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Anthony (2yr 26M) + KCP (2yr 43M) + Carter Jr (4yr 69M) for Klay (2yr 34M) + Gafford (1yr 14M) + Martin (3yr 29M) + Powell (1y 4M)

Why for ORL?

Improve outside shooting from KCP to Klay. Swot Carter Jr to Gafford to reduce long time capital commitment to allow more space to re-sign Banchero, while remains competitive in the frontcourt. Trading away Anthony allow more playing time for Black to develop as the first guard off the bench, and ultimately starts together with Suggs.

Suggs/Klay/Wagner/Banchero/Gafford
Black/Martin/Da Silva/Isaac/Bitadze

Why for DAL?

Improve perimeter defense from Klay to KCP. Stabilize the C position with Carter Jr, who has the ability to start, given the long injury histories of AD and Lively. Reduce logjam in the forward position while adding a guard.

Irving/KCP/Cooper/AD/Lively
Anthony/Max/Marshall/PJ/Carter Jr

I’d do it for ORL…Gafford is my target, Klay at $15m is nice, but incidental. ORL should still be looking for a PG and Klay might have to be 6th man…hoping he can accept that role.

I like KCP for DAL…He’s a solid player and, if they want defense - he’s a savage. Just a redundant and expensive signing for ORL but a very good player. WCJ is a much better fit with AD and Lively, imo.

This trade would have made more sense when Luka was here, not really now. KCP is not the guy for Dallas. The last thing they need to do is continue with the soon-to-be-retired tour of Over the Hill exhibits.

A swap around KLay for Cole should be the only talking point

I think this is a really big move, and KCP and WCJ do make some sense for Dallas. WCJ should bounce back and I assume Gafford is looking at a similar contract to him after next season? If not more?

So if Dallas could turn around and trade Hardy/Cole for a scoring guard, or tax relief to sign Chris Paul or Tyus? I guess. And then Orlando needs to dump some salary to get under the tax and find a scoring guard of their own?

Like the pieces of this trade for both teams though so guess you do it and then make the trade both teams actually need to make after it.

sorry i really see no point at all for magic to do this..nothing there kind of awful garbage

orlando_joe wrote:sorry i really see no point at all for magic to do this..nothing there kind of awful garbage

ORL is dead last on 3 point shooting.

orlando_joe wrote:sorry i really see no point at all for magic to do this..nothing there kind of awful garbage

Yep Orlando has so much recent success they couldn't benefit from 3 guys who have all recently played major roles on Finals teams. Garbage players.

As to the OP, I'd simplify it a bit, but there is something to Gafford/Klay for KCP/something minor.

Michaellam1987 wrote:

orlando_joe wrote:sorry i really see no point at all for magic to do this..nothing there kind of awful garbage

ORL is dead last on 3 point shooting.

well lets see wcj 3 yrs for 45 and then TEAM option over 1 yr gafford then want to be paid really just a backup never played much more then 20 min for reason i take wcj
klay older cant guard can not run off screens like he use to will only get worse may give up more then helps i keep kcp great defense and believe his shooting bounces back with healthy team ..i for sure see how others may see different
then even cole expiring contract with TEAM option over martin 3 yrs

i do not see a single win for magic? or really even a need just bla to me

its almost like a dump ,do not sign gafford,pay martin 3rd yr 10 mill instead of wcj 20? its ugly

other ways to get 3pt shooting

orlando_joe wrote:

Michaellam1987 wrote:

orlando_joe wrote:sorry i really see no point at all for magic to do this..nothing there kind of awful garbage

ORL is dead last on 3 point shooting.

well lets see wcj 3 yrs for 45 and then TEAM option over 1 yr gafford then want to be paid really just a backup never played much more then 20 min for reason i take wcj
klay older cant guard can not run off screens like he use to will only get worse may give up more then helps i keep kcp great defense and believe his shooting bounces back with healthy team ..i for sure see how others may see different
then even cole expiring contract with TEAM option over martin 3 yrs

i do not see a single win for magic? or really even a need just bla to me

its almost like a dump ,do not sign gafford,pay martin 3rd yr 10 mill instead of wcj 20? its ugly

other ways to get 3pt shooting

If you see so highly of WCJ, then may be we are not on the same page, 10M deal for him, that is great, but then around 20M for 3 more year (yes, last year being TO), not so much. ORL is on significant cap problem very soon, once they resign Banchero to max contract. Good luck if you want to keep for every one, and paying 20M plus for all 5 position.

orlando_joe wrote:sorry i really see no point at all for magic to do this..nothing there kind of awful garbage

Agreed. Seems pointless for them.

If Dallas is trying to compete, Klay is currently a huge need. He's the best shooter/spacer by a wide margin. I don't understand why the Mavs are including him in a win-now trade. Lively/AD/Flagg/PJ/Marshall/Gafford/Christie...what would you say are the biggest shortcomings of that group?

Michaellam1987 wrote:

orlando_joe wrote:

Michaellam1987 wrote:
ORL is dead last on 3 point shooting.

well lets see wcj 3 yrs for 45 and then TEAM option over 1 yr gafford then want to be paid really just a backup never played much more then 20 min for reason i take wcj
klay older cant guard can not run off screens like he use to will only get worse may give up more then helps i keep kcp great defense and believe his shooting bounces back with healthy team ..i for sure see how others may see different
then even cole expiring contract with TEAM option over martin 3 yrs

i do not see a single win for magic? or really even a need just bla to me

its almost like a dump ,do not sign gafford,pay martin 3rd yr 10 mill instead of wcj 20? its ugly

other ways to get 3pt shooting

If you see so highly of WCJ, then may be we are not on the same page, 10M deal for him, that is great, but then around 20M for 3 more year (yes, last year being TO), not so much. ORL is on significant cap problem very soon, once they resign Banchero to max contract. Good luck if you want to keep for every one, and paying 20M plus for all 5 position.

so you do see this as dump for magic ? because gafford will cost as much maybe more with longer term..if you do not pay him magic will need starting center....and then paying martin 2 yrs on top of it...crazy bad..lol

so selling point is save 10 mill in 3 seasons and go with no starting center for 2 of them?

Astaluego wrote:If Dallas is trying to compete, Klay is currently a huge need. He's the best shooter/spacer by a wide margin. I don't understand why the Mavs are including him in a win-now trade. Lively/AD/Flagg/PJ/Marshall/Gafford/Christie...what would you say are the biggest shortcomings of that group?

I don't like this trade. WCJ gets badly overrated for reasons I've never quite understood.

But KCP would be the shooting replacement for Klay. Dallas doesn't really lose shooting in the trade. And not sure why you left him out of the Dallas rotation? He would be the starting SG from day 1.

The trade I want to see between these two teams is a deal centered around AD for Suggs. Something to the effect of AD/Hardy for Suggs/KCP/Howard/Picks. But I'd imagine its too big of a move for both teams to be realistic

daoneandonly wrote:The trade I want to see between these two teams is a deal centered around AD for Suggs. Something to the effect of AD/Hardy for Suggs/KCP/Howard/Picks. But I'd imagine its too big of a move for both teams to be realistic

This one we fully agree on. No matter what contracts Orlando wants to dump on Dallas as part of it. Dallas can trade some of their guys to a third/fourth team if needed.

jayjaysee wrote:

daoneandonly wrote:The trade I want to see between these two teams is a deal centered around AD for Suggs. Something to the effect of AD/Hardy for Suggs/KCP/Howard/Picks. But I'd imagine its too big of a move for both teams to be realistic

This one we fully agree on. No matter what contracts Orlando wants to dump on Dallas as part of it. Dallas can trade some of their guys to a third/fourth team if needed.

Yea I would be overjoyed with it. I'm sure Dallas could then use KCP or Klay to get a guard who can fill in while Ky is out. Younger, more balanced, and picks, everything the team should be looking for.

daoneandonly wrote:

jayjaysee wrote:

daoneandonly wrote:The trade I want to see between these two teams is a deal centered around AD for Suggs. Something to the effect of AD/Hardy for Suggs/KCP/Howard/Picks. But I'd imagine its too big of a move for both teams to be realistic

This one we fully agree on. No matter what contracts Orlando wants to dump on Dallas as part of it. Dallas can trade some of their guys to a third/fourth team if needed.

Yea I would be overjoyed with it. I'm sure Dallas could then use KCP or Klay to get a guard who can fill in while Ky is out. Younger, more balanced, and picks, everything the team should be looking for.

Bit different.. I would be enjoying Williams/Hardy/Flagg leading the offense to 10 wins and keeping Suggs/Ky on the bench as long as they are willing..

jayjaysee wrote:

daoneandonly wrote:

jayjaysee wrote:
This one we fully agree on. No matter what contracts Orlando wants to dump on Dallas as part of it. Dallas can trade some of their guys to a third/fourth team if needed.

Yea I would be overjoyed with it. I'm sure Dallas could then use KCP or Klay to get a guard who can fill in while Ky is out. Younger, more balanced, and picks, everything the team should be looking for.

Bit different.. I would be enjoying Williams/Hardy/Flagg leading the offense to 10 wins and keeping Suggs/Ky on the bench as long as they are willing..

Ha you really do want to tank don't you?

daoneandonly wrote:

jayjaysee wrote:

daoneandonly wrote:
Yea I would be overjoyed with it. I'm sure Dallas could then use KCP or Klay to get a guard who can fill in while Ky is out. Younger, more balanced, and picks, everything the team should be looking for.

Bit different.. I would be enjoying Williams/Hardy/Flagg leading the offense to 10 wins and keeping Suggs/Ky on the bench as long as they are willing..

Ha you really do want to tank don't you?

Yeah. If Kyrie wasn’t hurt, I’d be posting Dame+ for Kyrie deals. The team should take advantage of this opportunity

If you’re not tanking, I just think the team should double down and go get Durant? Enjoy a 1-3 year window of actual contention “if everyone is healthy”.. bring Flagg in to a good environment, etc. then retool when AD/Kyrie have actually declined. If you have KD, I assume you can get one of Chris Paul or Tyus to come around? That’s a real contender if Kyrie comes back right. And once KD has declined and AD/Kyrie are declining, you know if Flagg has developed into a two way star to build around or not.

If you’re trading a top 20 (whether it’s top 20 in AD or top 3 in Luka…) and you have the ability to do a real rebuild.. you should?

Kyrie/Suggs/Flagg/Boozer/Lively is a group that Dallas fans could actually hype up though..

daoneandonly wrote:The trade I want to see between these two teams is a deal centered around AD for Suggs. Something to the effect of AD/Hardy for Suggs/KCP/Howard/Picks. But I'd imagine its too big of a move for both teams to be realistic

I don’t think that would work for Orlando. The teams biggest shortcoming is the weak backcourt so I can’t see them trading their two best guards, even with the disappointing season KCP is the second best guard on the roster, for an upgrade at center. That’s not even factoring in that AD doesn’t like playing that position and prefers PF.