Charlotte Off Season Review

Moderators: pacers33granger, Mamba4Goat, Andre Roberstan, HartfordWhalers, Texas Chuck, Trader_Joe, loserX

How'd they do?

A
0
No votes
B+
0
No votes
B
0
No votes
B-
1
2%
C+
1
2%
C
0
No votes
C-
1
2%
D
11
26%
F
29
67%
 
Total votes: 43

User avatar
Mamba4Goat
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 6,839
And1: 4,054
Joined: Dec 13, 2013
         

Charlotte Off Season Review 

Post#1 » by Mamba4Goat » Thu Aug 1, 2019 11:39 pm

Hello all, here is Charlotte's review! Be warned that it isn't a very favored review and they are probably in the running for worst off season! Have fun reading! Let me know if you have any questions!

Charlotte Offseason Review

Key Losses:
Kemba Walker
Jeremy Lamb

Losses:
Frank Kaminsky
Tony Parker
Shelvin Mack
Random Mins

Draft:
12: PJ Washington
36: Cody Martin
52: Jalen Mcdaniels

Trades:
(With Boston) Kemba Walker S+T for Scary Terry S+T, 2020 2nd swap

Free Agency:
Terry Rozier 3/$56,700,000
PJ Washington (Rookie Deal)

Current Depth Chart: (taken from realgm with reason added in)
PG: Scary Terry/Devonte Graham
SG: Malik Monk/Nic Batum
SF: DeWayne Bacon/Miles Bridges/MKG
PF: PJ Washington/Marvin Williams
C: Cody Zeller/Bismack Biyombo/Willie Hernangomez


HartfordWhalers wrote:HW's Charlotte Offseason Review

Key Losses:
After 2 years of saying Kemba is our franchise, we won't trade Kemba, Charlotte decides to not pay him and he walks. Not trading Kemba was a sunk cost though, so at this point should they have maxed him and stayed mediocre? Maybe. For revenues and fan interest, mediocre is better than awful for 3 years. But if you want to get good, you need to get talent. Draft, free agency or trade; I take draft if I am Charlotte.

Losses:
Tony Parker not ending his career a lifelong Spur felt weird.

Draft:
Given where Charlotte is, I think they need to be going for the most upside possible at the end of the lottery. Is PJ Washington that? From what I see, probably not. Hopefully for Charlotte I am wrong on this one, but looking at their pick I wish they did six different things including possibly trading down and getting 2 bites at the apple. Going for a senior early in the 2nd round plays back at the same thing.

Trades:
So, Charlotte gave up Brooklyn's 2nd and will get Boston's 2nd if it is 54-60. And then they got a terrible contract Rozier. And if the let Kemba walk plan was to tank, spending that much to get a low end starter makes no sense. And low end starter is assuming significant improvement.

Free Agency:
Can we just give them an F already?

Current Depth Chart: (taken from realgm with reason added in)
I am looking forward to seeing Monk take 18 shots a game.

Needs:
Talent. A team vision. A new owner.

Additional Thoughts:
Charlotte traded a pair of 2nds for Willy Hernangómez, are they going to give him a bigger role?
Is a Batum trade going to happen, or will the forum have a daily Batum for Wiggins trade proposal?
Can someone take on MKG?

Projected Win/Loss: 22 wins


Off-Season Grade: D
Maybe Terry is the face needed to make tanking acceptable. I backed off the F referred to above because the team will probably tank hard enough to get a cornerstone prospect. But they really seemed quite bungling in the Rozier contract, and I am not sold on how they spent their draft aspects. They didn't move any vets. They didn't take on any bad salary with picks. They just kind of flopped; but at least they will be terrible. If they had added a little more talent I would have a full F.


pacers33granger wrote:Charlotte Offseason Review

Key Losses:
Lowballing Kemba was stupid. Why even make the offer? You know he's not going to accept it. Better to just let him know both parties should move on and that you will help him if he needs it to get somewhere specific. Lamb was gone basically no matter what and I'd almost have him in the losses column for Charlotte.

Losses:
I get that the bridge was burnt with Frank already, but he would seem to be a good candidate for them to bring back. That said, he also is kind of terrible, so there's that.

Draft:
Meh, Washington could be interesting. Problem is they should be swinging for the fences and decided again to play it safe which has been their MO and has caused a ton of issues. You're rebuilding and should not be taking guys who are likely to be 10 year vets and nothing more.

Trades:
Giving up a pick to overpay Rozier by an insane amount is easily the worst move of the offseason. I get that they couldn't offer that contract otherwise, but that means they had to jump through hoops to do so which makes it worse.

Free Agency:
Worst free agency of the offseason, 100%. Lose your franchise player because you lowballed him and then replace him with an average at best backup PG who is already 25 and will instantly be far and away the worst starting PG in the league. And then your GM makes an insane comment that they see him as a "lotto pick" which makes no sense and speaks volumes to the ineptitude in that front office.

And it cannot be overstated that the team constantly penny pinches but then hands out big contracts to role players (Rozier, Zeller, Williams, MKG, Batum, etc).

Final thoughts
I absolutely hate their offseason. They were a pretty bad team who managed to lose an All NBA caliber guy, a pretty good wing, and replaced them with a guy who is likely to be a negative overall even not accounting for the ridiculous contract. Unfortunately, there is almost nothing to look forward to on that roster outside of Bridge and maybe Monk. The rest are what they are or are downright bad.

Projected wins - 20. I don't see a single decent scorer on this team and they aren't a strong defensive team either.

Grade - F


Mamba4Goat wrote:Mamba's Charlotte Offseason Review

Key Losses:
Man, it sucks seeing Kemba go for nothing. However, I do get it. Saddling themselves with him on the supermax would make them permanently mediocre and I couldn't see Kemba taking too much less than everything they could offer to stay around. Hopefully they can start a full rebuild and get their feet underneath them now though.
Letting Lamb walk for nothing hurts too, especially since he took a really cheap deal and was basically their second best player (seriously, that's rough).

Losses:
Having Tony Parker there was weird. It'll be one of those weird trivia things where nobody ever remembers that Charlotte had Parker for a bit.

Draft:
Their draft is basically what's wrong with them. PJ Washington feels like a guy that a team like Boston should have drafted. He, imo, grades out to be a role player and that just isn't where they should be focused. They need guys that have some sort of potential and that isn't Washington.

Trades:
I am in the minority, but I liked them getting Scary Terry from Boston. He's the perfect "guy with potential" that they can give the reigns to and hope that something happens. I mean this in a non-harsh way but it's not like anyone is really going there.

Free Agency:
Aside from signing Rozier, Charlotte's hands were still tied in FA as they were pretty capped out without Walker anyways. Would've like for them to try and throw the MLE at a Jabari Parker type but I guess I get them reserving their salary as there likely aren't too many people lining up to come there.

Current Depth Chart: (taken from realgm with reason added in)
Man, this lineup is underwhelming....As Terry's biggest fan left on the board, even if he has a breakout year this team still will likely be the worst team in the NBA by a comfortable margin.

Needs:
Starting caliber players, NBA players in general, depth, good centers, assets, guys with potential, direction, Sam Hinkie (please), MJ to step away, Mitch to be fired, a ton of luck, guys with potential, etc.

Additional Thoughts:
The more I look at this, the more I'm talking myself into a Batum for Wiggins trade. Seriously, Monk and Terry are the only ones on this roster who have any star potential. Bridges and Washington (their recent picks) both grade to be role players (even high end if they pan out perfectly) but Wiggins would be nice as they don't really have anyone who can get the ball in the bucket either. They also should just implode and trade MKG, Marvin, Biz's expiring, and Zeller for any asset/bad contract packages that they can and just mail it in and develop their youth. They're going to have some rough years ahead of them.

Projected Win/Loss: 16 wins
They will be the worst team in the league by a healthy margin, even if Rozier is an all star this year and Monk in the MIP.

Off-Season Grade: D-
Getting Terry is what stopped me from making this a full F. This team is capped out, has blue chip prospects, has a very underwhelming everything, but at least they managed to get a NBA level PG after their superstar walked away.
John Stockton - All time leader in Assists and Steals.
User avatar
Kurt Heimlich
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,012
And1: 2,902
Joined: Jun 26, 2001

Re: Charlotte Off Season Review 

Post#2 » by Kurt Heimlich » Fri Aug 2, 2019 12:01 am

Off-season Grade: Oof
GhostOfChicago
General Manager
Posts: 8,915
And1: 7,747
Joined: Nov 02, 2013
 

Re: Charlotte Off Season Review 

Post#3 » by GhostOfChicago » Fri Aug 2, 2019 12:10 am

Image
Image
Stillwater
General Manager
Posts: 9,413
And1: 2,421
Joined: Jun 15, 2017
   

Re: Charlotte Off Season Review 

Post#4 » by Stillwater » Fri Aug 2, 2019 12:39 am

Probably should have just let Kemba go and tanked hard, but I get the move for Rozier since the lottery odds really suck now even when you tank.
I think they are still a treadmill team and certainly could have taken a chance on Sekou or Nas instead of the standard higher floor meh ceiling overpay.
Heck even overpicking Jalen Nowell at 12 who was severely undervalued as a playmaker in this draft falling to 43 or gambling on Bol would have been a cooler move to make with Kemba 1 foot out the door.
Anyway I think they get a D but also would not be surprised if they are still in the back half of the lottery by record running the tm
water aint the mirror unless you steal it
2019 REALGM draft contest winner
User avatar
KEMBAtheMETEOR
RealGM
Posts: 36,241
And1: 6,325
Joined: Feb 05, 2012

Re: Charlotte Off Season Review 

Post#5 » by KEMBAtheMETEOR » Fri Aug 2, 2019 12:48 am

I apologize that any of you actually had to write about this.

If D- was an option, I'd pick that, simply for the reason that we didn't punt a draft pick or a young prospect for cap relief or something.

But in basically every other way, this offseason was a total catastrophe- lowballing Kemba and letting him leave for nothing, panic-signing an awful player in Rozier in a panic move instead of conserving future cap space to take on bad salaries with picks attached, not making a single other move all summer, underwhelming picks... this offseason was an unmitigated disaster from start to finish.
formerly BizGilwalker
giberish
RealGM
Posts: 11,623
And1: 2,515
Joined: Mar 30, 2006
Location: Whereever you go - there you are

Re: Charlotte Off Season Review 

Post#6 » by giberish » Fri Aug 2, 2019 1:05 am

Would resigning Lamb have been plausible - it seems like he could have been better value then Rozier, then just filling in an MLE level PG. Or was there worry that he's just get in the way of Monk? Or perhaps he really wanted out as well and would have needed a much bigger deal to keep then Indy signed him for?
TheProfessor
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,732
And1: 543
Joined: May 01, 2010

Re: Charlotte Off Season Review 

Post#7 » by TheProfessor » Fri Aug 2, 2019 1:12 am

D, giving scary terry 20m a year for 3 years is a fireable offense.
User avatar
KEMBAtheMETEOR
RealGM
Posts: 36,241
And1: 6,325
Joined: Feb 05, 2012

Re: Charlotte Off Season Review 

Post#8 » by KEMBAtheMETEOR » Fri Aug 2, 2019 1:13 am

TheProfessor wrote:D, giving scary terry 20m a year for 3 years is a fireable offense.

We've had like 3 fireable offenses in the Kupchak era alone
formerly BizGilwalker
LofJ
General Manager
Posts: 8,421
And1: 5,557
Joined: Mar 29, 2014
   

Re: Charlotte Off Season Review 

Post#9 » by LofJ » Fri Aug 2, 2019 1:27 am

I just laugh at this point, there's nothing to be said that hasn't already been said.
Image
loserX
Senior Mod - NBA TnT Forum
Senior Mod - NBA TnT Forum
Posts: 38,209
And1: 13,858
Joined: Jun 29, 2006
       

Re: Charlotte Off Season Review 

Post#10 » by loserX » Fri Aug 2, 2019 2:04 am

Yeah, sorry to pile on, but at least Hornets fans are being good sports! Class acts.

Best move: I don't mind the drafting of PJ Washington. Maybe they could have looked at someone with a little higher ceiling, but this wasn't really a great draft, and Charlotte needs talent everywhere, so as long as the pick wasn't a total reach (and this wasn't) this would have been a perfectly fine move. Washington may be the team's best big man prospect since...Okafor?

Worst move: No surprises here. Pleading fiscal restraint to run off the team's best player ever and then throwing that restraint out the window to overpay Rozier is awful all the way around. Maybe Rozier surprises us all and blossoms with a bigger role and lowered expectations, but there was still literally no reason to pay him this money. I cannot be convinced the market was there.

One question: Well, I suppose there are a few. I guess the big one is what exactly is the plan now? The team does have some expiring vets it can peddle so the roster may look different by year's end, but the team needs to decide whether it's tanking or standing pat while the books clear, or what. The team badly needs talent, direction and leadership. What does ownership expect going forward?
BullyKing
Forum Mod - 76ers
Forum Mod - 76ers
Posts: 9,600
And1: 8,648
Joined: Jan 16, 2014

Re: Charlotte Off Season Review 

Post#11 » by BullyKing » Fri Aug 2, 2019 2:13 am

I really have to give it to Charlotte fans. This is one of the worst offseasons I can ever remember and they're taking it like champs. Deserve so much better of an owner than Jordan.

Not much more to add. Not trading Kemba was awful, compounding it with the Rozier albatross was just a gratuitous kick to the groin.

I absolutely hate their draft philosophy. I know they were late lottery picks but between Washington and Bridges, they seem fixated on low upside role players, which just makes no sense given where they are. I'm really rooting for them to get the number one pick next year. No team needs it more and no fan base deserves it more. Just a depressing situation all around.
NYSixersFan wrote:
the plan is to get as good as quickly as possible....I fully believe we could have been a borderline playoff team last year by adding young veterans....using or draft picks and cap space.....can I specifically tell you who? no.
User avatar
JDR720
Forum Mod - Hornets
Forum Mod - Hornets
Posts: 31,953
And1: 23,978
Joined: Jul 09, 2013
     

Re: Charlotte Off Season Review 

Post#12 » by JDR720 » Fri Aug 2, 2019 2:35 am

BullyKing wrote:I really have to give it to Charlotte fans. This is one of the worst offseasons I can ever remember and they're taking it like champs. Deserve so much better of an owner than Jordan.

Not much more to add. Not trading Kemba was awful, compounding it with the Rozier albatross was just a gratuitous kick to the groin.

I absolutely hate their draft philosophy. I know they were late lottery picks but between Washington and Bridges, they seem fixated on low upside role players, which just makes no sense given where they are. I'm really rooting for them to get the number one pick next year. No team needs it more and no fan base deserves it more. Just a depressing situation all around.

We are sports-sadomasochists. we like being punished.
User avatar
dakomish23
RealGM
Posts: 34,173
And1: 19,866
Joined: Sep 22, 2013
Location: Empire State
     

Re: Charlotte Off Season Review 

Post#13 » by dakomish23 » Fri Aug 23, 2019 6:10 pm

BullyKing wrote:I really have to give it to Charlotte fans. This is one of the worst offseasons I can ever remember and they're taking it like champs. Deserve so much better of an owner than Jordan.

Not much more to add. Not trading Kemba was awful, compounding it with the Rozier albatross was just a gratuitous kick to the groin.

I absolutely hate their draft philosophy. I know they were late lottery picks but between Washington and Bridges, they seem fixated on low upside role players, which just makes no sense given where they are. I'm really rooting for them to get the number one pick next year. No team needs it more and no fan base deserves it more. Just a depressing situation all around.


You think Bridges when drafted had low upside?

Maybe I’m biased b/c I liked him as a prospect somewhat
Read on Twitter
User avatar
dakomish23
RealGM
Posts: 34,173
And1: 19,866
Joined: Sep 22, 2013
Location: Empire State
     

Re: Charlotte Off Season Review 

Post#14 » by dakomish23 » Fri Aug 23, 2019 6:11 pm

They gotta move Marvin. Someone will bite. Even if it’s a mild asset, just start tearing it down as you can. Even better would be to take a bad contract back for s better asset, but I’m not sure they’ll go that route.




Read on Twitter
jbk1234
Forum Mod - Cavs
Forum Mod - Cavs
Posts: 36,158
And1: 20,622
Joined: Dec 22, 2010
   

Re: Charlotte Off Season Review 

Post#15 » by jbk1234 » Sat Aug 24, 2019 7:29 pm

I like Kemba, but giving him a supermax, or even a five-year max probably would've been a mistake. If he's your best player, you're a bubble team in the East, and unless the Hornets were prepared to mortgage their future to get off some contracts, that roster would've been locked until 2021. Building around a 31-year old Kemba then via F.A. wouldn't have been easy.

I don't think this off-season, in particular, that was the problem. The problem was the three or four off-seasons that preceded it. The bill just came due this summer.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app
It is highly unlikely that the Cavs will agree with your Kevin Love evaluation for the purpose of a trade.
pacers33granger
Forum Mod - Pacers
Forum Mod - Pacers
Posts: 11,932
And1: 4,828
Joined: Sep 26, 2006
 

Re: Charlotte Off Season Review 

Post#16 » by pacers33granger » Sat Aug 24, 2019 7:37 pm

jbk1234 wrote:
I don't think this off-season, in particular, that was the problem. The problem was the three or four off-seasons that preceded it. The bill just came due this summer.


This is 100% right but the biggest issue is they didn't learn anything apparently. They again went for a lower upside prospect in the draft and badly overpaid a role player, both of which are the types moves that caused this mess.
jbk1234
Forum Mod - Cavs
Forum Mod - Cavs
Posts: 36,158
And1: 20,622
Joined: Dec 22, 2010
   

Re: Charlotte Off Season Review 

Post#17 » by jbk1234 » Sat Aug 24, 2019 8:48 pm

pacers33granger wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
I don't think this off-season, in particular, that was the problem. The problem was the three or four off-seasons that preceded it. The bill just came due this summer.


This is 100% right but the biggest issue is they didn't learn anything apparently. They again went for a lower upside prospect in the draft and badly overpaid a role player, both of which are the types moves that caused this mess.
I'm not as down on Rozier as most and I really don't think that cap space will matter given the duration of the contract. They've got more expiring contracts than they can likely move as is.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app
It is highly unlikely that the Cavs will agree with your Kevin Love evaluation for the purpose of a trade.
pacers33granger
Forum Mod - Pacers
Forum Mod - Pacers
Posts: 11,932
And1: 4,828
Joined: Sep 26, 2006
 

Re: Charlotte Off Season Review 

Post#18 » by pacers33granger » Sun Aug 25, 2019 12:04 am

jbk1234 wrote:
pacers33granger wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
I don't think this off-season, in particular, that was the problem. The problem was the three or four off-seasons that preceded it. The bill just came due this summer.


This is 100% right but the biggest issue is they didn't learn anything apparently. They again went for a lower upside prospect in the draft and badly overpaid a role player, both of which are the types moves that caused this mess.
I'm not as down on Rozier as most and I really don't think that cap space will matter given the duration of the contract. They've got more expiring contracts than they can likely move as is.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app


That's not a reason to hand out the worst contract of the offseason to a bench player. And it's still exactly what got them into their current mess. I'm sure they felt the cap space wouldn't matter much when handing out the deals to guys like Zeller and MKG, but it came back to bite them this offseason.
jbk1234
Forum Mod - Cavs
Forum Mod - Cavs
Posts: 36,158
And1: 20,622
Joined: Dec 22, 2010
   

Re: Charlotte Off Season Review 

Post#19 » by jbk1234 » Sun Aug 25, 2019 12:16 am

pacers33granger wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
pacers33granger wrote:
This is 100% right but the biggest issue is they didn't learn anything apparently. They again went for a lower upside prospect in the draft and badly overpaid a role player, both of which are the types moves that caused this mess.
I'm not as down on Rozier as most and I really don't think that cap space will matter given the duration of the contract. They've got more expiring contracts than they can likely move as is.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app


That's not a reason to hand out the worst contract of the offseason to a bench player. And it's still exactly what got them into their current mess. I'm sure they felt the cap space wouldn't matter much when handing out the deals to guys like Zeller and MKG, but it came back to bite them this offseason.


I'm not at all convinced it was the worst contract handed out this offseason. He's not even getting $20M per. There are far scarier contracts. People keep calling him a backup but this is a league where Teague, Augustine, Rubio, Bledsoe, Reggie Jackson, Dragic, Trey Burke, and Rondo will all likely be starting on opening day. How many of those players are definitely better than Rozier?
It is highly unlikely that the Cavs will agree with your Kevin Love evaluation for the purpose of a trade.
pacers33granger
Forum Mod - Pacers
Forum Mod - Pacers
Posts: 11,932
And1: 4,828
Joined: Sep 26, 2006
 

Re: Charlotte Off Season Review 

Post#20 » by pacers33granger » Sun Aug 25, 2019 12:20 am

jbk1234 wrote:
pacers33granger wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:I'm not as down on Rozier as most and I really don't think that cap space will matter given the duration of the contract. They've got more expiring contracts than they can likely move as is.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app


That's not a reason to hand out the worst contract of the offseason to a bench player. And it's still exactly what got them into their current mess. I'm sure they felt the cap space wouldn't matter much when handing out the deals to guys like Zeller and MKG, but it came back to bite them this offseason.


I'm not at all convinced it was the worst contract handed out this offseason. He's not even getting $20M per. There are far scarier contracts. People keep calling him a backup but this is a league where Teague, Augustine, Rubio, Bledsoe, Reggie Jackson, Dragic, Trey Burke, and Rondo will all likely be starting on opening day. How many of those players are definitely better than Rozier?


He's 100% a backup. As are Augustin, Burke, and Rondo. The rest are unquestionably better than Rozier. Outside of him being kind of young (but not really as he's 25) and the hope he'll improve, he hasn't shown that he does a single thing well. He's a mediocre defender, doesn't distribute well, and can't even break 40% shooting. You could say he doesn't really turn the ball over, but it's hard to when you just jack up bad shots.

Return to Trades and Transactions