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Marrrcuss wrote:

R-DAWG wrote:

Marrrcuss wrote:I think peoples opinions have a lot of feeling with them. As R-Dawg just noted, Harrell won 6th man of the year while averaging 19 a game. He was a mismatch night mare for many teams and that will only get worse now being that you have to pick between lebron, AD and Harrell. Of course Harrell doesnt get one of your top 2 defenders.

Ibaka is Morris with shotblocking, although he didnt block a lot last year

This better defines my point - the upside of Harrell in this role is higher than the upside Ibaka would bring to the Lakers. The move could also backfire and not work.

However, on the Clippers - Ibaka is a better fit even if he doesn't have the ceiling of Harrell.

If he were starting, i would agree.

But bringing energy off the bench with (hopefully) Schroeder, please give me Harrell.

But this does require the Lakers brining in a replacement for Dwight.

If they land Gasol at the minimum (which is very possible if he want to compete for a championship take $2.6MM from the Lakers with a $2.9MM player option for next season - Rondo's deal from last year - vs $5.7MM this year from Golden State) that puts a bow on the offseason.

Would also like to see them land a wing - a Trevor Ariza if he is bought out or potentially Otto Porter Jr at the waiver deadline.

R-DAWG wrote:

Marrrcuss wrote:

R-DAWG wrote:
This better defines my point - the upside of Harrell in this role is higher than the upside Ibaka would bring to the Lakers. The move could also backfire and not work.

However, on the Clippers - Ibaka is a better fit even if he doesn't have the ceiling of Harrell.

If he were starting, i would agree.

But bringing energy off the bench with (hopefully) Schroeder, please give me Harrell.

But this does require the Lakers brining in a replacement for Dwight.

If they land Gasol at the minimum (which is very possible if he want to compete for a championship take $2.6MM from the Lakers with a $2.9MM player option for next season - Rondo's deal from last year - vs $5.7MM this year from Golden State) that puts a bow on the offseason.

Would also like to see them land a wing - a Trevor Ariza if he is bought out or potentially Otto Porter Jr at the waiver deadline.

I can stand for them to give Kuz one more year.

I think they get one more big. Most teams are out of money and I cant see all the remaining bigs saying no to getting a ring.

R-DAWG wrote:

Yenrallik1111 wrote:

kobe_vs_jordan wrote:Don't think projecting what Harrell will be at 34 vs what Ibaka is now is how to compare who the better player currently. Harrell won't even be a Laker by then.

sorry meant to say harell at 33-34 compared to Ibaka at 33-34.

Only problem here is Montrez Harrell is 26 years old, turning 27 in January.

He has a 2 year contract, with the second year a player option.

I'm not really sure how this is relevant, especially considering Lebron James will be 41-42 when Harrell is 33-34.

Look, I am in no way saying Harrell to the Lakers is a home run - it's high risk, high reward. I think it's the right move for the Lakers, just like I think Ibaka is the right move for the Clippers. Harrell's ceiling is higher, Ibaka's floor is higher. Sometimes, different players make sense for different situations.

I am not sure how that point is relevant, sorry maybe you misunderstood me there. I was simply making a straight comparison when they are both at that age respectively. Ibaka is the more complete player now and I think he always will. Harell to me is a raw hustle energy guy, those typically do not age well. do not get me wrong, he is a really good one or he would not have won 6th man of the year but your argument has holes. you say he won 6th man of the year and serge was not in the conversation, i then counter with fact and logic. Serge wasn't eligible because he started too many games, voiding that argument completely with zero acknowledgment or counter from you. Simply put, the lakers want to repeat and clippers are also in win now mode. to me is it quite clear serge is easily the better option for either team right now. and I think the lakers would have chose serge over harell if given the choice. that does not mean harell can not help, he clearly can. so with respect we will have to agree to disagree who would be the right/better move at the moment.

Yenrallik1111 wrote:

R-DAWG wrote:

Yenrallik1111 wrote:
sorry meant to say harell at 33-34 compared to Ibaka at 33-34.

Only problem here is Montrez Harrell is 26 years old, turning 27 in January.

He has a 2 year contract, with the second year a player option.

I'm not really sure how this is relevant, especially considering Lebron James will be 41-42 when Harrell is 33-34.

Look, I am in no way saying Harrell to the Lakers is a home run - it's high risk, high reward. I think it's the right move for the Lakers, just like I think Ibaka is the right move for the Clippers. Harrell's ceiling is higher, Ibaka's floor is higher. Sometimes, different players make sense for different situations.

I am not sure how that point is relevant, sorry maybe you misunderstood me there. I was simply making a straight comparison when they are both at that age respectively. Ibaka is the more complete player now and I think he always will. Harell to me is a raw hustle energy guy, those typically do not age well. do not get me wrong, he is a really good one or he would not have won 6th man of the year but your argument has holes. you say he won 6th man of the year and serge was not in the conversation, i then counter with fact and logic. Serge wasn't eligible because he started too many games, voiding that argument completely with zero acknowledgment or counter from you. Simply put, the lakers want to repeat and clippers are also in win now mode. to me is it quite clear serge is easily the better option for either team right now. and I think the lakers would have chose serge over harell if given the choice. that does not mean harell can not help, he clearly can. so with respect we will have to agree to disagree who would be the right/better move at the moment.

I feel Morris gives us some of what Serge does and the veterans minimum. No one else gives us what Harrell does tho. He went to the line as much as LeBron did. You need energy from your second unit.

Yenrallik1111 wrote:

R-DAWG wrote:

Yenrallik1111 wrote:
sorry meant to say harell at 33-34 compared to Ibaka at 33-34.

Only problem here is Montrez Harrell is 26 years old, turning 27 in January.

He has a 2 year contract, with the second year a player option.

I'm not really sure how this is relevant, especially considering Lebron James will be 41-42 when Harrell is 33-34.

Look, I am in no way saying Harrell to the Lakers is a home run - it's high risk, high reward. I think it's the right move for the Lakers, just like I think Ibaka is the right move for the Clippers. Harrell's ceiling is higher, Ibaka's floor is higher. Sometimes, different players make sense for different situations.

I am not sure how that point is relevant, sorry maybe you misunderstood me there. I was simply making a straight comparison when they are both at that age respectively. Ibaka is the more complete player now and I think he always will. Harell to me is a raw hustle energy guy, those typically do not age well. do not get me wrong, he is a really good one or he would not have won 6th man of the year but your argument has holes. you say he won 6th man of the year and serge was not in the conversation, i then counter with fact and logic. Serge wasn't eligible because he started too many games, voiding that argument completely with zero acknowledgment or counter from you. Simply put, the lakers want to repeat and clippers are also in win now mode. to me is it quite clear serge is easily the better option for either team right now. and I think the lakers would have chose serge over harell if given the choice. that does not mean harell can not help, he clearly can. so with respect we will have to agree to disagree who would be the right/better move at the moment.

I'm sorry, but I don't think it's clear that Serge is the better player - especially for a team that is at their best with Anthony Davis at C.

Harrell can be a feature offensive player off the bench, Serge is a complemtary player.

They are different players. Segre is a better for fit the Clippers. Harrell is POTENTIALLY a better fit on the Lakers. And Harrell hitting his upside on the Lakers, is more valuable than having Serge as a stretch 5 who would play limited minutes OR take Davis out of the C position, which was the Lakers best lineup last year.

Serge would have fit both teams better. Harrell is nice, and the Lakers got a good pickup, but ibaka would have been an even better fit no matter how you slice it. Ibakas 3pt shooting is a better fit with lebron/AD than Harrell whose strictly an inside guy.

Doesn't mean Harrell can't have an impact, just that in crunch time when you want the lane clear for lebron/AD its going to be a weird fit with Harrell who can't step out.

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Lakers went into the offseason wanting to get younger because of the short turnaround time and a packed regular season. Last season the core had LeBron, Green, Dwight, McGee, Morris, Bradley and Rondo all with significant mileage on their bodies and the Lakers rode their luck to avoid any significant injuries there. Banking on that to happen twice in a row would have been risky.

Also the team that starts the season might not be the one that finishes the season after the trade deadline.

[quote="Marrrcuss"][quote="Yenrallik1111"][quote="R-DAWG"]

Only problem here is Montrez Harrell is 26 years old, turning 27 in January.

He has a 2 year contract, with the second year a player option.

I'm not really sure how this is relevant, [b]especially considering Lebron James will be 41-42 when Harrell is 33-34.
[/b]
Look, I am in no way saying Harrell to the Lakers is a home run - it's high risk, high reward. I think it's the right move for the Lakers, just like I think Ibaka is the right move for the Clippers. Harrell's ceiling is higher, Ibaka's floor is higher. Sometimes, different players make sense for different situations.[/quote]

I am not sure how that point is relevant, sorry maybe you misunderstood me there. I was simply making a straight comparison when they are both at that age respectively. Ibaka is the more complete player now and I think he always will. Harell to me is a raw hustle energy guy, those typically do not age well. do not get me wrong, he is a really good one or he would not have won 6th man of the year but your argument has holes. you say he won 6th man of the year and serge was not in the conversation, i then counter with fact and logic. Serge wasn't eligible because he started too many games, voiding that argument completely with zero acknowledgment or counter from you. Simply put, the lakers want to repeat and clippers are also in win now mode. to me is it quite clear serge is easily the better option for either team right now. and I think the lakers would have chose serge over harell if given the choice. that does not mean harell can not help, he clearly can. so with respect we will have to agree to disagree who would be the right/better move at the moment.[/quote]

I feel Morris gives us some of what Serge does and the veterans minimum. No one else gives us what Harrell does tho. He went to the line as much as LeBron did. You need energy from your second unit.[/quote]

I don't see how Kieff can be compared to what Ibaka brings. That comparison is akin to me saying the Clips can keep, say, Motley to replace Trez.

He was also a focal point of the Clippers offense, be it with the second unit or starters, not quite sure that will be the case with the Lakers. Not saying he's a bad signing per se, but the situation will be different and it'll be interesting to see how it works out

R-DAWG wrote:

Yenrallik1111 wrote:

R-DAWG wrote:
Only problem here is Montrez Harrell is 26 years old, turning 27 in January.

He has a 2 year contract, with the second year a player option.

I'm not really sure how this is relevant, especially considering Lebron James will be 41-42 when Harrell is 33-34.

Look, I am in no way saying Harrell to the Lakers is a home run - it's high risk, high reward. I think it's the right move for the Lakers, just like I think Ibaka is the right move for the Clippers. Harrell's ceiling is higher, Ibaka's floor is higher. Sometimes, different players make sense for different situations.

I am not sure how that point is relevant, sorry maybe you misunderstood me there. I was simply making a straight comparison when they are both at that age respectively. Ibaka is the more complete player now and I think he always will. Harell to me is a raw hustle energy guy, those typically do not age well. do not get me wrong, he is a really good one or he would not have won 6th man of the year but your argument has holes. you say he won 6th man of the year and serge was not in the conversation, i then counter with fact and logic. Serge wasn't eligible because he started too many games, voiding that argument completely with zero acknowledgment or counter from you. Simply put, the lakers want to repeat and clippers are also in win now mode. to me is it quite clear serge is easily the better option for either team right now. and I think the lakers would have chose serge over harell if given the choice. that does not mean harell can not help, he clearly can. so with respect we will have to agree to disagree who would be the right/better move at the moment.

I'm sorry, but I don't think it's clear that Serge is the better player - especially for a team that is at their best with Anthony Davis at C.

Harrell can be a feature offensive player off the bench, Serge is a complemtary player.

They are different players. Segre is a better for fit the Clippers. Harrell is POTENTIALLY a better fit on the Lakers. And Harrell hitting his upside on the Lakers, is more valuable than having Serge as a stretch 5 who would play limited minutes OR take Davis out of the C position, which was the Lakers best lineup last year.

first, I want to acknowledge that it is clear we are not on the same page. yet the debate has remained civil/respectful I think. so thank you for that. Davis does not want to play center, and you best believe the lakers will accommodate that the best they can. Harell would be the "center" with both guys in the game, so again Serge is the better fit in that role for the lakers but I can admit harell should do fine. maybe there should be a poll or something on who is the better player/fit for either the clippers or lakers. but our debate feels like it has been beaten to death enough

Serge is just flat out a better fit for both teams. Can Harrell even close games for the Lakers? He can’t defend or space the floor. A scoring 6th man’s value is inversely related to going deeper into the playoffs.

Actually, for me, the Ibaka signing is the best deal until now in the free agency. But Harrell will have the better year in LA, he will be paid to do what he does well, Lakers had almost no offense off the bench, now they have Schroeder + Harrell, stacking minutes with LBJ or AD will result in a lot of points agains second units.

Ibaka is by far the best players, good defender and rebounder, shoots the 3pt ball nicely, but he went to the Clippers, and they will be disfunctional, Clippers everyday things we are used to now. He would be a dream fit for Lakers or Celtics, but as I said, GREAT Clippers signing.

Harrell is at the center of leaks that heavily damaged the Clippers unity. Ibaka is a true NBA professional.

I take the player that does his job and shuts up about it.

Ibaka improves the Clippers more than Harrell improves the Lakers, and comes cheaper.

But I noticed the Lakers are accomplishing one thing they needed to do: get younger. This past postseason was rough on an older team, and prepping for another (hopefully) extended playoff run may have led them to prioritize some springier legs.

Harrell>Ibaka. Both in LA now on contenders, i have no doubt he'll show it. And i think the first narrative that gets busted is that Ibaka is a better defender

Guys, youre judging the lakers picking up Harrell like it was a trade for Ibaka.

Its an addition to their team. They added the 6th man of the year to their core.

Every impact stat favours Harrell
Box stats favour Harrell
Harrell won 6MOY

Are people underrating Harrell or overrating Ibaka?

Ibaka is not a good defender, he will be like Harrell on the Clips and fans will be begging for Zubac to start. Book it.

mademan wrote:Harrell>Ibaka. Both in LA now on contenders, i have no doubt he'll show it. And i think the first narrative that gets busted is that Ibaka is a better defender

There's a better chance of Ben Simmons becoming a better three point shooter than Trae Young vs Harrell being a better defender, and the playoffs showed it. Even Plumlee was abusing him

zimpy27 wrote:Every impact stat favours Harrell
Box stats favour Harrell
Harrell won 6MOY

Are people underrating Harrell or overrating Ibaka?

Ibaka is not a good defender, he will be like Harrell on the Clips and fans will be begging for Zubac to start. Book it.

Its bitterness

Marrrcuss wrote:Guys, youre judging the lakers picking up Harrell like it was a trade for Ibaka.

Its an addition to their team. They added the 6th man of the year to their core.

Going off that then the clippers upgraded to a better player. Clippers had Trez they know if they upgraded in skill

Marrrcuss wrote:

zimpy27 wrote:Every impact stat favours Harrell
Box stats favour Harrell
Harrell won 6MOY

Are people underrating Harrell or overrating Ibaka?

Ibaka is not a good defender, he will be like Harrell on the Clips and fans will be begging for Zubac to start. Book it.

Its bitterness

Who said Zubac isn’t starting. As mentioned there is to much emotion in this with people trying to fight logic. Ibaka is the better player overall and everyone knows it