PHI/TOR/SAC/DET

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Bowdystuda
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PHI/TOR/SAC/DET 

Post#1 » by Bowdystuda » Thu Nov 25, 2021 3:24 am

TO PHILADELPHIA: Fred Vanvleet and Jerami Grant

OUT: Ben Simmons, Danny Green, 2022 1st round pick and 2023 2nd round pick.

PG- Vanvleet/Maxey
SG- Curry/Thybulle/Milton
SF- Grant/Korkmaz
PF- Harris/Niang
C- Embiid/Drummond


TO SACRAMENTO: Pascal Siakam

OUT: Tyrese Haliburton, Marvin Bagley, Tristan Thompson, Alex Len and 2022 1st round pick (Top 5 protected)

PG- Fox/Mitchell
SG- Hield/Davis/Ramsey
SF- Barnes/Harkless/Woodard
PF- Siakam/Metu
C- Holmes/Jones


TO TORONTO:
Ben Simmons, Tyrese Haliburton, Marvin Bagley Jr, Tristan Thompson (bought out), Danny Green (bought out), Alex Len and Sac 2022 1st round pick (top 5 protected)

OUT: Pascal Siakam, Fred Vanvleet and Goran Dragic.

PG- Haliburton/Banton/Flynn
SG- Trent Jr/Mykhailiuk
SF- Barnes/Watanabe
PF- Anunoby/Bagley Jr/Boucher
C- Simmons/Achiuwa/Birch


TO DETROIT: Goran Dragic, Phi 2022 1st round pick and Phi 2023 2nd round pick

OUT: Jerami Grant

PG- Hayes/Joseph/Jackson/Dragic
SG- Cunningham/Diallo
SF- Bey/Jackson
PF- Stewart/Lyles
C- Olynyk/Garza


Philly goes all in. Waiting until the off season wont help Simmons value or thier chances at a chip this year. Get 2 guys who can shoot the lights out. Both can score and play d. Vanvleet is honestly playing the best d of his career. No team will be able to double Embiid with the shooters Philly has. Both players are 27 and in thier prime.

Sacramento makes a desperately needed change. Get all star caliber big man. Can do a bit of everything. Shooting a career high 42% from 3 this season. Would give Sacramento a really solid starting 5. Good shooting with Hield, Barnes and now Siakam to space the floor and open lanes for Fox. Would get them to the playoffs most likely, which the fans really need.

Toronto kind of retools. Take back a bunch of contracts but will buy most of them out. Get Haliburton who they hope can be a big pg of the future. Can develop with the young core of Barnes, OG, Simmons, Banton, Trent Jr and Achiuwa. Get Simmons and put him at the Center position. With Simmons amazing d, it Would allow Nick Nurse to be super creative with his Defence. Teams would have a hard time scoring with Simmons, OG and Barnes. Also, rest players, like they did last year. See what the young players have. Take a chance on Bagley for 25 to 30 games. See what he has. If nothing, release in the off season. Would allow them to tank for 1 last year and hopefully get a top 5 pick. Would also open up a bunch of cap space for next year and moving forward.

Detroit gets a 1st and 2nd round pick for Grant. Open up 20 million in cap for next year and solidify thier tank job for this year. Without Grant, Detroit will be up there with Hou and NO for most loses. Should guarentee another top 5 pick this year.
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Re: PHI/TOR/SAC/DET 

Post#2 » by Godaddycurse » Thu Nov 25, 2021 3:28 am

toronto getting way too much at the expense of everyone else
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Re: PHI/TOR/SAC/DET 

Post#3 » by BullyKing » Thu Nov 25, 2021 3:28 am

I have Simmons and Haliburton as the two most valuable pieces in the trade. The idea that Toronto ends up with them both and a 1st round pick seems off to say the least.
NYSixersFan wrote:
the plan is to get as good as quickly as possible....I fully believe we could have been a borderline playoff team last year by adding young veterans....using or draft picks and cap space.....can I specifically tell you who? no.
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Re: PHI/TOR/SAC/DET 

Post#4 » by BullyKing » Thu Nov 25, 2021 3:30 am

Godaddycurse wrote:toronto getting way too much at the expense of everyone else


Yeah after looking at this closer, Sixers are trading Simmons for Grant and FVV but they alone are paying the price for Grant. Which means this is Simmons for FVV which feels like not something the Sixers would be interested in.
NYSixersFan wrote:
the plan is to get as good as quickly as possible....I fully believe we could have been a borderline playoff team last year by adding young veterans....using or draft picks and cap space.....can I specifically tell you who? no.
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Re: PHI/TOR/SAC/DET 

Post#5 » by Bowdystuda » Thu Nov 25, 2021 3:33 am

BullyKing wrote:I have Simmons and Haliburton as the two most valuable pieces in the trade. The idea that Toronto ends up with them both and a 1st round pick seems off to say the least.

Simmons does not have more value than Siakam. Especially considering the situation. I also have Vanvleet around the same value as Haliburton depending on the team. Rebuilding team would value Haliburton more. Win now team will want Vanvleet. Philly is in win now mode
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Re: PHI/TOR/SAC/DET 

Post#6 » by Bowdystuda » Thu Nov 25, 2021 3:35 am

BullyKing wrote:
Godaddycurse wrote:toronto getting way too much at the expense of everyone else


Yeah after looking at this closer, Sixers are trading Simmons for Grant and FVV but they alone are paying the price for Grant. Which means this is Simmons for FVV which feels like not something the Sixers would be interested in.


Yes and no. Having Dragic does matter in the trade cuz without his 20 million expiring contract, they could not get a grant without giving up either Harris or Curry +. Which they dont want to do I am assuming. Dragics big expiring contract does hold some value
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Re: PHI/TOR/SAC/DET 

Post#7 » by Godaddycurse » Thu Nov 25, 2021 3:38 am

Bowdystuda wrote:
BullyKing wrote:
Godaddycurse wrote:toronto getting way too much at the expense of everyone else


Yeah after looking at this closer, Sixers are trading Simmons for Grant and FVV but they alone are paying the price for Grant. Which means this is Simmons for FVV which feels like not something the Sixers would be interested in.


Yes and no. Having Dragic does matter in the trade cuz without his 20 million expiring contract, they could not get a grant without giving up either Harris or Curry +. Which they dont want to do I am assuming. Dragics big expiring contract does hold some value


They can do Green + fillers to match for grant. I personally don't have grant worth that much more than OP but detroit fans value him more than this.
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Re: PHI/TOR/SAC/DET 

Post#8 » by BullyKing » Thu Nov 25, 2021 3:38 am

Bowdystuda wrote:
BullyKing wrote:
Godaddycurse wrote:toronto getting way too much at the expense of everyone else


Yeah after looking at this closer, Sixers are trading Simmons for Grant and FVV but they alone are paying the price for Grant. Which means this is Simmons for FVV which feels like not something the Sixers would be interested in.


Yes and no. Having Dragic does matter in the trade cuz without his 20 million expiring contract, they could not get a grant without giving up either Harris or Curry +. Which they dont want to do I am assuming. Dragics big expiring contract does hold some value


While I admire your effort to paint providing filler salary as value, Simmons could be traded for FVV and Grant with no salary filler needed.
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the plan is to get as good as quickly as possible....I fully believe we could have been a borderline playoff team last year by adding young veterans....using or draft picks and cap space.....can I specifically tell you who? no.
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Re: PHI/TOR/SAC/DET 

Post#9 » by fanforlife » Thu Nov 25, 2021 3:39 am

I don't see the Pistons being tempted at all by this. Why trade their leading scorer for a late first round pick and a second round pick? These picks just aren't that valuable.
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Re: PHI/TOR/SAC/DET 

Post#10 » by Resistance » Thu Nov 25, 2021 4:01 am

Bowdystuda wrote:TO PHILADELPHIA: Fred Vanvleet and Jerami Grant

OUT: Ben Simmons, Danny Green, 2022 1st round pick and 2023 2nd round pick.

PG- Vanvleet/Maxey
SG- Curry/Thybulle/Milton
SF- Grant/Korkmaz
PF- Harris/Niang
C- Embiid/Drummond


TO SACRAMENTO: Pascal Siakam

OUT: Tyrese Haliburton, Marvin Bagley, Tristan Thompson, Alex Len and 2022 1st round pick (Top 5 protected)

PG- Fox/Mitchell
SG- Hield/Davis/Ramsey
SF- Barnes/Harkless/Woodard
PF- Siakam/Metu
C- Holmes/Jones


TO TORONTO:
Ben Simmons, Tyrese Haliburton, Marvin Bagley Jr, Tristan Thompson (bought out), Danny Green (bought out), Alex Len and Sac 2022 1st round pick (top 5 protected)

OUT: Pascal Siakam, Fred Vanvleet and Goran Dragic.

PG- Haliburton/Banton/Flynn
SG- Trent Jr/Mykhailiuk
SF- Barnes/Watanabe
PF- Anunoby/Bagley Jr/Boucher
C- Simmons/Achiuwa/Birch


TO DETROIT: Goran Dragic, Phi 2022 1st round pick and Phi 2023 2nd round pick

OUT: Jerami Grant

PG- Hayes/Joseph/Jackson/Dragic
SG- Cunningham/Diallo
SF- Bey/Jackson
PF- Stewart/Lyles
C- Olynyk/Garza


Philly goes all in. Waiting until the off season wont help Simmons value or thier chances at a chip this year. Get 2 guys who can shoot the lights out. Both can score and play d. Vanvleet is honestly playing the best d of his career. No team will be able to double Embiid with the shooters Philly has. Both players are 27 and in thier prime.

Sacramento makes a desperately needed change. Get all star caliber big man. Can do a bit of everything. Shooting a career high 42% from 3 this season. Would give Sacramento a really solid starting 5. Good shooting with Hield, Barnes and now Siakam to space the floor and open lanes for Fox. Would get them to the playoffs most likely, which the fans really need.

Toronto kind of retools. Take back a bunch of contracts but will buy most of them out. Get Haliburton who they hope can be a big pg of the future. Can develop with the young core of Barnes, OG, Simmons, Banton, Trent Jr and Achiuwa. Get Simmons and put him at the Center position. With Simmons amazing d, it Would allow Nick Nurse to be super creative with his Defence. Teams would have a hard time scoring with Simmons, OG and Barnes. Also, rest players, like they did last year. See what the young players have. Take a chance on Bagley for 25 to 30 games. See what he has. If nothing, release in the off season. Would allow them to tank for 1 last year and hopefully get a top 5 pick. Would also open up a bunch of cap space for next year and moving forward.

Detroit gets a 1st and 2nd round pick for Grant. Open up 20 million in cap for next year and solidify thier tank job for this year. Without Grant, Detroit will be up there with Hou and NO for most loses. Should guarentee another top 5 pick this year.




Which players will Toronto initially be waiving to get the trade completed?


TO TORONTO:
Ben Simmons, Tyrese Haliburton, Marvin Bagley Jr, Tristan Thompson (bought out), Danny Green (bought out), Alex Len and Sac 2022 1st round pick (top 5 protected)

OUT: Pascal Siakam, Fred Vanvleet and Goran Dragic.
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Re: PHI/TOR/SAC/DET 

Post#11 » by BoogieTime » Thu Nov 25, 2021 5:07 am

not Hali
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Re: PHI/TOR/SAC/DET 

Post#12 » by RipPizzaGuy » Thu Nov 25, 2021 7:23 am

I want Pascal, but not for Hali.

I start the offer with Bagley/tristan/harkless and multiple firsts

Ultimately I'd be willing to give mitchell + salary + 1st

I haven't followed Toronto all that closely. I did see that they were rolling with barnes/og. Seems like siakam may have thrown off some chemistry. Wish I had followed closer.

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Re: PHI/TOR/SAC/DET 

Post#13 » by giberish » Thu Nov 25, 2021 7:57 am

First, you'd have to at least drop the Kings 1st from this deal. The Kings probably don't do Haliburton + filler for Siakam but they might at least think about it. They obviously aren't adding a 1st to the deal. The Raptors don't need to get a 1st back to consider the deal either. Simmons and Siakam have similar values. Maybe Siakam's a little higher but I don't think by all that much. While IMO Haliburton is clear higher trade value then Van Vleet. You can't even consider Dragic's EC filler as adding value as Detroit could just take the Kings EC filler instead.

The other problem is trying to pry away Grant from the Pistons. It would almost certainly take more then EC filler (from Sac or Toronto, Detroit wouldn't care) and a Philly 1st. Even without the Kings 1st, Toronto is the team that could be adding more value to get a deal done but I don't see what they could/would add that Detoit would care about.
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Re: PHI/TOR/SAC/DET 

Post#14 » by PhillyNj » Thu Nov 25, 2021 12:00 pm

Bowdystuda wrote:
BullyKing wrote:I have Simmons and Haliburton as the two most valuable pieces in the trade. The idea that Toronto ends up with them both and a 1st round pick seems off to say the least.

Simmons does not have more value than Siakam. Especially considering the situation. I also have Vanvleet around the same value as Haliburton depending on the team. Rebuilding team would value Haliburton more. Win now team will want Vanvleet. Philly is in win now mode

Simmons absolutely has more value than Siakem. You better rethink this.
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Re: PHI/TOR/SAC/DET 

Post#15 » by vege » Thu Nov 25, 2021 4:55 pm

A late 1st and a guy that will bet bought out won't land you Grant, this is laughable.
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Re: PHI/TOR/SAC/DET 

Post#16 » by MoneyTalks41890 » Thu Nov 25, 2021 5:00 pm

I don’t like this for DET, not enough comp. I also think this is too rich for SAC. But I like FVV and Grant for Philly.

Maybe Mitchell, filler, 1st from SAC for Siakam, Mitchell goes to DET for Grant, then Simmons, 1sts to TOR for Siakam and FVV.
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Re: PHI/TOR/SAC/DET 

Post#17 » by TheProfessor » Thu Nov 25, 2021 5:27 pm

Send the phi first to Tor and the Sac first to Det, then i think the deal becomes more fair
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Re: PHI/TOR/SAC/DET 

Post#18 » by mattao313 » Thu Nov 25, 2021 5:30 pm

MoneyTalks41890 wrote:I don’t like this for DET, not enough comp. I also think this is too rich for SAC. But I like FVV and Grant for Philly.

Maybe Mitchell, filler, 1st from SAC for Siakam, Mitchell goes to DET for Grant, then Simmons, 1sts to TOR for Siakam and FVV.
Id rather have the Sac 1st than Mitchell if I was Detroit.

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Re: PHI/TOR/SAC/DET 

Post#19 » by giberish » Thu Nov 25, 2021 6:17 pm

Realistically, something like:

Sac trades: Mitchell, Beasley, Thompson, Jones, 2022 1st (top-4 protected for a couple years) for Siakam

Kings trade Mitchell because they aren't trading Haliburton for Siakam, especially not adding a 1st. They also keep Len as a backup C
.

Toronto trades: Van Vleet, Siakam for Simmons, Mitchell, Jones, 2022 Philly 1st (top-4 protected for a couple years).

Toronto gets an interesting rookie PG for Van Vleet along with the Siakam/Simmons swap. Getting the upside if Simmons works out well and adding a 1st as partial coverage if he doesn't.


Philly trades: Simmons, 2022 1st for Van Vleet, Grant.

Grant replaces Simmons forward defensive role while Van Vleet adds another offense-creator option.

Detroit trades Grant for Beasley, Thompson, 2022 Sac 1st

The Kings 1st may be interesting enough for Detroit to move Grant for EC filler.


Also no one adds more then 1 roster spot.
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Re: PHI/TOR/SAC/DET 

Post#20 » by Slacktard » Thu Nov 25, 2021 8:16 pm

I don't like any Simmons deal Where Jerami Grant makes up a huge portion of the return value.

Just don't see anything very special about him. He gets to shoot a lot more on a bad team than he would on a good team and his shooting isn't that good. I think he's at best 4th or 5th option in a starting lineup on a very good team or more likely 6th man playing 25 mins.

I watched a lot of bad to mediocre Sixers teams where 'someone' had to get the points and got inflated as a result.

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