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Could something work to unite Jokic with Bogdan Bogdanovic on the Nuggets? I bet they would be a very fun pair to watch and they would have a lot of synergy already from this shared Olympic run.

MPJ+Nnaji
For
Bogdan+Hunter

Just not sure on what the pick compensation would look like.

zimpy27 wrote:MPJ+Nnaji
For
Bogdan+Hunter

Just not sure on what the pick compensation would look like.

I think it’s Holmes and not Nnaji. But I’m really low on MPJ in Atlanta.

Think you’re right that’s the only real base that makes sense though.

jayjaysee wrote:

zimpy27 wrote:MPJ+Nnaji
For
Bogdan+Hunter

Just not sure on what the pick compensation would look like.

I think it’s Holmes and not Nnaji. But I’m really low on MPJ in Atlanta.

Think you’re right that’s the only real base that makes sense though.

Im not sure how you put a competent defense around Trae/MPJ, but for Holmes, i think ATL should do it.

mademan wrote:

jayjaysee wrote:

zimpy27 wrote:MPJ+Nnaji
For
Bogdan+Hunter

Just not sure on what the pick compensation would look like.

I think it’s Holmes and not Nnaji. But I’m really low on MPJ in Atlanta.

Think you’re right that’s the only real base that makes sense though.

Im not sure how you put a competent defense around Trae/MPJ, but for Holmes, i think ATL should do it.

Yeah, I think they need to plan to outscore everyone and hope they drafted well in Zac. But they have some good defensive players on the roster and would have some flexibility in adding another good one. Capela, OO, Nance, Zac, Daniels.. turn one of the bigs into another perimeter defensive player to open some minutes for Holmes anyways and think you can make it work..

mademan wrote:Im not sure how you put a competent defense around Trae/MPJ,

I think we overdo this on paper stuff. I mean Dallas just went to the Finals on the backs of their defense starting Luka/Kyrie and its not like the supporting cast was some all-defense guys. Lively good for a rookie, but still a rookie. Derrick Jones is fine, but when he's your best wing defender....

It's fabulous to be Boston, Minny, or dynasty GSW where everyone in the rotation essentially is a plus defender, but you don't have to have to that to compete defensively. Even without an elite anchor.

jayjaysee wrote:

zimpy27 wrote:MPJ+Nnaji
For
Bogdan+Hunter

Just not sure on what the pick compensation would look like.

I think it’s Holmes and not Nnaji. But I’m really low on MPJ in Atlanta.

Think you’re right that’s the only real base that makes sense though.

MPJ and Holmes is $30k short of being a salary match for Bogdan and Hunter. So Denver have to move someone else too.

zimpy27 wrote:

jayjaysee wrote:

zimpy27 wrote:MPJ+Nnaji
For
Bogdan+Hunter

Just not sure on what the pick compensation would look like.

I think it’s Holmes and not Nnaji. But I’m really low on MPJ in Atlanta.

Think you’re right that’s the only real base that makes sense though.

MPJ and Holmes is $30k short of being a salary match for Bogdan and Hunter. So Denver have to move someone else too.

But Nnaji pushes Atlanta over the tax and IMO MPJ isn’t worth Hunter and Bogdan as is, definitely not when you add 6-8 mil a year to him (Nnaji)

Denver has some other contracts to match and the wiggle room from second apron.

jayjaysee wrote:

zimpy27 wrote:

jayjaysee wrote:
I think it’s Holmes and not Nnaji. But I’m really low on MPJ in Atlanta.

Think you’re right that’s the only real base that makes sense though.

MPJ and Holmes is $30k short of being a salary match for Bogdan and Hunter. So Denver have to move someone else too.

But Nnaji pushes Atlanta over the tax and IMO MPJ isn’t worth Hunter and Bogdan as is, definitely not when you add 6-8 mil a year to him (Nnaji)

Denver has some other contracts to match and the wiggle room from second apron.

Well I think MPJ is the best player in the deal and the contracts match so I kind of see it as fair. I'm also pretty low on Hunter. Hawks would have to want MPJ to do that deal anyway, they aren't doing it for DaRon I don't think.

Hawks have actually been on the hunt for a large offensive wing and had interest in Ingram. Trae, JJ, MPJ, Okongwu would be a nice fit. Risacher can play SG or Dyson Daniels can. The size is really to help OO and boost rebounding.

Denver should trade Murray, not to Atlanta, but he's the one they should move.

zimpy27 wrote:

jayjaysee wrote:

zimpy27 wrote:
MPJ and Holmes is $30k short of being a salary match for Bogdan and Hunter. So Denver have to move someone else too.

But Nnaji pushes Atlanta over the tax and IMO MPJ isn’t worth Hunter and Bogdan as is, definitely not when you add 6-8 mil a year to him (Nnaji)

Denver has some other contracts to match and the wiggle room from second apron.

Well I think MPJ is the best player in the deal and the contracts match so I kind of see it as fair. I'm also pretty low on Hunter. Hawks would have to want MPJ to do that deal anyway, they aren't doing it for DaRon I don't think.

Hawks have actually been on the hunt for a large offensive wing and had interest in Ingram. Trae, JJ, MPJ, Okongwu would be a nice fit. Risacher can play SG or Dyson Daniels can. The size is really to help OO and boost rebounding.

Whats crazy is from a few reports we were offered Ingram in the trade for Murray and we didn't want him and instead wanted Daniels. Could have been contract but seemed scheme fit was said in there as well on us not wanting ingram. Looks like they were really hard after better defensive players that fit around trae. Which Daniels, Risa, and Jalen are all 3 about as best you could ask for in that department for young guys with upside and Trae type fitting pieces.

Threezus wrote:

zimpy27 wrote:

jayjaysee wrote:
But Nnaji pushes Atlanta over the tax and IMO MPJ isn’t worth Hunter and Bogdan as is, definitely not when you add 6-8 mil a year to him (Nnaji)

Denver has some other contracts to match and the wiggle room from second apron.

Well I think MPJ is the best player in the deal and the contracts match so I kind of see it as fair. I'm also pretty low on Hunter. Hawks would have to want MPJ to do that deal anyway, they aren't doing it for DaRon I don't think.

Hawks have actually been on the hunt for a large offensive wing and had interest in Ingram. Trae, JJ, MPJ, Okongwu would be a nice fit. Risacher can play SG or Dyson Daniels can. The size is really to help OO and boost rebounding.

Whats crazy is from a few reports we were offered Ingram in the trade for Murray and we didn't want him and instead wanted Daniels. Could have been contract but seemed scheme fit was said in there as well on us not wanting ingram. Looks like they were really hard after better defensive players that fit around trae. Which Daniels, Risa, and Jalen are all 3 about as best you could ask for in that department for young guys with upside and Trae type fitting pieces.

Yeah I think Daniels is a great player and a great fit with Trae.

Risacher is an upside pick, he isn't starter level right now. I expect him off the bench.

I'd try to find a 3rd team for MPJ. What about Detroit who wants to win and could use the shooting?

Denver out: MPJ, Holmes
Denver in: Beef Stew + Bogdan

Detroit out: Beef Stew, THJ
Detroit in: MPJ

ATL out: Bogdan
ATL in: THJ, Holmes

Picks where needed, but seems pretty solid to me. Maybe some minor incentive from Detroit to ATL?

Detroit - gets a shooter they need badly, another solid addition as they attempt to compete. Great option around Cade.

Denver adds some depth and Bogdan should elevate playing with Joker.

ATL sells Bogdan for an expiring + 1st

Texas Chuck wrote:

mademan wrote:Im not sure how you put a competent defense around Trae/MPJ,

I think we overdo this on paper stuff. I mean Dallas just went to the Finals on the backs of their defense starting Luka/Kyrie and its not like the supporting cast was some all-defense guys. Lively good for a rookie, but still a rookie. Derrick Jones is fine, but when he's your best wing defender....

It's fabulous to be Boston, Minny, or dynasty GSW where everyone in the rotation essentially is a plus defender, but you don't have to have to that to compete defensively. Even without an elite anchor.

Excellent point. I’ll take it a step further and say that every trade doesn’t have to solve every roster issue. I think MPJ makes the Hawks better overall and the cost isn’t significant. Biggest issue with the deal as constructed is that it might put the Hawks in the tax? If so something needs to be adjusted.

I think there's a path for Bogdan to go to Denver that works for both teams, as MPJ adds to Atlanta in a position they need some shooting and size. MPJ is not a star, nor is Bogdan, but he has a little upside left.

jbk1234 wrote:Denver should trade Murray, not to Atlanta, but he's the one they should move.

IMO they should trade Murray and MPJ. Those guys are overpaid relative to production and Denver is losing talent because of it.

babyjax13 wrote:

jbk1234 wrote:Denver should trade Murray, not to Atlanta, but he's the one they should move.

IMO they should trade Murray and MPJ. Those guys are overpaid relative to production and Denver is losing talent because of it.

Can you explain how this works?

Denver losing talent because of MPJ/Murray.

Are you saying Denver could trade both of these guys for equally talented players who cost less?

Colbinii wrote:

babyjax13 wrote:

jbk1234 wrote:Denver should trade Murray, not to Atlanta, but he's the one they should move.

IMO they should trade Murray and MPJ. Those guys are overpaid relative to production and Denver is losing talent because of it.

Can you explain how this works?

Denver losing talent because of MPJ/Murray.

Are you saying Denver could trade both of these guys for equally talented players who cost less?

They can't keep a full roster together with them and MPJ, in particular, is not worth what he is paid. They've lost Bruce Brown and KCP, they don't have assets to attach to Nnaji to trade him because all their pick capital is gone - there is one path to building a full roster around Jokic and that involves making some hard decisions.

They might not get a 1:1 trade in terms of talent, but the roster as a whole will be stronger if they can at least move MPJ for multiple players. I've also long thought Murray has been overpaid for what he produces, but the playoff performances have made him worth keeping. I am not sure that is the case now, but if they understandably want to keep the option of that two-man game, they should at least start by trading MPJ.

I fear that what they will do is wait out the cap/tax rise, only to fill that space by extending Braun/Watson and not meaningfully upgrading the roster.

babyjax13 wrote:

Colbinii wrote:

babyjax13 wrote:IMO they should trade Murray and MPJ. Those guys are overpaid relative to production and Denver is losing talent because of it.

Can you explain how this works?

Denver losing talent because of MPJ/Murray.

Are you saying Denver could trade both of these guys for equally talented players who cost less?

They can't keep a full roster together with them and MPJ, in particular, is not worth what he is paid. They've lost Bruce Brown and KCP, they don't have assets to attach to Nnaji to trade him because all their pick capital is gone - there is one path to building a full roster around Jokic and that involves making some hard decisions.

They might not get a 1:1 trade in terms of talent, but the roster as a whole will be stronger if they can at least move MPJ for multiple players. I've also long thought Murray has been overpaid for what he produces, but the playoff performances have made him worth keeping. I am not sure that is the case now, but if they understandably want to keep the option of that two-man game, they should at least start by trading MPJ.

I fear that what they will do is wait out the cap/tax rise, only to fill that space by extending Braun/Watson and not meaningfully upgrading the roster.

There is a lot of theory I agree with here, but what players could they trade MPJ for who can shoot an incredible clip on a difficult shot diet, produce excellent size at the 3, and have the ability to completely dominate a series like he did against the Lakers?

Colbinii wrote:

babyjax13 wrote:

Colbinii wrote:
Can you explain how this works?

Denver losing talent because of MPJ/Murray.

Are you saying Denver could trade both of these guys for equally talented players who cost less?

They can't keep a full roster together with them and MPJ, in particular, is not worth what he is paid. They've lost Bruce Brown and KCP, they don't have assets to attach to Nnaji to trade him because all their pick capital is gone - there is one path to building a full roster around Jokic and that involves making some hard decisions.

They might not get a 1:1 trade in terms of talent, but the roster as a whole will be stronger if they can at least move MPJ for multiple players. I've also long thought Murray has been overpaid for what he produces, but the playoff performances have made him worth keeping. I am not sure that is the case now, but if they understandably want to keep the option of that two-man game, they should at least start by trading MPJ.

I fear that what they will do is wait out the cap/tax rise, only to fill that space by extending Braun/Watson and not meaningfully upgrading the roster.

There is a lot of theory I agree with here, but what players could they trade MPJ for who can shoot an incredible clip on a difficult shot diet, produce excellent size at the 3, and have the ability to completely dominate a series like he did against the Lakers?

Cam Johnson comes to mind immediately. You'd certainly be giving up some size with him, and the theoretical upside of his best possible performance might be lower... You could look at a guy like Jerami Grant who would provide something different (also ... speaking of guys they couldn't keep).

Obviously there would be a lot of decisions about *how* to fill out the roster after you trade MPJ, but I don't think that their philosophy should be to find a guy who has the exact same attributes. Instead they should think about what they can get + what they need and fill out the roster to address both of those. e.g., if you trade MPJ for Cam Johnson (whether it be a direct trade or a three-way) and you decide you need another scoring option, there are plenty of combo guards who could provide some tertiary scoring or act as bench sparkplugs that should be available.