Turner to the Celtics - How?

Moderators: Texas Chuck, pacers33granger, BullyKing, HartfordWhalers, Mamba4Goat, Andre Roberstan, Trader_Joe, loserX

User avatar
Wizop
RealGM
Posts: 10,687
And1: 1,742
Joined: Jun 15, 2003
Location: Indianapolis, IN
Contact:
   

Re: Turner to the Celtics - How? 

Post#81 » by Wizop » Thu Sep 17, 2020 2:27 am

djFan71 wrote:Did you guys do much of the Brogdon/Holiday/X/Warren/<Turner or Sabonis> type lineups where X is other Holiday or whoever was available between Lamb, Dipo, etc? Or McConnell even?

I feel like that would be the "modern" type lineup. If you did, how do the #s look with those lineups with Turner, those lineups with Sabonis, vs lineups with both Tuner & Sabonis together?

Feel free to just point me at a thread if your sub has covered it already... I'm guessing it's come up. :)
Second unit played 2 Holidays, McConnell, McDermott, and Sabonis and was very effective. A big factor in playoffs was that the second unit collapsed without Sabonis.

Because of staggered injuries the projected first unit of Brogdon, Oladipo, Warren, Turner, and Sabonis only played 86 minutes together all year.
giberish
RealGM
Posts: 12,805
And1: 3,266
Joined: Mar 30, 2006
Location: Whereever you go - there you are

Re: Turner to the Celtics - How? 

Post#82 » by giberish » Thu Sep 17, 2020 2:33 am

basketballwacko2 wrote:
pacers33granger wrote:I don't think there's a deal there to be had without a 3rd team somehow. Boston certainly have the value, but the fit isn't good.

- Hayward doesn't fit our timeline and forces either him or Warren to be the PF next to Domas. That's very very bad for our defense.
- I'd personally love Smart, but we have more than enough guards as is.
- Brown is worth much more than Turner.
- No team hates picks, but we're not in the market for them now (or ever really).
- We'd be looking to consolidate talent, not dilute it.

As other Indy fans have pointed out, find us a good defensive PF that can hit threes and we'll talk. But that guy isn't on the table for Turner. Plus Turner is like 80% of that, so it makes the most sense to stick with him.



It makes no sense to talk about trading Turner to the Celtics. Whether it's Brown or Hayward doesn't matter you end up thin at the 4/5 with no real PF on the team at all and no backups unless Goga improves drastically. Unless you think Jakar Sampson is a 24 min per game guy! So all this talk of trading Turner for some unnamed player who is gonna give us what he gives us and then some is pointless. The SG's and SF type options don't help.


Warren seems like he could cover a lot of PF minutes. IMO a Tuner for Brown deal would work out well for Indy (a defensive downgrade at pf but a defensive upgrade at SF with Brown). You'd need to find a backup pf (and perhaps a backup C if Goga isn't ready) but those are secondary roles you can fill with minor deals (or MLE money). The problem with a Turner for Hayward deal is that Hayward isn't that good, and he's really expensive so Indy loses depth and talent while getting older.
basketballwacko2
RealGM
Posts: 15,753
And1: 2,272
Joined: May 11, 2002
Location: Just outside of No where.
     

Re: Turner to the Celtics - How? 

Post#83 » by basketballwacko2 » Thu Sep 17, 2020 2:53 am

patman66 wrote:
basketballwacko2 wrote:
100proof wrote:Wow Indy might over value Turner.

And I am most likely undervaluing theis.

Theis was better or equal to everything turner gave this year at a third of the cost. (Turner blocked more shots and shot 1% better on threes at a higher clip) (theis is a superior overall defender)

Guess Celtics will just stick with the cheaper, equally effective player



Yeah do that! :lol:


Yeah, we are still playing all right..


For now but the Heat may have something to say about how long.
basketballwacko2
RealGM
Posts: 15,753
And1: 2,272
Joined: May 11, 2002
Location: Just outside of No where.
     

Re: Turner to the Celtics - How? 

Post#84 » by basketballwacko2 » Thu Sep 17, 2020 2:54 am

Wizop wrote:
basketballwacko2 wrote:
pacers33granger wrote:I don't think there's a deal there to be had without a 3rd team somehow. Boston certainly have the value, but the fit isn't good.

- Hayward doesn't fit our timeline and forces either him or Warren to be the PF next to Domas. That's very very bad for our defense.
- I'd personally love Smart, but we have more than enough guards as is.
- Brown is worth much more than Turner.
- No team hates picks, but we're not in the market for them now (or ever really).
- We'd be looking to consolidate talent, not dilute it.

As other Indy fans have pointed out, find us a good defensive PF that can hit threes and we'll talk. But that guy isn't on the table for Turner. Plus Turner is like 80% of that, so it makes the most sense to stick with him.



It makes no sense to talk about trading Turner to the Celtics. Whether it's Brown or Hayward doesn't matter you end up thin at the 4/5 with no real PF on the team at all and no backups unless Goga improves drastically. Unless you think Jakar Sampson is a 24 min per game guy! So all this talk of trading Turner for some unnamed player who is gonna give us what he gives us and then some is pointless. The SG's and SF type options don't help.
Correct. Anyone find a secret way to and-1 from the android app?

Sent from my phone.


If there was a -1 there would be a lot of guys on here with a net negative.
basketballwacko2
RealGM
Posts: 15,753
And1: 2,272
Joined: May 11, 2002
Location: Just outside of No where.
     

Re: Turner to the Celtics - How? 

Post#85 » by basketballwacko2 » Thu Sep 17, 2020 3:00 am

giberish wrote:
basketballwacko2 wrote:
pacers33granger wrote:I don't think there's a deal there to be had without a 3rd team somehow. Boston certainly have the value, but the fit isn't good.

- Hayward doesn't fit our timeline and forces either him or Warren to be the PF next to Domas. That's very very bad for our defense.
- I'd personally love Smart, but we have more than enough guards as is.
- Brown is worth much more than Turner.
- No team hates picks, but we're not in the market for them now (or ever really).
- We'd be looking to consolidate talent, not dilute it.

As other Indy fans have pointed out, find us a good defensive PF that can hit threes and we'll talk. But that guy isn't on the table for Turner. Plus Turner is like 80% of that, so it makes the most sense to stick with him.



It makes no sense to talk about trading Turner to the Celtics. Whether it's Brown or Hayward doesn't matter you end up thin at the 4/5 with no real PF on the team at all and no backups unless Goga improves drastically. Unless you think Jakar Sampson is a 24 min per game guy! So all this talk of trading Turner for some unnamed player who is gonna give us what he gives us and then some is pointless. The SG's and SF type options don't help.


Warren seems like he could cover a lot of PF minutes. IMO a Tuner for Brown deal would work out well for Indy (a defensive downgrade at pf but a defensive upgrade at SF with Brown). You'd need to find a backup pf (and perhaps a backup C if Goga isn't ready) but those are secondary roles you can fill with minor deals (or MLE money). The problem with a Turner for Hayward deal is that Hayward isn't that good, and he's really expensive so Indy loses depth and talent while getting older.


I like Warren at SF and some back up PF but he's not a PF. Losing the shot blocking of Turner cannot be replaced. Sabonis tries but he just isn't long enough to block a lot of shots. Turner is a very good defender in addition to the rim protection.

Now if Indiana had drafted better especially in 2017 taking John Collins instead of TJ Leaf they'd be deeper at PF and this might not be such a problem. It's simple if Turner goes out a shot blocker must come back and none of them are as good at shooting 3s as he is.
patman66
Rookie
Posts: 1,054
And1: 252
Joined: Dec 11, 2019
     

Re: Turner to the Celtics - How? 

Post#86 » by patman66 » Thu Sep 17, 2020 3:04 am

basketballwacko2 wrote:
patman66 wrote:
basketballwacko2 wrote:

Yeah do that! :lol:


Yeah, we are still playing all right..


For now but the Heat may have something to say about how long.


Hayward getting back would have even more to say about it. Without him we will be hard pressed to win, Brown, Smart and Tatum are all playing an extra 10 min a game that they shouldn't. they have been getting worn down in the 4th except for 2 games since he went out.
basketballwacko2
RealGM
Posts: 15,753
And1: 2,272
Joined: May 11, 2002
Location: Just outside of No where.
     

Re: Turner to the Celtics - How? 

Post#87 » by basketballwacko2 » Thu Sep 17, 2020 3:05 am

patman66 wrote:
basketballwacko2 wrote:
patman66 wrote:
Yeah, we are still playing all right..


For now but the Heat may have something to say about how long.


Hayward getting back would have even more to say about it. Without him we will be hard pressed to win, Brown, Smart and Tatum are all playing an extra 10 min a game that they shouldn't. they have been getting worn down in the 4th except for 2 games since he went out.



Normally I support the Celtics when they are not playing the Pacers but that Heat team is better than I thought they were.
User avatar
Scoot McGroot
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 28,676
And1: 4,162
Joined: Feb 16, 2005
     

Re: Turner to the Celtics - How? 

Post#88 » by Scoot McGroot » Thu Sep 17, 2020 3:21 am

djFan71 wrote:
pacers33granger wrote:
patman66 wrote:
Ok great, I understand what you mean now- what you are willing to pay and what he is worth and the constraints that indy has as a pro team in a smaller market. But I think it is unreasonable view by some that they expect a better fit at the 4 but at the same overall talent level of turner and for the same price. That is not gong to happen. Atlanta is not trading you john collins with Cappela. Orlando does not want Turner, Siakem, Maybe PJ Washington, Draymont Green is a match, but the last two years he don't seem like the same guy. Collins from Portland? not with nurkic. there are not a lot of good 4s on teams that don't have 5s, or that one that do like toronto and boston the 4s are too much value for turner.


No argument from me personally. It's the eternal issue with Turner. We're not getting a better PF, so while he's best at C and is minimized at PF, we're better off keeping him and playing him out of position. Honestly it only works because he's ok with it, which is rare out of a young guy. He will never be a star or anything but he's solid and is a great teammate.

Did you guys do much of the Brogdon/Holiday/X/Warren/<Turner or Sabonis> type lineups where X is other Holiday or whoever was available between Lamb, Dipo, etc? Or McConnell even?

I feel like that would be the "modern" type lineup. If you did, how do the #s look with those lineups with Turner, those lineups with Sabonis, vs lineups with both Tuner & Sabonis together?

Feel free to just point me at a thread if your sub has covered it already... I'm guessing it's come up. :)



The bubble and playoffs were the lineup you listed, but with Oladipo as the X. It was fine when teams had nothing to play for and didn’t adjust. It was blown up when we faced Miami in the playoffs.
User avatar
Scoot McGroot
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 28,676
And1: 4,162
Joined: Feb 16, 2005
     

Re: Turner to the Celtics - How? 

Post#89 » by Scoot McGroot » Thu Sep 17, 2020 3:31 am

patman66 wrote:
Scoot McGroot wrote:
patman66 wrote:
I am refereing to may proposal that has Bjelica and Jymchal Green coming to Indy,
in 20 min green give 5 rebounds and shoots 3s at a .38 clip over the last three years
in 28 min bjlica gives you 6 rebounds and shots 3s at a .400 clip over three years.

I don't see that as a massive hole.

At the back up 5 Theis give you 24 min 6.5 rebounds and shoots with a .600 clip

I don't see a massive hole there either.

The 14th pick could be used on precious who needs a year, but is a Siakem/Bam style big on the upside.

Langford is or will be a fan favorite and is locked up for three years.


If you could combine all those guys into one, no drop off. But it takes 72 minutes a night, as you listed, for them to produce ok numbers in a game that’s only 48 minutes long. And that’s numbers, not even impact.

And if it was so simple to get Bam/Siakam at 14, why don’t teams get them every year? Infinitely rare, not something to just assume will happen.

As for Langford, yeah, he’s an Indiana guy, but he definitely didn’t elicit any warm feelings at IU. He was supposed to be the savior, and is unfairly denigrated for playing through the thumb injury. He’s not Oladipo beloved at all.


What is your issue there are 96 min now between the 4 and the 5. Turner plays 32 and sabonis plays 32 that is 32 more min at the 4 and 5 that will be better than what is is now and Both turner and sabonis are best at the 5, or or are you saying that turner is just as effective playing alongside sabonis as he is when he is manning the pivot.

existing front court total 144 min 48 x 3

Sabonis/Turner/Warren/Doug/Leaf ( now no Holiday he is gone to more money green pastures) vs

Sabonis/Green/Bjelica/Theis/14th pick/Warren/Leaf

And this does not factor in Langford.

yes for the 18 min that turner will play the 5 backing up Sabonis you will see a significant down grade from Turner to theis, but he is good enough to start for the celts and shoot .600 from the field. This isn't mosgov or something.
now at the 18 min turner plays the 4 alongside Sabonis I think the drop off to Green/bjelica is even less than it was at center to theis. Never mind it no longer has Warren playing out of postion at the 4, but can stay at the 3 for the min that were played by Justin. I try to post honestly. Not trying to make it seem otherwise that turner and savonis are the only ones that paly the 4/5 so there is a down grade in the front court for the whole game.



So, 96 minutes at the bigs and the guys we trade Turner for need 72 of those minutes to approximate an impact of Turner, leaving 24 minutes for Sabonis?

I like Theis. A lot. He’s just not quite a Turner. He’s just not quite not quite a Turner and that’s ok. It fits the setup in Boston and he’s playing hot now, so it’s working. But a full season? If Theis, Green, and Bjelica with Sabonis? It just weakens the overall team. We only need one of those guys as a backup, but here we’re just platooning all of them as the starter? But mostly, in pitching These guys and Romeo, you’re pitching how a lot of guys can help off the bench or 3rd units, but it’s ignoring it’s a steep drop at the starting spot. One that just can’t be ignored and hope that depth of backups fixes it.

You’re also missing Goga. And Justin is apparently still a solid possibility to come back and we can spend up to the MLE on him. If a team wants to give him more than the MLE, It’s absolutely fine to assume he will go. And Jakarr at the end of the year may not have been all that much different than a Green.
patman66
Rookie
Posts: 1,054
And1: 252
Joined: Dec 11, 2019
     

Re: Turner to the Celtics - How? 

Post#90 » by patman66 » Thu Sep 17, 2020 4:14 am

Scoot McGroot wrote:
patman66 wrote:
Scoot McGroot wrote:
If you could combine all those guys into one, no drop off. But it takes 72 minutes a night, as you listed, for them to produce ok numbers in a game that’s only 48 minutes long. And that’s numbers, not even impact.

And if it was so simple to get Bam/Siakam at 14, why don’t teams get them every year? Infinitely rare, not something to just assume will happen.

As for Langford, yeah, he’s an Indiana guy, but he definitely didn’t elicit any warm feelings at IU. He was supposed to be the savior, and is unfairly denigrated for playing through the thumb injury. He’s not Oladipo beloved at all.


What is your issue there are 96 min now between the 4 and the 5. Turner plays 32 and sabonis plays 32 that is 32 more min at the 4 and 5 that will be better than what is is now and Both turner and sabonis are best at the 5, or or are you saying that turner is just as effective playing alongside sabonis as he is when he is manning the pivot.

existing front court total 144 min 48 x 3

Sabonis/Turner/Warren/Doug/Leaf ( now no Holiday he is gone to more money green pastures) vs

Sabonis/Green/Bjelica/Theis/14th pick/Warren/Leaf

And this does not factor in Langford.

yes for the 18 min that turner will play the 5 backing up Sabonis you will see a significant down grade from Turner to theis, but he is good enough to start for the celts and shoot .600 from the field. This isn't mosgov or something.
now at the 18 min turner plays the 4 alongside Sabonis I think the drop off to Green/bjelica is even less than it was at center to theis. Never mind it no longer has Warren playing out of postion at the 4, but can stay at the 3 for the min that were played by Justin. I try to post honestly. Not trying to make it seem otherwise that turner and savonis are the only ones that paly the 4/5 so there is a down grade in the front court for the whole game.



So, 96 minutes at the bigs and the guys we trade Turner for need 72 of those minutes to approximate an impact of Turner, leaving 24 minutes for Sabonis?

I like Theis. A lot. He’s just not quite a Turner. He’s just not quite not quite a Turner and that’s ok. It fits the setup in Boston and he’s playing hot now, so it’s working. But a full season? If Theis, Green, and Bjelica with Sabonis? It just weakens the overall team. We only need one of those guys as a backup, but here we’re just platooning all of them as the starter? But mostly, in pitching These guys and Romeo, you’re pitching how a lot of guys can help off the bench or 3rd units, but it’s ignoring it’s a steep drop at the starting spot. One that just can’t be ignored and hope that depth of backups fixes it.

You’re also missing Goga. And Justin is apparently still a solid possibility to come back and we can spend up to the MLE on him. If a team wants to give him more than the MLE, It’s absolutely fine to assume he will go. And Jakarr at the end of the year may not have been all that much different than a Green.


you have to get beyond "the bigs" And how do those guys equal turner. Turner scored 12 points and 6 rebounds. Thies by himself got just as many rebounds and scored 2 less points in less min and as the 6th option on the team. he shot better and he was more effcient. never mind the contributions of Green and bjelica. Boga plays what 8 min a game in blowouts? The MLE is 9,7 mil, how do the pacers pay 9.7 when they can only give him a 25% raise which will be about 6 mil. And why is Jakarr Sampson mentioned as a 4/Green. Sampson is a wing who might not be back either. If you want to say Justin takes a 33% discount to stay with his brother, fine, but he is already 30 and never got a good payday yeat, this is his last chance.

I understand you don't want to trade turner for the package I laid out. I understand your hesitancy to trade the best player for smaller pieces. What I don't understand is your mischaracterization of the player package I put together and my reasons why those players were chosen or the roles they would play.

1. Theis will play the 18 min a game that Sabonis does not play at the 5.
2. Green and Bjelica will play the 4 for the 48 min. Allowing Warren to stay at the 3 and not be played out of position and making up for the loss of Justin at the 3.
3. Langford will begiven a chance to develop behind Dipo who most likely will be on a "under 30 min" for the first 1/2 of the year.
4. the 14th pick could be used on Precious who has the traits of siakem and Bam as rookies and has that upside.

Turner is the best player in the package, but this package is just not to replace his 32 min that he plays. It is to strengthen existing weaknesses and not just replace Turner. you are not going to trade turner and get an equal player or you would have said those players names. They don't exist on teams that need centers.
djFan71
Forum Mod - Celtics
Forum Mod - Celtics
Posts: 8,222
And1: 8,853
Joined: Jul 24, 2010
 

Re: Turner to the Celtics - How? 

Post#91 » by djFan71 » Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:49 am

Scoot McGroot wrote:
djFan71 wrote:
pacers33granger wrote:
No argument from me personally. It's the eternal issue with Turner. We're not getting a better PF, so while he's best at C and is minimized at PF, we're better off keeping him and playing him out of position. Honestly it only works because he's ok with it, which is rare out of a young guy. He will never be a star or anything but he's solid and is a great teammate.

Did you guys do much of the Brogdon/Holiday/X/Warren/<Turner or Sabonis> type lineups where X is other Holiday or whoever was available between Lamb, Dipo, etc? Or McConnell even?

I feel like that would be the "modern" type lineup. If you did, how do the #s look with those lineups with Turner, those lineups with Sabonis, vs lineups with both Tuner & Sabonis together?

Feel free to just point me at a thread if your sub has covered it already... I'm guessing it's come up. :)



The bubble and playoffs were the lineup you listed, but with Oladipo as the X. It was fine when teams had nothing to play for and didn’t adjust. It was blown up when we faced Miami in the playoffs.

MIA's really good, though, and have been playing that way all season and Butler is the best player in the series. They blew up MIL, too and up 1-0 on BOS. Do you think the approach is to get Sabonis back and play big? I haven't watched enough games to see how Turner/Sabonis work, so I'm not saying it doesn't. But, it just seems to counter the trend. From the outside in, I'd lean towards picking one or the other and seeing what assets I could get to retool around the other, personally. If your D was acceptable the times Sabonis was on the floor without Turner, I'd stick with him due to the offensive edge. Then try to get as much shooting / secondary shot creation / wing defense back as you can. Obviously, easier said than done. But Turner could get you some of that.

I'm not even saying it to pimp Hayward, since I'd rather resign him or get different pieces than Turner (who I like but don't think we NEED). But, in theory, I love a Brogdon/Dipo/Warren/Hayward/Sabonis lineup. Hayward's a soild on ball defender, and great at team D which is big. Age/injury/salary concerns, sure. But skillset wise that seems perfect.
djFan71
Forum Mod - Celtics
Forum Mod - Celtics
Posts: 8,222
And1: 8,853
Joined: Jul 24, 2010
 

Re: Turner to the Celtics - How? 

Post#92 » by djFan71 » Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:53 am

Wizop wrote:
djFan71 wrote:Did you guys do much of the Brogdon/Holiday/X/Warren/<Turner or Sabonis> type lineups where X is other Holiday or whoever was available between Lamb, Dipo, etc? Or McConnell even?

I feel like that would be the "modern" type lineup. If you did, how do the #s look with those lineups with Turner, those lineups with Sabonis, vs lineups with both Tuner & Sabonis together?

Feel free to just point me at a thread if your sub has covered it already... I'm guessing it's come up. :)
Second unit played 2 Holidays, McConnell, McDermott, and Sabonis and was very effective. A big factor in playoffs was that the second unit collapsed without Sabonis.

Because of staggered injuries the projected first unit of Brogdon, Oladipo, Warren, Turner, and Sabonis only played 86 minutes together all year.

Yikes. That's brutal on the injuries.
As mentioned in previous reply, if that 2nd lineup worked, imagine it with Brogdon/Dipo/Warren and Wing X that you get back via Turner trade or draft with a pick returned from him.
Guzman_9
Senior
Posts: 663
And1: 127
Joined: Dec 13, 2011

Re: Turner to the Celtics - How? 

Post#93 » by Guzman_9 » Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:55 am

mademan wrote:Turner/1st for Smart


No way Pacers giving a first let alone Turner for Smart haha.

Pacers rarely trade their picks literally the only time since ive been a fan since 07 they trade a 1st was 2020 for Brogdon.
Pacer Fan. 8-)
djFan71
Forum Mod - Celtics
Forum Mod - Celtics
Posts: 8,222
And1: 8,853
Joined: Jul 24, 2010
 

Re: Turner to the Celtics - How? 

Post#94 » by djFan71 » Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:07 am

It's really too bad Turner just barely doesn't fit into GSW's TPE. He's not worth #2, but you could find a basis with that and balance it out with a 3rd team or whatever. But, he's just $.4M too much. So you have to add Wiggins and everything falls apart.
Topofthekey
Rookie
Posts: 1,161
And1: 400
Joined: Nov 18, 2017

Re: Turner to the Celtics - How? 

Post#95 » by Topofthekey » Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:10 am

patman66 wrote:
Godaddycurse wrote:
patman66 wrote:The pacers need a 4 with range and decent defense and a back up 5.

I would think a 4 team with the clippers and kings would have to be in place.

Jymichal Green from the clippers in a trade for Kanter. 5 mill of salary
Bjelica from the kings for the 30th + porier 8 mil in salary
Langford, Theis 14 from the celts. 9 mill

pacers dump leaf on the kings.

Pacers get what they need and a late lottery pick. Langford develops under dipo, and cap flexibility


Pacers need a consolidation trade, not acquire another bunch of smaller pieces.


Well what are they consolidating? Sampson and Holiday are FA and holiday is locked in by stupid rules to get a sub market deal. Lamb has a torn ACL, They got Doug backing up Warren. I see a team that needs help at the 4 and a backup center.
Dipo is at the bottom of his value right now, Are you thinking Warren and Turner for a star? There is no one else to add to Turner to increase his value. They don't even have a first.

Sabonis-Turner-Warren-Oladipo-Brogdon are the current projected starters

Safe to say they all deserve to be starters

Off the bench, Pacers have McDermott-Holiday-Holiday-Lamb-McConnell

Again, safe to say they are all capable backups

Add in the fact that Pacers would like to find opportunities to play Goga and Sumner, and you're looking at 12 players who all deserve getting their playing time

Barring injuries (or suspensions or whatever), no matter how you look at it, someone is going to end up wasting away on the bench

Hence them requiring a consolidation trade or two, to bring that number down to a more manageable figure
User avatar
Spin Move
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 8,945
And1: 711
Joined: Sep 22, 2004
     

Re: Turner to the Celtics - How? 

Post#96 » by Spin Move » Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:16 am

Not loving any of these proposed trades from the celtics point of view, Turner can block shots but doesnt rebound at a high rate his Box +_ is .1 net Per is 14.8, really not good for a big. He is making 20 million a year, he is a guy I would not mind on the celtics, but I am not thinking of giving GH+ picks and really not thinking about trading smart or Brown for him, he is a solid player don't get me wrong and maybe he needs to be away from Sabonis to be better. We can't get to 20 million in player salary woth dumping for him, Kanter, Poirer etc don't add up to enough
Topofthekey
Rookie
Posts: 1,161
And1: 400
Joined: Nov 18, 2017

Re: Turner to the Celtics - How? 

Post#97 » by Topofthekey » Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:23 am

giberish wrote:
basketballwacko2 wrote:
pacers33granger wrote:I don't think there's a deal there to be had without a 3rd team somehow. Boston certainly have the value, but the fit isn't good.

- Hayward doesn't fit our timeline and forces either him or Warren to be the PF next to Domas. That's very very bad for our defense.
- I'd personally love Smart, but we have more than enough guards as is.
- Brown is worth much more than Turner.
- No team hates picks, but we're not in the market for them now (or ever really).
- We'd be looking to consolidate talent, not dilute it.

As other Indy fans have pointed out, find us a good defensive PF that can hit threes and we'll talk. But that guy isn't on the table for Turner. Plus Turner is like 80% of that, so it makes the most sense to stick with him.



It makes no sense to talk about trading Turner to the Celtics. Whether it's Brown or Hayward doesn't matter you end up thin at the 4/5 with no real PF on the team at all and no backups unless Goga improves drastically. Unless you think Jakar Sampson is a 24 min per game guy! So all this talk of trading Turner for some unnamed player who is gonna give us what he gives us and then some is pointless. The SG's and SF type options don't help.


Warren seems like he could cover a lot of PF minutes. IMO a Tuner for Brown deal would work out well for Indy (a defensive downgrade at pf but a defensive upgrade at SF with Brown). You'd need to find a backup pf (and perhaps a backup C if Goga isn't ready) but those are secondary roles you can fill with minor deals (or MLE money). The problem with a Turner for Hayward deal is that Hayward isn't that good, and he's really expensive so Indy loses depth and talent while getting older.

Basically any trade suggestion involving Hayward for Turner, in a nutshell

One can see why it has never found any real traction with Pacers posters
100proof
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,655
And1: 879
Joined: Jul 25, 2019
 

Re: Turner to the Celtics - How? 

Post#98 » by 100proof » Thu Sep 17, 2020 10:43 am

Guzman_9 wrote:
mademan wrote:Turner/1st for Smart


No way Pacers giving a first let alone Turner for Smart haha.

Pacers rarely trade their picks literally the only time since ive been a fan since 07 they trade a 1st was 2020 for Brogdon.


Wow.

Smart is so much better than turner.
HartfordWhalers
Senior Mod - 76ers and NBA TnT Forum
Senior Mod - 76ers and NBA TnT Forum
Posts: 41,422
And1: 16,052
Joined: Apr 07, 2010
   

Re: Turner to the Celtics - How? 

Post#99 » by HartfordWhalers » Thu Sep 17, 2020 11:36 am

100proof wrote:
Guzman_9 wrote:
mademan wrote:Turner/1st for Smart


No way Pacers giving a first let alone Turner for Smart haha.

Pacers rarely trade their picks literally the only time since ive been a fan since 07 they trade a 1st was 2020 for Brogdon.


Wow.

Smart is so much better than turner.


Would you really refuse to trade Smart for Turner?
HartfordWhalers
Senior Mod - 76ers and NBA TnT Forum
Senior Mod - 76ers and NBA TnT Forum
Posts: 41,422
And1: 16,052
Joined: Apr 07, 2010
   

Re: Turner to the Celtics - How? 

Post#100 » by HartfordWhalers » Thu Sep 17, 2020 11:41 am

basketballwacko2 wrote:
pacers33granger wrote:I don't think there's a deal there to be had without a 3rd team somehow. Boston certainly have the value, but the fit isn't good.

- Hayward doesn't fit our timeline and forces either him or Warren to be the PF next to Domas. That's very very bad for our defense.
- I'd personally love Smart, but we have more than enough guards as is.
- Brown is worth much more than Turner.
- No team hates picks, but we're not in the market for them now (or ever really).
- We'd be looking to consolidate talent, not dilute it.

As other Indy fans have pointed out, find us a good defensive PF that can hit threes and we'll talk. But that guy isn't on the table for Turner. Plus Turner is like 80% of that, so it makes the most sense to stick with him.



It makes no sense to talk about trading Turner to the Celtics. Whether it's Brown or Hayward doesn't matter you end up thin at the 4/5 with no real PF on the team at all and no backups unless Goga improves drastically. Unless you think Jakar Sampson is a 24 min per game guy! So all this talk of trading Turner for some unnamed player who is gonna give us what he gives us and then some is pointless. The SG's and SF type options don't help.


I cannot understand the ‘whether it is Brown’.

Are you saying you wouldn’t trade Turner for Brown?

Return to Trades and Transactions