Gordon to PHX - AGAIN

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Gordon to PHX - AGAIN 

Post#1 » by jredsaz » Tue Jun 30, 2020 9:02 pm

Suns recieve Aaron Gordon, 2020 1st (15)
Magic recieve 2020 1st (10)

Suns get a starting four who adds needed athleticism. Spacing isnt great with he and Ayton but his position versatility will benefit the Suns. Maintain a pick to help address the Suns weak backcourt.

Magic jump five spots in the draft and add $17 million in cap space. AG doesnt seem to fit and getting our from underneath this contract with and improved pick and no salary coming back is a benefit.

EDIT: Another consideration is the cost of AG in a Covid economy. Orlando is at about $125 mil in salary for 20/21 with Fournier and Ennis opting in (which I expect to happen). Moving AG saves ownership significant $$$.

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Re: Gordon to PHX - AGAIN 

Post#2 » by NotACat » Tue Jun 30, 2020 9:09 pm

Seems like an overpay from Orlando, AG is worth more than moving up 5 spots IMO.
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Re: Gordon to PHX - AGAIN 

Post#3 » by ACM_Dirk » Tue Jun 30, 2020 9:13 pm

Yeah it sounds unfair. Maybe it could work without ORL 1st rp.
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Re: Gordon to PHX - AGAIN 

Post#4 » by KEMBAtheMETEOR » Tue Jun 30, 2020 9:21 pm

I think 15+Gordon should be able to fetch a 5-9 pick. I wouldn't send 8 only because we already have two young SF/PFs with odd skillsets and adding a third one to the mix might get too weird.
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Re: Gordon to PHX - AGAIN 

Post#5 » by Crives » Tue Jun 30, 2020 9:28 pm

I don’t see a team with cap space trading for Gordon unless they send bad money when there are good FA PFs that can be signed that don’t cost draft assets. (gallinari, Wood, Grant..)
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Re: Gordon to PHX - AGAIN 

Post#6 » by jredsaz » Tue Jun 30, 2020 9:41 pm

Crives wrote:I don’t see a team with cap space trading for Gordon unless they send bad money when there are good FA PFs that can be signed that don’t cost draft assets. (gallinari, Wood, Grant..)
That's kinda what I'm thinking and why I feel like a swap if fair. Think Gordon is a little better than neutral value on his contract.

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Re: Gordon to PHX - AGAIN 

Post#7 » by jredsaz » Tue Jun 30, 2020 9:45 pm

NotACat wrote:Seems like an overpay from Orlando, AG is worth more than moving up 5 spots IMO.
But it's also straight cap space. There is value in that. Quite a bit Also, for next summer moves $16.5 mil off the books for a big splash with a strong supporting cast.

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Re: Gordon to PHX - AGAIN 

Post#8 » by jredsaz » Tue Jun 30, 2020 9:47 pm

KEMBAtheMETEOR wrote:I think 15+Gordon should be able to fetch a 5-9 pick. I wouldn't send 8 only because we already have two young SF/PFs with odd skillsets and adding a third one to the mix might get too weird.
Maybe. But it's a significant cap hit to any team taking him on. Not sure who is in that range that has the cap space to take the straight contract into spcace?

Knicks could but doesnt make sense. Pistons could but that is a position they dont need filled.

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Re: Gordon to PHX - AGAIN 

Post#9 » by orlando_joe » Tue Jun 30, 2020 9:52 pm

this board might think its fair...but dont see any way magic do that..picks like 8-20 are about same in this draft..plus nobody has seen them play in march even makes it more pot luck...of any yr this is it that there will be players picked even well after15 that should have went 7-12
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Re: Gordon to PHX - AGAIN 

Post#10 » by orlando_joe » Tue Jun 30, 2020 9:54 pm

jredsaz wrote:
NotACat wrote:Seems like an overpay from Orlando, AG is worth more than moving up 5 spots IMO.
But it's also straight cap space. There is value in that. Quite a bit Also, for next summer moves $16.5 mil off the books for a big splash with a strong supporting cast.

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magic not looking to cap dump ag...come on man
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Re: Gordon to PHX - AGAIN 

Post#11 » by Texas Chuck » Tue Jun 30, 2020 9:55 pm

orlando_joe wrote:this board might think its fair...but dont see any way magic do that..picks like 8-20 are about same in this draft..plus nobody has seen them play in march even makes it more pot luck...


Great I'll trade the Dallas pick for the Orlando pick straight up and I won't even ask for incentive for letting the Magic get the cheaper rookie scale deal. Seems like a no-brainer for the Magic, no? :D

Yes that is tongue in cheek, but its to make a very important point -- higher picks are always worth more than lower picks. Doesn't guarantee you will draft the superior player, but you always want the better pick.
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Re: Gordon to PHX - AGAIN 

Post#12 » by orlando_joe » Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:00 pm

Texas Chuck wrote:
orlando_joe wrote:this board might think its fair...but dont see any way magic do that..picks like 8-20 are about same in this draft..plus nobody has seen them play in march even makes it more pot luck...


Great I'll trade the Dallas pick for the Orlando pick straight up and I won't even ask for incentive for letting the Magic get the cheaper rookie scale deal. Seems like a no-brainer for the Magic, no? :D

Yes that is tongue in cheek, but its to make a very important point -- higher picks are always worth more than lower picks. Doesn't guarantee you will draft the superior player, but you always want the better pick.

well ya...10 to 15 to me not worth ag in this draft other draft maybe...next yr i bet it will
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Re: Gordon to PHX - AGAIN 

Post#13 » by orlando_joe » Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:00 pm

Texas Chuck wrote:
orlando_joe wrote:this board might think its fair...but dont see any way magic do that..picks like 8-20 are about same in this draft..plus nobody has seen them play in march even makes it more pot luck...


Great I'll trade the Dallas pick for the Orlando pick straight up and I won't even ask for incentive for letting the Magic get the cheaper rookie scale deal. Seems like a no-brainer for the Magic, no? :D

Yes that is tongue in cheek, but its to make a very important point -- higher picks are always worth more than lower picks. Doesn't guarantee you will draft the superior player, but you always want the better pick.

well ya...10 to 15 to me not worth ag in this draft other draft maybe...next yr i bet it will
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Re: Gordon to PHX - AGAIN 

Post#14 » by Texas Chuck » Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:07 pm

orlando_joe wrote:
Texas Chuck wrote:
orlando_joe wrote:this board might think its fair...but dont see any way magic do that..picks like 8-20 are about same in this draft..plus nobody has seen them play in march even makes it more pot luck...


Great I'll trade the Dallas pick for the Orlando pick straight up and I won't even ask for incentive for letting the Magic get the cheaper rookie scale deal. Seems like a no-brainer for the Magic, no? :D

Yes that is tongue in cheek, but its to make a very important point -- higher picks are always worth more than lower picks. Doesn't guarantee you will draft the superior player, but you always want the better pick.

well ya...10 to 15 to me not worth ag in this draft other draft maybe...next yr i bet it will


Oh I'm fine with that opinion. Heck I'm AG's biggest detractor and I'm not excited about this deal for the Magic at all. Was responding to the idea that picks 8 through 20 being about the same. I disagree with that--even in this admittedly odd year.
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Re: Gordon to PHX - AGAIN 

Post#15 » by Resistance » Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:12 pm

orlando_joe wrote:
Texas Chuck wrote:
orlando_joe wrote:this board might think its fair...but dont see any way magic do that..picks like 8-20 are about same in this draft..plus nobody has seen them play in march even makes it more pot luck...


Great I'll trade the Dallas pick for the Orlando pick straight up and I won't even ask for incentive for letting the Magic get the cheaper rookie scale deal. Seems like a no-brainer for the Magic, no? :D

Yes that is tongue in cheek, but its to make a very important point -- higher picks are always worth more than lower picks. Doesn't guarantee you will draft the superior player, but you always want the better pick.

well ya...10 to 15 to me not worth ag in this draft other draft maybe...next yr i bet it will




Which path do you prefer that the Orlando FO takes:

1. Take the best offer available for Gordon and move on to assembling a better balanced roster.

2. Continue with a clunky fitting roster because the offers for Gordon are below expectations.
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Re: Gordon to PHX - AGAIN 

Post#16 » by jredsaz » Tue Jun 30, 2020 10:57 pm

Resistance wrote:
orlando_joe wrote:
Texas Chuck wrote:
Great I'll trade the Dallas pick for the Orlando pick straight up and I won't even ask for incentive for letting the Magic get the cheaper rookie scale deal. Seems like a no-brainer for the Magic, no? :D

Yes that is tongue in cheek, but its to make a very important point -- higher picks are always worth more than lower picks. Doesn't guarantee you will draft the superior player, but you always want the better pick.

well ya...10 to 15 to me not worth ag in this draft other draft maybe...next yr i bet it will




Which path do you prefer that the Orlando FO takes:

1. Take the best offer available for Gordon and move on to assembling a better balanced roster.

2. Continue with a clunky fitting roster because the offers for Gordon are below expectations.
Another consideration is the cost of AG in a Covid economy. Orlando is at about $125 mil in salary for 20/21 with Fournier and Ennis opting in (which I expect to happen). Shedding AG saves the owner significant $$$ for a player that doesnt help them win given the roster construction. Would allow the Magic to use the MLE on a better fit at SF.

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Re: Gordon to PHX - AGAIN 

Post#17 » by Ducklett » Tue Jun 30, 2020 11:06 pm

Texas Chuck wrote:
orlando_joe wrote:
Texas Chuck wrote:
Great I'll trade the Dallas pick for the Orlando pick straight up and I won't even ask for incentive for letting the Magic get the cheaper rookie scale deal. Seems like a no-brainer for the Magic, no? :D

Yes that is tongue in cheek, but its to make a very important point -- higher picks are always worth more than lower picks. Doesn't guarantee you will draft the superior player, but you always want the better pick.

well ya...10 to 15 to me not worth ag in this draft other draft maybe...next yr i bet it will


Oh I'm fine with that opinion. Heck I'm AG's biggest detractor and I'm not excited about this deal for the Magic at all. Was responding to the idea that picks 8 through 20 being about the same. I disagree with that--even in this admittedly odd year.


I think its pretty clear that higher pick is better in most cases as your get a larger pool of players to choose from. Trading up 5 spots usually results in trading up a tier in most drafts. In this draft, 4-18 could be players categorized in the same tier so I think that the value of trading up from 15 to 10 wouldn't be the same as it would be in other drafts that aren't situated like this one.

I think if the Magic start trading Vuc, Evan, and AG, it would be after 2020. This draft is not the one to go hog wild for trading everything for picks.

P.S. Just a reminder of how messed up this whole draft process is going to end up being: the 2020 NBA Draft was supposed to happen 5 days ago. We should have already had picks and be about to head into Free Agency. This whole draft is going to be a huge mess.
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Re: Gordon to PHX - AGAIN 

Post#18 » by orlando_joe » Tue Jun 30, 2020 11:21 pm

jredsaz wrote:
Resistance wrote:
orlando_joe wrote:well ya...10 to 15 to me not worth ag in this draft other draft maybe...next yr i bet it will




Which path do you prefer that the Orlando FO takes:

1. Take the best offer available for Gordon and move on to assembling a better balanced roster.

2. Continue with a clunky fitting roster because the offers for Gordon are below expectations.
Another consideration is the cost of AG in a Covid economy. Orlando is at about $125 mil in salary for 20/21 with Fournier and Ennis opting in (which I expect to happen). Shedding AG saves the owner significant $$$ for a player that doesnt help them win given the roster construction. Would allow the Magic to use the MLE on a better fit at SF.

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i dont agree with any of that at all..rather keep him then either of those options..lol
does not help them win...wow
would rather send 2nds and dump aminu and ennis befor any of that if its just money
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Re: Gordon to PHX - AGAIN 

Post#19 » by jredsaz » Wed Jul 1, 2020 12:10 am

orlando_joe wrote:
jredsaz wrote:
Resistance wrote:


Which path do you prefer that the Orlando FO takes:

1. Take the best offer available for Gordon and move on to assembling a better balanced roster.

2. Continue with a clunky fitting roster because the offers for Gordon are below expectations.
Another consideration is the cost of AG in a Covid economy. Orlando is at about $125 mil in salary for 20/21 with Fournier and Ennis opting in (which I expect to happen). Shedding AG saves the owner significant $$$ for a player that doesnt help them win given the roster construction. Would allow the Magic to use the MLE on a better fit at SF.

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i dont agree with any of that at all..rather keep him then either of those options..lol
does not help them win...wow
would rather send 2nds and dump aminu and ennis befor any of that if its just money
Not sure how much owners of mid level teams are going to want to spend over the cap. Magic look like a perfect candidate to dump some salary if it doesnt cost them victories.

A healthy Aminu can produce 80% of AG at 50% of the cost. Could use the MLE and still save about $10 million by moving AGs salary.



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Re: Gordon to PHX - AGAIN 

Post#20 » by orlando_joe » Wed Jul 1, 2020 1:09 am

jredsaz wrote:
orlando_joe wrote:
jredsaz wrote:Another consideration is the cost of AG in a Covid economy. Orlando is at about $125 mil in salary for 20/21 with Fournier and Ennis opting in (which I expect to happen). Shedding AG saves the owner significant $$$ for a player that doesnt help them win given the roster construction. Would allow the Magic to use the MLE on a better fit at SF.

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i dont agree with any of that at all..rather keep him then either of those options..lol
does not help them win...wow
would rather send 2nds and dump aminu and ennis befor any of that if its just money
Not sure how much owners of mid level teams are going to want to spend over the cap. Magic look like a perfect candidate to dump some salary if it doesnt cost them victories.

A healthy Aminu can produce 80% of AG at 50% of the cost. Could use the MLE and still save about $10 million by moving AGs salary.



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no he really can not

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