RealGM

First who are the most untradeable players? MPJ, Beal, Poole, Simmons, Middleton, Herro, LaVine, Barrett, KAT, Gobert, AD, Wiggins, FVV, Collins, Ayton.
The difficulty in moving these players because of contract size, lack of production, injury prone, make them hard to get a fair trade.
Of these, can you make a realistic trade that will improve the sender/receiver?

I don't buy that MPJ is untradeable. He was inconsistent this year and was horrific against the Wolves, but was a killer against the Lakers the series prior. I think it would still take a pretty good return to get him out of Denver

Darius Garland has to be in this discussion as well. Four more years at over $40MM AAS for what he's providing on-court is far uglier than some of the ones on your list.

Like half of the untradeable guys on your list were traded within the last couple years and with more years left on their current contracts.

Of the guys listed, I think Beal is the only one you would really have a difficult time trading if you were willing to take a sober look at their value and adjust your expectations accordingly.

Between the massive contract, NTC, declining play, and constant injuries, Beal might actually be untradeable.

Of the ones listed, only Beal and Poole won't be moved without decent incentive. John Collins finished the year decent enough to be traded for Poole and a 1st in my opinion(or something close to this). Still not positive value probably, neutral wouldn't be crazy.

Simmons is an expiring so it's easy to take on a bad contract for him... Middleton showed up when needed against the Pacers, has positive value, Lavine on the other hand... when was he last healthy and producing? I guess he is up there with Poole. Ayton just needs to be traded to a city without snow lol

tcheco wrote:Of the ones listed, only Beal and Poole won't be moved without decent incentive. John Collins finished the year decent enough to be traded for Poole and a 1st in my opinion(or something close to this). Still not positive value probably, neutral wouldn't be crazy.

Simmons is an expiring so it's easy to take on a bad contract for him... Middleton showed up when needed against the Pacers, has positive value, Lavine on the other hand... when was he last healthy and producing? I guess he is up there with Poole. Ayton just needs to be traded to a city without snow lol

Beal is the worst for sure. I wouldn’t touch Middleton - he is talented but aging fast and can’t stay on the court. That’s a lot of money to pay someone in street clothes.

SkyHook wrote:Darius Garland has to be in this discussion as well. Four more years at over $40MM AAS for what he's providing on-court is far uglier than some of the ones on your list.

Come on now.

Garland is still an elite(ish) PG whose very young. I think teams like the Magic (Franz) and SAS (Keldon Johnson+picks) should be blowing up the Cavs phone for him.

He's an absolute buy. The Cavs btw, should make a deal for him, but need to not only make sure that DM resigns but will stick around for at least 2 years without asking out.

If the Suns owner didn't explicitly say he "will not do trades with Cleveland" I'd be spamming this board with various trades for him lol.

Beal is quite literally the definition of untradeable to a degree we haven't seen in a long time and was traded within the last year.

Every player is tradeable. Teams will trade positive value for All-NBA talents like Towns, Brown, Gobert and Mitchell.

The tier of players who are harder to move are players below this, like Garland, LaVine, MPJ and Ayton who are just not that impactful and paid near-max money. Still, a PG needy team would give up something positive for Garland.

Players like Herro, Poole and RJ are overpaid but not on near-max deals.

Then there are expiring like FVV and Simmons who are just salary ballast for a star deal.

none of those guys are untradable. They might not get back any/much value, but that's a different story. In fact, most of them would be considered the "best available free agent" if they were hitting the market this summer.

theBigLip wrote:

tcheco wrote:Of the ones listed, only Beal and Poole won't be moved without decent incentive. John Collins finished the year decent enough to be traded for Poole and a 1st in my opinion(or something close to this). Still not positive value probably, neutral wouldn't be crazy.

Simmons is an expiring so it's easy to take on a bad contract for him... Middleton showed up when needed against the Pacers, has positive value, Lavine on the other hand... when was he last healthy and producing? I guess he is up there with Poole. Ayton just needs to be traded to a city without snow lol

Beal is the worst for sure. I wouldn’t touch Middleton - he is talented but aging fast and can’t stay on the court. That’s a lot of money to pay someone in street clothes.

Middleton is far from "I wouldn't touch" though. Like, if Milwaukee came to Detroit and said "Middleton for cap space", the Pistons should 100% make that deal. They aren't getting a better player for their cap space AND then can just use him as expiring salary ballast next off-season if this year goes poorly.

Low opportunity cost for Detroit there.

It’s Bradley Beal. It would be the worst contract in the league even if he didn’t have a no trade clause

Slim Charless wrote:

SkyHook wrote:Darius Garland has to be in this discussion as well. Four more years at over $40MM AAS for what he's providing on-court is far uglier than some of the ones on your list.

Come on now.

Garland is still an elite(ish) PG whose very young. I think teams like the Magic (Franz) and SAS (Keldon Johnson+picks) should be blowing up the Cavs phone for him.

He's an absolute buy. The Cavs btw, should make a deal for him, but need to not only make sure that DM resigns but will stick around for at least 2 years without asking out.

If the Suns owner didn't explicitly say he "will not do trades with Cleveland" I'd be spamming this board with various trades for him lol.

He's had two decent — but far from elite — seasons and, being extremely generous, three middling ones. He's a fifth starter at best. Tiny inefficient guards on long-term contracts at over 25% of the cap are something to be avoided.

SkyHook wrote:Darius Garland has to be in this discussion as well. Four more years at over $40MM AAS for what he's providing on-court is far uglier than some of the ones on your list.

So a player that at least two teams are currently attempting to acquire is untradeable?

Good take.

Colbinii wrote:

theBigLip wrote:

tcheco wrote:Of the ones listed, only Beal and Poole won't be moved without decent incentive. John Collins finished the year decent enough to be traded for Poole and a 1st in my opinion(or something close to this). Still not positive value probably, neutral wouldn't be crazy.

Simmons is an expiring so it's easy to take on a bad contract for him... Middleton showed up when needed against the Pacers, has positive value, Lavine on the other hand... when was he last healthy and producing? I guess he is up there with Poole. Ayton just needs to be traded to a city without snow lol

Beal is the worst for sure. I wouldn’t touch Middleton - he is talented but aging fast and can’t stay on the court. That’s a lot of money to pay someone in street clothes.

Middleton is far from "I wouldn't touch" though. Like, if Milwaukee came to Detroit and said "Middleton for cap space", the Pistons should 100% make that deal. They aren't getting a better player for their cap space AND then can just use him as expiring salary ballast next off-season if this year goes poorly.

Low opportunity cost for Detroit there.

Respectfully disagree.

Pistons have $60M+ in cap space which should net them 3 good players. Taking on Middleton sucks up two of those slots. Monk, Bridges, Claxton, Oubre are available and will be around longer. I’d rather make those kind of signings, or maybe some other trades with the cap space.

SkyHook wrote:

Slim Charless wrote:

SkyHook wrote:Darius Garland has to be in this discussion as well. Four more years at over $40MM AAS for what he's providing on-court is far uglier than some of the ones on your list.

Come on now.

Garland is still an elite(ish) PG whose very young. I think teams like the Magic (Franz) and SAS (Keldon Johnson+picks) should be blowing up the Cavs phone for him.

He's an absolute buy. The Cavs btw, should make a deal for him, but need to not only make sure that DM resigns but will stick around for at least 2 years without asking out.

If the Suns owner didn't explicitly say he "will not do trades with Cleveland" I'd be spamming this board with various trades for him lol.

He's had two decent — but far from elite — seasons and, being extremely generous, three middling ones. He's a fifth starter at best. Tiny inefficient guards on long-term contracts at over 25% of the cap are something to be avoided.

I disagree. Plainly.

He was on the upswing until DM trade, who took over most of the things that Garland did well. Now he's better at those things and as such the Cavs should choose him if the choice has to be made. Doesn't make Garland a subpar player.

Again, I think Orlando and SAS should be all over this. Nets and Wiz too for that matter.

jbk1234 wrote:

SkyHook wrote:Darius Garland has to be in this discussion as well. Four more years at over $40MM AAS for what he's providing on-court is far uglier than some of the ones on your list.

So a player that at least two teams are currently attempting to acquire is untradeable?

Good take.

As compared to some of the other players on the OP list? Sure. In reality, virtually no player is untradeable.

In the era of four year max’s no contract is fully immovable.

Some do have negative value though.

theBigLip wrote:

Colbinii wrote:

theBigLip wrote:
Beal is the worst for sure. I wouldn’t touch Middleton - he is talented but aging fast and can’t stay on the court. That’s a lot of money to pay someone in street clothes.

Middleton is far from "I wouldn't touch" though. Like, if Milwaukee came to Detroit and said "Middleton for cap space", the Pistons should 100% make that deal. They aren't getting a better player for their cap space AND then can just use him as expiring salary ballast next off-season if this year goes poorly.

Low opportunity cost for Detroit there.

Respectfully disagree.

Pistons have $60M+ in cap space which should net them 3 good players. Taking on Middleton sucks up two of those slots. Monk, Bridges, Claxton, Oubre are available and will be around longer. I’d rather make those kind of signings, or maybe some other trades with the cap space.

I agree that for the Pistons, makes zero sense to trade for Middleton, but can easily see him joining a contending team and making them much better. Him as a 3 option in a contending team is a great fit. My issue with him in the Bucks is being next to other banged up players(Lillard slowed down, Giannis with some injuries).

SkyHook wrote:

Slim Charless wrote:

SkyHook wrote:Darius Garland has to be in this discussion as well. Four more years at over $40MM AAS for what he's providing on-court is far uglier than some of the ones on your list.

Come on now.

Garland is still an elite(ish) PG whose very young. I think teams like the Magic (Franz) and SAS (Keldon Johnson+picks) should be blowing up the Cavs phone for him.

He's an absolute buy. The Cavs btw, should make a deal for him, but need to not only make sure that DM resigns but will stick around for at least 2 years without asking out.

If the Suns owner didn't explicitly say he "will not do trades with Cleveland" I'd be spamming this board with various trades for him lol.

He's had two decent — but far from elite — seasons and, being extremely generous, three middling ones. He's a fifth starter at best. Tiny inefficient guards on long-term contracts at over 25% of the cap are something to be avoided.

The year before Mitchell got here he was an allstar. His performance was elite that season.

Despite sharing the ball with Mitchell, he averaged 21.6 ppg on .587 TS% to go along with 7.6 apg the season before this one. That's not middling.

He was injured last season. His *bad season* numbers were 18 ppg on 56 TS% and 6.5 assists. That's not even middling.

Finally, he is on a rookie max (25%) whereby he's limited to 8% raises with the cap projected to go up 10% annually.