T&T board top 10 worst contracts - Vote for #7

[Dr Positivity]

2023 list
Special re-do

1. Bradley Beal (2 years, 103.8 million + 57.1 million 3rd year player option - no trade clause)
2. Paul George (3 years, 155 million + 56.6 million 4th year player option)
3. Joel Embiid (4 years, 227.2 million + 67.3 million 5th year player option)
4. Jerami Grant (3 years, 96 million + 36.4 million 4th year player option)

5. DeJounte Murray (3 years, 94.7 million + 31.6 million 4th year player option)
6. Kawhi Leonard (3 years, 149.5 million)

Please vote for the lowest trade value of this list including play, salary, age, health, character, etc., not "who deserves it the least"

In addition, please nominate a new player to replace them on the list.



Patrick Williams (4 years, 72 million + 18 million 5th year player option)



Jordan Poole (3 years, 95.5 million)



Deandre Ayton (2 years, 69.6 million)





Immanuel Quickley (5 years, 162.5 million)



Jalen Green (1 year, 12.4 million rookie contract + 2 years, 69.3 million extension + 36 million 4th year player option)



RJ Barrett (3 years, 83.1 million)



Brandon Ingram (3 years, 114.1 million + 4th year 41.9 million player option)



Zion Williamson (4 years, 163.2 million)



Jimmy Butler (3 years, 159.8 million)



Zach LaVine (2 years, 92 million + 49 million 3rd year player option)

[Dr Positivity]

Vote Poole

I don't really get people voting for Quickley over him here.

Nominate Middleton

[ReggiesKnicks]

Vote Green
Nominate Brown

I also don't understand Quickley mentions.

[tmorgan]

Just going from my previous thinking list from here on out… no noms from me.

V Quickley

(To answer Dr. P — Quickley’s only somewhat better than Poole, they’re both overpaid, IQ has two more years)

[ReggiesKnicks]

Just going from my previous thinking list from here on out… no noms from me.

V Quickley

(To answer Dr. P — Quickley’s only somewhat better than Poole, they’re both overpaid, IQ has two more years)

IQ is vastly superior to Poole. What are we even doing here?

[HornetJail]

V: Jalen Green
N: OG

[Dr Positivity]

Just going from my previous thinking list from here on out… no noms from me.

V Quickley

(To answer Dr. P — Quickley’s only somewhat better than Poole, they’re both overpaid, IQ has two more years)

I prefer Quickley's skillset as a 3pt shooting PG who averages 7 ast/2.3 per 36 and is average to decent defender, and in a healthier season he could still break out as the Raptors best player next year. Poole could still have Jamal Crawford's career but it's hard for me to be excited about perennial microwave/6th man contender at big money.

[Godaddycurse]

V Williams

[SkyHook]

V: Ingram
N: IQ

[zimpy27]

Vote RJ


I'll be putting in trades all offseason to get IQ to Lakers. I see young Jrue Holiday honestly. Yes he's injured but I like the talent and it's worth a shot.

[tmorgan]

Just going from my previous thinking list from here on out… no noms from me.

V Quickley

(To answer Dr. P — Quickley’s only somewhat better than Poole, they’re both overpaid, IQ has two more years)

IQ is vastly superior to Poole. What are we even doing here?

Looking at the actual numbers from this season?

Even discounting IQ’s injury problems lately, he didn’t play better than Poole this season. I think he’s better anyway, I dislike Poole and his archetype, but Quickley is definitely not earning his paycheck. He’s 25. This is his 5th year. Expecting major improvement going forward may be wishful thinking.

I want neither, but Poole goes away faster.

[tmorgan]

Vote RJ


I'll be putting in trades all offseason to get IQ to Lakers. I see young Jrue Holiday honestly. Yes he's injured but I like the talent and it's worth a shot.

Jrue Holiday? In Quickley? I… I don’t know how to respond to that.

Ok, we’ll just keep it moving. When opinions differ this much, you just have to agree to disagree.

[ReggiesKnicks]

Just going from my previous thinking list from here on out… no noms from me.

V Quickley

(To answer Dr. P — Quickley’s only somewhat better than Poole, they’re both overpaid, IQ has two more years)

IQ is vastly superior to Poole. What are we even doing here?

Looking at the actual numbers from this season?

Is 40 games the only benchmark we have for assessing a players value?

[tmorgan]

IQ is vastly superior to Poole. What are we even doing here?

Looking at the actual numbers from this season?

Is 40 games the only benchmark we have for assessing a players value?

Lolz, gettin snarky with it.

Obviously not, because IQ has played 21 games. Zing!

[SkyHook]

Vote RJ


I'll be putting in trades all offseason to get IQ to Lakers. I see young Jrue Holiday honestly. Yes he's injured but I like the talent and it's worth a shot.

Wow, I don't see that at all. IQ is a below league average shooter (both eFG & TS) and is 11th percentile in d-EPM. Jrue wasn't a great shooter when he was new to the league, but I don't ever remember him being an atrocious defender.

Not how I'd want to commit $130MM over the next four years, but I think it's a great idea for Jeannie & Rob.

[Godaddycurse]

Vote RJ


I'll be putting in trades all offseason to get IQ to Lakers. I see young Jrue Holiday honestly. Yes he's injured but I like the talent and it's worth a shot.

Wow, I don't see that at all. IQ is a below league average shooter (both eFG & TS) and is 11th percentile in d-EPM. Jrue wasn't a great shooter when he was new to the league, but I don't ever remember him being an atrocious defender.

Not how I'd want to commit $130MM over the next four years, but I think it's a great idea for Jeannie & Rob.

He wasnt an atrocious defender in NYK for 4 years, quite the opposite in fact. being on a rebuilding toronto team didn't help. His TS is about average for his position and his eFG was better in NYK when he was actually landing his floaters. His 3pt shooting is steady but the increased playmaking responsibilities affected his timing on shots inside the arc it seems.

[luciano-davidwesley]

V Quickley

[ReggiesKnicks]

Looking at the actual numbers from this season?

Is 40 games the only benchmark we have for assessing a players value?

Lolz, gettin snarky with it.

Obviously not, because IQ has played 21 games. Zing!

I'm not getting snarky, I am just trying to have a discussion. The only statement you provided regarding comparison is the past few months.

Compare IQ's career to Poole's (Starting in 2022 when he started getting consistent minutes) and one player is clearly superior to the other. Advanced Stats, TS+, +/-, Ast:TO, ect all favor Quickley.

Even though they score at similar efficiencies, Quickley has far more of a creation burden over this time (evidenced by AST% on shots made being much lower for IQ compared to Poole).

I just don't know how you can look at a 21 game sample and come to conclusions regarding IQ by disregarding the past 4 seasons of his career. Meanwhile, Poole has not only been worse this year but worse every year of his career other than 2022 when he was actually comparable to IQ because he played off Curry's gravity, and Poole is somehow a better basketball player? I can't buy that.

I haven't been on this forum long but it does appear people here would have trouble remembering what they ate for breakfast yesterday.

[vxmike]

V: Ingram

[tmorgan]

Is 40 games the only benchmark we have for assessing a players value?

Lolz, gettin snarky with it.

Obviously not, because IQ has played 21 games. Zing!

I'm not getting snarky, I am just trying to have a discussion. The only statement you provided regarding comparison is the past few months.

Compare IQ's career to Poole's (Starting in 2022 when he started getting consistent minutes) and one player is clearly superior to the other. Advanced Stats, TS+, +/-, Ast:TO, ect all favor Quickley.

Even though they score at similar efficiencies, Quickley has far more of a creation burden over this time (evidenced by AST% on shots made being much lower for IQ compared to Poole).

I just don't know how you can look at a 21 game sample and come to conclusions regarding IQ by disregarding the past 4 seasons of his career. Meanwhile, Poole has not only been worse this year but worse every year of his career other than 2022 when he was actually comparable to IQ because he played off Curry's gravity, and Poole is somehow a better basketball player? I can't buy that.

I haven't been on this forum long but it does appear people here would have trouble remembering what they ate for breakfast yesterday.

I absolutely never said Poole is a better player than Quickley. I said Quickley hasn’t played better this year (which he hasn’t), and that I still think Quickley is better than Poole, but not by enough to deal with two more years of overpaid-ness. I looked at all the stats, thank you very much. Jordan Poole sucks, and is next on my list. Quickley isn’t good, has never been a positive defender by DBPM, and is a conservative no-mistakes kind of PG that doesn’t create that much for others.

Honestly. If you want to enjoy the discussion, know that I’m not disrespecting you by not agreeing, and I won’t insinuate anything about your mental coherence just because I disagree. Try it.

And I didn’t eat breakfast, because I’m recovering from kidney stones and I’m on pain killers that zap my appetite, thus my prolific posting these last few weeks as compared to my usual mostly lurking approach.