RealGM

Super straightforward and simple trade.

Bruce Brown for Bojan Bogdonavich + 2025 1st (Bucks).

1. Bruce Brown is a perfect fit for Thibs and his system. NY still holds on to most of their draft assets to go for a star.

2. Raptors get an expiring and a 1st rd pick for next year which is projected to be a better draft

Thoughts?

Brown is not worth his contract much less a first round on top of it. Not sure why this continues to be posted?

I get Toronto fans want to get an asset but why is NY picking up a bad contract in Bojan just to flip him for another bad contract in BB and pay a 1st. If Bojan had a GTD contract then maybe I could see it, but really where does Brown get his minutes from?

I would just release Bojan, keep my picks, and shop around with the MLE over doing this.

psman2 wrote:I get Toronto fans want to get an asset but why is NY picking up a bad contract in Bojan just to flip him for another bad contract in BB and pay a 1st. If Bojan had a GTD contract then maybe I could see it, but really where does Brown get his minutes from?

I would just release Bojan, keep my picks, and shop around with the MLE over doing this.

And if they liked Bruce Brown, they might could sign him for the MLE while keeping their first. Because unless Toronto finds a trade where they take back future money to get an asset, he's almost certainly going to be a free agent. Toronto doesn't want to pay him his contract any more than anyone else does.

psman2 wrote:I get Toronto fans want to get an asset but why is NY picking up a bad contract in Bojan just to flip him for another bad contract in BB and pay a 1st. If Bojan had a GTD contract then maybe I could see it, but really where does Brown get his minutes from?

I would just release Bojan, keep my picks, and shop around with the MLE over doing this.

brunson/mcbride
dvv/hart
og/brown
Randle/(OG)/Achiuwa
Hartenstein/Robinson

He would be their 8-9th man. One can argue they are better off with a bigger body though.

The biggest problem with OP's trade is that it is over 110% incoming which hard caps them at 1st apron which is a no no for NYK and is DOA for that alone

Texas Chuck wrote:

psman2 wrote:I get Toronto fans want to get an asset but why is NY picking up a bad contract in Bojan just to flip him for another bad contract in BB and pay a 1st. If Bojan had a GTD contract then maybe I could see it, but really where does Brown get his minutes from?

I would just release Bojan, keep my picks, and shop around with the MLE over doing this.

And if they liked Bruce Brown, they might could sign him for the MLE while keeping their first. Because unless Toronto finds a trade where they take back future money to get an asset, he's almost certainly going to be a free agent. Toronto doesn't want to pay him his contract any more than anyone else does.

Unless Toronto finds some use for capspace to take back assets i actually expect them to operate over the cap (ie pick up his option) and use MLE themselves.

Godaddycurse wrote:

Texas Chuck wrote:

psman2 wrote:I get Toronto fans want to get an asset but why is NY picking up a bad contract in Bojan just to flip him for another bad contract in BB and pay a 1st. If Bojan had a GTD contract then maybe I could see it, but really where does Brown get his minutes from?

I would just release Bojan, keep my picks, and shop around with the MLE over doing this.

And if they liked Bruce Brown, they might could sign him for the MLE while keeping their first. Because unless Toronto finds a trade where they take back future money to get an asset, he's almost certainly going to be a free agent. Toronto doesn't want to pay him his contract any more than anyone else does.

Unless Toronto finds some use for capspace i actually expect them to operate over the cap (ie pick up his option) and use MLE themselves

Maybe. But I wouldn't. I'd rather sign a value contract that I could potentially flip at the deadline to get to the floor than just pick up Brown.

But I wouldn't see not being able to sign Brown a big loss for a team that plays Josh Hart 40+

Texas Chuck wrote:

Godaddycurse wrote:

Texas Chuck wrote:
And if they liked Bruce Brown, they might could sign him for the MLE while keeping their first. Because unless Toronto finds a trade where they take back future money to get an asset, he's almost certainly going to be a free agent. Toronto doesn't want to pay him his contract any more than anyone else does.

Unless Toronto finds some use for capspace i actually expect them to operate over the cap (ie pick up his option) and use MLE themselves

Maybe. But I wouldn't. I'd rather sign a value contract that I could potentially flip at the deadline to get to the floor than just pick up Brown.

But I wouldn't see not being able to sign Brown a big loss for a team that plays Josh Hart 40+

Value contracts are hard to come by.. Typically FA contracts are overpaid, esp for non popular FA destinations like Toronto. I wouldn't mind if they try to snatch someone like KCP or patrick williams though, or maybe give the bruce brown contract (1+1) to a wing like DJJ

Godaddycurse wrote:

psman2 wrote:I get Toronto fans want to get an asset but why is NY picking up a bad contract in Bojan just to flip him for another bad contract in BB and pay a 1st. If Bojan had a GTD contract then maybe I could see it, but really where does Brown get his minutes from?

I would just release Bojan, keep my picks, and shop around with the MLE over doing this.

brunson/mcbride
dvv/hart
og/brown
Randle/(OG)/Achiuwa
Hartenstein/Robinson

He would be their 8-9th man. One can argue they are better off with a bigger body though.

Teams usually don't want to pay their 8/9th man 23 million and give up a 1st for a expiring contract. Toronto is going to have to find a team that has GTD bad expirings or future money to have any hope of extracting a 1st for Brown.

psman2 wrote:

Godaddycurse wrote:

psman2 wrote:I get Toronto fans want to get an asset but why is NY picking up a bad contract in Bojan just to flip him for another bad contract in BB and pay a 1st. If Bojan had a GTD contract then maybe I could see it, but really where does Brown get his minutes from?

I would just release Bojan, keep my picks, and shop around with the MLE over doing this.

brunson/mcbride
dvv/hart
og/brown
Randle/(OG)/Achiuwa
Hartenstein/Robinson

He would be their 8-9th man. One can argue they are better off with a bigger body though.

Teams usually don't want to pay their 8/9th man 23 million and give up a 1st for a expiring contract. Toronto is going to have to find a team that has GTD bad expirings or future money to have any hope of extracting a 1st for Brown.

Oh im just answering the minutes part. for sure brown is not worth a 1st

Godaddycurse wrote:Value contracts are hard to come by..

This is true. Still got to think they could sign someone with more value to themselves or other teams than Brown on his deal. And if not, just overpay a similar guy on a one year deal and nothing lost by trying.

I think Raptors probably pick up Brown's contract and move him to land something, even if a similar but better fitting role player. But value here is off, I think more realistically he'd get you a couple 2nd rounders, unless you're taking back bad money.

I think an expiring Brown midseason or at the deadline has more value than Brown at $20M heading into free agency. Someone will get injured on a playoff team, and rather than writing off the season as lost, trading for Brown won't be an awful option. Maybe there's a player in the last year of his rookie deal who wants a lot more than his team wants to give him.

jbk1234 wrote:I think an expiring Brown midseason or at the deadline has more value than Brown at $20M heading into free agency. Someone will get injured on a playoff team, and rather than writing off the season as lost, trading for Brown won't be an awful option. Maybe there's a player in the last year of his rookie deal who wants a lot more than his team wants to give him.

How many playoff teams have 20+ million of matching salary on their roster they're willing to part with for Brown? That's the issue I see with Brown, he really only has value to a contending team but his number makes it difficult for those teams to trade for him.

balsamic_ducks wrote:

jbk1234 wrote:I think an expiring Brown midseason or at the deadline has more value than Brown at $20M heading into free agency. Someone will get injured on a playoff team, and rather than writing off the season as lost, trading for Brown won't be an awful option. Maybe there's a player in the last year of his rookie deal who wants a lot more than his team wants to give him.

How many playoff teams have 20+ million of matching salary on their roster they're willing to part with for Brown? That's the issue I see with Brown, he really only has value to a contending team but his number makes it difficult for those teams to trade for him.

They're out there. The Lakers, Heat, Dallas, Knicks, etc.

Godaddycurse wrote:

psman2 wrote:I get Toronto fans want to get an asset but why is NY picking up a bad contract in Bojan just to flip him for another bad contract in BB and pay a 1st. If Bojan had a GTD contract then maybe I could see it, but really where does Brown get his minutes from?

I would just release Bojan, keep my picks, and shop around with the MLE over doing this.

brunson/mcbride
dvv/hart
og/brown
Randle/(OG)/Achiuwa
Hartenstein/Robinson

He would be their 8-9th man. One can argue they are better off with a bigger body though.

The biggest problem with OP's trade is that it is over 110% incoming which hard caps them at 1st apron which is a no no for NYK and is DOA for that alone

Effective the ed of the regular season, it's over 100% that triggers the 1st apron. And that will be an issue for the Knicks, since staying under the 1st apron is unlikely. Also, adding a minimum salary or 2 to get to 100% would hard cap them at the 2nd apron, which is not far off if things work out for them in FA. If they resign OG at $38 million, Hartenstein at $17 million, and Achiuwa at $6 million, retain Sims and fill out the roster with 2 minimums, they'll be just under the 1st apron and about $11 million below the 2nd apron if they drop Bojan. They'll have the $5 million tax MLE, but using it will also trigger the 2nd apron hard cap.

Godaddycurse wrote:

psman2 wrote:I get Toronto fans want to get an asset but why is NY picking up a bad contract in Bojan just to flip him for another bad contract in BB and pay a 1st. If Bojan had a GTD contract then maybe I could see it, but really where does Brown get his minutes from?

I would just release Bojan, keep my picks, and shop around with the MLE over doing this.

brunson/mcbride
dvv/hart
og/brown
Randle/(OG)/Achiuwa
Hartenstein/Robinson

He would be their 8-9th man. One can argue they are better off with a bigger body though.

The biggest problem with OP's trade is that it is over 110% incoming which hard caps them at 1st apron which is a no no for NYK and is DOA for that alone

I spent some time just now with the new CBA to understand this better. What I found was an important nuance to your comments. Your statement applies if the trade occurs after June 30th, when the new cap year begins. It would not cause problems if the trade occurred draft weekend since the Knicks are hard capped at the 1st apron this cap year, but are $7 million below it. There is a reason the Knicks were offering a 1st for Brown at the TDL and, while Bojan has more value than Fournier, pending his recovery, Brown is a better fit and a larger expiring for salary matching purposes, and the Knicks have to something with their 3 picks this year. One can argue that Brown is not worth a 1st in a vacuum, but we're not in a vacuum.

islandboy53 wrote:

Godaddycurse wrote:

psman2 wrote:I get Toronto fans want to get an asset but why is NY picking up a bad contract in Bojan just to flip him for another bad contract in BB and pay a 1st. If Bojan had a GTD contract then maybe I could see it, but really where does Brown get his minutes from?

I would just release Bojan, keep my picks, and shop around with the MLE over doing this.

brunson/mcbride
dvv/hart
og/brown
Randle/(OG)/Achiuwa
Hartenstein/Robinson

He would be their 8-9th man. One can argue they are better off with a bigger body though.

The biggest problem with OP's trade is that it is over 110% incoming which hard caps them at 1st apron which is a no no for NYK and is DOA for that alone

I spent some time just now with the new CBA to understand this better. What I found was an important nuance to your comments. Your statement applies if the trade occurs after June 30th, when the new cap year begins. It would not cause problems if the trade occurred draft weekend since the Knicks are hard capped at the 1st apron this cap year, but are $7 million below it. There is a reason the Knicks were offering a 1st for Brown at the TDL and, while Bojan has more value than Fournier, pending his recovery, Brown is a better fit and a larger expiring for salary matching purposes, and the Knicks have to something with their 3 picks this year. One can argue that Brown is not worth a 1st in a vacuum, but we're not in a vacuum.

Just breakdown the minutes next year for the Knicks 1-3. All of those minutes are accounted for when they are at full health. McBride already is ticket to get less minutes than the Knicks likely want to give him.

Bojan is only 2m GTD and is going to get released, he is hurt and simply not worth his contract anymore. They might give him something like a 1/5m type of deal to rehab and comeback as a backup PF. I would not be coming at this from the point of view that they get to turn Bojan's gtd 19m into Browns 23m. Plus they can bring back Burks cheap to fill-in for emergencies at 2/3 and can either resign Precious or use some of MLE on frontcourt help and stay below the apron or both by exceeding the apron with TMLE.

Brown is just not solving a problem for the Knicks and is going to push them much further into the tax than necessary. I would say there is only a slim chance of any kind of Brown to Knicks trade happening.