RealGM

PJ Washington for Jaden Ivey

-Mavericks take Flagg leaving room to trade Washington and in exchange they get a solid young guard that can fill in while Kyrie misses time.

-I personally love the fit of Washington on the Pistons. If you took this year's Piston's playoff squad and added Washington, they would be even tougher.

I think Detroit shouldn't trade Ivey. He showed a lot of progress this season, especially the 3 point shot and the defense. He was looking good before he got injured. I want to see what we got in him.

PJ Washington would be great for Detroit, just not for Ivey or Ausar or obviously Cade. I'd be fine trading Duren to a 3rd team and PJ Washington to Detroit.

That creates a hole, to fill one. Ivey was well on his way before his leg break, and is massively needed to help Cade run the offense.

Ausar/Duren/Cade/Ivey are basically off limits per the GM. Holland is close to that. Langdon is going to be very conservative with the sudden success.

Now, with all that said, PJ would be a spectacular fit with Detroit. He has experience working a helocentric player in Luka, so he'll fit seamlessly with Cade. Would love to have him, but its gonna be a first, and a ton of seconds.(Pistons have 15! Available) Harris/Fontecchio/Sasser e.t.c.

NYG wrote:
-I personally love the fit of Washington on the Pistons. If you took this year's Piston's playoff squad and added Washington, they would be even tougher.

If you took this years Pistons Playoff Squad and added Ivey, they would have been better.

My offer would be Fontecchio + Sasser + 2016 top 5 protected 1st and if they want I would add 2nds (we have 4 in 2027 and 4 in 2028 we need to trade some of those) for PJ.

vege wrote:My offer would be Fontecchio + Sasser + 2016 top 5 protected 1st and if they want I would add 2nds (we have 4 in 2017 and 4 in 2018 we need to trade some of those) for PJ.

Are you guys sending picks from the past via some black sorcery?

If I’m Dallas, I’m moving Gafford before I’m moving P.J. Even if Davis isn’t your full time center, you still want to have lineups where he’s playing the 5. In theory, Lively should be playing 30 MPG at C and Davis should give you 12 or so. Come playoff time you can increase those minutes. Gafford is a luxury item in these scenarios.

PJ gives you a small ball 4 and there are plenty of minutes in the front court for him and Flagg.

I think PJ is the heart of the Mavs, he just has that swag the team always needed. He's not untouchable by any means, but Dallas would need to get really good value back for him

R-DAWG wrote:If I’m Dallas, I’m moving Gafford before I’m moving P.J. Even if Davis isn’t your full time center, you still want to have lineups where he’s playing the 5. In theory, Lively should be playing 30 MPG at C and Davis should give you 12 or so. Come playoff time you can increase those minutes. Gafford is a luxury item in these scenarios.

PJ gives you a small ball 4 and there are plenty of minutes in the front court for him and Flagg.

Gafford is a luxury for the playoffs. The problem is Dallas absolutely has to have a center better than Dwight Powell behind them to get through a regular season and as playoff insurance.

Marshall and Martin to play behind AD/Flagg is still okay depth. Powell/Kai Jones(or the like) behind injury prone Lively/AD is not.

I'm okay trading Gafford but then a move for a center has to happen.

Texas Chuck wrote:

R-DAWG wrote:If I’m Dallas, I’m moving Gafford before I’m moving P.J. Even if Davis isn’t your full time center, you still want to have lineups where he’s playing the 5. In theory, Lively should be playing 30 MPG at C and Davis should give you 12 or so. Come playoff time you can increase those minutes. Gafford is a luxury item in these scenarios.

PJ gives you a small ball 4 and there are plenty of minutes in the front court for him and Flagg.

Gafford is a luxury for the playoffs. The problem is Dallas absolutely has to have a center better than Dwight Powell behind them to get through a regular season and as playoff insurance.

Marshall and Martin to play behind AD/Flagg is still okay depth. Powell/Kai Jones(or the like) behind injury prone Lively/AD is not.

I'm okay trading Gafford but then a move for a center has to happen.

Wouldn't AD split the Center spot with Lively when not out there together, if Gafford got moved?

cgf wrote:

Texas Chuck wrote:

R-DAWG wrote:If I’m Dallas, I’m moving Gafford before I’m moving P.J. Even if Davis isn’t your full time center, you still want to have lineups where he’s playing the 5. In theory, Lively should be playing 30 MPG at C and Davis should give you 12 or so. Come playoff time you can increase those minutes. Gafford is a luxury item in these scenarios.

PJ gives you a small ball 4 and there are plenty of minutes in the front court for him and Flagg.

Gafford is a luxury for the playoffs. The problem is Dallas absolutely has to have a center better than Dwight Powell behind them to get through a regular season and as playoff insurance.

Marshall and Martin to play behind AD/Flagg is still okay depth. Powell/Kai Jones(or the like) behind injury prone Lively/AD is not.

I'm okay trading Gafford but then a move for a center has to happen.

Wouldn't AD split the Center spot with Lively when not out there together, if Gafford got moved?

Yes, but Dallas has to expect them to miss 50 games combined, maybe more. So they need another real option. I love Dwight Powell but he cannot be that guy.

Texas Chuck wrote:

cgf wrote:

Texas Chuck wrote:
Gafford is a luxury for the playoffs. The problem is Dallas absolutely has to have a center better than Dwight Powell behind them to get through a regular season and as playoff insurance.

Marshall and Martin to play behind AD/Flagg is still okay depth. Powell/Kai Jones(or the like) behind injury prone Lively/AD is not.

I'm okay trading Gafford but then a move for a center has to happen.

Wouldn't AD split the Center spot with Lively when not out there together, if Gafford got moved?

Yes, but Dallas has to expect them to miss 50 games combined, maybe more. So they need another real option. I love Dwight Powell but he cannot be that guy.

Getting someone to fill in during the regular season doesn't require too much. Just someone like Kornet or Achiuwa.

cgf wrote:

Texas Chuck wrote:

cgf wrote:
Wouldn't AD split the Center spot with Lively when not out there together, if Gafford got moved?

Yes, but Dallas has to expect them to miss 50 games combined, maybe more. So they need another real option. I love Dwight Powell but he cannot be that guy.

Getting someone to fill in during the regular season doesn't require too much. Just someone like Kornet or Achiuwa.

Yeah, I mean just play Dwight Powell at that point. Kornet works only because of the perimeter players Boston has. Precious is nobody's answer. Knicks are massively better when he is off the court and manage to be negative with him on it despite their perimeter talent. And there is a reason he doesn't play for them in the playoffs.

They need better than that because they are going to be dependent on defense especially until Ky returns.

Texas Chuck wrote:

cgf wrote:

Texas Chuck wrote:
Yes, but Dallas has to expect them to miss 50 games combined, maybe more. So they need another real option. I love Dwight Powell but he cannot be that guy.

Getting someone to fill in during the regular season doesn't require too much. Just someone like Kornet or Achiuwa.

Yeah, I mean just play Dwight Powell at that point. Kornet works only because of the perimeter players Boston has. Precious is nobody's answer. Knicks are massively better when he is off the court and manage to be negative with him on it despite their perimeter talent. And there is a reason he doesn't play for them in the playoffs.

They need better than that because they are going to be dependent on defense especially until Ky returns.

That's kinda what I was getting at. To make noise in the playoffs you'll need Lively & AD healthy, so would any Powell-upgrade be getting meaningful minutes then? If not, wouldn't you be better off putting your resources into your perimeter players so that if you do have to survive for a game without one of your bigtime centers to keep a series alive, you can get away with some generic 3C like Bryant, Sims, or Achiuwa.

...who actually deputizes pretty well any time he has to fill in for injuries & knows he'll get minutes even if he does something dumb. He made a meaningful contribution to us with the innings that he has eaten over these past two regular seasons; as well as last postseason. It's when he's just getting a couple of minutes...like he has been with Towns & Robinson healthy...that he's just an abomination.


Just trying to say that although I like Gafford a lot, if he could get you a significant perimeter piece who would play meaningful minutes even when both Lively & AD are healthy, that could make you a stronger team even if it meant persevering through 400-600 minutes from some JAG, whether that's Powell or someone else.

But I think I'm a little more comfortable with dealing with an injury prone player like Robinson / AD / KP, and just planning around their availability, than most. So that could be a me thing.

EDIT:
Have you ran any smallball lineups with PJ at the 5? I always liked the idea and that could be a nice hedge against going cheap on that 3C...especially now that you have Flagg who should be able to play both forward spots.

Yes Dallas needs perimeter help. And yes they should be willing to use Gafford or Washington to go get it. But they would also need to backfill center if they trade Gafford. And they have to make the playoffs. And without Kyrie to start the season, they can't go replacement level at center with AD/Lively gtd to miss games too. Already have subpar options at SG, can't have 3 positions that weak.

Texas Chuck wrote:Yes Dallas needs perimeter help. And yes they should be willing to use Gafford or Washington to go get it. But they would also need to backfill center if they trade Gafford. And they have to make the playoffs. And without Kyrie to start the season, they can't go replacement level at center with AD/Lively gtd to miss games too. Already have subpar options at SG, can't have 3 positions that weak.

What if a Gafford trade got you a good SG like DDV? Not proposing that specific trade, just using him as an example of a good-starter / great-backup caliber player...kinda like Gafford...at a position of bigger need.

And is there still a ton of pressure to make the playoffs next year? Doesn't Flagg kinda buy the organization a year even if they can't rally once Kyrie is back? I can imagine the feeling on the ground going either way on that one, as it would totally make sense for the frustration over Luka to be so strong that even the euphoria over Flagg might not offset it.

PG is priority one. Christie/Klay would be nice to upgrade, but right now PG is a 2-way guy and nobody.

Texas Chuck wrote:PG is priority one. Christie/Klay would be nice to upgrade, but right now PG is a 2-way guy and nobody.

Let's say Coby White instead of Donte then. Coby can fill in while Kyrie is out and when he's locked in, defend well enough to play next to Kyrie if you can get healthy for the playoffs...especially with a Flagg - AD - Lively & PJ frontcourt.