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Sorry, IND...this trade is based on IND disappointing in the playoffs and Turner getting frisky. No matter what happens, Haliburton is going nowhere. But, IND invested heavily in Siakim, who is a big-time player with a big-time contract too. They can't sink back to the bottom with those two major investments. IF they look good to end the year, I expect they'll try to just re-sign Myles Turner and keep it on the tracks. If they falter, on one end or the other, or Turner happily announces that he loves LAL , they could make changes. This deal's fairness must be considered with Turner's demand/request in mind...this is IND doing pretty well with a direction they hadn't necessarily hoped for...

ORL sends: WCJ, KCP, Jett Howard, DEN 25 frp
ORL gets: Austin Reaves, Benjamin Mathurin, Rui Hachimura
Why: Backcourt playmaker/scorer they desperately need, Mathurin is a huge offensive upgrade off the bench, Rui is solid depth

IND sends: Myles Turner ($32m SnT), Mathurin
IND gets: Wendell Carter, KCP, DEN 25 frp
Why: KCP is a perfect pairing with Hali, he ups the defensive identity significantly and can run with IND's fast-pace. WCJ slots in as a versatile C that can spread the floor for Hali & Siakim to do their thing. Late frp for giving up Mathurin - who'd likely lose minutes with Nembhard being the third of three guards getting big minutes anyway. ORL would prefer to up the draft equity and get Nembhard, but IND isn't considering that.

LAL sends: Reaves, Hachimura
LAL gets: Myles Turner, Jett Howard
LAL gets their dream C, a rim-protecting, floor-spreading, lob target for two of the best passers in the NBA. LAL loves Reaves, but Luka's role severely diminishes Reaves' place in the offense. Howard is salary filler, but still very young and promising as another sniper like Knecht. ORL doesn't mind including him as guaranteed money without a guaranteed role is a no-no with all of the big rookie extensions hitting soon.

Skybox wrote:Sorry, IND...this trade is based on IND disappointing in the playoffs and Turner getting frisky. No matter what happens, Haliburton is going nowhere. But, IND invested heavily in Siakim, who is a big-time player with a big-time contract too. They can't sink back to the bottom with those two major investments. IF they look good to end the year, I expect they'll try to just re-sign Myles Turner and keep it on the tracks. If they falter, on one end or the other, or Turner happily announces that he loves LAL , they could make changes. This deal's fairness must be considered with Turner's demand/request in mind...this is IND doing pretty well with a direction they hadn't necessarily hoped for...

ORL sends: WCJ, KCP, Jett Howard, DEN 25 frp
ORL gets: Austin Reaves, Benjamin Mathurin, Rui Hachimura
Why: Backcourt playmaker/scorer they desperately need, Mathurin is a huge offensive upgrade off the bench, Rui is solid depth

IND sends: Myles Turner ($32m SnT), Mathurin
IND gets: Wendell Carter, KCP, DEN 25 frp
Why: KCP is a perfect pairing with Hali, he ups the defensive identity significantly and can run with IND's fast-pace. WCJ slots in as a versatile C that can spread the floor for Hali & Siakim to do their thing. Late frp for giving up Mathurin - who'd likely lose minutes with Nembhard being the third of three guards getting big minutes anyway. ORL would prefer to up the draft equity and get Nembhard, but IND isn't considering that.

LAL sends: Reaves, Hachimura
LAL gets: Myles Turner, Jett Howard
LAL gets their dream C, a rim-protecting, floor-spreading, lob target for two of the best passers in the NBA. LAL loves Reaves, but Luka's role severely diminishes Reaves' place in the offense. Howard is salary filler, but still very young and promising as another sniper like Knecht. ORL doesn't mind including him as guaranteed money without a guaranteed role is a no-no with all of the big rookie extensions hitting soon.

Must be an Orlando fan as this is a lopsided traded. Indy values Mathurin as more than a late 1st rd pick. KCP is a negative contract that would have to share time with Nembhard and Shephard. Just don’t see how you expect Orlando to get Reaves and Mathurin for that poo poo plater.

Helsbyte wrote:

Skybox wrote:Sorry, IND...this trade is based on IND disappointing in the playoffs and Turner getting frisky. No matter what happens, Haliburton is going nowhere. But, IND invested heavily in Siakim, who is a big-time player with a big-time contract too. They can't sink back to the bottom with those two major investments. IF they look good to end the year, I expect they'll try to just re-sign Myles Turner and keep it on the tracks. If they falter, on one end or the other, or Turner happily announces that he loves LAL , they could make changes. This deal's fairness must be considered with Turner's demand/request in mind...this is IND doing pretty well with a direction they hadn't necessarily hoped for...

ORL sends: WCJ, KCP, Jett Howard, DEN 25 frp
ORL gets: Austin Reaves, Benjamin Mathurin, Rui Hachimura
Why: Backcourt playmaker/scorer they desperately need, Mathurin is a huge offensive upgrade off the bench, Rui is solid depth

IND sends: Myles Turner ($32m SnT), Mathurin
IND gets: Wendell Carter, KCP, DEN 25 frp
Why: KCP is a perfect pairing with Hali, he ups the defensive identity significantly and can run with IND's fast-pace. WCJ slots in as a versatile C that can spread the floor for Hali & Siakim to do their thing. Late frp for giving up Mathurin - who'd likely lose minutes with Nembhard being the third of three guards getting big minutes anyway. ORL would prefer to up the draft equity and get Nembhard, but IND isn't considering that.

LAL sends: Reaves, Hachimura
LAL gets: Myles Turner, Jett Howard
LAL gets their dream C, a rim-protecting, floor-spreading, lob target for two of the best passers in the NBA. LAL loves Reaves, but Luka's role severely diminishes Reaves' place in the offense. Howard is salary filler, but still very young and promising as another sniper like Knecht. ORL doesn't mind including him as guaranteed money without a guaranteed role is a no-no with all of the big rookie extensions hitting soon.

Must be an Orlando fan as this is a lopsided traded. Indy values Mathurin as more than a late 1st rd pick. KCP is a negative contract that would have to share time with Nembhard and Shephard. Just don’t see how you expect Orlando to get Reaves and Mathurin for that poo poo plater.

Probably so...I didn't think Mathurin was valued that way in IND. Reaves is certainly the key for ORL, imo. I figure ORL helps LAL pay for Turner and gets Reaves. Happy to leave Mathurin out and re-work it. I know IND won't like it regardless...again, based on the idea the Myles and/or his agent are enthralled by his potential fit in LAL and he is an UFA.

Seems terrible for LAL at first glance. Reaves is just as good, if not better than Turner in a vacuum.

But, beyond that, Turner is a Free Agent and you have a 2025 1st in the deal. How does that work?

And then, beyond that, the Lakers get hard-capped here with a S+T, no?

Just too many moving parts for a S+T.

I don't love the fit of Turner with Luka, I'd prefer a better rebounder and overall better rim runner, especially if I'm sending Reaves I'd want back a fit with more Zubac/Kessler/Lively upside.

Indy could trade Mathurin, Toppin, or Nesmith, but the purpose would be to generate tax room to keep Turner. Also, if trading for a FRP, a 2026 would be the target as we don't have ours

If Turner is gone, then Mathurin is pretty much an untradeable. Indy would possibly look for a smaller deal to get a WCJ, but that would just involve a Rui, not a Mathurin.


But this deal is insanely tilted toward an Orlando, as they deal all lower valued pieces and improve on all of them?

Others have already pointed out the legal and financial issues in a sign and trade with LA here, and the 2025 picks involved in a sign and trade.

Wizop wrote:Indy could trade Mathurin, Toppin, or Nesmith, but the purpose would be to generate tax room to keep Turner. Also, if trading for a FRP, a 2026 would be the target as we don't have ours

That's the likely way it goes...my premise is based on Turner saying "That's all folks" to go play with Luka and LBJ

Skybox wrote:

Wizop wrote:Indy could trade Mathurin, Toppin, or Nesmith, but the purpose would be to generate tax room to keep Turner. Also, if trading for a FRP, a 2026 would be the target as we don't have ours

That's the likely way it goes...my premise is based on Turner saying "That's all folks" to go play with Luka and LBJ

So Turner is turning down some 25-30m a year to sign in LA for whatever MLE they can fit under the 1st apron. That threat doesn't have much teeth. Unless Lebron changes his mind a takes a drastic pay cut, like league minimum, then they only way Turner realistically lands in LA is they can make a SNT attractive enough for Indy.

psman2 wrote:

Skybox wrote:

Wizop wrote:Indy could trade Mathurin, Toppin, or Nesmith, but the purpose would be to generate tax room to keep Turner. Also, if trading for a FRP, a 2026 would be the target as we don't have ours

That's the likely way it goes...my premise is based on Turner saying "That's all folks" to go play with Luka and LBJ

So Turner is turning down some 25-30m a year to sign in LA for whatever MLE they can fit under the 1st apron. That threat doesn't have much teeth. Unless Lebron changes his mind a takes a drastic pay cut, like league minimum, then they only way Turner realistically lands in LA is they can make a SNT attractive enough for Indy.

The Lakers can do a Sign and Trade. If Turner wants to leave, we shouldn't need more than a minor asset to assist with a Sign and Trade.

ReggiesKnicks wrote:

psman2 wrote:

Skybox wrote:
That's the likely way it goes...my premise is based on Turner saying "That's all folks" to go play with Luka and LBJ

So Turner is turning down some 25-30m a year to sign in LA for whatever MLE they can fit under the 1st apron. That threat doesn't have much teeth. Unless Lebron changes his mind a takes a drastic pay cut, like league minimum, then they only way Turner realistically lands in LA is they can make a SNT attractive enough for Indy.

The Lakers can do a Sign and Trade. If Turner wants to leave, we shouldn't need more than a minor asset to assist with a Sign and Trade.

Depends on what salary has to be included and Indy's ability to turn that salary into something they want. LAL is not a threat to sign him outright so the SNT has to make sense for Indy first and foremost. Taking on 25+ million of unwanted players for a minor asset like a 2nd is not something that is really appealing if they are not able to find a 3rd team to land them something that makes sense for Indy.

I have no reason to believe that Turner wants to leave unless Indy does not offer him market value.

Skybox wrote:Sorry, IND...this trade is based on IND disappointing in the playoffs and Turner getting frisky. No matter what happens, Haliburton is going nowhere. But, IND invested heavily in Siakim, who is a big-time player with a big-time contract too. They can't sink back to the bottom with those two major investments. IF they look good to end the year, I expect they'll try to just re-sign Myles Turner and keep it on the tracks. If they falter, on one end or the other, or Turner happily announces that he loves LAL , they could make changes. This deal's fairness must be considered with Turner's demand/request in mind...this is IND doing pretty well with a direction they hadn't necessarily hoped for...

ORL sends: WCJ, KCP, Jett Howard, DEN 25 frp
ORL gets: Austin Reaves, Benjamin Mathurin, Rui Hachimura
Why: Backcourt playmaker/scorer they desperately need, Mathurin is a huge offensive upgrade off the bench, Rui is solid depth

IND sends: Myles Turner ($32m SnT), Mathurin
IND gets: Wendell Carter, KCP, DEN 25 frp
Why: KCP is a perfect pairing with Hali, he ups the defensive identity significantly and can run with IND's fast-pace. WCJ slots in as a versatile C that can spread the floor for Hali & Siakim to do their thing. Late frp for giving up Mathurin - who'd likely lose minutes with Nembhard being the third of three guards getting big minutes anyway. ORL would prefer to up the draft equity and get Nembhard, but IND isn't considering that.

LAL sends: Reaves, Hachimura
LAL gets: Myles Turner, Jett Howard
LAL gets their dream C, a rim-protecting, floor-spreading, lob target for two of the best passers in the NBA. LAL loves Reaves, but Luka's role severely diminishes Reaves' place in the offense. Howard is salary filler, but still very young and promising as another sniper like Knecht. ORL doesn't mind including him as guaranteed money without a guaranteed role is a no-no with all of the big rookie extensions hitting soon.

That's hysterically bad for Indiana. If I was the Pacers and this was the best I could do if Turner demands out I'd say good bye and look for a free agent.

Helsbyte wrote:

Skybox wrote:Sorry, IND...this trade is based on IND disappointing in the playoffs and Turner getting frisky. No matter what happens, Haliburton is going nowhere. But, IND invested heavily in Siakim, who is a big-time player with a big-time contract too. They can't sink back to the bottom with those two major investments. IF they look good to end the year, I expect they'll try to just re-sign Myles Turner and keep it on the tracks. If they falter, on one end or the other, or Turner happily announces that he loves LAL , they could make changes. This deal's fairness must be considered with Turner's demand/request in mind...this is IND doing pretty well with a direction they hadn't necessarily hoped for...

ORL sends: WCJ, KCP, Jett Howard, DEN 25 frp
ORL gets: Austin Reaves, Benjamin Mathurin, Rui Hachimura
Why: Backcourt playmaker/scorer they desperately need, Mathurin is a huge offensive upgrade off the bench, Rui is solid depth

IND sends: Myles Turner ($32m SnT), Mathurin
IND gets: Wendell Carter, KCP, DEN 25 frp
Why: KCP is a perfect pairing with Hali, he ups the defensive identity significantly and can run with IND's fast-pace. WCJ slots in as a versatile C that can spread the floor for Hali & Siakim to do their thing. Late frp for giving up Mathurin - who'd likely lose minutes with Nembhard being the third of three guards getting big minutes anyway. ORL would prefer to up the draft equity and get Nembhard, but IND isn't considering that.

LAL sends: Reaves, Hachimura
LAL gets: Myles Turner, Jett Howard
LAL gets their dream C, a rim-protecting, floor-spreading, lob target for two of the best passers in the NBA. LAL loves Reaves, but Luka's role severely diminishes Reaves' place in the offense. Howard is salary filler, but still very young and promising as another sniper like Knecht. ORL doesn't mind including him as guaranteed money without a guaranteed role is a no-no with all of the big rookie extensions hitting soon.

Must be an Orlando fan as this is a lopsided traded. Indy values Mathurin as more than a late 1st rd pick. KCP is a negative contract that would have to share time with Nembhard and Shephard. Just don’t see how you expect Orlando to get Reaves and Mathurin for that poo poo plater.

I didn't realize that KCP was $22 million a year! Yeah he's a bad contract and worthless than zero to Indiana. This trade wants Turner and Mathurin for WCJ and KCP and a pick when they likely still be in the tax. Which is the only reason to move Turner is to stay out of the tax.

Skybox wrote:

Helsbyte wrote:

Skybox wrote:Sorry, IND...this trade is based on IND disappointing in the playoffs and Turner getting frisky. No matter what happens, Haliburton is going nowhere. But, IND invested heavily in Siakim, who is a big-time player with a big-time contract too. They can't sink back to the bottom with those two major investments. IF they look good to end the year, I expect they'll try to just re-sign Myles Turner and keep it on the tracks. If they falter, on one end or the other, or Turner happily announces that he loves LAL , they could make changes. This deal's fairness must be considered with Turner's demand/request in mind...this is IND doing pretty well with a direction they hadn't necessarily hoped for...

ORL sends: WCJ, KCP, Jett Howard, DEN 25 frp
ORL gets: Austin Reaves, Benjamin Mathurin, Rui Hachimura
Why: Backcourt playmaker/scorer they desperately need, Mathurin is a huge offensive upgrade off the bench, Rui is solid depth

IND sends: Myles Turner ($32m SnT), Mathurin
IND gets: Wendell Carter, KCP, DEN 25 frp
Why: KCP is a perfect pairing with Hali, he ups the defensive identity significantly and can run with IND's fast-pace. WCJ slots in as a versatile C that can spread the floor for Hali & Siakim to do their thing. Late frp for giving up Mathurin - who'd likely lose minutes with Nembhard being the third of three guards getting big minutes anyway. ORL would prefer to up the draft equity and get Nembhard, but IND isn't considering that.

LAL sends: Reaves, Hachimura
LAL gets: Myles Turner, Jett Howard
LAL gets their dream C, a rim-protecting, floor-spreading, lob target for two of the best passers in the NBA. LAL loves Reaves, but Luka's role severely diminishes Reaves' place in the offense. Howard is salary filler, but still very young and promising as another sniper like Knecht. ORL doesn't mind including him as guaranteed money without a guaranteed role is a no-no with all of the big rookie extensions hitting soon.

Must be an Orlando fan as this is a lopsided traded. Indy values Mathurin as more than a late 1st rd pick. KCP is a negative contract that would have to share time with Nembhard and Shephard. Just don’t see how you expect Orlando to get Reaves and Mathurin for that poo poo plater.

Probably so...I didn't think Mathurin was valued that way in IND. Reaves is certainly the key for ORL, imo. I figure ORL helps LAL pay for Turner and gets Reaves. Happy to leave Mathurin out and re-work it. I know IND won't like it regardless...again, based on the idea the Myles and/or his agent are enthralled by his potential fit in LAL and he is an UFA.

The Lakers can't sign Turner unless it's a S&T they'll need the Pacers to cooperate which won't happen like this.

ReggiesKnicks wrote:

psman2 wrote:

Skybox wrote:
That's the likely way it goes...my premise is based on Turner saying "That's all folks" to go play with Luka and LBJ

So Turner is turning down some 25-30m a year to sign in LA for whatever MLE they can fit under the 1st apron. That threat doesn't have much teeth. Unless Lebron changes his mind a takes a drastic pay cut, like league minimum, then they only way Turner realistically lands in LA is they can make a SNT attractive enough for Indy.

The Lakers can do a Sign and Trade. If Turner wants to leave, we shouldn't need more than a minor asset to assist with a Sign and Trade.

LAL has virtually nothing to trade that would be of any interest to the Pacers.

basketballwacko2 wrote:

ReggiesKnicks wrote:

psman2 wrote:
So Turner is turning down some 25-30m a year to sign in LA for whatever MLE they can fit under the 1st apron. That threat doesn't have much teeth. Unless Lebron changes his mind a takes a drastic pay cut, like league minimum, then they only way Turner realistically lands in LA is they can make a SNT attractive enough for Indy.

The Lakers can do a Sign and Trade. If Turner wants to leave, we shouldn't need more than a minor asset to assist with a Sign and Trade.

LAL has virtually nothing to trade that would be of any interest to the Pacers.

I wouldn't mind Rui if we moved on from Obi.

ReggiesKnicks wrote:

basketballwacko2 wrote:

ReggiesKnicks wrote:
The Lakers can do a Sign and Trade. If Turner wants to leave, we shouldn't need more than a minor asset to assist with a Sign and Trade.

LAL has virtually nothing to trade that would be of any interest to the Pacers.

I wouldn't mind Rui if we moved on from Obi.

The reason to move Toppin is to sign Turner if you get Rui it defeats the purpose. So you trade Turner for Rui and the Lakers 2031 #1 there's no center on the team unless you're resigning Bryant or Jackson I don't feel good about either of them as my starter.

Pretty much if you're not signing Turner you may as well rebuild and trade everyone but Haliburton and Nembhard.

basketballwacko2 wrote:

ReggiesKnicks wrote:

basketballwacko2 wrote:
LAL has virtually nothing to trade that would be of any interest to the Pacers.

I wouldn't mind Rui if we moved on from Obi.

The reason to move Toppin is to sign Turner if you get Rui it defeats the purpose. So you trade Turner for Rui and the Lakers 2031 #1 there's no center on the team unless you're resigning Bryant or Jackson I don't feel good about either of them as my starter.

Pretty much if you're not signing Turner you may as well rebuild and trade everyone but Haliburton and Nembhard.

Oh, if we are losing Turner for nothing, I would 100% take a TPE and Rui and a 2031 Unprotected 1st versus nothing

psman2 wrote:

Skybox wrote:

Wizop wrote:Indy could trade Mathurin, Toppin, or Nesmith, but the purpose would be to generate tax room to keep Turner. Also, if trading for a FRP, a 2026 would be the target as we don't have ours

That's the likely way it goes...my premise is based on Turner saying "That's all folks" to go play with Luka and LBJ

So Turner is turning down some 25-30m a year to sign in LA for whatever MLE they can fit under the 1st apron. That threat doesn't have much teeth. Unless Lebron changes his mind a takes a drastic pay cut, like league minimum, then they only way Turner realistically lands in LA is they can make a SNT attractive enough for Indy.

start over...it's a sign and trade, of course