Jimmy to GSW with Toronto

[slos]

Three team trade

Warriors in Butler
Warriors out Wiggins, Kuminga, Payton, Anderson, 2025 FRP

Miami in Brown, Kuminga, Payton, Anderson, GSW 2025 FRP, POR 2025 SRP
Miami out Butler

Toronto in Wiggins
Toronto out Brown, POR 2025 SRP

Why Warriors? They go all in with Jimmy and create a 2-3 year window for another title. Golden State keeps 3,3 mil under the 2nd apron to fill their last posts.

Curry........Schroder
Hield........Podziemski
Butler.......Moody...........Santos
Green.......Waters
Looney......Jackson

Why Miami? They move on from Jimmy replacing him with Kuminga who fits better their Herro/Bam timeline, while adding nice rotational pieces to keep competing and entering the next draft with a pair of picks.

Rozier........Robinson....Payton
Herro........Jacquez.....Burks
Brown.......Anderson....Larsson
Kuminga....Jovic.........Richardson
Adebayo....Ware.........Highsmith

Why Toronto? They spend an early 2nd to add another Canadian wing. Raps still spend the season experimenting and trying to keep everyone fresh for next season in hopes for improvement through the lottery.

Quickley.....Mitchell......Shead
Barrett.......Dick..........Walter
Wiggins......Agbaji........Temple
Barnes.......Boucher......Mogbo
Poeltl........Olynyk.......Fernando

[Texas Chuck]

Is Toronto just here because Wiggins is Canadian? Because Miami could use him and he's better and healthier than Brown. I don't think they are needed.

[Godaddycurse]

Is Toronto just here because Wiggins is Canadian? Because Miami could use him and he's better and healthier than Brown. I don't think they are needed.

Adding wiggins puts us into the tax. Not paying an early 2nd to do that

[Texas Chuck]

Is Toronto just here because Wiggins is Canadian? Because Miami could use him and he's better and healthier than Brown. I don't think they are needed.

Adding wiggins puts us into the tax. Not paying an early 2nd to do that

I mean assuming you could solve that easily enough, I'd probably take the value win here. Wiggins would have an immediate flip market or in the summer. Teams like big wings who defend and can do enough offensively to stay on the court.

[Thaddy]

Toronto isn't looking to give away picks, they want to accumulate since they are rebuilding. Wiggins isn't going to move the needle for them and he's an older player now. Another team like Miami should be there instead of TO.

[slos]

Is Toronto just here because Wiggins is Canadian? Because Miami could use him and he's better and healthier than Brown. I don't think they are needed.

Adding wiggins puts us into the tax. Not paying an early 2nd to do that

Actually I think Toronto will still have a 6 mil breathing room under the tax after a Wiggins/Brown swap. Next season they still stay under the tax line after they sign their FRP with 12 contracts and only Mitchell to resign if they wish.

@Chuck if Miami cuts Toronto they probably become a 2nd apron team next season after they resign Kuminga.

[BBallFreak]

I don't like this for Miami. The downgrade from Wiggins to Brown is drastic. For a second round pick? That's terrible. Toronto is literally stealing value, here.

No, we'll keep Wiggins and flip him for better value and expiring deals.

[Thaddy]

I don't like this for Miami. The downgrade from Wiggins to Brown is drastic. For a second round pick? That's terrible. Toronto is literally stealing value, here.

No, we'll keep Wiggins and flip him for better value and expiring deals.

Wiggins contract is brutal. He is a role player and should have never been an all star. I wouldn't call their values too different. Brown can likely be re-signed for a fraction of what he currently costs. Wiggins will face the same fate a player like Gay Trent Jr faced where they are left with a minimum offer.

[Texas Chuck]

@Chuck if Miami cuts Toronto they probably become a 2nd apron team next season after they resign Kuminga.

They have the off-season to figure that out. I just don't like giving value up to a 3rd team like this if I can help it. Maybe they decide they prefer Wiggins to Robinson or Rozier. Then they move out that money instead.

I just think Brown is a pretty big negative value on that contract not able to play and Wiggins is worth having on his contract--and he plays a role that is always in demand and that Miami would have an immediate need for.

[BBallFreak]

I don't like this for Miami. The downgrade from Wiggins to Brown is drastic. For a second round pick? That's terrible. Toronto is literally stealing value, here.

No, we'll keep Wiggins and flip him for better value and expiring deals.

Wiggins contract is brutal. He is a role player and should have never been an all star. I wouldn't call their values too different. Brown can likely be re-signed for a fraction of what he currently costs. Wiggins will face the same fate a player like Gay Trent Jr faced where they are left with a minimum offer.

I disagree with all of that. It's an absolutely terrible take to say that their value is even remotely close.

[mademan]

Wiggins seems like a seamless fit between Herro/Bam. I think Miami values him here

Wiggins a year ago was a chit contract, but he was going through some personal things. Seems like he's turned it around

[NW]

I don't like this for Miami. The downgrade from Wiggins to Brown is drastic. For a second round pick? That's terrible. Toronto is literally stealing value, here.

No, we'll keep Wiggins and flip him for better value and expiring deals.

Wiggins contract is brutal. He is a role player and should have never been an all star. I wouldn't call their values too different. Brown can likely be re-signed for a fraction of what he currently costs. Wiggins will face the same fate a player like Gay Trent Jr faced where they are left with a minimum offer.

Wiggins contract is far from brutal if he continues playing how he has this season. He’s a wing that can defend the opponents best wing and is a solid 3-4 option on offense. Can imagine a number of contenders can use that.

Just hard to make a deal for Butler to work between the hard capped at the apron and need to get to 14 players after a likely 3-4 for 1 deal.

Also curious what Miami wants to do in a Butler deal. If the goal is cap relief and draft capital, probably means Wiggins to a third team. If the goal is to be competitive, I think Wiggins could do well on the Heat too

[OutsidetheNBA]

I don't like this for Miami. The downgrade from Wiggins to Brown is drastic. For a second round pick? That's terrible. Toronto is literally stealing value, here.

No, we'll keep Wiggins and flip him for better value and expiring deals.

Wiggins contract is brutal. He is a role player and should have never been an all star. I wouldn't call their values too different. Brown can likely be re-signed for a fraction of what he currently costs. Wiggins will face the same fate a player like Gay Trent Jr faced where they are left with a minimum offer.

Wiggins makes 18% of the cap for the next 3 years. He had a terrible year last year, but this year he is averaging 18/4/2 with solid defense while shooting 43% from 3 and near .6 TS%. Take away last year, and he's shot 38%+ from 3 each year as a Warrior. 18% of the cap is absolutely reasonable for that production.

[Godaddycurse]

Is Toronto just here because Wiggins is Canadian? Because Miami could use him and he's better and healthier than Brown. I don't think they are needed.

Adding wiggins puts us into the tax. Not paying an early 2nd to do that

Actually I think Toronto will still have a 6 mil breathing room under the tax after a Wiggins/Brown swap. Next season they still stay under the tax line after they sign their FRP with 12 contracts and only Mitchell to resign if they wish.

@Chuck if Miami cuts Toronto they probably become a 2nd apron team next season after they resign Kuminga.

Pretty sure wiggins puts us into the tax next year unless we dump someone

[Godaddycurse]

Is Toronto just here because Wiggins is Canadian? Because Miami could use him and he's better and healthier than Brown. I don't think they are needed.

Adding wiggins puts us into the tax. Not paying an early 2nd to do that

I mean assuming you could solve that easily enough, I'd probably take the value win here. Wiggins would have an immediate flip market or in the summer. Teams like big wings who defend and can do enough offensively to stay on the court.

Its not that easy though? Its probably not hard to trade wiggins for an expiring but much harder to get someone to absorb him into space next offseason. Easier to just involve another team than Toronto when we have a bunch of young wings who needs minutes

[Nate the Great]

I don’t know how many times it has to be said…the Warriors can’t trade four players for one, unless they also gain enough cap space to sign three minimum wage players. And Jimmy Butler is a terrible fit for them, for several reasons.

[james vincent]

Is Toronto just here because Wiggins is Canadian? Because Miami could use him and he's better and healthier than Brown. I don't think they are needed.

Adding wiggins puts us into the tax. Not paying an early 2nd to do that

I mean assuming you could solve that easily enough, I'd probably take the value win here. Wiggins would have an immediate flip market or in the summer. Teams like big wings who defend and can do enough offensively to stay on the court.

That maybe true (to an extent) but I don’t trust Wiggins’s history (with Minnesota and Golden State).

Although he did help them win a championship, when he tunes out (he’s disengaged and a net negative).Granted, he’s been through a lot (personally) so I’ll give him the benefit of the doubt.

Nevertheless, he needs the right infrastructure and culture around for him to succeed and Toronto isn’t there; they’re rebuilding.

Therefore, I believe that Miami with Riley and Spo will keep him engaged and hold him accountable for his lapses.

I don’t think Toronto should trade for him as he doesn’t fit their timeline; neither does Bruce Brown or Jakob Poetl (hence Toronto should trade both of these players for younger guys if possible).

[Coxy]

This is awful for the Warriors. Butler is old and hasn't been fully healthy over long stretches for years now. He's also an average fit for what we do. Then, you add in his salary his upcoming free agency with a PO, and it's just a terrible idea for the Warriors to consider.

I'm not sure I'd even trade Wiggins straight up for Butler right now factoring everything into it.

[Crazy-Canuck]

I don't like this for Miami. The downgrade from Wiggins to Brown is drastic. For a second round pick? That's terrible. Toronto is literally stealing value, here.

No, we'll keep Wiggins and flip him for better value and expiring deals.

Wiggins contract is brutal. He is a role player and should have never been an all star. I wouldn't call their values too different. Brown can likely be re-signed for a fraction of what he currently costs. Wiggins will face the same fate a player like Gay Trent Jr faced where they are left with a minimum offer.

Now that his family issues are hopefully behind him, Im guessing you haven't seen wiggins this year. Hes got a great value for his contract for how he's producing.

[MessiahUjiri]

I think Toronto says yes.

Miami should say yes too. Jimmy is no longer worth his contract, and he’s owed >$50M next year.

Golden State would hesitate. I dunno if a 4 for 1 is a realistic trade. Maybe they get Kevin Love too? He can still be an old Channing Frye like role.