Make the Kings a playoff team

[TheProfessor]

Alright just to toss out something different:

TOR out: Gasol, Powell, OG
TOR in: Barnes, Bogdan, Bell

MIN out: RoCo, Bell
MIN in: Bjelica, OG, 2 2nds

SAC out: Barnes, Bogdan, Bjelica, 2 2nds
SAC in: Gasol, RoCo, Powell

Fox/CoJo/Yogi
Buddy/Powell
RoCo/Ariza
Bagley/Holmes
Gasol/Dedmon/Holmes

Yeah, Nooo. Just from the Raptors perspective, First Masai has stated that OG is untouchable. Second, Gasol is a positive asset. Powell is a neutral asset, OG is a positive asset. Barnes is an albatross waiting to happen, Bjelica is a neutral asset and Bogdan is well a positive expiring. Yeah it's not happening.

[Sactowndog]

What are you searching for? Dedmon is as solid of a fitting role player next to Bagley as I’ve seen mentioned yet.

Yeah if Dedmon can keep up his shooting he’s a much better fit than Kelly. Vastly superior defender and generally better cog type.

My philosophy is to get with the best player you can as long as they are a decent fit. I think Olynk is a good fit next to Bagley and he is just a better player. So I would prefer Olynyk over Dedmond (not that I hate Dedmond, don't get me wrong)

I disagree with this pretty strongly.

Olynyk's strength is his outside shooting and Dedmon has a higher percentage from 3 than Olynyk last year. Kelly shoots at 35.4% from 3. Meanwhile Dedmon shoots at 38.2%. Dedmon is more of a threat to stretch the floor which is critical with both Fox and Bagley.

On the defensive end the Kings lacked a rim protector and Dedmon average 1.1 blocks a game and 5.9 defensive rebounds. Olynyk averages .5 blocks and 3.8 defensive rebounds.

[MoneyTalks41890]

Yeah if Dedmon can keep up his shooting he’s a much better fit than Kelly. Vastly superior defender and generally better cog type.

My philosophy is to get with the best player you can as long as they are a decent fit. I think Olynk is a good fit next to Bagley and he is just a better player. So I would prefer Olynyk over Dedmond (not that I hate Dedmond, don't get me wrong)

I disagree with this pretty strongly.

Olynyk's strength is his outside shooting and Dedmon has a higher percentage from 3 than Olynyk last year. Kelly shoots at 35.4% from 3. Meanwhile Dedmon shoots at 38.2%. Dedmon is more of a threat to stretch the floor which is critical with both Fox and Bagley.

On the defensive end the Kings lacked a rim protector and Dedmon average 1.1 blocks a game and 5.9 defensive rebounds. Olynyk averages .5 blocks and 3.8 defensive rebounds.

Kelly can kind of put the ball on the floor and pass. But Dedmon is a better defender and 3 point spot up shooter.

[Call Me Geoff]

Don't touch the Kings. Their best offseason addition is the growth of Fox, Harry and Bagley. Fox is going to be a beast and I'm extremely excited about the jump Bagley should make this year. Buddy is supremely underrated, he's one of the better 2 guards in the league. With the vet offseason additions and the talents of Bagley and Fox I see the Kings competing for not just an 8 seed but possibly pushing for as high as a 4 seed.

[Sactowndog]

My philosophy is to get with the best player you can as long as they are a decent fit. I think Olynk is a good fit next to Bagley and he is just a better player. So I would prefer Olynyk over Dedmond (not that I hate Dedmond, don't get me wrong)

I disagree with this pretty strongly.

Olynyk's strength is his outside shooting and Dedmon has a higher percentage from 3 than Olynyk last year. Kelly shoots at 35.4% from 3. Meanwhile Dedmon shoots at 38.2%. Dedmon is more of a threat to stretch the floor which is critical with both Fox and Bagley.

On the defensive end the Kings lacked a rim protector and Dedmon average 1.1 blocks a game and 5.9 defensive rebounds. Olynyk averages .5 blocks and 3.8 defensive rebounds.

Kelly can kind of put the ball on the floor and pass. But Dedmon is a better defender and 3 point spot up shooter.

Yes he can but the question was next to Bagley. Bagley can put the ball on the floor and hopefully learns to pass. The player next to Bagley needs to stretch the floor, protect the rim and grab rebounds.

[MoneyTalks41890]

I disagree with this pretty strongly.

Olynyk's strength is his outside shooting and Dedmon has a higher percentage from 3 than Olynyk last year. Kelly shoots at 35.4% from 3. Meanwhile Dedmon shoots at 38.2%. Dedmon is more of a threat to stretch the floor which is critical with both Fox and Bagley.

On the defensive end the Kings lacked a rim protector and Dedmon average 1.1 blocks a game and 5.9 defensive rebounds. Olynyk averages .5 blocks and 3.8 defensive rebounds.

Kelly can kind of put the ball on the floor and pass. But Dedmon is a better defender and 3 point spot up shooter.

Yes he can but the question was next to Bagley. Bagley can put the ball on the floor and hopefully learns to pass. The player next to Bagley needs to stretch the floor, protect the rim and grab rebounds.

Yeah I agree I think I am just saying Dedmon is the better fit but Kelly the better player overall, but I like Dedmon there better

[BoogieTime]

Is Olynyk even a center?

[CoachD]

I think the Kings missed their opportunity in the summer, when they apparently had a monster offer on the table for Horford, and then he bailed on it for Philly.

Horford would have added so much value on the court and to their culture

That was the move

[rpa]

The answer to this question is entirely dependent on how improved Fox and Bagley are this season (and, to a lesser extent, Giles, Hield, and Bogdan). If there's little improvement then they're screwed. If Fox and Bagley make jumps as Fox did from season 1 => 2 then Fox is an allstar and they're in the playoffs. Without knowing that you're shooting at a moving target.

[becorz]

Kelly can kind of put the ball on the floor and pass. But Dedmon is a better defender and 3 point spot up shooter.

Yes he can but the question was next to Bagley. Bagley can put the ball on the floor and hopefully learns to pass. The player next to Bagley needs to stretch the floor, protect the rim and grab rebounds.

Yeah I agree I think I am just saying Dedmon is the better fit but Kelly the better player overall, but I like Dedmon there better

That is essentially what I was arguing too. Then again, if Giles works out....he would be a pretty similar player to Olynyk. And that seems to be the direction the Kings want to go, with Dedmond kind of bridging the gap.

[Mr Swagtastic]

Alright just to toss out something different:

TOR out: Gasol, Powell, OG
TOR in: Barnes, Bogdan, Bell

MIN out: RoCo, Bell
MIN in: Bjelica, OG, 2 2nds

SAC out: Barnes, Bogdan, Bjelica, 2 2nds
SAC in: Gasol, RoCo, Powell

Fox/CoJo/Yogi
Buddy/Powell
RoCo/Ariza
Bagley/Holmes
Gasol/Dedmon/Holmes

Barnes isn't worth $60 million over the next 3 years, IMHO he's not a great defender and IMHO worth his deal. Bogdanovic is a good piece but where is his minutes going to come from? This is a bad use of future cap space to risk that

PG: Lowry/VanVleet/McCaw
SG: Bogdanovic/Thomas/Davis
SF: Barnes/Johnson/Hollis-Jefferson
PF: Siakam/Hollis-Jefferson/Boucher
C: Ibaka/Bell/???

That team isn't good it's a treadmill team with no depth no cap and direction.

[psman2]

Alright just to toss out something different:

TOR out: Gasol, Powell, OG
TOR in: Barnes, Bogdan, Bell

MIN out: RoCo, Bell
MIN in: Bjelica, OG, 2 2nds

SAC out: Barnes, Bogdan, Bjelica, 2 2nds
SAC in: Gasol, RoCo, Powell

Fox/CoJo/Yogi
Buddy/Powell
RoCo/Ariza
Bagley/Holmes
Gasol/Dedmon/Holmes

Barnes isn't worth $60 million over the next 3 years, IMHO he's not a great defender and IMHO worth his deal. Bogdanovic is a good piece but where is his minutes going to come from? This is a bad use of future cap space to risk that

PG: Lowry/VanVleet/McCaw
SG: Bogdanovic/Thomas/Davis
SF: Barnes/Johnson/Hollis-Jefferson
PF: Siakam/Hollis-Jefferson/Boucher
C: Ibaka/Bell/???

That team isn't good it's a treadmill team with no depth no cap and direction.

I agree I wouldn't rather have Gasol over Barnes this year if your goal is to win. Likewise I would rather have Gasol over Barnes if you goal is to blow it up next year or want cap space. So there is no scenario I would want to make that swap.

I have the value between OG and Bogdan very close, but for Toronto I keep the younger player with more team control at a position of need.

[BoogieTime]

Anunoby is absolutely not good so far, and has had injury issuees.

The cap I can see, as they should bottom out once their vets all retire, but it’s not a FA destination and I don’t see better players than prime BOgi/Barnes ending up there (even as Harrison is a bit overpaid) via that route.

[BoogieTime]

Alright just to toss out something different:

TOR out: Gasol, Powell, OG
TOR in: Barnes, Bogdan, Bell

MIN out: RoCo, Bell
MIN in: Bjelica, OG, 2 2nds

SAC out: Barnes, Bogdan, Bjelica, 2 2nds
SAC in: Gasol, RoCo, Powell

Fox/CoJo/Yogi
Buddy/Powell
RoCo/Ariza
Bagley/Holmes
Gasol/Dedmon/Holmes

Yeah, Nooo. Just from the Raptors perspective, First Masai has stated that OG is untouchable. Second, Gasol is a positive asset. Powell is a neutral asset, OG is a positive asset. Barnes is an albatross waiting to happen, Bjelica is a neutral asset and Bogdan is well a positive expiring. Yeah it's not happening.

OG has been terrible by any metric. He’s the hope, besides awkward Siakam of any possible upside for the Raptors to continue post-Leonard. It’s going to be a rebuild for you guys.

[psman2]

Alright just to toss out something different:

TOR out: Gasol, Powell, OG
TOR in: Barnes, Bogdan, Bell

MIN out: RoCo, Bell
MIN in: Bjelica, OG, 2 2nds

SAC out: Barnes, Bogdan, Bjelica, 2 2nds
SAC in: Gasol, RoCo, Powell

Fox/CoJo/Yogi
Buddy/Powell
RoCo/Ariza
Bagley/Holmes
Gasol/Dedmon/Holmes

Yeah, Nooo. Just from the Raptors perspective, First Masai has stated that OG is untouchable. Second, Gasol is a positive asset. Powell is a neutral asset, OG is a positive asset. Barnes is an albatross waiting to happen, Bjelica is a neutral asset and Bogdan is well a positive expiring. Yeah it's not happening.

OG has been terrible by any metric. He’s the hope, besides awkward Siakam of any possible upside for the Raptors to continue post-Leonard. It’s going to be a rebuild for you guys.

I have to disagree here. OG's 1st year showed a lot of promise by any METRIC. Those metrics had him playing at a higher level than Bogdan's last two years.

I would gamble on OG in a rebuild over having to pay a 28 year old Bogdan next year.

[Mr Swagtastic]

Anunoby is absolutely not good so far, and has had injury issues.

Anunoby has seemed a shot that Raptors are not going to descend post Kawhi

The cap, I can see that angle for Toronto. Though I don’t see Toronto as a FA destination, having a lot of good young players coming up, or good FA classes coming up, so I wouldn’t mind getting the two best players going forward, BOgiBarnes, if I was them. That’s the difference in fanbase perception though

Money and a world class organization talk volumes. Barnes aint worth that money. Anunoby locked down Harden, he had a bad year because of the death of his father, a stomach injury and being thrust from his starting role to a bench guy. I don't think Toronto moves him right now he's 6'8 215lbs with a 7'3" wingspan and can keep up with guards and forwards. I think with Matt Thomas we don't need Bogdanovic especially if it costs Anunoby. I don't see him as a star but I think we hold onto him and see how he does with this team and under the tutelage of Hollis-Jefferson and Stanley Johnson

[BoogieTime]

Yeah, Nooo. Just from the Raptors perspective, First Masai has stated that OG is untouchable. Second, Gasol is a positive asset. Powell is a neutral asset, OG is a positive asset. Barnes is an albatross waiting to happen, Bjelica is a neutral asset and Bogdan is well a positive expiring. Yeah it's not happening.

OG has been terrible by any metric. He’s the hope, besides awkward Siakam of any possible upside for the Raptors to continue post-Leonard. It’s going to be a rebuild for you guys.

I have to disagree here. OG's 1st year showed a lot of promise by any METRIC. Those metrics had him playing at a higher level than Bogdan's last two years.

I would gamble on OG in a rebuild over having to pay a 28 year old Bogdan next year.

Well, he was very subpar last year by any metric, and IMO doesn’t have near the value Raptors fans on this thread have portrayed

I can make excuses for Bogdan too, he was injured a lot of last year, but think he can break out as a starter and continue off his FIBA run.

But as I said, in a rebuild, which is what Toronto is going to do post their vets retiring, it might be the play to bottom out anyways

[BoogieTime]

Anunoby is absolutely not good so far, and has had injury issues.

Anunoby has seemed a shot that Raptors are not going to descend post Kawhi

The cap, I can see that angle for Toronto. Though I don’t see Toronto as a FA destination, having a lot of good young players coming up, or good FA classes coming up, so I wouldn’t mind getting the two best players going forward, BOgiBarnes, if I was them. That’s the difference in fanbase perception though

Money and a world class organization talk volumes. Barnes aint worth that money. Anunoby locked down Harden, he had a bad year because of the death of his father, a stomach injury and being thrust from his starting role to a bench guy. I don't think Toronto moves him right now he's 6'8 215lbs with a 7'3" wingspan and can keep up with guards and forwards. I think with Matt Thomas we don't need Bogdanovic especially if it costs Anunoby. I don't see him as a star but I think we hold onto him and see how he does with this team and under the tutelage of Hollis-Jefferson and Stanley Johnson

Barnes may not be worth the money, though he’s a solid 4th option type vet coming into the meat of his career, and it will look better as the cap rises/his contract descends, but I haven’t come up with a better FA that has signed in Toronto lately? Next years FA class is paltry as well

[psman2]

OG has been terrible by any metric. He’s the hope, besides awkward Siakam of any possible upside for the Raptors to continue post-Leonard. It’s going to be a rebuild for you guys.

I have to disagree here. OG's 1st year showed a lot of promise by any METRIC. Those metrics had him playing at a higher level than Bogdan's last two years.

I would gamble on OG in a rebuild over having to pay a 28 year old Bogdan next year.

Well, he was very subpar last year by any metric, and IMO doesn’t have near the value Raptors fans on this thread have portrayed

I can make excuses for Bogdan too, he was injured a lot of last year, but think he can break out as a starter and continue off his FIBA run.

But as I said, in a rebuild, which is what Toronto is going to do post their vets retiring, it might be the play to bottom out anyways

I didn't make any excuses or talk about circumstances. I simply refuted you false metric statement. OG 1st year saw him post a higher RPM, TS, WS, BPM, and VORP than Bogdan in either of his years. Those are metrics right?

Again I have their trade value very close. If I was a win now team that had a need at SG I would make a move for Bogdan before OG. IF I was rebuilding or had a bigger need at SF I would go for OG.

[Mr Swagtastic]

Anunoby is absolutely not good so far, and has had injury issues.

Anunoby has seemed a shot that Raptors are not going to descend post Kawhi

The cap, I can see that angle for Toronto. Though I don’t see Toronto as a FA destination, having a lot of good young players coming up, or good FA classes coming up, so I wouldn’t mind getting the two best players going forward, BOgiBarnes, if I was them. That’s the difference in fanbase perception though

Money and a world class organization talk volumes. Barnes aint worth that money. Anunoby locked down Harden, he had a bad year because of the death of his father, a stomach injury and being thrust from his starting role to a bench guy. I don't think Toronto moves him right now he's 6'8 215lbs with a 7'3" wingspan and can keep up with guards and forwards. I think with Matt Thomas we don't need Bogdanovic especially if it costs Anunoby. I don't see him as a star but I think we hold onto him and see how he does with this team and under the tutelage of Hollis-Jefferson and Stanley Johnson

Barnes may not be worth the money, though he’s a solid 4th option type vet coming into the meat of his career, and it will look better as the cap rises/his contract descends, but I haven’t come up with a better FA that has signed in Toronto lately? Next years FA class is paltry as well

Your basing Toronto's fa class on having no cap and the old CBA. No matter how you try to spin Barnes he ain't worth $60 million over 3 years I am sorry 14 ppg 5 rpg and 1 apg isn't going to fly. Toronto is saving for 2021 more likely and having $20 million tied up in Barnes then whatever Siakam, VanVleet and Bogdanovic get. Look at the names you tell me who you take Barnes over, I rather use that $20 million that Barnes is getting to overpay Beal, Gobert or Holliday or massively overpay Giannis Antetokounmpo. Wishful thinking I know but I ain't a fan of treadmill teams and like I said Barnes doesn't help us at the price of Anunoby and Gasol and Powell