NYK godfather offer 4 JJJ

I_Love_This_Game!! · Post #1 » by **I_Love_This_Game!!** » Wed May 22, 2024 1:42 pm

NYK trades / MEM receives: Julius Randle, Mitchell Robinson, Jericho Sims, 2025 first round pick (DET), 2025 first round pick (WAS), two 2nd round picks (2024 from Utah & 2025 from DET)

MEM trades / NYK receives: Jaren Jackson, Jr., Brandon Clarke, Ziaire Williams

NOTE: Jackson is better than Randle in some areas and vice versa. So, one could argue that they are similar-impact players in different areas. The reason for the overpay is because I do not believe the Grizzlies are interested in trading Jackson Jr. It would require this type of overpay (or even more) to pique their interest.

Why this trade works for the Knicks: Although Randle has been an All-NBA player, NY needs a better fit at the PF position. Jackson would be perfect. Thibs would love his defense and his shooting from outside would compliment the Knicks backcourt. Clarke would be a decent backup to Hartenstein (assuming he is resigned). Williams is a throw-in but offers some upside. Their new lineup:

PG...Brunson...McBride
SG...DiVincenzo...Hart
SF...OG...Williams
PF...Jackson Jr....Achiuwa (resigned)
C...Hartenstein...Clarke

Why this trade works for Memphis: The Grizzlies add a number of assets here. Although Randle is not the defender Jackson is, he is a better scorer and rebounder. Robinson would fill the void in the middle. And, they acquire 2 first round picks and 2 second round picks, which they can filp to upgrade the SF position. Their new lineup:

PG...Morant...Smart
SG...Bane...Konchar
SF...Williams...LaRavia...Kennard
PF...Randle...Jackson
C...Robinson...Sims

Thoughts?

giberish · Post #2 » by **giberish** » Wed May 22, 2024 1:49 pm

Memphis really has no reason to trade JJJ. So value doesn't really matter.

Post #3 » by **gswhoops** » Wed May 22, 2024 1:52 pm

This is hardly a "godfather" offer. Those two picks are very unlikely to convey (Detroit never goes below top-10 protected, Washington never goes below top-8) and they represent the bulk of the value here.

A more accurate description is Memphis giving up a younger, better player for middling assets.

JRoy · Post #4 » by **JRoy** » Wed May 22, 2024 1:53 pm

No reason for MEM to move JJJ J but that is a hell of an offer.

Post #5 » by **jbk1234** » Wed May 22, 2024 1:59 pm

giberish wrote:Memphis really has no reason to trade JJJ. So value doesn't really matter.

This matters more than folks want to admit.

hugepatsfan · Post #6 » by **hugepatsfan** » Wed May 22, 2024 2:04 pm

Knicks have a lot of asset, but the protection on their owed picks and them being a really solid team now with a real core in place is going to make it somewhat difficult for them to do the “godfather” offer thing. I think they’re going to end up being in the running but ultimately outbid in these star player trades that do happen. And for deals like this where the other side won’t be particularly inclined to deal, Knicks don’t have the premium chip needed to pry a guy loose.

Laimbeer · Post #7 » by **Laimbeer** » Wed May 22, 2024 2:04 pm

I_Love_This_Game!! wrote:Jackson is better than Randle in some areas and vice versa. So, one could argue that they are similar-impact players in different areas.

Find me "one" who would take Randle over JJJ.

The firsts may never convey and Robinson is nothing special, particularly with his injuries and that contract. You'd have to include picks to move him. This is a pretty easy no from Memphis.

psman2 · Post #8 » by **psman2** » Wed May 22, 2024 2:24 pm

Send Randle to a 3rd team for assets and come back and add some picks with upside. Still likely a no but at least it would be a more polite one.

Post #9 » by **gswhoops** » Wed May 22, 2024 2:25 pm

Laimbeer wrote:
I_Love_This_Game!! wrote:Jackson is better than Randle in some areas and vice versa. So, one could argue that they are similar-impact players in different areas.

Find me "one" who would take Randle over JJJ.

The firsts may never convey and Robinson is nothing special, particularly with his injuries and that contract. You'd have to include picks to move him. This is a pretty easy no from Memphis.

Yeah I mean the bolded statement is one that is technically true but irrelevant. Randle is better at some things (post scoring, rebounding) that the league doesn't value very highly, while JJJ is better at things that the league does value highly (3pt shooting, perimeter defense, rim protection). In terms of overall impact, they're not close.

DowJones · Post #10 » by **DowJones** » Wed May 22, 2024 2:28 pm

JRoy wrote:No reason for MEM to move JJJ J but that is a hell of an offer.

It depends on how high you are on Randle because those picks are heavily protected and will never be unprotected. I really wish we would accurately display the protections on picks because it radically alters the trade.

Euphonetiks · Post #11 » by **Euphonetiks** » Wed May 22, 2024 2:32 pm

A rim protecting big that can space is really valuable. I also understand that the idea of JJJ is probably better than JJJ. He misses a lot of time and his advanced numbers leave something to be desired. His 3P% is also not great, but that kind of volume is difficult to find in a big.

Randle is a very good player, better than JJJ in a vacuum, but JJJ's archetype is much more in demand. For roster construction purposes, Randle is not the easiest to incorprate into different systems and with different stars. His perimeter shooting is erratic and he also has off seasons (19-20, 21-22).

As to the other stuff, I don't think Mitch carries much value at this point with the injuries. Neither of the 1sts are likley to convey this year and they might not convey at all. At the least this should be the 2 highest of the Knicks picks in 2025, so MEM at least gets 2 late 1sts instead of seconds.

Post #12 » by **Texas Chuck** » Wed May 22, 2024 2:37 pm

godfather offers mean something different to OP, I guess? This to me is like the first offer, the one you know Memphis never takes. Then if you really want JJJ, you get serious and start offering actual assets.

wemby · Post #13 » by **wemby** » Wed May 22, 2024 2:41 pm

"Godfather" offer. Rockets/Spurs/OKC could tear this to pieces.

Post #14 » by **Mavrelous** » Wed May 22, 2024 2:43 pm

That's a low ball offer, not a godfather offer.

Creativetran · Post #15 » by **Creativetran** » Wed May 22, 2024 2:44 pm

Laimbeer wrote:Find me "one" who would take Randle over JJJ.

I’m sure if you go over to the Knicks board, you will find some

jibba jones · Post #16 » by **jibba jones** » Wed May 22, 2024 3:46 pm

But on the Knicks board, you will also find just as many that don’t.

mg · Post #17 » by mg » Wed May 22, 2024 3:48 pm

With Ja coming back next season the Grizzlies need to get serious. They are not trading JJJ. In fact they need to bring in a 5 that compliments him and get back to winning.

spree8 · Post #18 » by **spree8** » Wed May 22, 2024 3:53 pm

Creativetran wrote:
Laimbeer wrote:Find me "one" who would take Randle over JJJ.

I’m sure if you go over to the Knicks board, you will find some

Doubt it

Wolveswin · Post #19 » by **Wolveswin** » Wed May 22, 2024 3:57 pm

OP trade was doomed to fail. Set us up for godfather offer, not even godson offer.

Post #20 » by **gswhoops** » Wed May 22, 2024 5:33 pm

Euphonetiks wrote:A rim protecting big that can space is really valuable. I also understand that the idea of JJJ is probably better than JJJ. He misses a lot of time and his advanced numbers leave something to be desired. His 3P% is also not great, but that kind of volume is difficult to find in a big.

Randle is a very good player, better than JJJ in a vacuum, but JJJ's archetype is much more in demand. For roster construction purposes, Randle is not the easiest to incorprate into different systems and with different stars. His perimeter shooting is erratic and he also has off seasons (19-20, 21-22).

As to the other stuff, I don't think Mitch carries much value at this point with the injuries. Neither of the 1sts are likley to convey this year and they might not convey at all. At the least this should be the 2 highest of the Knicks picks in 2025, so MEM at least gets 2 late 1sts instead of seconds.

FWIW, Randle has played 195 games over the last 3 years; JJJ has played 207.