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Cavs fell apart once again in the playoffs. Team is mentally weak and needs an overhaul. Mobley and Mitchell are two good guys to build around but wveryone else is expendable

Post your best suggestion for the cavs without trading mobley or mitchell. In order to make them an actual contender not a good regular season team

This feels redundant with the existing Allen thread and the existing Garland thread. But I guess if people have ideas just around the margins, maybe they weren't already covered there?

My thoughts are twofold: The Cavs need a competent backup center to give us 5 minutes a half in the playoffs because if Mobley is unable to play, Allen gets worn out. Opponents pin him between their center and a wing with size on the boards, when he's already fatigued, that's fatal.

Other than that don't worry about seedlings or home court advantage. That's a fool's game. Both Garland and Mitchell aggravated existing injuries that never fully healed. With the benefit of hindsight playing them during that mini slump in March due to the No. 1 seed being in jeopardy was foolish. If your opponent is healthy and you're not, that's going to matter a lot more than the location of a hypothetical game 7.

I'm not 100% opposed to a trade (although Mitchell being so outspoken for his fondness of Cleveland makes trading him difficult), I just see very few proposals that don't result in the Cavs being considerably worse.

I think they'd be foolish to rock the boat.

Improve depth with minor tweaks, but otherwise run it back. Injuries hurt them for a couple of games, as did some poor end of game close out.

But let's not overreact. They significantly outperformed their regular season expectations and unfortunately didn't play their best + had some poor injury luck in the 2nd round.

They have had injuries. But they also haven't looked like a team ready for deep playoff runs. Not sure why its being considered so unlikely they could improve their playoff chances trading one of the big 4. I'd want my team to be open to anything. And I'd realize my fandom makes me value the guys I have more than guys I currently don't have so I wouldn't automatically believe every proposed deal makes my team considerably worse.

I mean if Mobley/Mitchell are who they are being claimed to be, then you shouldn't even be able to get considerably worse trading one or both of Garland/Allen for better fitting win now pieces, right?

And if they aren't then nothing around the margins is going to help, and that's without getting into the payroll issues that is going to bleed depth making improving in that fashion very very difficult.

IDK, if my goal is a championship, I am exploring hard all options, and probably meaning Garland gets moved.

I can't put my finger on it. Last year everyone blamed the coach and subsequently, he got fired. Was it coaching this year as well? Seems like mostly the problems was with injuries.

What member of the core four is the weak link? Darius?

So hard to put together a 60 win team, I wouldn't change anything other than at the margins.

I've always been on the camp that the Cavs wouldn't be a true contender unless they addressed their limitations. Atkins has worked wonders, but come playoff time, these things get exposed. If they can get good value for one of their core pieces (preferrably not Mobley) I'd consider moving them to get better wings and more depth and cap flexibility.

Just posted this in trade Garland thread:

Garland and either Strus or Okoro (works as two separate deals so whichever is needed)
for
HerbJ, Murray
maybe #7? Don't think it is needed really.

For CLE, bigger pg and great wing defense it needs.
Murray/Mitchell/HJones/Allen/Mobley

For NO, playmaker that can get more out of team.
Garland/CJ/Murphy/Zion/Missi

LarsV8 wrote:So hard to put together a 60 win team, I wouldn't change anything other than at the margins.

This core has flopped in the playoffs everytime. Just hoping it gets better isnt a valid strategy

1) Poke Milwaukee about a Giannis deal. I would do Mobley + Allen for Giannis, but getting a 3rd/4th team in the mix isn't straightforward.

2) Test the market on Garland. They would need 85% of Garland as the team showed how desperate they are for a Mike Conley-esque floor general and tempo commander.

3) Strus is a bit undersized next to Garland/Mobley, can they swap him for someone and start Hunter instead?

Struss for Goga+25

Cleveland can send a 2nd or cash to a 3rd team if Orlando needs to send small matching salary.
Cleveland adds a competent back-up center and picks up a late 1st.
Orlando adds a good guard who fits the next 3-4 years. Could be part of a larger Orlando Magic deal.

Presser wrote:

LarsV8 wrote:So hard to put together a 60 win team, I wouldn't change anything other than at the margins.

This core has flopped in the playoffs everytime. Just hoping it gets better isnt a valid strategy

Disagree, find out what went wrong, come up with new approaches, adapt.

You don't accidently win 60+

There is variance in the day to day outcomes.

Seem so many dumb examples of teams making this mistake, have a good thing, over tinker, and end up in a worse situation.

Xman wrote:Just posted this in trade Garland thread:

Garland and either Strus or Okoro (works as two separate deals so whichever is needed)
for
HerbJ, Murray
maybe #7? Don't think it is needed really.

For CLE, bigger pg and great wing defense it needs.
Murray/Mitchell/HJones/Allen/Mobley

For NO, playmaker that can get more out of team.
Garland/CJ/Murphy/Zion/Missi

See, this is the type of trade where I think the Cavs would be considerably worse afterwards. Murray hasn't even been solid, on either end of the court, since leaving San Antonio. He benefited greatly from playing next to Derrick White on defense and from being given a green light on a bad team on offense. He's been bad.

Herb Jones is an upgrade over Okoro but I question whether he could even start in a lineup that had Allen and Murray. Someone has to go to the bench or your spacing would be atrocious. Value aside, there's just no reason for the Cavs to consider anything like this.

ReggiesKnicks wrote:1) Poke Milwaukee about a Giannis deal. I would do Mobley + Allen for Giannis, but getting a 3rd/4th team in the mix isn't straightforward.

2) Test the market on Garland. They would need 85% of Garland as the team showed how desperate they are for a Mike Conley-esque floor general and tempo commander.

3) Strus is a bit undersized next to Garland/Mobley, can they swap him for someone and start Hunter instead?

Struss for Goga+25

Cleveland can send a 2nd or cash to a 3rd team if Orlando needs to send small matching salary.
Cleveland adds a competent back-up center and picks up a late 1st.
Orlando adds a good guard who fits the next 3-4 years. Could be part of a larger Orlando Magic deal.

I think Cleveland and Orlando could be good trade partners. To expand on your trade, I think a Garland+Strus for Goga+Jalen Suggs+filler framework works.

Garland and Strus help Orlando with their shooting, Goga and Jalen help with Cavs' weaknesses (backup C and backcourt defense).

I agree with the sentiment that Cleveland does not need to rush into kneejerk roster shakeups. Jerome, Merrill, Okoro, Wade, Strus, who makes sense to keep around, who leaves this summer on their own, and can Cleveland find some better fitting pieces?

Toine85 wrote:

ReggiesKnicks wrote:1) Poke Milwaukee about a Giannis deal. I would do Mobley + Allen for Giannis, but getting a 3rd/4th team in the mix isn't straightforward.

2) Test the market on Garland. They would need 85% of Garland as the team showed how desperate they are for a Mike Conley-esque floor general and tempo commander.

3) Strus is a bit undersized next to Garland/Mobley, can they swap him for someone and start Hunter instead?

Struss for Goga+25

Cleveland can send a 2nd or cash to a 3rd team if Orlando needs to send small matching salary.
Cleveland adds a competent back-up center and picks up a late 1st.
Orlando adds a good guard who fits the next 3-4 years. Could be part of a larger Orlando Magic deal.

I think Cleveland and Orlando could be good trade partners. To expand on your trade, I think a Garland+Strus for Goga+Jalen Suggs+filler framework works.

Garland and Strus help Orlando with their shooting, Goga and Jalen help with Cavs' weaknesses (backup C and backcourt defense).

This doesn't really help Cleveland. Cleveland's issue is they need the floor general and someone to command the offense, Suggs doesn't do that while Garland does.

Garland for LeBron. The King returns home for one last hurrah, and the Lakers get a player on Luka's timeline as part of their new Luka-oriented direction.

ReggiesKnicks wrote:

Toine85 wrote:

ReggiesKnicks wrote:1) Poke Milwaukee about a Giannis deal. I would do Mobley + Allen for Giannis, but getting a 3rd/4th team in the mix isn't straightforward.

2) Test the market on Garland. They would need 85% of Garland as the team showed how desperate they are for a Mike Conley-esque floor general and tempo commander.

3) Strus is a bit undersized next to Garland/Mobley, can they swap him for someone and start Hunter instead?

Struss for Goga+25

Cleveland can send a 2nd or cash to a 3rd team if Orlando needs to send small matching salary.
Cleveland adds a competent back-up center and picks up a late 1st.
Orlando adds a good guard who fits the next 3-4 years. Could be part of a larger Orlando Magic deal.

I think Cleveland and Orlando could be good trade partners. To expand on your trade, I think a Garland+Strus for Goga+Jalen Suggs+filler framework works.

Garland and Strus help Orlando with their shooting, Goga and Jalen help with Cavs' weaknesses (backup C and backcourt defense).

This doesn't really help Cleveland. Cleveland's issue is they need the floor general and someone to command the offense, Suggs doesn't do that while Garland does.

That's where my thoughts went, one step forward, two steps back. If Cleveland is open to moving Garland, they would expect someone who can create coming back, and I just don't see them realistically getting a worthwhile piece in return.

jowglenn wrote:Garland for LeBron. The King returns home for one last hurrah, and the Lakers get a player on Luka's timeline as part of their new Luka-oriented direction.

It's not legal and I really don't want a 41 year old LBJ back on a $50+M deal.