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I already know my fellow cavs fans will hate this, but if we want to be a serious contender it should be considered.

Cavs trade Darius Garland, Evan Mobley, George’s Niang, Carris Levert , Dean Wade

Cavs Aquire Jimmy Butler and Brandon Ingram

Heat Trade Jimmy Butler
Heat Aquire Evan Mobley, Niang, Wade, LaVert, #21

Just came out Heat arnt planning on extending Butler this way they rebuild with one of the best young talent there is in Mobley with some fillers

Pelicans Trade Brandon Ingram #21
Pelicans Aquire Darrius Garland

Pelicans reportedly want to move on from Ingram, Garland gives them a young PG. who has always thrives without Mitchell

I dont think Jimmy at this age quite has this value, but interesting try to go all in

daoneandonly wrote:I dont think Jimmy at this age quite has this value, but interesting try to go all in

Do you think Cavs could get more from Miami?

daoneandonly wrote:I dont think Jimmy at this age quite has this value, but interesting try to go all in

Agreed, this feels like quite the overpay for Butler, there’s no ignoring his age and mileage and then sending a guy like Mobley in return in addition to a first rounder and the salary savings.

Mitchell is going to be on a max extension.

Jimmy is leaving because at 35 and after missing the playoffs with an injury, he wants one and the Heat don't want to give it to him.

Ingram is leaving because he wants one the Pelicans don't want to give him one.

That's $150M+ on three players, one of whom is 35 and is often injured and another who just got completely disappeared in the playoffs. Once you add in Allen, Strus, and whatever Okoro gets, we're almost certainly a second apron team that's basically hard capped.

In addition to undervaluing our players and over valuing Butler and Ingram's trade values, you've created the Suns East when the rest of the league is looking at them as a cautionary tale.

Presser wrote:Heat Trade Jimmy Butler
Heat Aquire Evan Mobley, Niang, Wade, LaVert, #21

I don't value Mobley as much as some and I don't like the fit with Bam. We're also not going to rebuild. Adding in another team where we get a player we want makes a lot more sense. I also wouldn't trade Mobley if I were you

I think if the Cavs instead made this offer to LA for LeBron + Ingram, you'll have a higher-tier contender.

I dont love the idea for the Cavs.
Keep it Small and just do the pelicans /Ingram for Garland swap.

brackdan70 wrote:I dont love the idea for the Cavs.
Keep it Small and just do the pelicans /Ingram for Garland swap.

Personally I think that’s doesn’t move the needle much, unless Mobley takes a big step forward offensively we would be the same team, maybe getting out of the first round if we get the right matchup

jbk1234 wrote:Mitchell is going to be on a max extension.

Jimmy is leaving because at 35 and after missing the playoffs with an injury, he wants one and the Heat don't want to give it to him.

Ingram is leaving because he wants one the Pelicans don't want to give him one.

That's $150M+ on three players, one of whom is 35 and is often injured and another who just got completely disappeared in the playoffs. Once you add in Allen, Strus, and whatever Okoro gets, we're almost certainly a second apron team that's basically hard capped.

In addition to undervaluing our players and over valuing Butler and Ingram's trade values, you've created the Suns East when the rest of the league is looking at them as a cautionary tale.

Not really much more than they are gonna be paying once they extend Mobley who will go for a Max. Idk you’re probably right I’m just frustrated with this team that doesn’t play well together.

Presser wrote:

jbk1234 wrote:Mitchell is going to be on a max extension.

Jimmy is leaving because at 35 and after missing the playoffs with an injury, he wants one and the Heat don't want to give it to him.

Ingram is leaving because he wants one the Pelicans don't want to give him one.

That's $150M+ on three players, one of whom is 35 and is often injured and another who just got completely disappeared in the playoffs. Once you add in Allen, Strus, and whatever Okoro gets, we're almost certainly a second apron team that's basically hard capped.

In addition to undervaluing our players and over valuing Butler and Ingram's trade values, you've created the Suns East when the rest of the league is looking at them as a cautionary tale.

Not really much more than they are gonna be paying once they extend Mobley who will go for a Max. Idk you’re probably right I’m just frustrated with this team that doesn’t play well together.

A rookie max is 25% of the cap. A vet max is 5-10% higher. Also, the core four barely played together last year. They were healthy for 4 of our playoff games and like 20 regular season games.

Presser wrote:

brackdan70 wrote:I dont love the idea for the Cavs.
Keep it Small and just do the pelicans /Ingram for Garland swap.

Personally I think that’s doesn’t move the needle much, unless Mobley takes a big step forward offensively we would be the same team, maybe getting out of the first round if we get the right matchup

Mobley at his age likely does take a big step. He was pretty solid in the Playoffs. I think Butler doesn’t move the needle as much as you think.

jbk1234 wrote:

Presser wrote:

jbk1234 wrote:Mitchell is going to be on a max extension.

Jimmy is leaving because at 35 and after missing the playoffs with an injury, he wants one and the Heat don't want to give it to him.

Ingram is leaving because he wants one the Pelicans don't want to give him one.

That's $150M+ on three players, one of whom is 35 and is often injured and another who just got completely disappeared in the playoffs. Once you add in Allen, Strus, and whatever Okoro gets, we're almost certainly a second apron team that's basically hard capped.

In addition to undervaluing our players and over valuing Butler and Ingram's trade values, you've created the Suns East when the rest of the league is looking at them as a cautionary tale.

Not really much more than they are gonna be paying once they extend Mobley who will go for a Max. Idk you’re probably right I’m just frustrated with this team that doesn’t play well together.

A rookie max is 25% of the cap. A vet max is 5-10% higher. Also, the core four barely played together last year. They were healthy for 4 of our playoff games and like 20 regular season games.

Yet they played their best with the injures. Mitchell and garland both play better when the other is out and same with Allen and Mobley.

Presser wrote:

jbk1234 wrote:

Presser wrote:
Not really much more than they are gonna be paying once they extend Mobley who will go for a Max. Idk you’re probably right I’m just frustrated with this team that doesn’t play well together.

A rookie max is 25% of the cap. A vet max is 5-10% higher. Also, the core four barely played together last year. They were healthy for 4 of our playoff games and like 20 regular season games.

Yet they played their best with the injures. Mitchell and garland both play better when the other is out and same with Allen and Mobley.

I'm not really concerned about whether the individual players excel in losses due to usage, but rather whether the team plays well in wins against playoff caliber teams. Let's get a new coach hired and see if he can unlock some things.

jbk1234 wrote:

Presser wrote:

jbk1234 wrote:
A rookie max is 25% of the cap. A vet max is 5-10% higher. Also, the core four barely played together last year. They were healthy for 4 of our playoff games and like 20 regular season games.

Yet they played their best with the injures. Mitchell and garland both play better when the other is out and same with Allen and Mobley.

I'm not really concerned about whether the individual players excel in losses due to usage, but rather whether the team plays well in wins against playoff caliber teams. Let's get a new coach hired and see if he can unlock some things.

I mean they went 18-2 without mobley and garland that’s not a usage thing. I guess we’ll see what happens. Personally I’d be very disappointed if we don’t see major shake ups. But maybe you’re right it just takes the right coach.

Hard pass if I am Cleveland:

Mitchell/Jerome/Porter Jr.
Butler/Merill
Ingram/Strus
?/?
Allen/?

Presser wrote:

jbk1234 wrote:

Presser wrote:

Yet they played their best with the injures. Mitchell and garland both play better when the other is out and same with Allen and Mobley.

I'm not really concerned about whether the individual players excel in losses due to usage, but rather whether the team plays well in wins against playoff caliber teams. Let's get a new coach hired and see if he can unlock some things.

I mean they went 18-2 without mobley and garland that’s not a usage thing. I guess we’ll see what happens. Personally I’d be very disappointed if we don’t see major shake ups. But maybe you’re right it just takes the right coach.

They went 18-2 gainst the bottom half of the league.

mcfly1204 wrote:Hard pass if I am Cleveland:

Mitchell/Jerome/Porter Jr.
Butler/Merill
Ingram/Strus
?/?
Allen/?

I’d Probably line it up

Mitchell
Struss
Butler
Ingram
Allen

Obviously you’d have to work on your bench. Sign some solid vets with your midline

Presser wrote:

jbk1234 wrote:

Presser wrote:
Not really much more than they are gonna be paying once they extend Mobley who will go for a Max. Idk you’re probably right I’m just frustrated with this team that doesn’t play well together.

A rookie max is 25% of the cap. A vet max is 5-10% higher. Also, the core four barely played together last year. They were healthy for 4 of our playoff games and like 20 regular season games.

Yet they played their best with the injures. Mitchell and garland both play better when the other is out and same with Allen and Mobley.

Garland + Mitchell lineups are better than just Garland alone in both seasons they've played together. Garland gets more usage with Mitchell out but the team is less successful.

Garland's performance last year is explained much better by "Garland had a bad year due to injury" rather than "Garland doesn't fit with Mitchell".

mcfly1204 wrote:Hard pass if I am Cleveland:

Mitchell/Jerome/Porter Jr.
Butler/Merill
Ingram/Strus
?/?
Allen/?

I question if this post-trade team is a contender too. That said, Butler certainly isn't a SG, he'd be starting at 4, and Okoro is still around to start at 2.

I think the team is actually closer if they can just do Garland for Butler. Would really hope a return for Garland would be someone that would be around a little longer than this though.