Ingram to Utah (w/BRK)

[babyjax13]

I don't want this to happen (I like watching miserably bad teams so that my addiction to the draft matters for my fandom), but I keep circling back to it as something that seems possible for a few reasons:
1. Ainge is a notorious "buy low" GM
2. Ingram's age fits with Lauri and Sexton
3. Ingram isn't going to get a max extension offer, and for less than the max I don't hate having him (except for the lottery situation)
4. We struggle to add significant talent in FA, etc. and Ingram seems like the kind of low-key personality that might enjoy SLC

New Orleans is probably interested in Kessler, and also likely interested in maintaining some salary flexibility moving forward, which is tougher, so we probably need a third team interested in taking Collins for compensation. New Orleans also still has two roster spots, sooooo....


UTA trades: John Collins, Walker Kessler, 2025 MIN/CLE 1st (worst) (29.5 x 1.25 = 36.75 > Ingram's ~36.0m salary)
in: Brandon Ingram
Utah buys low on Brandon Ingram and extends him with Lauri. I'm just going to say we do this if he agrees to a yearly average under $40 million? He blocks Williams' minutes a bit and also will hurt the tank, so plenty of reasons not to do this, as well.

BRK trades: Bojan Bogdanovic, Denis Schroeder
in: John Collins, 2025 MIN/CLE 1st (worst)
Brooklyn gets a first for swapping expirings for Collins (who has an additional year).

NOP trades: Brandon Ingram
in: Bojan Bogdanovic, Walker Kessler, Denis Schroeder
New Orleans gets a center and some decent depth. This should keep their salaries relatively under control moving forward, too.

[HadAnEffectHere]

So I like this for both teams if it happened earlier and for different GMs.

1. Griffin gets fired if he trades Brandon Ingram for Walker Kessler even if this is basically Ingram's value at this point.
2. The Jazz have destroyed their roster so thoroughly that it would be extremely hard to build a functional roster around Ingram, Sexton, and Markkanen. They need a bunch of bench depth, a starting center, and a starting SG who can really defend and shoot. There's no one left in FA and a trade at this point would be pretty hard.

[TheBrooklynKidd]

Brooklyn already has 4 1sts in the 2025 draft so a “Worst of” selection from 2 contenders isn’t worth sacrificing their cap space.

[kobe_vs_jordan]

Think Utah stealing a bit of value. Collins not the first gets you 28 milling in expiring for Collins contract.

Nets adding majority of the value of the expiring , might as well toss in a weak first and get Ingram themselves vs Collins and and a weak first.

[SkyHook]

I can't say that I see any of these three teams signing off on this.

[jazzfan1971]

Ingram to Utah makes some sense. He would fit with Lauri well.

[Colbinii]

The idea that Ingram could or would extend for < 40 Million AAV with Utah but not New Orleans seems like you have buried your head under the sand.

From everything we have heard, Ingram is looking for 200 Million+ on his next deal, which is well above 40 AAV (and at a minimum 40 AAV for 5 years).

[jayjaysee]

I think Utah is getting Ingram too cheap here..

And if you’re trading for Ingram, you should keep Kessler IMO? He probably isn’t a good starting center, but you need a starting center..

Would find a third team that wants Hendricks and make it work. Or just add pick value to find a center..

[HadAnEffectHere]

I also think there's basically no chance Ingram stays in Utah unless he gets a full max from Utah.

[babyjax13]

The idea that Ingram could or would extend for < 40 Million AAV with Utah but not New Orleans seems like you have buried your head under the sand.

From everything we have heard, Ingram is looking for 200 Million+ on his next deal, which is well above 40 AAV (and at a minimum 40 AAV for 5 years).

I don't think New Orleans wants to pay him anything close to what he'd get on the open market, which will certainly be less than a max contract.

[wemby]

This deal sounds light for the Pelicans (I think they should get an extra first on top of Kessler) and Nets (a bad first isn't worth the cap space). Jazz should pay to bridge the difference.

[Colbinii]

The idea that Ingram could or would extend for < 40 Million AAV with Utah but not New Orleans seems like you have buried your head under the sand.

From everything we have heard, Ingram is looking for 200 Million+ on his next deal, which is well above 40 AAV (and at a minimum 40 AAV for 5 years).

I don't think New Orleans wants to pay him anything close to what he'd get on the open market, which will certainly be less than a max contract.

They paid McCollum over 30 Million AAV. I think New Orleans would approach 40 AAV but not max money. There are also years as another variable to consider.

[jazzfan1971]

This deal sounds light for the Pelicans (I think they should get an extra first on top of Kessler) and Nets (a bad first isn't worth the cap space). Jazz should pay to bridge the difference.

I think I agree in a vacuum. However, we have the Paul George situation to consider. IF Nawlins is determined to not resign him as the Clips were with George AND the market for him is soft, which seems a real possibility, then you might see some team swoop in and land him for a below vacuum level deal.

In my mind Ainge is an opportunist first and last. If he can add BI to the value chest of the Jazz on a significantly below market deal, I think he will happily do so. Tanking be damned. OTOH, I suspect his interest falls off extremely fast as the cost gets close to fair value. And he simply pivots to tanking again.

[jayjaysee]

Yeah, I side with.. if Ingram is willing to lock himself below 40 average (below a 25% max) - NOP should give it to him and deal with the tax issues next season or trade Trey this year and have no tax issues

[HadAnEffectHere]

Yeah, I side with.. if Ingram is willing to lock himself below 40 average (below a 25% max) - NOP should give it to him and deal with the tax issues next season or trade Trey this year and have no tax issues

The major issue is there's no reason for Ingram to want to stay in New Orleans or for the Pelicans to want to keep Ingram as they **** the roster by adding Murray before trading Ingram.

There's just nowhere near enough shooting or defense and way too much iso scoring at so so efficiency.

Ingram is not going to get the ball nearly as much as he wants and will go to another team before staying in New Orleans with Murray, McCollum,and Zion. New Orleans would have to pay way more than other teams to keep him and they would value him way less than other teams.

David Griffin was also pretty clear that the Pels would never pay the tax to keep Ingram.

The most likely outcome is Ingram walking for nothing and Griffin getting fired.

[jayjaysee]

Yeah, I side with.. if Ingram is willing to lock himself below 40 average (below a 25% max) - NOP should give it to him and deal with the tax issues next season or trade Trey this year and have no tax issues

The major issue is there's no reason for Ingram to want to stay in New Orleans or for the Pelicans to want to keep Ingram as they **** the roster by adding Murray before trading Ingram.

There's just nowhere near enough shooting or defense and way too much iso scoring at so so efficiency.

Ingram is not going to get the ball nearly as much as he wants and will go to another team before staying in New Orleans with Murray, McCollum,and Zion. New Orleans would have to pay way more than other teams to keep him and they would value him way less than other teams.

David Griffin was also pretty clear that the Pels would never pay the tax to keep Ingram.

The most likely outcome is Ingram walking for nothing and Griffin getting fired.

Or you pay Ingram and trade CJM and assets for a center that offers rim protection? That seems to take care of that. Three creators. Stagger the minutes if you want..

Trey and Herb are really good shooters. DJM and Ingram are good enough shooters..

I don’t think Ingram was ever the star some thought, but feel like a lot of people are focusing on 3 post season games against a team with pretty elite perimeter defense - where the actual star of the team wasn’t playing..

[babyjax13]

The idea that Ingram could or would extend for < 40 Million AAV with Utah but not New Orleans seems like you have buried your head under the sand.

From everything we have heard, Ingram is looking for 200 Million+ on his next deal, which is well above 40 AAV (and at a minimum 40 AAV for 5 years).

I don't think New Orleans wants to pay him anything close to what he'd get on the open market, which will certainly be less than a max contract.

They paid McCollum over 30 Million AAV. I think New Orleans would approach 40 AAV but not max money. There are also years as another variable to consider.

And CJ's contract is not a great one. IMO, they would rather commit to Murphy and Jones than Ingram.

[Colbinii]

I don't think New Orleans wants to pay him anything close to what he'd get on the open market, which will certainly be less than a max contract.

They paid McCollum over 30 Million AAV. I think New Orleans would approach 40 AAV but not max money. There are also years as another variable to consider.

And CJ's contract is not a great one. IMO, they would rather commit to Murphy and Jones than Ingram.

How does the Ingram contract affect Herb Jones?

[BK_2020]

What makes Ainge a notorious "buy-low" GM? In the two decades he's been an executive, I can't think of a single "buy-low" trade he pulled off.

[babyjax13]

They paid McCollum over 30 Million AAV. I think New Orleans would approach 40 AAV but not max money. There are also years as another variable to consider.

And CJ's contract is not a great one. IMO, they would rather commit to Murphy and Jones than Ingram.

How does the Ingram contract affect Herb Jones?

It blocks the path of one of Murphy/Jones to a starting role, and presumably would be long enough that New Orleans would have to decide to extend Jones while paying Ingram/Zion/Murray/Murphy. IDK, I have the sense that New Orleans wants to recover some kind of asset for Ingram but otherwise be done.

I'm not reading into the playoffs, it seemed clear during the season that he just wasn't long for that team. At the same time, I don't think he's a max player, and the general sentiment (if rumors are to believed) is that no NBA team believes that, either. 40 million is pretty close to the max for him, I don't think New Orleans can commit that amount of money with so many other players they have already committed to, or will have to soon extend, etc.

I think Ingram is good and capable of being a second option on a team with a *really good* first option who isn't heliocentric. That means he fits very few, if any, teams in that role (because his skillset is very much heliocentric). The Lakers feel like the best place for him as LeBron ages.