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Riffing off of this idea... What if?

SkyHook wrote:

SkyHook wrote:Listened to a podcast this morning (edit: from 1/8) that had a proposed Sexton + Collins for Butler trade in which the Heat would need to give up a protected first or multiple seconds.

It's going to be a long few weeks for Pat Riley and absolutely exhausting for our friend BBallFreak.

Per Wiretap (edit: a few days later):

"The Miami Heat are seeking a quality player or multiple quality players to help them this season as they evaluate trade offers on Jimmy Butler. Miami also doesn't want to take back any long-term salary for the 2026 offseason unless it is for an All-Star talent."

First thing I thought of when I read this.
(Not happening.)

Butler + Rozier + 2026 SRP (LAL) + 2029 FRP (MIA)
for
Collins + Sexton + Clarkson

Why for the Heat?
•"Multiple quality players to help them this season".
•Saves $14.7MM, getting them completely out of the tax this season.
•Resets the repeater tax clock.
•No additional salary beyond 2025-26.

Why for the Jazz?

•Draft assets in return for taking on a massive amount of additional salary.
•Allowing Butler to remain away from the team for the rest of the season—he can focus on his coffee shop—improves tanking odds.
•Attempt to trade Butler for additional asset return in the summer or negotiate a buyout.
•No additional salary beyond 2025-26.

I don't necessarily see either MIA or UTA doing this, more of an off-the-wall thought exercise. Maybe as a last ditch desperation move. Does Riley dislike Butler enough to send him to a team he doesn't want, one with no chance (or desire) to compete this season. Does the Riley-Ainge mutual loathing society prevent even a conversation from happening?

CAnnot see Miami adding a first to turn Butler/Rozier into that trio. I don't think they should do it without the pick as the best player they get back shouldn't share the court with Herro for long stretches and Clarkson shouldn't play at all with both of those guys there.

I get Utah would want compensation as Butler figures to not be happy playing there with no extension, but Miami shouldn't give it.

Texas Chuck wrote:CAnnot see Miami adding a first to turn Butler/Rozier into that trio. I don't think they should do it without the pick as the best player they get back shouldn't share the court with Herro for long stretches and Clarkson shouldn't play at all with both of those guys there.

I get Utah would want compensation as Butler figures to not be happy playing there with no extension, but Miami shouldn't give it.

Understandable reasoning.

I know it’s not a real idea. But I think you take this for Miami.

You take this but don’t trade Clarkson, you trade Sexton for the late first he’s worth. And now you’re under the tax and got a first and kept your books clean.. that’s an easy extension or follow up trade that makes this one of the best deals out there for Miami somehow? Outside of Milwaukee getting desperate enough to trade their unprotected 2031 first. But I don’t see them doing that.

For Utah though? I guess if you tell Butler to stay in Miami or LA or anywhere he wants.. and if he opts in, then you try and build a roster around him and Lauri for next season? But he’s not going to play hard as an expiring next year if he does opt in right? But he kind of would have to in order to get paid.. this season he has the leverage of the player option..

SkyHook wrote:Riffing off of this idea... What if?

SkyHook wrote:

SkyHook wrote:Listened to a podcast this morning (edit: from 1/8) that had a proposed Sexton + Collins for Butler trade in which the Heat would need to give up a protected first or multiple seconds.

It's going to be a long few weeks for Pat Riley and absolutely exhausting for our friend BBallFreak.

Per Wiretap (edit: a few days later):

"The Miami Heat are seeking a quality player or multiple quality players to help them this season as they evaluate trade offers on Jimmy Butler. Miami also doesn't want to take back any long-term salary for the 2026 offseason unless it is for an All-Star talent."

First thing I thought of when I read this.
(Not happening.)

Butler + Rozier + 2026 SRP (LAL) + 2029 FRP (MIA)
for
Collins + Sexton + Clarkson

Why for the Heat?
•"Multiple quality players to help them this season".
•Saves $14.7MM, getting them completely out of the tax this season.
•Resets the repeater tax clock.
•No additional salary beyond 2025-26.

Why for the Jazz?

•Draft assets in return for taking on a massive amount of additional salary.
•Allowing Butler to remain away from the team for the rest of the season—he can focus on his coffee shop—improves tanking odds.
•Attempt to trade Butler for additional asset return in the summer or negotiate a buyout.
•No additional salary beyond 2025-26.

I don't necessarily see either MIA or UTA doing this, more of an off-the-wall thought exercise. Maybe as a last ditch desperation move. Does Riley dislike Butler enough to send him to a team he doesn't want, one with no chance (or desire) to compete this season. Does the Riley-Ainge mutual loathing society prevent even a conversation from happening?

Is Butler able to be traded once he opts in to his last year “at Utah”?

SkyHook wrote:Riffing off of this idea... What if?

SkyHook wrote:

SkyHook wrote:Listened to a podcast this morning (edit: from 1/8) that had a proposed Sexton + Collins for Butler trade in which the Heat would need to give up a protected first or multiple seconds.

It's going to be a long few weeks for Pat Riley and absolutely exhausting for our friend BBallFreak.

Per Wiretap (edit: a few days later):

"The Miami Heat are seeking a quality player or multiple quality players to help them this season as they evaluate trade offers on Jimmy Butler. Miami also doesn't want to take back any long-term salary for the 2026 offseason unless it is for an All-Star talent."

First thing I thought of when I read this.
(Not happening.)

Butler + Rozier + 2026 SRP (LAL) + 2029 FRP (MIA)
for
Collins + Sexton + Clarkson

Why for the Heat?
•"Multiple quality players to help them this season".
•Saves $14.7MM, getting them completely out of the tax this season.
•Resets the repeater tax clock.
•No additional salary beyond 2025-26.

Why for the Jazz?

•Draft assets in return for taking on a massive amount of additional salary.
•Allowing Butler to remain away from the team for the rest of the season—he can focus on his coffee shop—improves tanking odds.
•Attempt to trade Butler for additional asset return in the summer or negotiate a buyout.
•No additional salary beyond 2025-26.

I don't necessarily see either MIA or UTA doing this, more of an off-the-wall thought exercise. Maybe as a last ditch desperation move. Does Riley dislike Butler enough to send him to a team he doesn't want, one with no chance (or desire) to compete this season. Does the Riley-Ainge mutual loathing society prevent even a conversation from happening?

Miami likes Sexton. I am not sure Miami would see Collins as much of an upgrade over the Jovic/Love pairing. I like Clarkson better than Rozier, but Burks gives you a lot of what Clarkson does for the minimum.

I think Miami would consider a Rozier for Sexton deal, but Utah's only real motivation here would be to save ~$25M next season. I don't think Utah would trade Sexton for a salary dump and I doubt Miami would be willing to add any relevant draft capital to do this deal.

jayjaysee wrote:I know it’s not a real idea. But I think you take this for Miami.

You take this but don’t trade Clarkson, you trade Sexton for the late first he’s worth. And now you’re under the tax and got a first and kept your books clean.. that’s an easy extension or follow up trade that makes this one of the best deals out there for Miami somehow? Outside of Milwaukee getting desperate enough to trade their unprotected 2031 first. But I don’t see them doing that.

For Utah though? I guess if you tell Butler to stay in Miami or LA or anywhere he wants.. and if he opts in, then you try and build a roster around him and Lauri for next season? But he’s not going to play hard as an expiring next year if he does opt in right? But he kind of would have to in order to get paid.. this season he has the leverage of the player option..

If he opts in (likely), Utah's priorities would be:
•Trade him.
•Allow him to negotiate a FA deal with anyone pending a buyout at some level of discount.
•Given local reports pointing to another tanking season in 25-26, Butler not playing hard isn't necessarily a downside.

SkyHook wrote:

jayjaysee wrote:I know it’s not a real idea. But I think you take this for Miami.

You take this but don’t trade Clarkson, you trade Sexton for the late first he’s worth. And now you’re under the tax and got a first and kept your books clean.. that’s an easy extension or follow up trade that makes this one of the best deals out there for Miami somehow? Outside of Milwaukee getting desperate enough to trade their unprotected 2031 first. But I don’t see them doing that.

For Utah though? I guess if you tell Butler to stay in Miami or LA or anywhere he wants.. and if he opts in, then you try and build a roster around him and Lauri for next season? But he’s not going to play hard as an expiring next year if he does opt in right? But he kind of would have to in order to get paid.. this season he has the leverage of the player option..

If he opts in (likely), Utah's priorities would be:
•Trade him.
•Allow him to negotiate a FA deal with anyone pending a buyout at some level of discount.
•Given local reports pointing to another tanking season in 25-26, Butler not playing hard isn't necessarily a downside.

I don’t know what Utah will do. For the fans, I think trading Lauri and tanking is the best road forward. The next two drafts have enough dart throws at real star talent to reset a franchise IMO.

Their is no world in which Miami gives up a first, protected or otherwise, along with Butler, without getting some sort of franchise cornerstone. I like Sexton and Collins and would trade Butler for them, but would not include draft capital. I'd be expecting draft capital...

BBallFreak wrote:Their is no world in which Miami gives up a first, protected or otherwise, along with Butler, without getting some sort of franchise cornerstone. I like Sexton and Collins and would trade Butler for them, but would not include draft capital. I'd be expecting draft capital...

I would think of the seconds for the 20 million saved in the Clarkson/Terry swap.

BBallFreak wrote:Their is no world in which Miami gives up a first, protected or otherwise, along with Butler, without getting some sort of franchise cornerstone. I like Sexton and Collins and would trade Butler for them, but would not include draft capital. I'd be expecting draft capital...

Again, I don't see this scenario happening.

Would Collins + Sexton for Butler work straight up? I think it makes some sense, but that both MIA & UTA would want draft compensation and—especially given the management personalities involved—both would likely hold the line, so it's probably just yet another impasse.

SkyHook wrote:

BBallFreak wrote:Their is no world in which Miami gives up a first, protected or otherwise, along with Butler, without getting some sort of franchise cornerstone. I like Sexton and Collins and would trade Butler for them, but would not include draft capital. I'd be expecting draft capital...

Again, I don't see this scenario happening.

Would Collins + Sexton for Butler work straight up? I think it makes some sense, but that both MIA & UTA would want draft compensation and—especially given the management personalities involved—both would likely hold the line, so it's probably just yet another impasse.

Yeah before I read through this I thought it would be Collins and Sexton for Butler, which I like for both. I think Miami should be able to get a little more, not sure if they actually will.