Best Player For RJ Barrett and 6th Overall

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Re: Best Player For RJ Barrett and 6th Overall 

Post#41 » by rugbyrugger23 » Thu Jul 30, 2020 9:03 am

Topofthekey wrote:Does Aaron Gordon + Mo Bamba for Barrett + #6 make sense for both teams?

Magic commit to Vucevic and Isaac, upgrades a position of need, and gets a re-do for Bamba

Knicks get Gordon who helps bring excitement to the team, and a project in Bamba

I think you could take out #6 and it is a debatable no by Knicks. As is pure Magic trick by Orlando.
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Re: Best Player For RJ Barrett and 6th Overall 

Post#42 » by Godaddycurse » Thu Jul 30, 2020 2:49 pm

If Mitchell and Gobert's rift is too big to heal, what about Barrett + #6 + 2021 unprotected + dallas 2023 pick for Mitchell? Mitchell can be derrick rose-lite for thibs.
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Re: Best Player For RJ Barrett and 6th Overall 

Post#43 » by tidho » Thu Jul 30, 2020 3:42 pm

E S V L wrote:
NYG wrote:Who is the best player the Knicks could get for Barrett and 6? No need to match salary.


If the Memphis management sees Barret as SF and Okongwu as an elite big, it can decide to offer Jaren Jackson Jr.

this seems like a bad idea
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Re: Best Player For RJ Barrett and 6th Overall 

Post#44 » by tidho » Thu Jul 30, 2020 3:43 pm

K Love! :)

Ok, Love & Garland

RJ, 6, and any other $30M you want to move
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Re: Best Player For RJ Barrett and 6th Overall 

Post#45 » by BarbaGrizz » Thu Jul 30, 2020 4:18 pm

E S V L wrote:
NYG wrote:Who is the best player the Knicks could get for Barrett and 6? No need to match salary.


If the Memphis management sees Barret as SF and Okongwu as an elite big, it can decide to offer Jaren Jackson Jr.


Geez absolutely atrocious for Memphis
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Re: Best Player For RJ Barrett and 6th Overall 

Post#46 » by rugbyrugger23 » Thu Jul 30, 2020 5:00 pm

Godaddycurse wrote:If Mitchell and Gobert's rift is too big to heal, what about Barrett + #6 + 2021 unprotected + dallas 2023 pick for Mitchell? Mitchell can be derrick rose-lite for thibs.

Not sure if Gobert stays around Utah to play with Barrett and picks. A third team would be needed to get Jazz a Gobert running mate.

Beal?

But then the question becomes, why would Knicks not just trade for Beal?
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Re: Best Player For RJ Barrett and 6th Overall 

Post#47 » by E S V L » Thu Jul 30, 2020 5:27 pm

BarbaGrizz wrote:
E S V L wrote:
NYG wrote:Who is the best player the Knicks could get for Barrett and 6? No need to match salary.


If the Memphis management sees Barret as SF and Okongwu as an elite big, it can decide to offer Jaren Jackson Jr.


Geez absolutely atrocious for Memphis


At first glance only
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Re: Best Player For RJ Barrett and 6th Overall 

Post#48 » by Mr Puddles » Thu Jul 30, 2020 6:45 pm

E S V L wrote:
BarbaGrizz wrote:
E S V L wrote:
If the Memphis management sees Barret as SF and Okongwu as an elite big, it can decide to offer Jaren Jackson Jr.


Geez absolutely atrocious for Memphis


At first glance only


No at second glance it doesn't get any better. Jaren Jackson Jr. is significantly better than Barret at this point and #6 in this year's draft doesn't come close to making up for it.

If JJJ could be had at that price, the Suns better be all over it with a package of Oubre, #10, Cameron Johnson and a 2022 pick.
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Re: Best Player For RJ Barrett and 6th Overall 

Post#49 » by R-DAWG » Thu Jul 30, 2020 6:54 pm

gswhoops wrote:I feel like the answer here is "not a good enough one to make it worth it"

Maybe this package gets you Beal? Feels a little light for him though.


This is the correct answer. Even if you trade this package for Bradley Beal, what does that do for the team? Put you in play for the 8th seed? Then, your 2 years away from being forced to max out Beal through his age 34 season, with limited paths to getting better.

The one player that I would go all-in for if he became available would be Karl Anthony Towns.
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Re: Best Player For RJ Barrett and 6th Overall 

Post#50 » by Crizzle » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:41 pm

Mr Puddles wrote:
E S V L wrote:
BarbaGrizz wrote:
Geez absolutely atrocious for Memphis


At first glance only


No at second glance it doesn't get any better. Jaren Jackson Jr. is significantly better than Barret at this point and #6 in this year's draft doesn't come close to making up for it.

If JJJ could be had at that price, the Suns better be all over it with a package of Oubre, #10, Cameron Johnson and a 2022 pick.



Yeah jaren has way too much upside right now . You would really have to be high on barrett and whoever is still there at 6
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Re: Best Player For RJ Barrett and 6th Overall 

Post#51 » by drosestruts » Thu Jul 30, 2020 9:22 pm

a bit of an expansion on Barrett and #6 but...


New York in: Jonathan Isaac and Gary Harris
New York out: RJ Barrett, Elfrid Payton, Wayne Ellington, Reggie Bullock, NYK 2020 1st round pick, LAC 2020 1st round pick

Orlando in: RJ Barrett, Elfrid Payton, Wayne Ellington, and NYK 2020 1st round pick
Orlando out: Jonathan Isaac and Evan Fournier

Denver in: Evan Fournier, Reggie Bullock, and LAC 2020 1st round pick
Denver out: Gary Harris


New York:
Uses a combination of picks and players to add two young players who are more developed and ready to contribute to the team now. While they miss out on the 2020 draft they'll have 2 picks coming in 2021 (their own and Dallas) which is a draft people say is deeper and better anyway. Everyone knows Thibs likes defense - Harris, Isaac and Robinson is the start of a great looking defense.

Orlando:
Adding Barrett and the #6 pick is the big get here. Payton and Ellington can provide backcourt depth for the year before expiring.

Denver:
Might be getting the best deal here, turns Harris into the comparable Fournier, adds additional wing depth in Bullock and adds a late 1st.
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Re: Best Player For RJ Barrett and 6th Overall 

Post#52 » by Scoot McGroot » Thu Jul 30, 2020 9:28 pm

drosestruts wrote:a bit of an expansion on Barrett and #6 but...


New York in: Jonathan Isaac and Gary Harris
New York out: RJ Barrett, Elfrid Payton, Wayne Ellington, Reggie Bullock, NYK 2020 1st round pick, LAC 2020 1st round pick

Orlando in: RJ Barrett, Elfrid Payton, Wayne Ellington, and NYK 2020 1st round pick
Orlando out: Jonathan Isaac and Evan Fournier

Denver in: Evan Fournier, Reggie Bullock, and LAC 2020 1st round pick
Denver out: Gary Harris


New York:
Uses a combination of picks and players to add two young players who are more developed and ready to contribute to the team now. While they miss out on the 2020 draft they'll have 2 picks coming in 2021 (their own and Dallas) which is a draft people say is deeper and better anyway. Everyone knows Thibs likes defense - Harris, Isaac and Robinson is the start of a great looking defense.

Orlando:
Adding Barrett and the #6 pick is the big get here. Payton and Ellington can provide backcourt depth for the year before expiring.

Denver:
Might be getting the best deal here, turns Harris into the comparable Fournier, adds additional wing depth in Bullock and adds a late 1st.


I definitely don't see Orlando considering that, even at all. Isaac for Barrett/6? I mean, I could understand why people might think that would be considered, but on a down draft year, when Barrett has also been devalued? I just don't see it considered. Add in Fournier for other, lesser expirings? Really not a consideration. It's a concept of splitting your own, superior, prospect, into multiple lotto tickets at a very low hit rate.
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Re: Best Player For RJ Barrett and 6th Overall 

Post#53 » by drosestruts » Thu Jul 30, 2020 11:30 pm

Scoot McGroot wrote:
drosestruts wrote:a bit of an expansion on Barrett and #6 but...


New York in: Jonathan Isaac and Gary Harris
New York out: RJ Barrett, Elfrid Payton, Wayne Ellington, Reggie Bullock, NYK 2020 1st round pick, LAC 2020 1st round pick

Orlando in: RJ Barrett, Elfrid Payton, Wayne Ellington, and NYK 2020 1st round pick
Orlando out: Jonathan Isaac and Evan Fournier

Denver in: Evan Fournier, Reggie Bullock, and LAC 2020 1st round pick
Denver out: Gary Harris


New York:
Uses a combination of picks and players to add two young players who are more developed and ready to contribute to the team now. While they miss out on the 2020 draft they'll have 2 picks coming in 2021 (their own and Dallas) which is a draft people say is deeper and better anyway. Everyone knows Thibs likes defense - Harris, Isaac and Robinson is the start of a great looking defense.

Orlando:
Adding Barrett and the #6 pick is the big get here. Payton and Ellington can provide backcourt depth for the year before expiring.

Denver:
Might be getting the best deal here, turns Harris into the comparable Fournier, adds additional wing depth in Bullock and adds a late 1st.


I definitely don't see Orlando considering that, even at all. Isaac for Barrett/6? I mean, I could understand why people might think that would be considered, but on a down draft year, when Barrett has also been devalued? I just don't see it considered. Add in Fournier for other, lesser expirings? Really not a consideration. It's a concept of splitting your own, superior, prospect, into multiple lotto tickets at a very low hit rate.


Splitting your own superior prospect into two lotto tickets is pretty much exactly what this is and is a very on-target description.

Payton and Ellington are certainly a downgrade from Fournier but the minutes for Barrett will have to come somehow, and it saves them from needing to resign Augustin as Payton can cover the PG spot with Fultz. Really just trades Fournier for minutes for Barrett and depth at the guard spots.
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Re: Best Player For RJ Barrett and 6th Overall 

Post#54 » by hege53190 » Thu Jul 30, 2020 11:38 pm

Catchall wrote:It's probably too early to trade Barrett. It's not clear what kind of player he'll be. Rookies usually take strides by their 3rd season. People were questioning Tatum his first two seasons. Barrett could be pretty special if he keeps developing.


Tatum was the leading playoff scorer on a team that took LeBron to 7 games in the Eastern Conference finals as a rookie. I am not saying that Barret can't develop but It probably isn't smart to use Tatum as the baseline.
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Re: Best Player For RJ Barrett and 6th Overall 

Post#55 » by jjohns828 » Fri Jul 31, 2020 12:01 am

drosestruts wrote:a bit of an expansion on Barrett and #6 but...


New York in: Jonathan Isaac and Gary Harris
New York out: RJ Barrett, Elfrid Payton, Wayne Ellington, Reggie Bullock, NYK 2020 1st round pick, LAC 2020 1st round pick

Orlando in: RJ Barrett, Elfrid Payton, Wayne Ellington, and NYK 2020 1st round pick
Orlando out: Jonathan Isaac and Evan Fournier

Denver in: Evan Fournier, Reggie Bullock, and LAC 2020 1st round pick
Denver out: Gary Harris


New York:
Uses a combination of picks and players to add two young players who are more developed and ready to contribute to the team now. While they miss out on the 2020 draft they'll have 2 picks coming in 2021 (their own and Dallas) which is a draft people say is deeper and better anyway. Everyone knows Thibs likes defense - Harris, Isaac and Robinson is the start of a great looking defense.

Orlando:
Adding Barrett and the #6 pick is the big get here. Payton and Ellington can provide backcourt depth for the year before expiring.

Denver:
Might be getting the best deal here, turns Harris into the comparable Fournier, adds additional wing depth in Bullock and adds a late 1st.


I'd rather keep Isaac, wasn't high on Barrett to begin with and I'm not high on this years draft at all.
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Re: Best Player For RJ Barrett and 6th Overall 

Post#56 » by E S V L » Fri Jul 31, 2020 2:09 am

Mr Puddles wrote:
E S V L wrote:
BarbaGrizz wrote:
Geez absolutely atrocious for Memphis


At first glance only


No at second glance it doesn't get any better. Jaren Jackson Jr. is significantly better than Barret at this point and #6 in this year's draft doesn't come close to making up for it.

If JJJ could be had at that price, the Suns better be all over it with a package of Oubre, #10, Cameron Johnson and a 2022 pick.


The Nicks package is way better than the one from the Suns you referred to. I believe that Barret will likely become a Kawai type of player, whereas Okongwu can be the next Clarke.
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Re: Best Player For RJ Barrett and 6th Overall 

Post#57 » by NYG » Fri Jul 31, 2020 2:12 am

R-DAWG wrote:
gswhoops wrote:I feel like the answer here is "not a good enough one to make it worth it"

Maybe this package gets you Beal? Feels a little light for him though.


This is the correct answer. Even if you trade this package for Bradley Beal, what does that do for the team? Put you in play for the 8th seed? Then, your 2 years away from being forced to max out Beal through his age 34 season, with limited paths to getting better.

The one player that I would go all-in for if he became available would be Karl Anthony Towns.


What about just 6th Overall? Who is the most Thibodeau vet you can get for that pick?
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Re: Best Player For RJ Barrett and 6th Overall 

Post#58 » by Mr Puddles » Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:36 am

E S V L wrote:
Mr Puddles wrote:
E S V L wrote:
At first glance only


No at second glance it doesn't get any better. Jaren Jackson Jr. is significantly better than Barret at this point and #6 in this year's draft doesn't come close to making up for it.

If JJJ could be had at that price, the Suns better be all over it with a package of Oubre, #10, Cameron Johnson and a 2022 pick.


The Nicks package is way better than the one from the Suns you referred to. I believe that Barret will likely become a Kawai type of player, whereas Okongwu can be the next Clarke.


It might be your personal opinion that Barret will likely become a Kawai type player, but his actual performance thus far puts him stratospheres away from reaching that level of play. His rookie year was slightly better than Josh Jackson's rookie season.

Not saying that Barrett can't improve, but as of right now he doesn't have the kind of value you're attributing to him.
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Re: Best Player For RJ Barrett and 6th Overall 

Post#59 » by E S V L » Fri Jul 31, 2020 11:38 am

Mr Puddles wrote:
E S V L wrote:
Mr Puddles wrote:
No at second glance it doesn't get any better. Jaren Jackson Jr. is significantly better than Barret at this point and #6 in this year's draft doesn't come close to making up for it.

If JJJ could be had at that price, the Suns better be all over it with a package of Oubre, #10, Cameron Johnson and a 2022 pick.


The Nicks package is way better than the one from the Suns you referred to. I believe that Barret will likely become a Kawai type of player, whereas Okongwu can be the next Clarke.


It might be your personal opinion that Barret will likely become a Kawai type player, but his actual performance thus far puts him stratospheres away from reaching that level of play. His rookie year was slightly better than Josh Jackson's rookie season.

Not saying that Barrett can't improve, but as of right now he doesn't have the kind of value you're attributing to him.


Once Barret shows flashes of what I think he is, he will become untouchable. Same approach applies to JJJ though.
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Re: Best Player For RJ Barrett and 6th Overall 

Post#60 » by Rockazoids » Fri Jul 31, 2020 1:24 pm

Mr Puddles wrote:
E S V L wrote:
Mr Puddles wrote:
No at second glance it doesn't get any better. Jaren Jackson Jr. is significantly better than Barret at this point and #6 in this year's draft doesn't come close to making up for it.

If JJJ could be had at that price, the Suns better be all over it with a package of Oubre, #10, Cameron Johnson and a 2022 pick.


The Nicks package is way better than the one from the Suns you referred to. I believe that Barret will likely become a Kawai type of player, whereas Okongwu can be the next Clarke.


It might be your personal opinion that Barret will likely become a Kawai type player, but his actual performance thus far puts him stratospheres away from reaching that level of play. His rookie year was slightly better than Josh Jackson's rookie season.

Not saying that Barrett can't improve, but as of right now he doesn't have the kind of value you're attributing to him.

A rookie RJ Barrett
14.3 PPG, 5.0 RPG, 2.6 APG, 1.0 SPG, 40.2 FG%, 32.0 3P%, 61.4 FT%, 47.9 TS%

A rookie Brandon Ingram
9.4 PPG, 4.0 RPG, 2.1 APG, 0.6 SPG, 40.2 FG%, 29.4 3P%, 62.2 FT% , 47.4 TS%

20/19 Brandon Ingram
24.2 PPG, 6.3 RPG, 4.2 APG, 1.0 SPG , 46.4 FG%, 38.4 3P%, 85.8 FT%, 58.8 TS%

Look how far a rookie Ingram has come.
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