Thoughts in General, Rumors, etc... Take 6

[Texas Chuck]

These Knicks/Brunson reports are interesting and not surprising.

My only thought is if their offer is 4/$100M, I think Dallas meets or beats that. So would Brunson take less money to play in NY and have the chance to run the team? And would Barrett/Randle understand their new place in the pecking order? I see lots of Knicks fans suggesting Brunson would be the 3rd option, and sorry but you don't dump your lotto pick and pay him 9 figures to have him behind RJ Barrett offensively.

But yeah Dallas should be concerned. They can't replace his talent if he leaves though I'm sure we will start to hear a full year of Timmy and Spencer and we'll be just fine.....lol

[babyjax13]

So, maybe we shouldn't be making fun of Harden for 'forcing his way out' of Brooklyn. Kyrie is the kind of coworker that would make anyone think about quitting.

[Godaddycurse]

These Knicks/Brunson reports are interesting and not surprising.

My only thought is if their offer is 4/$100M, I think Dallas meets or beats that. So would Brunson take less money to play in NY and have the chance to run the team? And would Barrett/Randle understand their new place in the pecking order? I see lots of Knicks fans suggesting Brunson would be the 3rd option, and sorry but you don't dump your lotto pick and pay him 9 figures to have him behind RJ Barrett offensively.

But yeah Dallas should be concerned. They can't replace his talent if he leaves though I'm sure we will start to hear a full year of Timmy and Spencer and we'll be just fine.....lol

And Dragic

[tester551]

Apparently the sixers are still trying to get EG.
Korkmaz-Thybulle-Niang and two minimum matches salary.

What's the best the rockets could get with Thybulle+KJ to team 3?

Read on Twitter

?t=4JwuXKhJZFiVbcvZ3jc6UQ&s=19

As a Portland fan, I'd take Thybulle & Reed (minimum salary match) into the Covington TPE & give out on of the following:

1) 3-4 2nd round picks
2) Trendon Watford + Didi Louzada
3) Keon Johnson

[MartinToVaught]

So, maybe we shouldn't be making fun of Harden for 'forcing his way out' of Brooklyn. Kyrie is the kind of coworker that would make anyone think about quitting.

To be fair, the exact same thing could be said about Harden. He's burnt bridges with literally every other star he's played with in his career so far. Even Embiid already seems to be losing patience with him, judging from what he said in the press conference after the Heat series. And Harden quit on the Rockets to go play with Kyrie in the first place.

Harden and Kyrie are two sides of the same diva coin. It's just that Kyrie is a lot crazier whereas Harden is more passive-aggressive.

[HartfordWhalers]

If Philly trades for KZ Okpala, I would like to take credit even if that is the one KO I didn't post about.

[cgf]

It being the Knicks, I don't believe this...but if the Knicks did what they did last night because they know that Brunson wants to join and that they can dump Burks (or Nerlens) for free (or some SRPs) to get there. How good would that team actually be without something like RJ becoming a legit #1 option, Randle having a full bounceback to his MIP season, or Toppin taking a massive leap (while Julius played a lot more smallball-5)?

Starters:
Brunson
Grimes / Fournier / Quickley / Reddish
Barrett
Randle
Robinson

2nd unit:
Rose
Quickley / Fournier / Grimes
Fournier / Reddish / Grimes
Toppin
Sims / Randle

Reddish / Fournier / Quickley / Grimes + Gibson + McBride


Is that more than (or even) a play-in team without a lot of internal growth?

[MartinToVaught]

It being the Knicks, I don't believe this...but if the Knicks did what they did last night because they know that Brunson wants to join and that they can dump Burks (or Nerlens) for free (or some SRPs) to get there. How good would that team actually be without something like RJ becoming a legit #1 option, Randle having a full bounceback to his MIP season, or Toppin taking a massive leap (while Julius played a lot more smallball-5)?

Brunson | Rose | Quickley | McBride
Grimes | Quickley | Fournier
Barrett | Fournier | Reddish
Randle | Toppin | Reddish
Robinson | Sims | Randle | Gibson

Is that more than (or even) a play-in team without a lot of internal growth?

I don't see how that team even makes the play-in. They would be spending $100 million (plus the draft picks they traded away) just to stay where they are now, and end up trading even more future assets down the road just to dump his contract.

[cgf]

It being the Knicks, I don't believe this...but if the Knicks did what they did last night because they know that Brunson wants to join and that they can dump Burks (or Nerlens) for free (or some SRPs) to get there. How good would that team actually be without something like RJ becoming a legit #1 option, Randle having a full bounceback to his MIP season, or Toppin taking a massive leap (while Julius played a lot more smallball-5)?

Brunson | Rose | Quickley | McBride
Grimes | Quickley | Fournier
Barrett | Fournier | Reddish
Randle | Toppin | Reddish
Robinson | Sims | Randle | Gibson

Is that more than (or even) a play-in team without a lot of internal growth?

I don't see how that team even makes the play-in. They would be spending $100 million (plus the draft picks they traded away) just to stay where they are now, and end up trading even more future assets down the road just to dump his contract.

Between Kemba being washed, Rose getting hurt, & Quickley's growing pains; not having a PG really hurt the team. So if I'm being generous I can see how adding a capable starting PG would bump them up the handful of wins that they missed the play-in by. While I can also see how giving Brunson an FVV-ish contract could age similarly well; if I try to see what the best-case scenario that the FO is shooting for is.

...but that's pretty much how I feel about it too :-/

At least it shouldn't cost us too many picks to lock ourselves into that play-in contender ceiling...if Burks & Noel can be moved for free/SRPs...given that dumping Kemba - by far the most useless of that troika on the court - only cost us a handful of SRPs (which we had a mountain of), and swapping a protected 2023 FRP for a protected 2025 one.

[MoneyTalks41890]

It being the Knicks, I don't believe this...but if the Knicks did what they did last night because they know that Brunson wants to join and that they can dump Burks (or Nerlens) for free (or some SRPs) to get there. How good would that team actually be without something like RJ becoming a legit #1 option, Randle having a full bounceback to his MIP season, or Toppin taking a massive leap (while Julius played a lot more smallball-5)?

Brunson | Rose | Quickley | McBride
Grimes | Quickley | Fournier
Barrett | Fournier | Reddish
Randle | Toppin | Reddish
Robinson | Sims | Randle | Gibson

Is that more than (or even) a play-in team without a lot of internal growth?

I don't see how that team even makes the play-in. They would be spending $100 million (plus the draft picks they traded away) just to stay where they are now, and end up trading even more future assets down the road just to dump his contract.

Between Kemba being washed & Rose getting hurt, not having a PG really hurt the team. So I could see adding a capable starting PG bumping them up the handful of wins that they missed the play-in by, while I can also see how giving Brunson an FVV-ish contract could age similarly well if I try to see what the best-case scenario that the FO is shooting for is...but that's pretty much how I feel about it too :-/

At least it shouldn't cost us too many picks to lock ourselves into that play-in contender ceiling...if Burks & Noel can be moved for free/SRPs...

If the Knicks can get to enough space to sign Brunson, I think they need to start looking around for trade targets with their picks. I don't think they should try to use all of those picks in the draft. They'd be better off trying to acquire a proven talent. Not sure who that is, though, since it should probably be a big.

[K_chile22]

Uh oh

Read on Twitter

?t=GB2rZ3ZVCs97GeAaPvRBiQ&s=19

It's pretty obvious.

1) He wants a larger role and wants to be "the guy" on a team.

2) His Dad started working for New York Knicks.

3) The Knicks GM said "I spoke with Jalen's Dad and this doesn't mean we are going to pursue Jalen", which means they did talk about the prospects of going after Jalen.

I'm aware that it's not surprising, what is interesting there is all the noise lately was about how confident the Mavs were in keeping him but now the Knicks seem to be gaining momentum

[gswhoops]

It being the Knicks, I don't believe this...but if the Knicks did what they did last night because they know that Brunson wants to join and that they can dump Burks (or Nerlens) for free (or some SRPs) to get there. How good would that team actually be without something like RJ becoming a legit #1 option, Randle having a full bounceback to his MIP season, or Toppin taking a massive leap (while Julius played a lot more smallball-5)?

Brunson | Rose | Quickley | McBride
Grimes | Quickley | Fournier
Barrett | Fournier | Reddish
Randle | Toppin | Reddish
Robinson | Sims | Randle | Gibson

Is that more than (or even) a play-in team without a lot of internal growth?

I don't really see it. They're clearly behind Boston, Miami, Milwaukee, Philadelphia, Toronto, Chicago (assuming they re-sign Lavine), and Brooklyn (assuming KD is still on the roster opening night). That leaves them competing with Atlanta, Cleveland, Charlotte, and Washington for the play-in spots, and I'd put them behind ATL/CLE/CHA and on par with WAS.

[cgf]

I don't see how that team even makes the play-in. They would be spending $100 million (plus the draft picks they traded away) just to stay where they are now, and end up trading even more future assets down the road just to dump his contract.

Between Kemba being washed & Rose getting hurt, not having a PG really hurt the team. So I could see adding a capable starting PG bumping them up the handful of wins that they missed the play-in by, while I can also see how giving Brunson an FVV-ish contract could age similarly well if I try to see what the best-case scenario that the FO is shooting for is...but that's pretty much how I feel about it too :-/

At least it shouldn't cost us too many picks to lock ourselves into that play-in contender ceiling...if Burks & Noel can be moved for free/SRPs...

If the Knicks can get to enough space to sign Brunson, I think they need to start looking around for trade targets with their picks. I don't think they should try to use all of those picks in the draft. They'd be better off trying to acquire a proven talent. Not sure who that is, though, since it should probably be a big.

Agreed, with the only exception I can think of being if the FO was able to use them to move up for next year's Ivey.

Where I'm unsure is when it would be best to make that move; as I do feel like this summer would be too soon for most of our kids. Which makes me wonder if the best play wouldn't be to wait until closer to the TDL or after next season to use those picks for that big move. Let the FO see how giving them a capable PG helps our kids' development/trade-value; hoping that they (& Fournier/Randle) look a lot more interesting to other teams when put in less of a position to fail.

[MoneyTalks41890]

What about something around Randle, picks for John Collins? I think holding onto Collins just got more awkward, since they were openly shopping him, and Atlanta still needs to make a lot of changes. Randle probably isn't one, but maybe a third team or something.

[Texas Chuck]

I'm aware that it's not surprising, what is interesting there is all the noise lately was about how confident the Mavs were in keeping him but now the Knicks seem to be gaining momentum

It's either very real(this is my take)

or

everyone just watched the Knicks give up their lotto pick in part to dump Kemba and are assuming the Knicks wouldn't do this with no indication they have a real shot.

[MartinToVaught]

Another issue is that the Knicks are setting Brunson up to fail. Looking at the reaction on social media, a significant portion of the Knicks' fanbase is already predisposed to dislike Brunson now because of the mess that their front office made last night. If he gets off to a slow start, it's going to be a feeding frenzy with fans booing him and the media piling on. And it won't even be his fault, it'll be Dolan's.

[cgf]

What about something around Randle, picks for John Collins? I think holding onto Collins just got more awkward, since they were openly shopping him, and Atlanta still needs to make a lot of changes. Randle probably isn't one, but maybe a third team or something.

Depends on the exact price IMO, as I don't love the idea of moving Randle out just to put someone new in Toppin's way. I haven't over-reacted to Obi's last two games the way some knicks fans have but I do like the kid and think he could be a good starter in another half-season to season.

Collins could hold the seat warm for that time, before being moved in a further trade if/when Toppin's ready to start, just as well as Randle...while (probably) holding more value in that future trade than Julius would and being a better fit if Obi never does put it all together. So that kind of a swap could make me feel better about it, but that would really depend on how many picks it'd take to make happen.

[cgf]

I'm aware that it's not surprising, what is interesting there is all the noise lately was about how confident the Mavs were in keeping him but now the Knicks seem to be gaining momentum

It's either very real(this is my take)

or

everyone just watched the Knicks give up their lotto pick in part to dump Kemba and are assuming the Knicks wouldn't do this with no indication they have a real shot.

Unfortunately with this franchise, the latter is very much a possibility...

Another issue is that the Knicks are setting Brunson up to fail. Looking at the reaction on social media, a significant portion of the Knicks' fanbase is already predisposed to dislike Brunson now because of the mess that their front office made last night. If he gets off to a slow start, it's going to be a feeding frenzy with fans booing him and the media piling on. And it won't even be his fault, it'll be Dolan's.

Our fanbase complains about everything unless we're in the middle of a miracle run...and even then some still complain. So I dunno how much to take from that; especially if Randle is still around for people to focus their anger on.

I don't love the larger plan so I don't love the goals they were aiming for, but the FO actually went about achieving its goals fairly effectively last night; getting good value for #11 & not even having to lose any of those protected FRPs they got to dump Kemba into capspace, instead just swapping it (alongside a handful of SRPs) for a protected 2025 FRP.

Though I knew better than to get too excited about actually drafting someone at #11...so maybe that's why I'm not as disappointed as some of our more vocal fans

[CP War Hawks]

It being the Knicks, I don't believe this...but if the Knicks did what they did last night because they know that Brunson wants to join and that they can dump Burks (or Nerlens) for free (or some SRPs) to get there. How good would that team actually be without something like RJ becoming a legit #1 option, Randle having a full bounceback to his MIP season, or Toppin taking a massive leap (while Julius played a lot more smallball-5)?

Brunson | Rose | Quickley | McBride
Grimes | Quickley | Fournier
Barrett | Fournier | Reddish
Randle | Toppin | Reddish
Robinson | Sims | Randle | Gibson

Is that more than (or even) a play-in team without a lot of internal growth?

I don't see how that team even makes the play-in. They would be spending $100 million (plus the draft picks they traded away) just to stay where they are now, and end up trading even more future assets down the road just to dump his contract.

Between Kemba being washed, Rose getting hurt, & Quickley's growing pains; not having a PG really hurt the team. So if I'm being generous I can see how adding a capable starting PG would bump them up the handful of wins that they missed the play-in by. While I can also see how giving Brunson an FVV-ish contract could age similarly well; if I try to see what the best-case scenario that the FO is shooting for is.

...but that's pretty much how I feel about it too :-/

At least it shouldn't cost us too many picks to lock ourselves into that play-in contender ceiling...if Burks & Noel can be moved for free/SRPs...given that dumping Kemba - by far the most useless of that troika on the court - only cost us a handful of SRPs (which we had a mountain of), and swapping a protected 2023 FRP for a protected 2025 one.

It's a play in team for sure. Rose being out most of the season just tanked the 2022 season. You'll get the 2021 Randle back for the most part.

[hugepatsfan]

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/atlanta-hawks/cap/

Hawks cap sheet for this season. They are at $151.3M. That will go up to about $155.5M once they sign AJ Griffin, their #16 pick (he'll sign for 120% of the rookie scale cap hold listed on the spotrac page). That's vs. a luxury tax line of $149.0M.

I can't imagine they go into the luxury tax this year. They can waive Gallinari for his $5M partial guarantee. That saves them $16.45M, so take them down to about $139M in team salary. The full MLE is about $10.4M. Hawks can use that and go over the tax (but under the apron). They'll need to fill their roster out too. They might want to bring Delon Wright back who was a good backup PG for them, particularly on defense.

In order to add from the outside and stay under the tax, the Hawks are going to need to subtract SOMEONE off the current roster. And besides Gallo since we're already accounting for them to waive him. Huerter seems like the guy they'd move over Trae/Collins/Hunter/Capela/Oongwu/Johnson if it's about saving money. And probably over Bogi as well since Huerter's deal is 4 years vs. 2 for Bogi so you get the most long term savings. And then even beyond the finances, their biggest basketball need is to improve perimeter defense, particularly at the SG spot - one of Huerter or Bogi should be replaced by a guy whose strength is defense over offense.

I've been proposing we give up a pick for Huerter, but the more I dig into it the more I think we could get him for free. Just take on the salary. Especially if they have a MLE signing like Gary Harris lined up.