RealGM

White to Houston

FVV + Tate + most favorable of Bky, Hou, Pho 2027 first to Boston

Houston is all in and White is a perfect replacement for FVV

Boston has FVV to rehab with Tatum and get ready for next year while picking up a blue chip asset

I thought this would be Coby White and thought it was a crazy overpay lol

But I actually kind of like this for both teams. Boston might try to thread the needle and try to get a top 5 pick to add to Tatum and brown next year which could be their best move going forward.

Not enough outgoing salary for houston. Also needs one more pick imo

This feels short for Boston. They would be paying FVV $50M (though if you factor in the pro-rated amount Houston would have already paid before Dec 15 its probably closer to $41-42M??) for essentially 1 year of play for a 32 yr old coming off an ACL injury. Thats in addition to giving up a valuable player in White who still has 2 years + a PO on his deal after this season. I dont think 1 draft pick -- even a potentially very valuable one -- covers that delta.

schaffy wrote:This feels short for Boston. They would be paying FVV $50M (though if you factor in the pro-rated amount Houston would have already paid before Dec 15 its probably closer to $41-42M??) for essentially 1 year of play for a 32 yr old coming off an ACL injury. Thats in addition to giving up a valuable player in White who still has 2 years + a PO on his deal after this season. I dont think 1 draft pick -- even a potentially very valuable one -- covers that delta.

My thought is if it's 1 pick it has to be a REALLY good one, and I think best of 3 including two teams that I would expect to be in the lottery would be enough. You could also add in a pick in 2029.

I do agree you have to view FVV as a bad contract.

FVV is not a bad contract.

He is a good player and appropriately paid. he just has a dead year due to injury, which Boston is dealing with anyway w/ Tatum.

He will fit right in with Boston next year.

LarsV8 wrote:FVV is not a bad contract.

He is a good player and appropriately paid. he just has a dead year due to injury, which Boston is dealing with anyway w/ Tatum.

He will fit right in with Boston next year.

This is denial. He has 2 years left on his deal. He's out injured for one of them and most guys usually are lesser versions of themselves in year 1 back from injury so that second year is questionable too for a guy who will be 32 and is a small guard (usually not an archetype that ages well even absent injury). It sucks that it happened like it did but he's now absolutely one million percent a bad contract and you should accept that.

hugepatsfan wrote:

LarsV8 wrote:FVV is not a bad contract.

He is a good player and appropriately paid. he just has a dead year due to injury, which Boston is dealing with anyway w/ Tatum.

He will fit right in with Boston next year.

This is denial. He has 2 years left on his deal. He's out injured for one of them and most guys usually are lesser versions of themselves in year 1 back from injury so that second year is questionable too for a guy who will be 32 and is a small guard (usually not an archetype that ages well even absent injury). It sucks that it happened like it did but he's now absolutely one million percent a bad contract and you should accept that.

Yeah, I mean 50% of the contract is now worthless, and the 2nd year he is basically a good expiring because nobody knows how he will bounce back from injury. It's not some awful toxic contract, but it's certainly a negative asset.

In the trade OP proposed I would think Boston needs more, at least another pick.

I think it’s light for Boston. Need to include a better player and another pick to get white.

Wouldn't Memphis out bid them?
Kcp + this year's pics(Phoenix)
4 white
Or Atlanta
Kennard, zach risa+ this year's pics(noa)
4
White

I think a bigger question is why would Boston trade White? He is arguably a top 30 player on a team friendly contract and he is not old.
Boston hopes to contend when Tatum is back.
I don’t see why they would move White. They could not replacement him.

brackdan70 wrote:I think a bigger question is why would Boston trade White? He is arguably a top 30 player on a team friendly contract and he is not old.
Boston hopes to contend when Tatum is back.
I don’t see why they would move White. They could not replacement him.

He'll be 32 in October. He's not exactly young. I could definitely see him trailing off by the end of the deal. I'd still ask for another 1st because FVV was pretty mediocre before the injury and I don't buy that he'll be easily moved next summer.

jbk1234 wrote:

brackdan70 wrote:I think a bigger question is why would Boston trade White? He is arguably a top 30 player on a team friendly contract and he is not old.
Boston hopes to contend when Tatum is back.
I don’t see why they would move White. They could not replacement him.

He'll be 32 in October. He's not exactly young. I could definitely see him trailing off by the end of the deal. I'd still ask for another 1st because FVV was pretty mediocre before the injury and I don't buy that he'll be easily moved next summer.

Actually, Derrick White turned 31 on July 2nd. He's not going to have a birthday in October. He's a relatively young 31 though because he was in the 2017 draft at 23 yrs old, and just hasn't played a ton of NBA minutes for a player of 31 years.

With all the players taken off the roster, White will probably have a lot more shots, assists, etc this year without Jrue, KP, Tatum, etc -- will be interesting to see if his efficiency or defense tails off given more responsibility in the offense

jbk1234 wrote:

brackdan70 wrote:I think a bigger question is why would Boston trade White? He is arguably a top 30 player on a team friendly contract and he is not old.
Boston hopes to contend when Tatum is back.
I don’t see why they would move White. They could not replacement him.

He'll be 32 in October. He's not exactly young. I could definitely see him trailing off by the end of the deal. I'd still ask for another 1st because FVV was pretty mediocre before the injury and I don't buy that he'll be easily moved next summer.

He will be 32 next July. Yeah he is not young but he has the type of game that should age well. He will be 34 the last (4th) year of his contract ( a player option).
Celtics have him for age 31,32,33 and the PO at 34. I wouldn’t expect too much decline there.
If for some reason the did want to trade him I think they need two decent picks and a good young player that can contribute now.
Van fleet and Tate don’t do anything for the Celtics.

That may be the most valuable pick on the market with the Nets likely to be an affront to basketball for a while, and the Suns a couple steps above that, and I think it should yield a better player than White... but he's such a good fit with that Rockets team that I like this anyway.

If the Celtics are serious about just bottoming out, resetting the lux tax, they should do this and flip FVV for a smaller contract they can stretch.

FVV is effectively deadweight at this point, he's not playing this year, and 32-year-old sub-6-foot guards who were already on the inefficient side, generally don't bounce back that well, so if you're even getting quality rotation level play out of him in 2026-27, it's a bonus.

The idea I have in mind is Josh Green + NSJ for VanVleet, and Boston stretches the remaining $28M on Green over 5 years. So White's $28M becomes roughly $10-11M immediately, bringing the Celtics a couple million under the luxury tax line factoring in Green's dead salary and the small salaries of NSJ and Tate. On Charlotte's side, I don't hate rolling the dice that FVV plays like a $10M backup PG in 2026-27, and having an already rostered plan B at backup PG if Sexton walks in FA. He's savvy enough that he might be able to get by playing less than 100%. and if not, he's a big expiring at the same time as Miles Bridges and Grant Williams... but this idea works with any team with a 2-year contract to a completely unserviceable player.

HornetJail wrote:That may be the most valuable pick on the market with the Nets likely to be an affront to basketball for a while, and the Suns a couple steps above that, and I think it should yield a better player than White... but he's such a good fit with that Rockets team that I like this anyway.

If the Celtics are serious about just bottoming out, resetting the lux tax, they should do this and flip FVV for a smaller contract they can stretch.

FVV is effectively deadweight at this point, he's not playing this year, and 32-year-old sub-6-foot guards who were already on the inefficient side, generally don't bounce back that well, so if you're even getting quality rotation level play out of him in 2026-27, it's a bonus.

The idea I have in mind is Josh Green + NSJ for VanVleet, and Boston stretches the remaining $28M on Green over 5 years. So White's $28M becomes roughly $10-11M immediately, bringing the Celtics a couple million under the luxury tax line factoring in Green's dead salary and the small salaries of NSJ and Tate. On Charlotte's side, I don't hate rolling the dice that FVV plays like a $10M backup PG in 2026-27, and having an already rostered plan B at backup PG if Sexton walks in FA. He's savvy enough that he might be able to get by playing less than 100%. and if not, he's a big expiring at the same time as Miles Bridges and Grant Williams... but this idea works with any team with a 2-year contract to a completely unserviceable player.

It's a long ways away, but the 27 draft is currently projected to be Anthony Bennett level bad. I don't think that pick two years out gets you a player better than White.

No reason for Boston to consider this.

jbk1234 wrote:

HornetJail wrote:That may be the most valuable pick on the market with the Nets likely to be an affront to basketball for a while, and the Suns a couple steps above that, and I think it should yield a better player than White... but he's such a good fit with that Rockets team that I like this anyway.

It's a long ways away, but the 27 draft is currently projected to be Anthony Bennett level bad. I don't think that pick two years out gets you a player better than White.

I don't think OP's idea is strong enough to entice Celts to trade D White, but it's hard to really handicap a draft two years out. We don't know how prospects are going to look this far out. Even if 2027 was as bad as 2013, there are still going to be opportunities for KCP, CJ McCollum, Victor Oladipo, types in the lottery.

With the Jays both on supermaxes, if the Celtics could draft a fifth starter - seventh man type who'd be making $6 - $12 per yr over a rookie contract that then frees up the rest of Derrick's $35 million for Brad to allot that money towards a starting center

redslastlaugh wrote:

jbk1234 wrote:

HornetJail wrote:That may be the most valuable pick on the market with the Nets likely to be an affront to basketball for a while, and the Suns a couple steps above that, and I think it should yield a better player than White... but he's such a good fit with that Rockets team that I like this anyway.

It's a long ways away, but the 27 draft is currently projected to be Anthony Bennett level bad. I don't think that pick two years out gets you a player better than White.

I don't think OP's idea is strong enough to entice Celts to trade D White, but it's hard to really handicap a draft two years out. We don't know how prospects are going to look this far out. Even if 2027 was as bad as 2013, there are still going to be opportunities for KCP, CJ McCollum, Victor Oladipo, types in the lottery.

With the Jays both on supermaxes, if the Celtics could draft a fifth starter - seventh man type who'd be making $6 - $12 per yr over a rookie contract that then frees up the rest of Derrick's $35 million for Brad to allot that money towards a starting center

My thought is that pick, with a best of 3 swap, including 2 likely bad teams is SOOO good it's worth it. It's not crazy to think that has a 35% of being top 4 and a 10% of being #1 overall. Now, obviously it could also easily end up in the 10-15 range.

I generally don't buy the good v. bad draft rankings, particularly two years out. I think it's draft-heads creating narratives for draft-heads to read and doesn't have a lot of connection to the real world. Except that I think it's fair to say there isn't a Wemby/Lebron level prospect... but that's most drafts.

That said, I'm a Celtics fan, so I'd be more than happy to get more in the deal. I'm curious what people think it would take for the Celtics to say yes.

Golabki wrote:

redslastlaugh wrote:

jbk1234 wrote:
It's a long ways away, but the 27 draft is currently projected to be Anthony Bennett level bad. I don't think that pick two years out gets you a player better than White.

I don't think OP's idea is strong enough to entice Celts to trade D White, but it's hard to really handicap a draft two years out. We don't know how prospects are going to look this far out. Even if 2027 was as bad as 2013, there are still going to be opportunities for KCP, CJ McCollum, Victor Oladipo, types in the lottery.

With the Jays both on supermaxes, if the Celtics could draft a fifth starter - seventh man type who'd be making $6 - $12 per yr over a rookie contract that then frees up the rest of Derrick's $35 million for Brad to allot that money towards a starting center

My thought is that pick, with a best of 3 swap, including 2 likely bad teams is SOOO good it's worth it. It's not crazy to think that has a 35% of being top 4 and a 10% of being #1 overall. Now, obviously it could also easily end up in the 10-15 range.

I generally don't buy the good v. bad draft rankings, particularly two years out. I think it's draft-heads creating narratives for draft-heads to read and doesn't have a lot of connection to the real world. Except that I think it's fair to say there isn't a Wemby/Lebron level prospect... but that's most drafts.

That said, I'm a Celtics fan, so I'd be more than happy to get more in the deal. I'm curious what people think it would take for the Celtics to say yes.

According to Bobby Marks, the Celtics would demand a "Desmond Bane-plus" offer for Derrick White.

https://www.nbcsportsboston.com/nba/boston-celtics/video-bobby-marks-derrick-white-trade-desmond-bane-plus-offer/715063

It was also reported that the Celtics laughed at a package offered by Toronto that included the 9th pick in the last draft.

https://sports.yahoo.com/article/celtics-trade-rumors-boston-laughed-195340239.html

So Fred Van Vleet, Jae'Sean Tate, and one first rounder has no hope of being accepted by Boston. They want to keep him.