DAL-CHI-DET-WAS (Caruso + Grimes / Omax / Kispert)

[realEAST]

DAL in: A. Caruso, C. Kispert
DAL out: T. Hardaway jr., O. Maxence Prosper, D. Powell, 2025 DAL 1st, 2028 CHA 2nd, 2028 MIA 2nd

CHI in: T. Hardaway jr., 2025 DAL 1st
CHI out: A. Caruso

DET in: O. Maxence Prosper, D. Powell, 2028 CHA 2nd, 2028 MIA 2nd
DET out: Q. Grimes

WAS in: Q. Grimes
WAS out: C. Kispert

Dallas adds fifth starter in Caruso, who offers great defense, good shooting and playmaking too; Kispert is bench scorer and great shooter with some size, should be great off the bench. Dallas also opens up enough space to offer full MLE to D. Jones jr., and keeps both Kleber and Josh Green, giving them a pretty good depth. They essentially upgrade Hardaway (who himself is more or less out of rotation) with Caruso and Kispert, which should be a significant improvement.

They monitor the progress of their youngsters off the bench (Green, Hardy) - if they show signs of progress, both of them should be good rotation pieces; if not, there is still enough for another move (Green, Hardy, Exum, 2025 TOR 2nd,...) to add what they miss.

Irving...........Exum......Hardy
Caruso..........Green.....BAE (if willing to go into luxury tax; still stay bellow 2nd Apron)
Doncic..........Kispert....#60
Washington....Jones jr.
Lively...........Gafford....Kleber

Bulls get an unprotected 1st in a deep draft, and an expiring guy who can play some minutes off the bench for them.

Detroit replace Grimes with Prosper who offers more years of team control, is a few years younger and plays position of greater need (combo forward).

Wasington swaps RFAs in last years of their contract - Grimes might be a better fit for them since he isn't a positional overlap with Coulibaly and Avdija, and he is better defender than Kispert, while still being a good shooter, giving them a nice defensive backbone of Grimes - Coulibaly - Avdija on the wing / forward positions., and some sort of identity going forward.

[Snakebites]

I can’t imagine Caruso going this cheaply.

[realEAST]

I can’t imagine Caruso going this cheaply.

He is expiring and 30 years old - he is really good, but don't think he brings in much more, maybe a good 2nd (TOR 2025?)

[Snakebites]

I can’t imagine Caruso going this cheaply.

He is expiring and 30 years old - he is really good, but don't think he brings in much more, maybe a good 2nd (TOR 2025?)

Yeah I didn't consider the contract situation.

Man the Bulls missed the boat not trading him either of the last 2 deadlines.

Reminds me of the Pistons.

[Mavrelous]

THJ + 1st for Caruso is good for me, the rest is a pass...
Mavs re-sign Morris to vet min, and DJJ to 36/4 contract and call it an offseason...
If the Wizards like Powell/TOR 2nd for Kispert, then this also can be added (or send TOR 2nd to Bulls and POR 1st to the Wizards, etc...)

[theBigLip]

Is there something wrong with Prosper? He doesn’t play. Why again do the Pistons want him?

[nate33]

I don't see a good argument for the Wizards to trade Kispert for Grimes.

Grimes is a total self-check on offense, averaging 12.6 points per 36 minutes on a TS% of .516. I recognize that he is a good defender but one-dimensional defense isn't enough of you're only 6-5. The Wizards already have Bilal and Deni to play D (and do so with more size and versatility). They need spacing and offensive support more so than additional wing defenders.

Kispert is a better offensive player than most realize. He has a usage of 19.6%, which is a lot more than your typical catch-and-shoot 3-point specialist like Garrison Mathews, Isaiah Joe, Sam Hauser or Malik Beasley. Those guys post a usage in the 14-16 range. Kispert is actually elite at attacking a closeout and finishing at the rim with efficiency. His usage and efficiency is more in line with guys like Austin Reaves and Normal Powell. There are only 20 players in the league with a higher TS% and USG% than Kispert, and most of those guys are stars.

The bottom line is that it's a pretty sure bet that Grimes will be available in free agency for sub-MLE money next summer so he doesn't really have much value. He is basically an expiring contract. Kispert's RFA rights actually have value because he will probably go for MLE money or a bit more next summer.

[Apz]

As long as u dont put luka in guard position on your depthchart it will always be flawed. Caruso way too small to be 5th starter. This isnt carlisle mavs that plays 3 guards, this is a mavs that want size. Giving away omax to fill up with 3 guards is just a no. Mavs cant spend all their assets and their big young guy on this.

[7r5ur]

I don't see a good argument for the Wizards to trade Kispert for Grimes.

Grimes is a total self-check on offense, averaging 12.6 points per 36 minutes on a TS% of .516. I recognize that he is a good defender but one-dimensional defense isn't enough of you're only 6-5. The Wizards already have Bilal and Deni to play D (and do so with more size and versatility). They need spacing and offensive support more so than additional wing defenders.

Kispert is a better offensive player than most realize. He has a usage of 19.6%, which is a lot more than your typical catch-and-shoot 3-point specialist like Garrison Mathews, Isaiah Joe, Sam Hauser or Malik Beasley. Those guys post a usage in the 14-16 range. Kispert is actually elite at creating off the bounce and finishing at the rim with efficiency. His usage and efficiency is more in line with guys like Austin Reaves and Normal Powell. There are only 20 players in the league with a higher TS% and USG% than Kispert, and most of those guys are stars.

The bottom line is that it's a pretty sure bet that Grimes will be available in free agency for sub-MLE money next summer so he doesn't really have much value. He is basically an expiring contract. Kispert's RFA rights actually have value because he will probably go for MLE money or a bit more next summer.

Grimes had a 62% TS last season and was banged up this year. I guess it all depends on if you think he’ll be healthy again. Reasonable to prefer Kispert just on health alone. Don’t know that I’d call Kispert “elite at creating off the bounce” when 86% of his field goals are assisted though.

As for the trade, I don’t value Omax highly and I don’t care about deep future 2nds. If Grimes comes back healthy he’s exactly what the pistons need next to Cade as a 3&D guy, so I’d have to pass.

[Snakebites]

I don't really see the point in the Piston/Washington parts of this deal at all TBH.

[Texas Chuck]

Is there something wrong with Prosper? He doesn’t play. Why again do the Pistons want him?

Project rookie on a team in the Finals. Maybe he's not an NBA player but him not playing on a last team standing doesn't tell he cant....

Sent from my SM-A136U using RealGM mobile app

[realEAST]

THJ + 1st for Caruso is good for me, the rest is a pass...
Mavs re-sign Morris to vet min, and DJJ to 36/4 contract and call it an offseason...
If the Wizards like Powell/TOR 2nd for Kispert, then this also can be added (or send TOR 2nd to Bulls and POR 1st to the Wizards, etc...)

Dallas still needs to shave off apx 1.5 mil, so Powell and Omax for either Grimes or Kispert would get them there, while getting a more immediate upgrade, although one that is about to get paid next summer.

[DetroitDon15]

I don't really see the point in the Piston/Washington parts of this deal at all TBH.

It doesn’t make sense for the Detroit to enter the deal as a salary dump while giving a player up for value. If Kispert has any value, Detroit would cut out all parties and swap Grimes for him. Dallas salary dump, disappointing rookies and second rounds don’t help us. Weaver is long gone and so should terrible deals that don’t move the Pistons forward.

[realEAST]

I don't really see the point in the Piston/Washington parts of this deal at all TBH.

For Wasington, it was about, what I thought was a better fit, and creating a (defensive) identity for a team going forward. Also, Grimes could start along Avdija and Bilal, while Kispert is always going to be behind them.

For Pistons it is about preserving cap flexibility for a couple more seasons when they hopefully are a more attractive destination, with Prosper who still has three rookie years coming in for Grimes who is expiring this summer. Also, I saw Ivey-Cade as 1-2, so finding an athletic forward with 3&D potential seemed like a way to go (also, with new GM coming, and Grimes being brought in by Weaver, it might be a case of redoing your predecessor)

[vege]

I don't really see the point in the Piston/Washington parts of this deal at all TBH.

For Wasington, it was about, what I thought was a better fit, and creating a (defensive) identity for a team going forward. Also, Grimes could start along Avdija and Bilal, while Kispert is always going to be behind them.

For Pistons it is about preserving cap flexibility for a couple more seasons when they hopefully are a more attractive destination, with Prosper who still has three rookie years coming in for Grimes who is expiring this summer. Also, I saw Ivey-Cade as 1-2, so finding an athletic forward with 3&D potential seemed like a way to go (also, with new GM coming, and Grimes being brought in by Weaver, it might be a case of redoing your predecessor)

In theory Grimes can defend and shoot. He is a much better fit next to Cade than Ivey and Prosper (who can't do either) there's a good chance Prosper is not even a NBA caliber player, while Grimes might not be a great one, but he does belong into the league, is young, have a desirable skill set and a good contract.

If the new FO is going to undo what Weaver did, it's not by donating Grimes or Fontecchio, it's getting rid of players who don't fit well together, and moving other pieces to their proper roles. Moving Stewart to the backup center spot instead of the starting Power Forward, moving one of the non shooters in Ausar and/or Duren and moving Ivey who plays 0 defense and doesn't spread the floor, therefore he is a terrible fit next to Cade.

Cade is getting an extension, that's the only news we have about Detroit's future, so we are building around him. Prosper, even if he become a NBA caliber player, doesn't fit next to Cade.

So no, Detroit doesn't touch this deal, it doesn't help them financially or make sense on the court, you're just adding Detroit because they have cap flexibility, so you're dumping unwanted stuff to make your trade idea work.

Knowing Detroit's likely direction, you have information to do better next time. Send them players who can play defense and shoot the ball.

[Mavrelous]

THJ + 1st for Caruso is good for me, the rest is a pass...
Mavs re-sign Morris to vet min, and DJJ to 36/4 contract and call it an offseason...
If the Wizards like Powell/TOR 2nd for Kispert, then this also can be added (or send TOR 2nd to Bulls and POR 1st to the Wizards, etc...)

Dallas still needs to shave off apx 1.5 mil, so Powell and Omax for either Grimes or Kispert would get them there, while getting a more immediate upgrade, although one that is about to get paid next summer.

Mavs can add Lawson, nice kid, he was 2 way player, Mavs signed him since they couldn't fill the last roster spot.
Mavs like Prosper, they went out of their way to get him, while he started the season looking like a deer in headlight on offense, his defense and energy were great and his 3pt shot improved a lot, I doubt the team shares the pessimism about him displayed on this board.

[BeiBeau]

Is there something wrong with Prosper? He doesn’t play. Why again do the Pistons want him?

He’s a rookie on the 2nd best team in the NBA? Nobody is confusing him for what Dereck Lively is doing or what Kawhi did as a rookie. But what a crazy question. He’s fine, he’s still learning the NBA game, it’s very common for rookies.

[theBigLip]

Is there something wrong with Prosper? He doesn’t play. Why again do the Pistons want him?

He’s a rookie on the 2nd best team in the NBA? Nobody is confusing him for what Dereck Lively is doing or what Kawhi did as a rookie. But what a crazy question. He’s fine, he’s still learning the NBA game, it’s very common for rookies.

Not a crazy question. Just looking at his stats. Not in playoff rotation. Did he show any improvement? Anything encouraging a non-Dallas fan should be aware of?

[jayjaysee]

Yeah. I think there’s a deal here.

Not sure about the Washington/Detroit part. If I’m Washington, I’m just taking the Dallas package honestly.

But Kispert makes 5.7 million. So the Prosper/Powel for Kisper/vet min.. doesn’t actually help Dallas open money for the MLE… it actually hurts it.

Chicago likely doesn’t want to take on 6 extra mil here and would prefer one of those other teams taking on the extra money. I think an unprotected first for Caruso is fine, but would add the Toronto second to get it done/

[Mr Peanut]

Would be disappointed if Pistons traded Grimes for a collection of lesser parts. He had injury issues this season, but last year for the Knicks he was a very solid 3+D player and if he gets back to that level and continues an upward trajectory I think he has the potential to be the long-term starter next to Cade (or at least a very solid sixth man). I don't see any of the pieces returning to us in this trade as having even close to that potential so it's a pass.