Big al and Richardson for THJ and Maxi

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Big al and Richardson for THJ and Maxi 

Post#1 » by Pinkyring » Tue Jun 30, 2020 9:11 am

Ok i wanted to do something fresh some might hate it but it intrigues me.

DAL IN
AL HORFORD
JOSH RICHARDSON

PHILLY IN
TIM HARDAWAY JR
MAXI KLEBER
DWIGHT POWELL

philly is a tough spot, on paper they're a contender but i dont chemistry or coaching get them there. There is also the problem of basically having 4 max players with Richardson expiring next summer. This deal gives them flexibility financially while staying balanced, maxi is the do it big needed next to Embiid so he can thrive, THJ has shown with a tremendous playmaker next to him, he can fill it up from deep efficiently. I also think just based on reputation he will be cheaper for philly to retain than Richardson would.

For Dallas, they gamble taking on als salary although it is offset some by removing powell. They a smart veteran presence that can add a ton of value next to and mentoring KP. Richardson is a wing would could thrive with a bit bigger offensive load at the wing as well as being a more natural fit next to luka
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Re: Big al and Richardson for THJ and Maxi 

Post#2 » by daoneandonly » Tue Jun 30, 2020 11:23 am

DOnt see philly doing that, and you really should include Powell in the thread title given he makes more than Kleber.
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Re: Big al and Richardson for THJ and Maxi 

Post#3 » by ACM_Dirk » Tue Jun 30, 2020 11:31 am

Mixed emotions. Horford intrigues me, he brings solid defense, good playmaking, PO experience. But his contract is huge and awful, that move'd destroy every Dallas hope for 2021 FA (in which I'm not very confident, but that's not the point).
And I love JRich fit next to Luka. But it's very risky, Richardson is essentialy a rental, and he could walk away or demand to be overpaid.
If JRich is our target, the better move is to wait until 2021 and don't ruin our chemistry. Maxi and THJ are two important pieces of this team, Powell could be deadmoney in next years but so do Horford.
Mavs pass on this deal.
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Re: Big al and Richardson for THJ and Maxi 

Post#4 » by Apz » Tue Jun 30, 2020 12:12 pm

Would also pass. Seen to age and recent play, I cant see us taking on Als contract. Would have loved richardson, but giving up kleber and thj, nah that price is too high. And wouldnt mind getting out of powells contract but would rather roll the dice on him getting back as he were over eating horfords contract.

I would wait til next summer and see how it looks. No point in getting someone like Horford or a josh rental, atm we cant even be sure it will be a 20/21 season if a 2nd corona wave comes. Just wait and see imo if there isnt players you want for a longer time
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Re: Big al and Richardson for THJ and Maxi 

Post#5 » by Texas Chuck » Tue Jun 30, 2020 1:05 pm

Seems like a total non-starter for the Sixers. They give up the two best players and don't really gain much financial flexibility unless they let THJ walk which just creates bigger problems for them.

I love Maxi, but you don't give up Horford and Richardson for him.
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Re: Big al and Richardson for THJ and Maxi 

Post#6 » by hugepatsfan » Tue Jun 30, 2020 1:18 pm

Dallas should send Wright back as well. Essentially that breaks this down to two trades.

1) JRich for Hardaway. Dallas upgrades their talent, but PHI gets the better shooter which helps balance roster.

2) Horford for Wright/Powell/Kleber. Philly breaks Horford down into 3 smaller deals. Dallas consolidates 3 players into a better one. This really doesn’t hurt their cap space for ‘21 because the 3 players combined make right about what Horford does. I think it marginally decreases it because of cap holds for roster spots. PHI would have an easier time moving smaller deals to get under the tax in future years.

I think Dallas, like Philly, might prefer to keep Hardaway’s shooting over JRich’s overall game. And then the same way Horford/Embiid hasn’t been ideal, same may hold true with Porzingis. Although not as bad because Porzingis is a more comfortable shooter.
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Re: Big al and Richardson for THJ and Maxi 

Post#7 » by Apz » Tue Jun 30, 2020 2:25 pm

JRich for THJ. I might do that. Probably would

Problem with Horford is that he is pretty much unmovable. If he really start to decline, which it looks like, thats a lot of money bound up in a piece that might not even get to play much. While wright will continue to be movable, Kleber probably fits better with KP.

Mavs need to play it smart. If they get stuck with Al and he sucks, they might lose Luka. Better to keep their options open and have tradable pieces
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Re: Big al and Richardson for THJ and Maxi 

Post#8 » by Mr B » Tue Jun 30, 2020 2:40 pm

I would takes hard pass on this trade if I’m Dallas. Losing cap flexibility in 2021 is the main reason. Also I just don’t see the Mavs giving up THJ and Maxi. I like the players that would be coming back to Dallas but their talent is not enough to offset the potential they could get in free agency 2021.


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Re: Big al and Richardson for THJ and Maxi 

Post#9 » by Pinkyring » Tue Jun 30, 2020 3:08 pm

Texas Chuck wrote:Seems like a total non-starter for the Sixers. They give up the two best players and don't really gain much financial flexibility unless they let THJ walk which just creates bigger problems for them.

I love Maxi, but you don't give up Horford and Richardson for him.

It depends on what you think they can as free agents, i think next summer 4 for 60 can secure tim and Richardson is probably 4 for 80, so philly is essentially saving 15m a yr in cap replacing Horford with maxi and powell and Richardson with hardaway. While getting younger upfront
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Re: Big al and Richardson for THJ and Maxi 

Post#10 » by youngcrev » Tue Jun 30, 2020 3:24 pm

The Sixers downgrade 2 spots without making up a ton of ground salary wise. I could see it without Powell (proposed something similar a while back), but I just don't see the benefit with him in there.
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Re: Big al and Richardson for THJ and Maxi 

Post#11 » by matt6715 » Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:40 pm

I don't think its a huge stretch to say that the Mavs would value Maxi on his deal way, way more than they would value Horford on his.
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Re: Big al and Richardson for THJ and Maxi 

Post#12 » by Mr B » Tue Jun 30, 2020 6:49 pm

matt6715 wrote:I don't think its a huge stretch to say that the Mavs would value Maxi on his deal way, way more than they would value Horford on his.

Facts


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Re: Big al and Richardson for THJ and Maxi 

Post#13 » by psman2 » Tue Jun 30, 2020 6:54 pm

Mr B wrote:
matt6715 wrote:I don't think its a huge stretch to say that the Mavs would value Maxi on his deal way, way more than they would value Horford on his.

Facts


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Isn't it also a fact that Powell is a big negative next year and likely long term as well and JRich > than THJ.

I think you would have to swap Powell for Wright as others posted to make this enticing enough for Philly to consider.
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Re: Big al and Richardson for THJ and Maxi 

Post#14 » by matt6715 » Tue Jun 30, 2020 6:56 pm

psman2 wrote:
Mr B wrote:
matt6715 wrote:I don't think its a huge stretch to say that the Mavs would value Maxi on his deal way, way more than they would value Horford on his.

Facts


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Isn't it also a fact that Powell is a big negative next year and likely long term as well and JRich > than THJ.

I think you would have to swap Powell for Wright as others posted to make this enticing enough for Philly to consider.


While Richardson is definitely an overall upgrade, Hardaway has played his role impossibly well this year and has blossomed into a true 3rd scoring threat and lethal catch and shoot 3 point shooter. Richardson is a decent shooter but not in THJ's (current) league.
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Re: Big al and Richardson for THJ and Maxi 

Post#15 » by psman2 » Tue Jun 30, 2020 6:58 pm

matt6715 wrote:
psman2 wrote:
Mr B wrote:Facts


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Isn't it also a fact that Powell is a big negative next year and likely long term as well and JRich > than THJ.

I think you would have to swap Powell for Wright as others posted to make this enticing enough for Philly to consider.


While Richardson is definitely an overall upgrade, Hardaway has played his role impossibly well this year and has blossomed into a true 3rd scoring threat and lethal catch and shoot 3 point shooter. Richardson is a decent shooter but not in THJ's (current) league.


No question that THJ had a rebound season, but I feel confident that Philly would prefer sticking it out with JRich by a rather large margin over THJ.
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Re: Big al and Richardson for THJ and Maxi 

Post#16 » by Pinkyring » Tue Jun 30, 2020 7:20 pm

psman2 wrote:
matt6715 wrote:
psman2 wrote:
Isn't it also a fact that Powell is a big negative next year and likely long term as well and JRich > than THJ.

I think you would have to swap Powell for Wright as others posted to make this enticing enough for Philly to consider.


While Richardson is definitely an overall upgrade, Hardaway has played his role impossibly well this year and has blossomed into a true 3rd scoring threat and lethal catch and shoot 3 point shooter. Richardson is a decent shooter but not in THJ's (current) league.


No question that THJ had a rebound season, but I feel confident that Philly would prefer sticking it out with JRich by a rather large margin over THJ.

Universally Richardson would be the preference i dont think that's debatable, that said philly financially is in deep and next summer i think thj is 5m cheaper a year, that's a nice savings for philly without losing a ton of talent in addition to the 8 or 9 million savings for powell/maxi Horford portion
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Re: Big al and Richardson for THJ and Maxi 

Post#17 » by psman2 » Tue Jun 30, 2020 7:50 pm

Pinkyring wrote:
psman2 wrote:
matt6715 wrote:
While Richardson is definitely an overall upgrade, Hardaway has played his role impossibly well this year and has blossomed into a true 3rd scoring threat and lethal catch and shoot 3 point shooter. Richardson is a decent shooter but not in THJ's (current) league.


No question that THJ had a rebound season, but I feel confident that Philly would prefer sticking it out with JRich by a rather large margin over THJ.

Universally Richardson would be the preference i dont think that's debatable, that said philly financially is in deep and next summer i think thj is 5m cheaper a year, that's a nice savings for philly without losing a ton of talent in addition to the 8 or 9 million savings for powell/maxi Horford portion


I have THJ at $18,975,000 and JRich 10,865,952 next season. Are you referring to what it would cost to resign them in 21-22 season?

Edit: I think next summer is implying next contract after rereading your post.
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Re: Big al and Richardson for THJ and Maxi 

Post#18 » by Pinkyring » Tue Jun 30, 2020 7:57 pm

psman2 wrote:
Pinkyring wrote:
psman2 wrote:
No question that THJ had a rebound season, but I feel confident that Philly would prefer sticking it out with JRich by a rather large margin over THJ.

Universally Richardson would be the preference i dont think that's debatable, that said philly financially is in deep and next summer i think thj is 5m cheaper a year, that's a nice savings for philly without losing a ton of talent in addition to the 8 or 9 million savings for powell/maxi Horford portion


I have THJ at $18,975,000 and JRich 10,865,952 next season. Are you referring to what it would cost to resign them in 21-22 season?

Edit: I think next summer is implying next contract after rereading your post.

Yes next summer when they're free agents to re sign
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Re: Big al and Richardson for THJ and Maxi 

Post#19 » by psman2 » Tue Jun 30, 2020 8:14 pm

Pinkyring wrote:
psman2 wrote:
Pinkyring wrote:Universally Richardson would be the preference i dont think that's debatable, that said philly financially is in deep and next summer i think thj is 5m cheaper a year, that's a nice savings for philly without losing a ton of talent in addition to the 8 or 9 million savings for powell/maxi Horford portion


I have THJ at $18,975,000 and JRich 10,865,952 next season. Are you referring to what it would cost to resign them in 21-22 season?

Edit: I think next summer is implying next contract after rereading your post.

Yes next summer when they're free agents to re sign


I just don't think Philly takes this overall talent downgrade with out trying other avenues 1st. Maybe they use pick 20 this year to get off so some of Horford contract over downgrading JRich.

Something like this from Memphis might work. Dieng/Anderson for Horford/#20. Dieng is still a very good expiring backup center that they likely can resign to a reasonable deal if it works out. Anderson has an additional year at 9.9 but he is still a rotation worthy wing so not just dead money. Memphis likely has to follow up with a Val trade to make space in the lineup, maybe GS TPE and some 2nds. I am on the fence here for Memphis, this hurts our cap space hopes in 21 but if Horford bounces back could be a great player/vet influence for our team and we get another shot at a young player like Josh Green at 20.
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Re: Big al and Richardson for THJ and Maxi 

Post#20 » by Mr B » Tue Jun 30, 2020 9:12 pm

psman2 wrote:
Mr B wrote:
matt6715 wrote:I don't think its a huge stretch to say that the Mavs would value Maxi on his deal way, way more than they would value Horford on his.

Facts


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Isn't it also a fact that Powell is a big negative next year and likely long term as well and JRich > than THJ.

I think you would have to swap Powell for Wright as others posted to make this enticing enough for Philly to consider.

No, I’m wouldn’t say it’s fair to say Powell is a huge negative next season and beyond. The reason is because Carlisle loves him. He has a very defined role on the team and he’s one of the best roll men in the NBA. If you add him to any contending team that has a heavy P&R offense and he’s going to make them better.

Now no doubt that JRich and Horford are better players but I don’t think that JRich would be ok being the 3rd option. That’s what makes guys THJ and Powell so valuable to playoff teams. They embrace their role as a 3rd, 4th, or 5th option. It’s like when Wes Matthews was in Dallas. He couldn’t accept his role. He always tried to do too much which affected the on court chemistry. As for Horford, I like his game and when he brings would be better than Powell but his contract just makes it impossible for the Mavs to trade for him, in my opinion.


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