Pelicans / Clippers / Blazers: get Zion a center

Butter · Post #1 » by **Butter** » Sun Oct 13, 2024 12:14 pm

Pelicans trade:
Brandon Ingram
2027 FRP (Mil unprotected)

Pelicans Receive:
Deandre Ayton

The Pels solve two problems in one trade. Landing a starting quality center, avoid extending Ingram. I am guessing that if the Pels GM had found any decent trade options, Ingram would already be gone.

Clippers Trade:
Norman Powell
PJ Tucker

Clippers Receive
Brandon Ingram

Admittedly, I don't know anything about the Clippers roster. Clippers fans may freak out about this trade. But after losing Paul Georges production, and their lack of future draft picks, the Clippers have limited options to upgrade this roster. Ingram slides into the forward slot and compliments Kawhi, giving the Clips a shot at competing in the playoffs.

Portland Trades:
Deandre Ayton

Portland receives
Norman Powell
PJ Tucker
Mil FRP (unprotected)

Tucker added to match salaries, and has a 1 year contract. Norman Powell may refuse to report back to Portland, but provides SG depth behind Sharp. Primary benefit to the Blazers is the draft capitol. Blazers fans may be concerned that Clingan isn't ready to start. Depending on Timelords health, he gets all the mins he can handle.

Myth · Post #2 » by **Myth** » Sun Oct 13, 2024 12:20 pm

Yes for Portland.

As a side note and something I’ve said before here, I like the idea of Portland getting a vet like Tucker. I want to simultaneously tank and develop youth, and I think an important part of development is vet leadership. We don’t need that vet leadership to be high paid high minutes guys like Jerami Grant. PJ can teach toughness and vet savvy without being currently good enough to hurt a tank job or take minutes from developing players. Essentially, we need a Haslem but don’t have one within the team already.

JRoy · Post #3 » by **JRoy** » Sun Oct 13, 2024 12:24 pm

Works for POR as long as Norm can be routed elsewhere.

Godaddycurse · Post #4 » by **Godaddycurse** » Sun Oct 13, 2024 12:34 pm

FRP going the wrong way

Butter · Post #5 » by **Butter** » Sun Oct 13, 2024 12:46 pm

Godaddycurse wrote:FRP going the wrong way

Care to elaborate?

Godaddycurse · Post #6 » by **Godaddycurse** » Sun Oct 13, 2024 1:01 pm

Butter wrote:
Godaddycurse wrote:FRP going the wrong way

Care to elaborate?

I have Ingram worth more than Ayton and it isn't close

JRoy · Post #7 » by **JRoy** » Sun Oct 13, 2024 1:09 pm

Godaddycurse wrote:
Butter wrote:
Godaddycurse wrote:FRP going the wrong way

Care to elaborate?

I have Ingram worth more than Ayton and it isn't close

Who is giving a FRP for the privilege of overpaying BI?

Butter · Post #8 » by **Butter** » Sun Oct 13, 2024 1:13 pm

Godaddycurse wrote:
Butter wrote:
Godaddycurse wrote:FRP going the wrong way

Care to elaborate?

I have Ingram worth more than Ayton and it isn't close

You're probably right, but value isn't always about talent. The Pelicans have a gaping hole at center. Also, if their front office agreed on his value, he'd be signed to an extension by now. The entire league knows he wants out.

Answer me two questions:
1) will the Pelicans extend Ingram
2) which center can they legitimately get who's better than Ayton?

Also, Ayton may be an ideal center next to Zion. He likes mid range jumpers, giving Zion room to operate in the post. And he can occupy bigger players on defense. The Blazers are not going to give away a career 18/10 center.

Maybe the Pels can finagle a future pick from the Clippers.

Godaddycurse · Post #9 » by **Godaddycurse** » Sun Oct 13, 2024 1:18 pm

JRoy wrote:
Godaddycurse wrote:
Butter wrote:
Care to elaborate?

I have Ingram worth more than Ayton and it isn't close

Who is giving a FRP for the privilege of overpaying BI?

lakers fans offered one repeatedly. I haven't seen anyone offer that for Ayton though

Godaddycurse · Post #10 » by **Godaddycurse** » Sun Oct 13, 2024 1:20 pm

Butter wrote:
Also, Ayton may be an ideal center next to Zion. He likes mid range jumpers, giving Zion room to operate in the post. And he can occupy bigger players on defense. The Blazers are not going to give away a career 18/10 center.

You traded Nurkic and Little for Ayton essentially. He was also 18/10 back then.

JRoy · Post #11 » by **JRoy** » Sun Oct 13, 2024 1:20 pm

Godaddycurse wrote:
JRoy wrote:
Godaddycurse wrote:
I have Ingram worth more than Ayton and it isn't close

Who is giving a FRP for the privilege of overpaying BI?

lakers fans offered one repeatedly. I haven't seen anyone offer that for Ayton though

I wouldn’t either.

Butter · Post #12 » by **Butter** » Sun Oct 13, 2024 1:28 pm

Godaddycurse wrote:
JRoy wrote:
Godaddycurse wrote:
I have Ingram worth more than Ayton and it isn't close

Who is giving a FRP for the privilege of overpaying BI?

lakers fans offered one repeatedly. I haven't seen anyone offer that for Ayton though

Ok, straightforward question. How would Ayton fit next to Zion?

JRoy · Post #13 » by **JRoy** » Sun Oct 13, 2024 1:31 pm

Godaddycurse wrote:
Butter wrote:
Also, Ayton may be an ideal center next to Zion. He likes mid range jumpers, giving Zion room to operate in the post. And he can occupy bigger players on defense. The Blazers are not going to give away a career 18/10 center.

You traded Nurkic and Little for Ayton essentially. He was also 18/10 back then.

Little is a nothing.

Sorry to see Nurk go but I understand why they did it.

Post #14 » by **jbk1234** » Sun Oct 13, 2024 1:43 pm

JRoy wrote:
Godaddycurse wrote:
Butter wrote:
Care to elaborate?

I have Ingram worth more than Ayton and it isn't close

Who is giving a FRP for the privilege of overpaying BI?

A playoff team will pay late first value just to rent him for the postseason and figure out whether to pay him next summer, next summer.

If the Pels will swap these two straight up, and I'm skeptical, then the Blazers would be crazy to turn it down. The problem with this trade is that the Clippers are taking the best trade piece for a negative value package.

Godaddycurse · Post #15 » by **Godaddycurse** » Sun Oct 13, 2024 1:43 pm

Butter wrote:
Godaddycurse wrote:
JRoy wrote:
Who is giving a FRP for the privilege of overpaying BI?

lakers fans offered one repeatedly. I haven't seen anyone offer that for Ayton though

Ok, straightforward question. How would Ayton fit next to Zion?

Better question is how would Ayton respond to being 4th option again. didn't go so well last time in Phoenix

Post #16 » by **jbk1234** » Sun Oct 13, 2024 1:59 pm

Butter wrote:
Godaddycurse wrote:
Butter wrote:
Care to elaborate?

I have Ingram worth more than Ayton and it isn't close

You're probably right, but value isn't always about talent. The Pelicans have a gaping hole at center. Also, if their front office agreed on his value, he'd be signed to an extension by now. The entire league knows he wants out.

Answer me two questions:
1) will the Pelicans extend Ingram
2) which center can they legitimately get who's better than Ayton?

Also, Ayton may be an ideal center next to Zion. He likes mid range jumpers, giving Zion room to operate in the post. And he can occupy bigger players on defense. The Blazers are not going to give away a career 18/10 center.

Maybe the Pels can finagle a future pick from the Clippers.

Keep an eye the 21st. It's the last day for players on a rookie contract to extend. If Murphy hasn't signed an extension by then, and Griffin makes him available, the answer to your second question might surprise you.

I think the better question is what's the alternative for the Blazers if the Pelicans do pivot? Vuc and filler? It's a bad idea to try to leverage a trade partner when there's only one or two league wide.

Clipsz 4 Life · Post #17 » by **Tim Lehrbach** » Sun Oct 13, 2024 3:22 pm

Nothing personal, Butter, but I'm weary of this framework.

The Blazers aren't getting a first for Ayton unless, perhaps, long-term bad salary is coming back. On the other hand, Ingram makes no sense as a target.

As to "the first is going the wrong way," that may make sense in the RealGM "trade value" vacuum, but there's equally no way the Blazers spend a first round pick to dump Ayton, so what point is there in that statement?

Clipsz 4 Life · Post #18 » by **Tim Lehrbach** » Sun Oct 13, 2024 3:23 pm

jbk1234 wrote:I think the better question is what's the alternative for the Blazers if the Pelicans do pivot? Vuc and filler? It's a bad idea to try to leverage a trade partner when there's only one or two league wide.

The alternative is to let Ayton play out his contract, take a bazillion shots, and command the tank. And that's probably the plan, not the alternative.

Godaddycurse · Post #19 » by **Godaddycurse** » Sun Oct 13, 2024 5:32 pm

Tim Lehrbach wrote:
As to "the first is going the wrong way," that may make sense in the RealGM "trade value" vacuum, but there's equally no way the Blazers spend a first round pick to dump Ayton, so what point is there in that statement?

the point is OP's value is way off

Clipsz 4 Life · Post #20 » by **Tim Lehrbach** » Sun Oct 13, 2024 5:46 pm

Godaddycurse wrote:
Tim Lehrbach wrote:
As to "the first is going the wrong way," that may make sense in the RealGM "trade value" vacuum, but there's equally no way the Blazers spend a first round pick to dump Ayton, so what point is there in that statement?

the point is OP's value is way off

I know, so I shouldn't have asked the question the way I did. My point is it's a meaningless statement.

Chances of New Orleans trading a first round pick with Ingram for Ayton: 0%
Chances of Portland trading a first round pick with Ayton for Ingram: 0%

Just because one player is better than the other doesn't make a statement like "the first is going the wrong way" true. The "value" mindset is exactly what people need to shed here. Trades are about each team trying to improve its situation, not match value to the satisfaction of RealGM's Trades and Transactions board. Here, the Pelicans give away a better player and a first for a worse player, which is a bad idea for improving its situation. It adds little to the discussion to post a counterproposal that is equally unlikely just for effect.

Granted, my ranting doesn't add much either, so...