wed Aug 9, 2017 3:06 pm

^^^ Assuming that's Courtney Lee you have going to the Hornets, it doesn't work financially, Hornets are eating too much money.

This would've sorta worked if the Hornets didn't trade for Howard, the Knicks eating Plumlee's contract could've possibly gotten them MKG for Melo. But now, the Hornets are not gonna eat Anderson's contract and give MKG (who they value dearly as a lot of Hornets posters are about to tell you) on top of that, all for a late 1st rounder.
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Re: What's the deal with MKG? Is NY an Option? 

Post#4 » by eitanr » Wed Aug 9, 2017 5:24 pm

Caramel_Anton wrote:As a NYK fan - I'd be more inclined to suggest something like ...

Ny sends Melo
Ny receives MKG, Onuaku, Lamb, cha 2nd

Hou sends Anderson, hou 1st, onuaku
Hou receives Melo

Cha sends MKG, Lamb
Cha receives Anderson, Lee, hou 1st

Charlotte could look like
Kemba / MCW
Lee / Monk
Batum / Williams
Anderson / Kaminsky
Dwight / Zeller

Gives spacing that CHA needs and will allow Anderson to be productive in that scheme. Adds a 1st for taking on the contract. Lee for Lamb & 2nd is a fair swap.

New York gets a young defensive SF who fits their timeline, a backup SG & a decent prospect

Houston gets away with the deal they have been trying to get away with this entire time.

Value only works because CHA could actually use Anderson.


Well now doesn't the following work?

CHA Deals: MKG, Marvin Williams, Jeremy Lamb
Receive: Ryan Anderson, Courtney Lee, HOU 2019 1st

NYK Deals: C. Anthony, C. Lee
Receive: MKG, Marvin Williams, Jeremy Lamb, I. Taylor, M. Quarterman

HOU Deals: R. Anderson, C. Lee, I. Taylor, M. Quarterman, 2019 1st
Receives: C. Anthony
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Re: What's the deal with MKG? Is NY an Option? 

Post#5 » by eitanr » Wed Aug 9, 2017 7:13 pm

bump - interested in feedback from last post's trade idea
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Re: What's the deal with MKG? Is NY an Option? 

Post#6 » by daoneandonly » Wed Aug 9, 2017 7:17 pm

eitanr wrote:bump - interested in feedback from last post's trade idea


Houston does not give up nearly enough, which is why the stalemate is still there. Anderson is a negative value, the other pieces Houston is giving up barely equates to shedding his deal, on top of that they get Melo, it just does not make sense
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Re: What's the deal with MKG? Is NY an Option? 

Post#7 » by BeesWax » Wed Aug 9, 2017 7:59 pm

No real incentive in the deal for the Hornets. I like Lee but the rest of the return is not worth anything. A late first isn't enough to take back Anderson.
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Re: What's the deal with MKG? Is NY an Option? 

Post#8 » by pacers33granger » Wed Aug 9, 2017 8:03 pm

jdm3 wrote:No real incentive in the deal for the Hornets. I like Lee but the rest of the return is not worth anything. A late first isn't enough to take back Anderson.


I'm not a fan of it due to MKG going out as I still like him a lot, but the combo of Lamb/Williams is probably equivalent to Ryno as far as value goes. Imo MKG and the first are the only two positive value pieces involved on Charlotte's end.
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Re: RE: Re: What's the deal with MKG? Is NY an Option? 

Post#9 » by DoItALL9 » Wed Aug 9, 2017 8:46 pm

eitanr wrote:bump - interested in feedback from last post's trade idea

I think it's an A grade trade. I thought it immediately upon seeing your post title
eitanr wrote:
Caramel_Anton wrote:As a NYK fan - I'd be more inclined to suggest something like ...

Ny sends Melo
Ny receives MKG, Onuaku, Lamb, cha 2nd

Hou sends Anderson, hou 1st, onuaku
Hou receives Melo

Cha sends MKG, Lamb
Cha receives Anderson, Lee, hou 1st

Charlotte could look like
Kemba / MCW
Lee / Monk
Batum / Williams
Anderson / Kaminsky
Dwight / Zeller

Gives spacing that CHA needs and will allow Anderson to be productive in that scheme. Adds a 1st for taking on the contract. Lee for Lamb & 2nd is a fair swap.

New York gets a young defensive SF who fits their timeline, a backup SG & a decent prospect

Houston gets away with the deal they have been trying to get away with this entire time.

Value only works because CHA could actually use Anderson.


Well now doesn't the following work?

CHA Deals: MKG, Marvin Williams, Jeremy Lamb
Receive: Ryan Anderson, Courtney Lee, HOU 2019 1st

NYK Deals: C. Anthony, C. Lee
Receive: MKG, Marvin Williams, Jeremy Lamb, I. Taylor, M. Quarterman

HOU Deals: R. Anderson, C. Lee, I. Taylor, M. Quarterman, 2019 1st
Receives: C. Anthony
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Re: RE: Re: What's the deal with MKG? Is NY an Option? 

Post#10 » by DoItALL9 » Wed Aug 9, 2017 8:53 pm

Ryan Andersons contract is equal in length to Marvin Williams. the difference in money is offset by the pick. Lee spaces the floor better than mkg. Loss in individual defense but the team defense will still be strong with Dwight anchoring. Dwight and Ryno are familiar from Orlando.

Houston is happy.

Nyk prevents the mental sabotage of the team by keeping Carmelo from around KP. It's not a healthy environment for him to be if the Knicks want him to stay long term. For that reason you can't worry so much about what Houston is sending out.
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Re: What's the deal with MKG? Is NY an Option? 

Post#11 » by BeesWax » Wed Aug 9, 2017 9:05 pm

pacers33granger wrote:
jdm3 wrote:No real incentive in the deal for the Hornets. I like Lee but the rest of the return is not worth anything. A late first isn't enough to take back Anderson.


I'm not a fan of it due to MKG going out as I still like him a lot, but the combo of Lamb/Williams is probably equivalent to Ryno as far as value goes. Imo MKG and the first are the only two positive value pieces involved on Charlotte's end.

I will take Williams and Lamb over Anderson any day. Marvin's plays solid defense and Lamb has some value off the bench and expires earlier so it saves us some money down the line since Anderson cost more than Marvin the last two years.
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Re: What's the deal with MKG? Is NY an Option? 

Post#12 » by Caramel_Anton » Wed Aug 9, 2017 9:38 pm

jdm3 wrote:
pacers33granger wrote:
jdm3 wrote:No real incentive in the deal for the Hornets. I like Lee but the rest of the return is not worth anything. A late first isn't enough to take back Anderson.


I'm not a fan of it due to MKG going out as I still like him a lot, but the combo of Lamb/Williams is probably equivalent to Ryno as far as value goes. Imo MKG and the first are the only two positive value pieces involved on Charlotte's end.


I will take Williams and Lamb over Anderson any day. Marvin's plays solid defense and Lamb has some value off the bench and expires earlier so it saves us some money down the line since Anderson cost more than Marvin the last two years.


You have nobody currently to space the floor. You just acquired a new star on your team and if you don't make any moves to accommodate the inevitable changes in your offensive scheme, you will fail. Ryno & Lee will automatically be the 2 best three point shooters on your team (I think) - I know Ryno will be. Where you lose a bit on rim protection (williams & MKG) vs (Dwight) you make up for it by adding better perimeter defense (Lee). Dwight works best alone down there, having Ryno on the perimeter really would help your team win multiple games and enable Dwight to finally flourish under an offense. (Much like he & Anderson did in ORL)

Saying you'll take Williams and Lamb over Ryno "any day" is kind of silly.
Especially when that isn't the trade that is presented. It's Ryno & Lee for Williams, Lamb, MKG & a HOU 1st.
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Re: What's the deal with MKG? Is NY an Option? 

Post#13 » by Mystical Apples » Wed Aug 9, 2017 10:17 pm

Courtney is fine but his defense is overrated and his below average length will only compound issues as he ages. Besides, Lamb's cheaper 2-year deal transitions nicely to Malik Monk -- taking back the remaining $37M for Courtney is a non-starter

MKG is Charlotte's best perimeter defender and still only 23-years-old. His impact is wildly underrated too.
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Re: What's the deal with MKG? Is NY an Option? 

Post#14 » by azcatz11 » Wed Aug 9, 2017 10:19 pm

Caramel_Anton wrote:As a NYK fan - I'd be more inclined to suggest something like ...

Ny sends Melo
Ny receives MKG, Onuaku, Lamb, cha 2nd

Hou sends Anderson, hou 1st, onuaku
Hou receives Melo

Cha sends MKG, Lamb
Cha receives Anderson, Lee, hou 1st

Charlotte could look like
Kemba / MCW
Lee / Monk
Batum / Williams
Anderson / Kaminsky
Dwight / Zeller

Gives spacing that CHA needs and will allow Anderson to be productive in that scheme. Adds a 1st for taking on the contract. Lee for Lamb & 2nd is a fair swap.

New York gets a young defensive SF who fits their timeline, a backup SG & a decent prospect

Houston gets away with the deal they have been trying to get away with this entire time.

Value only works because CHA could actually use Anderson.


Terrible deal for the Hornets. The Rockets pick is worthless. Even though MKG + Lamb are UFA's next year, why would they eat two more years of Andersons' contract when he literally can't be moved anyplace else.
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Re: What's the deal with MKG? Is NY an Option? 

Post#15 » by LightTheBeam » Wed Aug 9, 2017 10:25 pm

I like how the OP had a solid original idea and literally within 1 post it became a Ryan Anderson to 3rd team, Melo to Houston.

OP I like the idea of Courtney Lee + for MKG. If NY decides to keep Melo, they just invested big money into THJ so keeping Lee and Melo makes little sense.

Porzingas/Melo/MKG/THJ/Frank isnt the worst lineup in the world.

Alternatively, Lee has experience in Charlotte and has played with Dwight. Hes a crafty veteran that could make a positive impact on Monk and the team with his shooting. Batum goes back to small forward.

Dwight/Zeller
Marvin/Kaminsky
Batum/Lamb
Lee/Monk
Kemba/MCW

For the extra value id recommend a pick swap top 5 protected for NYK instead of Hernangomez.
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Re: What's the deal with MKG? Is NY an Option? 

Post#16 » by Jaw » Wed Aug 9, 2017 10:30 pm

Caramel_Anton wrote:
jdm3 wrote:
pacers33granger wrote:
I'm not a fan of it due to MKG going out as I still like him a lot, but the combo of Lamb/Williams is probably equivalent to Ryno as far as value goes. Imo MKG and the first are the only two positive value pieces involved on Charlotte's end.


I will take Williams and Lamb over Anderson any day. Marvin's plays solid defense and Lamb has some value off the bench and expires earlier so it saves us some money down the line since Anderson cost more than Marvin the last two years.


You have nobody currently to space the floor. You just acquired a new star on your team and if you don't make any moves to accommodate the inevitable changes in your offensive scheme, you will fail. Ryno & Lee will automatically be the 2 best three point shooters on your team (I think) - I know Ryno will be. Where you lose a bit on rim protection (williams & MKG) vs (Dwight) you make up for it by adding better perimeter defense (Lee). Dwight works best alone down there, having Ryno on the perimeter really would help your team win multiple games and enable Dwight to finally flourish under an offense. (Much like he & Anderson did in ORL)

Saying you'll take Williams and Lamb over Ryno "any day" is kind of silly.
Especially when that isn't the trade that is presented. It's Ryno & Lee for Williams, Lamb, MKG & a HOU 1st.


I wouldn't say Hornets have nobody to space the floor but Batum, Lamb, Williams and Kaminsky all surprised me with how low their percentages were, I thought they'd all be at least around 35% (but then again I don't watch Hornets games that's based mostly off hearsay and 2k) . I like the trade for Hornets since they'd be getting the most out of Howard by surrounding him with 3 guys who shot 40% from 3 last year and moving MKG who's man would sag off him every time to bother Howard. I could understand Hornets declining since once they got Anderson's contracts there is no going back. Numerically it really isn't drastically worse than Williams but Williams as a 3 and D pf actually has trade value unlike Anderson who is negative with that larger contract.
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Re: What's the deal with MKG? Is NY an Option? 

Post#17 » by nykballa2k4 » Wed Aug 9, 2017 10:36 pm

eitanr wrote:
Caramel_Anton wrote:As a NYK fan - I'd be more inclined to suggest something like ...

Ny sends Melo
Ny receives MKG, Onuaku, Lamb, cha 2nd

Hou sends Anderson, hou 1st, onuaku
Hou receives Melo

Cha sends MKG, Lamb
Cha receives Anderson, Lee, hou 1st

Charlotte could look like
Kemba / MCW
Lee / Monk
Batum / Williams
Anderson / Kaminsky
Dwight / Zeller

Gives spacing that CHA needs and will allow Anderson to be productive in that scheme. Adds a 1st for taking on the contract. Lee for Lamb & 2nd is a fair swap.

New York gets a young defensive SF who fits their timeline, a backup SG & a decent prospect

Houston gets away with the deal they have been trying to get away with this entire time.

Value only works because CHA could actually use Anderson.


Well now doesn't the following work?

CHA Deals: MKG, Marvin Williams, Jeremy Lamb
Receive: Ryan Anderson, Courtney Lee, HOU 2019 1st

NYK Deals: C. Anthony, C. Lee
Receive: MKG, Marvin Williams, Jeremy Lamb, I. Taylor, M. Quarterman

HOU Deals: R. Anderson, C. Lee, I. Taylor, M. Quarterman, 2019 1st
Receives: C. Anthony


I feel like CHA is taking on too much salary to not be a contender. Lee is a nice add-on piece for a contending team. Anderson may fit in well in CHA, but not at that value.
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Re: What's the deal with MKG? Is NY an Option? 

Post#18 » by BeesWax » Wed Aug 9, 2017 10:46 pm

Caramel_Anton wrote:
jdm3 wrote:
pacers33granger wrote:
I'm not a fan of it due to MKG going out as I still like him a lot, but the combo of Lamb/Williams is probably equivalent to Ryno as far as value goes. Imo MKG and the first are the only two positive value pieces involved on Charlotte's end.


I will take Williams and Lamb over Anderson any day. Marvin's plays solid defense and Lamb has some value off the bench and expires earlier so it saves us some money down the line since Anderson cost more than Marvin the last two years.


You have nobody currently to space the floor. You just acquired a new star on your team and if you don't make any moves to accommodate the inevitable changes in your offensive scheme, you will fail. Ryno & Lee will automatically be the 2 best three point shooters on your team (I think) - I know Ryno will be. Where you lose a bit on rim protection (williams & MKG) vs (Dwight) you make up for it by adding better perimeter defense (Lee). Dwight works best alone down there, having Ryno on the perimeter really would help your team win multiple games and enable Dwight to finally flourish under an offense. (Much like he & Anderson did in ORL)

Saying you'll take Williams and Lamb over Ryno "any day" is kind of silly.
Especially when that isn't the trade that is presented. It's Ryno & Lee for Williams, Lamb, MKG & a HOU 1st.

It isn't silly it is common sense from our teams standpoint. Marc shot 35% last year and Kemba was around 40%. Batum was rough last season but took the summer off and will hopefully bounce back. Ryno just isn't any value to anyone anymore unless you only want shooting and our team prides on rebounding and defense. While Howard covers some flaws he would not be able to cover all of them is we shift this much.

Lee isn't a positive right now with his contract and age so adding in him and the first for MKG actually makes the trade even worse. I like Lee as a decent backup wing but he would have to start and this kills our flexibility and wing depth. It is just a terrible trade from the future stand point and from a system fit stand point. We get less flexible and worse of defense while maybe marginally improving on offense.
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Re: What's the deal with MKG? Is NY an Option? 

Post#19 » by pacers33granger » Wed Aug 9, 2017 10:47 pm

Jaw wrote:. Numerically it really isn't drastically worse than Williams but Williams as a 3 and D pf actually has trade value unlike Anderson who is negative with that larger contract.


Marvin definitely does not have positive value. He still has $42 mil left and is already 31. Doesn't mean he can't be a good piece for a contender, but I see no way anyone gives an expiring for him. And his contract year definitely seems to be an outlier for shooting. He's pretty consistently shot around 35% from three, which is good, but a far cry from the 40% he got his contract with.

He brings value and is a positive player, but he's not a positive asset. Basically the same situation as Ryno except Ryno is a better player.
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Re: What's the deal with MKG? Is NY an Option? 

Post#20 » by GoBobs » Wed Aug 9, 2017 10:49 pm

Charlotte has no desire to move MKG and even less desire to take on Anderson.

MKG is the only player on our team that has any shot at guarding Lebron. He is not a piece we can afford to move. His defense and rebounding is critical for our team.

Now maybe his defense and rebounding can be replaced by some of what Dwight Howard does, but right now we are not looking to build around Dwight Howard. He has been on a bunch of different teams the last few years and disappointed everywhere he has been. It wouldn't be a good plan to build around a player with that history.

Our core is Kemba, Cody Zeller, MKG, Batum, Marvin Williams, and Frank. Maybe Dwight will exceed expectations and become a part of that or Monk will play himself into a role.

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