CLE/LAL - LBJ gives Love another try

[Dr Positivity]

Scenario: Lakers strike out this summer on basically everyone who's looking to avoid that toxic environment

Lakers trade:
Josh Hart
Moritz Wagner

Cavaliers trade:
Kevin Love

Why for Lakers? They get a proven fit for LBJ and keep their core young guys. With development of Ingram it's possible Lakers have a nice "big 3" next year, to say nothing of players like Ball and Kuzma

Why for Cavs? They have 2nd thoughts about Love after his injury this year and get a few young players out of it including a nice fit for Sexton in Hart

[taikibansei]

I don't really get it for the Cavs. As I posted yesterday in a similar thread, Love last season went for 17.6/9.3/1.7 with a 22.4 PER and .614 TS%. He's at 18.6/10.7/2.1 with a 21.3 PER and a .572 TS% so far now--23.0/10.8/1.3 with a 24 PER and .703 TS% since he got back from his injury. No, he's not going to give you lock down defense--far from it--but he's a good second or third option who (when healthy) can usually be counted on to spread the floor and outscore/outrebound the guy he's matched up with.

Love has been injured a lot, but none of these injuries have been career-threatening. Moreover, the lottery rules changed this year. Basically, the bottom three teams now have the same odds (14%) for the number 1 pick, and the next two teams are still pretty close (12.5% and 10.5% respectively) to getting that pick. So if Love leads the Cavs from the worst record in the NBA (what they'd be without Love) to, say, the 5th-worst record--while making their many losses more competitive (and therefore more entertaining)--the lottery "penalty" for this will be much less than before.

On a team like the Cavs, who were never going to be a FA Mecca, Love represents good value. His contract is both below max and actually decreases at the end, making it much less a cap-killer than you guys make it out to be--and eminently tradeable down the road.

And for all this the Cavs get...Josh Hart and Moritz Wagner? I'm assuming you left out some players--the salaries don't match--and a draft pick....

[DowJones]

I do this because LA is essentially absorbing all of Love's salary. I like Hart as a nice 3 and D player. Cleveland could get a 3rd team involved and take back a bad contract and get an additional future 1st. I think Hart, a future 1st, Wagner, and a 1 year bad contract is good value for Love.

I think LA declines. They would be better off going after someone like Tobias Harris for that money and keeping Hart/Wagner.

[DowJones]

I don't really get it for the Cavs. As I posted yesterday in a similar thread, Love last season went for 17.6/9.3/1.7 with a 22.4 PER and .614 TS%. He's at 18.6/10.7/2.1 with a 21.3 PER and a .572 TS% so far now--23.0/10.8/1.3 with a 24 PER and .703 TS% since he got back from his injury. No, he's not going to give you lock down defense--far from it--but he's a good second or third option who (when healthy) can usually be counted on to spread the floor and outscore/outrebound the guy he's matched up with.

Love has been injured a lot, but none of these injuries have been career-threatening. Moreover, the lottery rules changed this year. Basically, the bottom three teams now have the same odds (14%) for the number 1 pick, and the next two teams are still pretty close (12.5% and 10.5% respectively) to getting that pick. So if Love leads the Cavs from the worst record in the NBA (what they'd be without Love) to, say, the 5th-worst record--while making their many losses more competitive (and therefore more entertaining)--the lottery "penalty" for this will be much less than before.

On a team like the Cavs, who were never going to be a FA Mecca, Love represents good value. His contract is both below max and actually decreases at the end, making it much less a cap-killer than you guys make it out to be--and eminently tradeable down the road.

And for all this the Cavs get...Josh Hart and Moritz Wagner? I'm assuming you left out some players--the salaries don't match--and a draft pick....

It is all about the direction of the franchise. Cleveland is not good and we won't be good anytime soon. What good is keeping Love, paying him money, and turning down assets for him? We aren't a serious playoff contender. I think he is a very good player, but we are clearly in a re-building stage. We need to have a few years where we gain top-5 picks. We also need to add future draft picks and add them up to make a play for a disgruntled superstar in a few years. Then the plan should be to add that disgruntled superstar to the young talent we have and hopefully convince said superstar to remain in Cleveland on a max.

[HornetJail]

because that worked spectacularly the first time around

[taikibansei]

I don't really get it for the Cavs. As I posted yesterday in a similar thread, Love last season went for 17.6/9.3/1.7 with a 22.4 PER and .614 TS%. He's at 18.6/10.7/2.1 with a 21.3 PER and a .572 TS% so far now--23.0/10.8/1.3 with a 24 PER and .703 TS% since he got back from his injury. No, he's not going to give you lock down defense--far from it--but he's a good second or third option who (when healthy) can usually be counted on to spread the floor and outscore/outrebound the guy he's matched up with.

Love has been injured a lot, but none of these injuries have been career-threatening. Moreover, the lottery rules changed this year. Basically, the bottom three teams now have the same odds (14%) for the number 1 pick, and the next two teams are still pretty close (12.5% and 10.5% respectively) to getting that pick. So if Love leads the Cavs from the worst record in the NBA (what they'd be without Love) to, say, the 5th-worst record--while making their many losses more competitive (and therefore more entertaining)--the lottery "penalty" for this will be much less than before.

On a team like the Cavs, who were never going to be a FA Mecca, Love represents good value. His contract is both below max and actually decreases at the end, making it much less a cap-killer than you guys make it out to be--and eminently tradeable down the road.

And for all this the Cavs get...Josh Hart and Moritz Wagner? I'm assuming you left out some players--the salaries don't match--and a draft pick....

It is all about the direction of the franchise. Cleveland is not good and we won't be good anytime soon. What good is keeping Love, paying him money, and turning down assets for him? We aren't a serious playoff contender. I think he is a very good player, but we are clearly in a re-building stage. We need to have a few years where we gain top-5 picks. We also need to add future draft picks and add them up to make a play for a disgruntled superstar in a few years. Then the plan should be to add that disgruntled superstar to the young talent we have and hopefully convince said superstar to remain in Cleveland on a max.

Sure, as I also wrote, if better players and/or frps are thrown in, you might consider doing a trade. The OP doesn't do this, though.

[kobe_vs_jordan]

Could see if Lakers strike out on all tier 2 FAs. Sure. Solves spacing and rebounding.

[jbk1234]

I have zero interest in locking ourselves into awful for three or four years with the new lottery odds. Just in terms of player development, that's a bad strategy.

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[Crives]

What about something built around

Ball to PHX
Love to LAL
Tyler Johnson + Suns 2021 1st top 5 protected + Milwaukee 1st to Cleveland

[DowJones]

What about something built around

Ball to PHX
Love to LAL
Tyler Johnson + Suns 2021 1st top 5 protected + Milwaukee 1st to Cleveland

Sounds good to me. I imagine LA would need more. Maybe send them the Milwaukee 1st?

[Ballerhogger]

What about something built around

Ball to PHX
Love to LAL
Tyler Johnson + Suns 2021 1st top 5 protected + Milwaukee 1st to Cleveland

Sounds good to me. I imagine LA would need more. Maybe send them the Milwaukee 1st?

Not without that suns pick to the lakers.

[Crives]

What about something built around

Ball to PHX
Love to LAL
Tyler Johnson + Suns 2021 1st top 5 protected + Milwaukee 1st to Cleveland

Sounds good to me. I imagine LA would need more. Maybe send them the Milwaukee 1st?

Not without that suns pick to the lakers.

So Kevin Love has negative value?
Maybe suns would add 2019 2nd to Lakers which is going to be close to a late 1st.

[jbk1234]

Sounds good to me. I imagine LA would need more. Maybe send them the Milwaukee 1st?

Not without that suns pick to the lakers.

So Kevin Love has negative value?
Maybe suns would add 2019 2nd to Lakers which is going to be close to a late 1st.

The Cavs already have Delly and Knight and we're going to eat T. Johnson's contract for a first that will likely be 25-30 years from now?

Oh, and as a bonus we're giving Love away for free? Just cut the Cavs out of this mess.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app

[Crives]

Not without that suns pick to the lakers.

So Kevin Love has negative value?
Maybe suns would add 2019 2nd to Lakers which is going to be close to a late 1st.

The Cavs already have Delly and Knight and we're going to eat T. Johnson's contract for a first that will likely be 25-30 years from now?

Oh, and as a bonus we're giving Love away for free? Just cut the Cavs out of this mess.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app

What’s fair value for Love? He seems hard to value due to his age / contract.

[taikibansei]

So Kevin Love has negative value?
Maybe suns would add 2019 2nd to Lakers which is going to be close to a late 1st.

The Cavs already have Delly and Knight and we're going to eat T. Johnson's contract for a first that will likely be 25-30 years from now?

Oh, and as a bonus we're giving Love away for free? Just cut the Cavs out of this mess.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app

What’s fair value for Love? He seems hard to value due to his age / contract.

Did you read my post above? The bottom line is that the Cavs have no incentive right now to give Love away. He would be the best player in this trade by far--regardless of age and contract--and yet you have the Cavs paying to get rid of him (by taking on bench players/eating awful contracts). Either you give them a usable starter and a frp or don't do the trade. They don't need more crap on that roster.

[Crives]

The Cavs already have Delly and Knight and we're going to eat T. Johnson's contract for a first that will likely be 25-30 years from now?

Oh, and as a bonus we're giving Love away for free? Just cut the Cavs out of this mess.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app

What’s fair value for Love? He seems hard to value due to his age / contract.

Did you read my post above? The bottom line is that the Cavs have no incentive right now to give Love away. He would be the best player in this trade by far--regardless of age and contract--and yet you have the Cavs paying to get rid of him (by taking on bench players/eating awful contracts). Either you give them a usable starter and a frp or don't do the trade. They don't need more crap on that roster.

What about Josh Jackson + Tyler Johnson? Two rotation players. Josh is still learning but has a lot of potential.

[taikibansei]

What’s fair value for Love? He seems hard to value due to his age / contract.

Did you read my post above? The bottom line is that the Cavs have no incentive right now to give Love away. He would be the best player in this trade by far--regardless of age and contract--and yet you have the Cavs paying to get rid of him (by taking on bench players/eating awful contracts). Either you give them a usable starter and a frp or don't do the trade. They don't need more crap on that roster.

What about Josh Jackson + Tyler Johnson? Two rotation players. Josh is still learning but has a lot of potential.

Among many other things, Josh needs to learn how to shoot before you talk up his "potential." Did you see the Cavs game last night? Without Love, they had something like 39 points at the half. Add Josh to that mix and they may well have gone scoreless....

[Crives]

Did you read my post above? The bottom line is that the Cavs have no incentive right now to give Love away. He would be the best player in this trade by far--regardless of age and contract--and yet you have the Cavs paying to get rid of him (by taking on bench players/eating awful contracts). Either you give them a usable starter and a frp or don't do the trade. They don't need more crap on that roster.

What about Josh Jackson + Tyler Johnson? Two rotation players. Josh is still learning but has a lot of potential.

Among many other things, Josh needs to learn how to shoot before you talk up his "potential." Did you see the Cavs game last night? Without Love, they had something like 39 points at the half. Add Josh to that mix and they may well have gone scoreless....

Joshs shot has looked a lot better since December. His low fg% has come from missing easy shots at the rim which will improve with time.

if not interested that’s fine and understandable.

But what do you do with Kevin if you win Zion? If you want to keep Zion at pf maybe then it makes sense to move love for some young players/ picks.

[taikibansei]

What about Josh Jackson + Tyler Johnson? Two rotation players. Josh is still learning but has a lot of potential.

Among many other things, Josh needs to learn how to shoot before you talk up his "potential." Did you see the Cavs game last night? Without Love, they had something like 39 points at the half. Add Josh to that mix and they may well have gone scoreless....

Joshs shot has looked a lot better since December. His low fg% has come from missing easy shots at the rim which will improve with time.

if not interested that’s fine and understandable.

But what do you do with Kevin if you win Zion? If you want to keep Zion at pf maybe then it makes sense to move love for some young players/ picks.

If the Cavs get Zion, things change.