Wiseman to OKC

Moderators: loserX, Trader_Joe, Mamba4Goat, Andre Roberstan, BullyKing, Texas Chuck, pacers33granger, HartfordWhalers

User avatar
eminence
RealGM
Posts: 10,063
And1: 6,309
Joined: Mar 07, 2015
 

Wiseman to OKC 

Post#1 » by eminence » Mon Sep 13, 2021 9:25 pm

Taking out the money saving aspect of some of the recently discussed deals. Turn 1 young asset into pieces that are more ready to win now.

Wiseman/Mulder (or Payton)

for

Favors/Dort

OKC - Get the highest upside prospect here.

GSW - Get guys more ready to play, and Dort has decent upside as well.

Would OKC be willing to send back pick value here?
'17-'18 APBR Win Projections Champion (1st of 20)
'18-'19 5th of 18
'19-'20 2nd of 17
User avatar
Takingbaconback
Head Coach
Posts: 6,705
And1: 2,457
Joined: Jun 22, 2013
       

Re: Wiseman to OKC 

Post#2 » by Takingbaconback » Mon Sep 13, 2021 9:39 pm

Give me Dort any day of the week over Wiseman. Centers in today's NBA have to be great at multiple aspects to have a decent impact on the court. I don't see that with Wiseman, I don't see him being great at anything at this point. Dort is one of the best defenders in the NBA already. GSW is technically giving up more value cuz Wiseman was the 2nd overall pick, but I wouldn't pull the trigger if I were OKC in this scenario.
jbk1234
Forum Mod - Cavs
Forum Mod - Cavs
Posts: 43,890
And1: 25,010
Joined: Dec 22, 2010
   

Re: Wiseman to OKC 

Post#3 » by jbk1234 » Mon Sep 13, 2021 9:54 pm

I'm not high on Wiseman, but this seems like selling low to an extreme. Wiseman for Dort straight up is a stretch, even though it would save GS a ton of money, but if you take out those savings, this is robbery by the Thunder.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app
It is highly unlikely that the Cavs will agree with your Kevin Love evaluation for the purpose of a trade.
User avatar
eminence
RealGM
Posts: 10,063
And1: 6,309
Joined: Mar 07, 2015
 

Re: Wiseman to OKC 

Post#4 » by eminence » Mon Sep 13, 2021 10:23 pm

Two highly differing opinions so far, lol. To jbk - the Warriors would need somebody to absorb some C minutes with this deal, any ideas to address that that don't involve Favors?

Maybe someone would send a cheaper playable C to GS if OKC sent them Williams?

Only guys I can think of still on the market are Cousins/Biyombo, not guys I'd be thrilled to bring in for the role. Baynes if he gets healthy. Jordan Bell the return. Not many non-trade options.
'17-'18 APBR Win Projections Champion (1st of 20)
'18-'19 5th of 18
'19-'20 2nd of 17
Commodor
Starter
Posts: 2,246
And1: 389
Joined: Jul 24, 2008
     

Re: Wiseman to OKC 

Post#5 » by Commodor » Mon Sep 13, 2021 10:34 pm

No thanks from this GSW fan. I like Dort but we have glut of wings already and a very thin big man rotation. Favors is very meh and really just provides the same as Looney.

Keep wiseman and hope he develops.
User avatar
zimpy27
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 21,728
And1: 21,978
Joined: Jul 13, 2014

Re: Wiseman to OKC 

Post#6 » by zimpy27 » Mon Sep 13, 2021 10:35 pm

Feels like OKC needs to give a bit more and I don't really understand where Dort would play for GSW. Who is the ball handler off the bench for GSW?
"Let's play some basketball!" - Fergie
User avatar
eminence
RealGM
Posts: 10,063
And1: 6,309
Joined: Mar 07, 2015
 

Re: Wiseman to OKC 

Post#7 » by eminence » Mon Sep 13, 2021 10:42 pm

zimpy27 wrote:Feels like OKC needs to give a bit more and I don't really understand where Dort would play for GSW. Who is the ball handler off the bench for GSW?


In this scenario presumably would be some combo of Poole/Dort.
'17-'18 APBR Win Projections Champion (1st of 20)
'18-'19 5th of 18
'19-'20 2nd of 17
User avatar
eminence
RealGM
Posts: 10,063
And1: 6,309
Joined: Mar 07, 2015
 

Re: Wiseman to OKC 

Post#8 » by eminence » Mon Sep 13, 2021 10:49 pm

Commodor wrote:No thanks from this GSW fan. I like Dort but we have glut of wings already and a very thin big man rotation. Favors is very meh and really just provides the same as Looney.

Keep wiseman and hope he develops.


I see Dort playing the 1-3 where I wouldn't say we have much of a glut, I see the glut at the 3/4.

If you're looking at Wiseman developing (say to a reasonable 5th starter level) for this season I think you're hoping for a miracle. Even by next season seems like a real longshot.
'17-'18 APBR Win Projections Champion (1st of 20)
'18-'19 5th of 18
'19-'20 2nd of 17
User avatar
zimpy27
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 21,728
And1: 21,978
Joined: Jul 13, 2014

Re: Wiseman to OKC 

Post#9 » by zimpy27 » Mon Sep 13, 2021 10:50 pm

eminence wrote:
zimpy27 wrote:Feels like OKC needs to give a bit more and I don't really understand where Dort would play for GSW. Who is the ball handler off the bench for GSW?


In this scenario presumably would be some combo of Poole/Dort.


Maybe Iggy as well I guess.

Is this the team?
Curry, Klay, Wiggins, Green, Favors -- Poole, Dort, Iggy, OPJ, Looney -- Lee, Moody, JTA, Kuminga, Bjelica

If so, I do see some playmaking holes and worry about development of Moody, JTA, Kuminga as third stringers.

The more I look at this lineup the more I wonder if Wiggins could just be moved for Favors. GSW don't really need Wiggins anymore.
"Let's play some basketball!" - Fergie
User avatar
Texas Chuck
Senior Mod - Mavericks and NBA TnT Forum
Senior Mod - Mavericks and NBA TnT Forum
Posts: 69,021
And1: 65,161
Joined: May 19, 2012
Location: Purgatory
   

Re: Wiseman to OKC 

Post#10 » by Texas Chuck » Mon Sep 13, 2021 10:53 pm

eminence wrote:Two highly differing opinions so far, lol. To jbk - the Warriors would need somebody to absorb some C minutes with this deal, any ideas to address that that don't involve Favors?

Maybe someone would send a cheaper playable C to GS if OKC sent them Williams?

Only guys I can think of still on the market are Cousins/Biyombo, not guys I'd be thrilled to bring in for the role. Baynes if he gets healthy. Jordan Bell the return. Not many non-trade options.


Trade options are tough because min centers are usually on one year deals. I'd be happy to send GSW WCS back, but he's a meh option and he makes $4M which means he costs GSW a lot more than a min guy would. Guess some of that offsets by GSW sending back Mulder?

Gasol would have been the answer but seems pretty locked into playing in Spain at this point.

But I too would have the deal Dort for Wiseman with no Favors and no picks or at most the OKC 2nd. Saves GSW a fortune while improving their chances to win right now and they keep their most valuable assets. Thunder take another boom/bust flier as they should until they find a star to pair with SGA.
bondom34 wrote:This is stupid and you know this is stupid.
psman2
Assistant Coach
Posts: 3,933
And1: 2,264
Joined: Feb 12, 2016
 

Re: Wiseman to OKC 

Post#11 » by psman2 » Mon Sep 13, 2021 10:55 pm

eminence wrote:Two highly differing opinions so far, lol. To jbk - the Warriors would need somebody to absorb some C minutes with this deal, any ideas to address that that don't involve Favors?

Maybe someone would send a cheaper playable C to GS if OKC sent them Williams?


Triston Thompson? Kings need some 3/4 help, could squeeze some 2nds out them maybe too.

WCS/2nds for Thompson likely works for Dallas.
Commodor
Starter
Posts: 2,246
And1: 389
Joined: Jul 24, 2008
     

Re: Wiseman to OKC 

Post#12 » by Commodor » Mon Sep 13, 2021 10:56 pm

eminence wrote:
Commodor wrote:No thanks from this GSW fan. I like Dort but we have glut of wings already and a very thin big man rotation. Favors is very meh and really just provides the same as Looney.

Keep wiseman and hope he develops.


I see Dort playing the 1-3 where I wouldn't say we have much of a glut, I see the glut at the 3/4.

If you're looking at Wiseman developing (say to a reasonable 5th starter level) for this season I think you're hoping for a miracle. Even by next season seems like a real longshot.


If you expect Poole to play more of a true 2 than 1 (which I do) then it is clear we are rather deep 2-4 and that PG & C is our largest needs. Dort is not a playmaker that fits the distributor mold he's a 3 & D guy.

Klay/Poole/Moody/Lee
Wiggins/Iguodala/OPJ
Green/Kuminga/JTA/Bjelica

As for Wiseman he may not become our starter this year but his value long term is far superior to anything Favors can provide. Make a push for Marc Gasol if big man depth is that important and just keep Wiseman. Favors-level talent is not difficult to find.
User avatar
eminence
RealGM
Posts: 10,063
And1: 6,309
Joined: Mar 07, 2015
 

Re: Wiseman to OKC 

Post#13 » by eminence » Mon Sep 13, 2021 10:59 pm

zimpy27 wrote:
eminence wrote:
zimpy27 wrote:Feels like OKC needs to give a bit more and I don't really understand where Dort would play for GSW. Who is the ball handler off the bench for GSW?


In this scenario presumably would be some combo of Poole/Dort.


Maybe Iggy as well I guess.

Is this the team?
Curry, Klay, Wiggins, Green, Favors -- Poole, Dort, Iggy, OPJ, Looney -- Lee, Moody, JTA, Kuminga, Bjelica

If so, I do see some playmaking holes and worry about development of Moody, JTA, Kuminga as third stringers.

The more I look at this lineup the more I wonder if Wiggins could just be moved for Favors. GSW don't really need Wiggins anymore.


I'd expect JTA ahead of Iggy in the rotation, but yes, that looks roughly correct. I expect Moody/Kuminga to get some G-league assignments and am willing to bring them along slow. Kuminga in particular there's no practical way to get into the rotation. Moody may have a chance to earn a higher slot while Klay is out. Wouldn't worry about JTA's development, he's 28 lol.

Staggering the rotations I'm not too concerned about playmaking throughout the roster, though it's certainly not an A+ area either.
'17-'18 APBR Win Projections Champion (1st of 20)
'18-'19 5th of 18
'19-'20 2nd of 17
User avatar
eminence
RealGM
Posts: 10,063
And1: 6,309
Joined: Mar 07, 2015
 

Re: Wiseman to OKC 

Post#14 » by eminence » Mon Sep 13, 2021 11:06 pm

Texas Chuck wrote:
eminence wrote:Two highly differing opinions so far, lol. To jbk - the Warriors would need somebody to absorb some C minutes with this deal, any ideas to address that that don't involve Favors?

Maybe someone would send a cheaper playable C to GS if OKC sent them Williams?

Only guys I can think of still on the market are Cousins/Biyombo, not guys I'd be thrilled to bring in for the role. Baynes if he gets healthy. Jordan Bell the return. Not many non-trade options.


Trade options are tough because min centers are usually on one year deals. I'd be happy to send GSW WCS back, but he's a meh option and he makes $4M which means he costs GSW a lot more than a min guy would. Guess some of that offsets by GSW sending back Mulder?

Gasol would have been the answer but seems pretty locked into playing in Spain at this point.

But I too would have the deal Dort for Wiseman with no Favors and no picks or at most the OKC 2nd. Saves GSW a fortune while improving their chances to win right now and they keep their most valuable assets. Thunder take another boom/bust flier as they should until they find a star to pair with SGA.


Yeah... Gasol would've been nice :(

Interesting, on the no Favors though.
'17-'18 APBR Win Projections Champion (1st of 20)
'18-'19 5th of 18
'19-'20 2nd of 17
User avatar
eminence
RealGM
Posts: 10,063
And1: 6,309
Joined: Mar 07, 2015
 

Re: Wiseman to OKC 

Post#15 » by eminence » Mon Sep 13, 2021 11:16 pm

Commodor wrote:
eminence wrote:
Commodor wrote:No thanks from this GSW fan. I like Dort but we have glut of wings already and a very thin big man rotation. Favors is very meh and really just provides the same as Looney.

Keep wiseman and hope he develops.


I see Dort playing the 1-3 where I wouldn't say we have much of a glut, I see the glut at the 3/4.

If you're looking at Wiseman developing (say to a reasonable 5th starter level) for this season I think you're hoping for a miracle. Even by next season seems like a real longshot.


If you expect Poole to play more of a true 2 than 1 (which I do) then it is clear we are rather deep 2-4 and that PG & C is our largest needs. Dort is not a playmaker that fits the distributor mold he's a 3 & D guy.

Klay/Poole/Moody/Lee
Wiggins/Iguodala/OPJ
Green/Kuminga/JTA/Bjelica

As for Wiseman he may not become our starter this year but his value long term is far superior to anything Favors can provide. Make a push for Marc Gasol if big man depth is that important and just keep Wiseman. Favors-level talent is not difficult to find.


I guess I don't get writing the depth chart like that, I'd love if Poole (or Dort in this scenario) were better playmakers, but they aren't. Someone will still be playing the 'pg' spot when Steph sits even if the playmaking load is more distributed. If you know of any good playmakers we could target (who make a comparable amount to Dort) feel free to post the deal - off the top of my head Jalen Brunson might be the only one in the league.

I obviously agree on the value of Favors, but Dort is the value of this deal, not Favors. Favors is a way to directly get a rotation quality big when it may be otherwise tricky to fill that role. Muscala would be a reasonable option as well directly from the Thunder, but that trade would have to wait a bit longer.

Obviously I would've liked Gasol, he also pretty obviously turned us down. Past that, there's nobody equal to Favors on the FA market left (unless Baynes heals).
'17-'18 APBR Win Projections Champion (1st of 20)
'18-'19 5th of 18
'19-'20 2nd of 17
User avatar
eminence
RealGM
Posts: 10,063
And1: 6,309
Joined: Mar 07, 2015
 

Re: Wiseman to OKC 

Post#16 » by eminence » Mon Sep 13, 2021 11:25 pm

psman2 wrote:
eminence wrote:Two highly differing opinions so far, lol. To jbk - the Warriors would need somebody to absorb some C minutes with this deal, any ideas to address that that don't involve Favors?

Maybe someone would send a cheaper playable C to GS if OKC sent them Williams?


Triston Thompson? Kings need some 3/4 help, could squeeze some 2nds out them maybe too.

WCS/2nds for Thompson likely works for Dallas.


I like the WCS suggestion (assuming he left on good terms and whatnot). Thompson is probably too expensive.

GS In: Dort/WCS
GS Out: Wiseman/Mulder

OKC In: Wiseman/Mulder
OKC Out: Williams/Dort

DAL In: Williams
DAL Out: WCS

With potential minor picks involved? A bad OKC-owned 1st (there must be one in that pile) to GS and a 2nd or two from Dallas to OKC?

I think having the '1st' from OKC would really help GS sell it to the casual fan even though it wouldn't be a high value 1st at all.
'17-'18 APBR Win Projections Champion (1st of 20)
'18-'19 5th of 18
'19-'20 2nd of 17
MoneyTalks41890
RealGM
Posts: 21,387
And1: 11,289
Joined: Oct 13, 2009
 

Re: Wiseman to OKC 

Post#17 » by MoneyTalks41890 » Mon Sep 13, 2021 11:27 pm

Dort for Wiseman feels like it can work. I think they are both very controversial on value. I see both as about end of lotto talent. But idk if I’d want to do that.
User avatar
Texas Chuck
Senior Mod - Mavericks and NBA TnT Forum
Senior Mod - Mavericks and NBA TnT Forum
Posts: 69,021
And1: 65,161
Joined: May 19, 2012
Location: Purgatory
   

Re: Wiseman to OKC 

Post#18 » by Texas Chuck » Mon Sep 13, 2021 11:43 pm

eminence wrote:DAL In: Williams
DAL Out: WCS
With potential minor picks involved?


I'm okay with this. I'm fine with Williams and Brown having to compete for minutes and having an extra wing is better than not having enough.

Would add multiple 2nds and/or Gilmore/Terry if OKC would add in a Favors/Powell swap so Dallas still had a defensive center on the roster but no big deal--would just have Kleber play more backup center and play wings every where else.
bondom34 wrote:This is stupid and you know this is stupid.
User avatar
eminence
RealGM
Posts: 10,063
And1: 6,309
Joined: Mar 07, 2015
 

Re: Wiseman to OKC 

Post#19 » by eminence » Mon Sep 13, 2021 11:49 pm

Texas Chuck wrote:
eminence wrote:DAL In: Williams
DAL Out: WCS
With potential minor picks involved?


I'm okay with this. I'm fine with Williams and Brown having to compete for minutes and having an extra wing is better than not having enough.

Would add multiple 2nds and/or Gilmore/Terry if OKC would add in a Favors/Powell swap so Dallas still had a defensive center on the roster but no big deal--would just have Kleber play more backup center and play wings every where else.


Sure, may as well while we're at it :)
'17-'18 APBR Win Projections Champion (1st of 20)
'18-'19 5th of 18
'19-'20 2nd of 17
Ballerhogger
RealGM
Posts: 34,156
And1: 10,564
Joined: Jul 06, 2014
       

Re: Wiseman to OKC 

Post#20 » by Ballerhogger » Mon Sep 13, 2021 11:57 pm

Dort showed lot promise last year almost beat us hes not going away for nothing

Return to Trades and Transactions