Detroit/New Orleans

[louc1970]

New Orleans decides to get younger current All-Star and start building.
Detroit gets a shooter and chance to see if a young center can anchor the team.

Detroit via S&T ($35,000,000) Duren/Jenkins/27 FRP
NOP Murphy/Missi

Duren for Murphy, FRP for Missi, Jenkins to make money work

Detroit gets a defensive frontcourt with Thompson, Holland, Murphy.
NOP gets a sub 23 grouping of Duren, Queen, Fears.

[Laimbeer]

I don't know if the money or anything else works but it would be an easy yes for Pistons imo.

[Pipp33]

I don't know if the money or anything else works but it would be an easy yes for Pistons imo.

Agree...and it should be an easy no of Pelicans.

I just don't see Duran worth that sort of money.

[babyjax13]

What about Duren for Zion?

[Billl]

If duren was after $35m, he likely would be signed already.

[jbk1234]

I have Murphy as worth more than Duren at $35M per.

[najb29]

Good trade for both teams. Could add Zion for 2 !st any year that works out Robinson, Hueter and Holland for money to even out.

[davidv2001]

Value wise, it makes perfect sense for the Pistons as Murphy is the better player. However, the starting center market has dried up, and I cannot imagine they would be happy to go into the season with Yves Missi or Paul Reed as their starter or playing small with John Collins at the five.

If you find a way to loop Dallas in and Detroit gets both Murphy and Gafford for Duren +, I think it becomes a lot more palatable for them.

[lordjeff05]

Duren doesnt fit with Zion or Queen so it’s pretty easy no. We’d have traded our best draft asset for a guy who doesnt fit with any of the other guys and traded our teo best assets, Murphy ahd the 27 pick in order to do it so we’d be limited in how to improve the team going forward.

The 27 pick is like a super pick because it’s best of us or MIL and even in a weak draft that has value.

[nykballa2k4]

New Orleans decides to get younger current All-Star and start building.
Detroit gets a shooter and chance to see if a young center can anchor the team.

Detroit via S&T ($35,000,000) Duren/Jenkins/27 FRP
NOP Murphy/Missi

Duren for Murphy, FRP for Missi, Jenkins to make money work

Detroit gets a defensive frontcourt with Thompson, Holland, Murphy.
NOP gets a sub 23 grouping of Duren, Queen, Fears.

Just don't like the fit at the moment. As you mention Queen (they invested quite a bit in him) is a center, can't really play with Duren. It would resemble Greg Monroe and Andre Drummond to some extent. I suppose Dumars was okay with that once, but ...

If I am Detroit, perhaps I just say f-it and fork over Robinson, Holland, and 2 FRP for Murphy? Add in a swap and 2 SRP if it's absolutely needed?

IMO Pelicans needs to tread lightly with Murphy because at 27M he is fair price, but every year he comes closer to a re-sign problem. This is probably his peak trade value.

[YayBasketball]

Duren doesnt fit with Zion or Queen so it’s pretty easy no. We’d have traded our best draft asset for a guy who doesnt fit with any of the other guys and traded our teo best assets, Murphy ahd the 27 pick in order to do it so we’d be limited in how to improve the team going forward.

The 27 pick is like a super pick because it’s best of us or MIL and even in a weak draft that has value.

You misread it. DET is giving up the 27 pick in the OP trade. Still don't like the fit, tho.

[lordjeff05]

Ah, youre right, apologies, but the fit is still really bad.

[Canadafan]

.

If I am Detroit, perhaps I just say f-it and fork over Robinson, Holland, and 2 FRP for Murphy? Add in a swap and 2 SRP if it's absolutely needed?

IMO Pelicans needs to tread lightly with Murphy because at 27M he is fair price, but every year he comes closer to a re-sign problem. This is probably his peak trade value.

Im at that point too. Cade Trey Ausar at the 3 perimeter spots. Damnnn, that some serious length. Treys shooting would make life so much easier for Cade+Duren as well.
Would prefer to keep Holland though.

[nykballa2k4]

.

If I am Detroit, perhaps I just say f-it and fork over Robinson, Holland, and 2 FRP for Murphy? Add in a swap and 2 SRP if it's absolutely needed?

IMO Pelicans needs to tread lightly with Murphy because at 27M he is fair price, but every year he comes closer to a re-sign problem. This is probably his peak trade value.

Im at that point too. Cade Trey Ausar at the 3 perimeter spots. Damnnn, that some serious length. Treys shooting would make life so much easier for Cade+Duren as well.
Would prefer to keep Holland though.

In my mind Holland is the inbetween on an additional FRP. he is a good player, but ultimately a bit of a redundancy.

[YayBasketball]

If I am Detroit, perhaps I just say f-it and fork over Robinson, Holland, and 2 FRP for Murphy? Add in a swap and 2 SRP if it's absolutely needed?

I've heard Detroit already offered that package and possibly more, Weaver/Dumars said 3 FRP plus help rerouting Poole for a starting Center -- or Ausar and picks.

Seems irrational, but they basically want the Bane level overpay offer or they're fine with keeping Murphy into the season. Pels were 'listening' to offers for Trey and Herb but are more engaged on finding a Center for Poole and possibly a protected 1st.

Names like: J. Allen, WCJ, Okongwu, Gafford, Turner have been discussed. But this late in the offseason, seems like Missi will be their starting center going into the season. With Turner or Gafford being some realistic options if they can get a deal done.

[Crymson]

Im at that point too. Cade Trey Ausar at the 3 perimeter spots. Damnnn, that some serious length. Treys shooting would make life so much easier for Cade+Duren as well.
Would prefer to keep Holland though.

Cade started alongside one of the league's best shooters last season. Duncan averaged only about 0.5 less points per game from beyond the arc than Murphy and shot a significantly better percentage on a meaningfully more difficult shot diet. He's better than Trey outside the arc; he's just quite a bit more limited inside it, though Trey is no creator either.

If you want to see Cade's life made easier on offense, you'd need to replace Ausar.

If I am Detroit, perhaps I just say f-it and fork over Robinson, Holland, and 2 FRP for Murphy? Add in a swap and 2 SRP if it's absolutely needed?

You don't say screw it and make that trade unless Murphy is going to put you over the top, and he won't for the Pistons. He's a chiefly off-ball third option, and they don't have even a viable #2. This trade would leave them with one tradeable pick, so it would effectively lock them out of any opportunity for trading for that #2 until at least the draft.

They've got no business making this sort of trade right now.

[nykballa2k4]

Im at that point too. Cade Trey Ausar at the 3 perimeter spots. Damnnn, that some serious length. Treys shooting would make life so much easier for Cade+Duren as well.
Would prefer to keep Holland though.

Cade started alongside one of the league's best shooters last season. Duncan averaged only about 0.5 less points per game from beyond the arc than Murphy and shot a significantly better percentage on a meaningfully more difficult shot diet. He's better than Trey outside the arc; he's just quite a bit more limited inside it, though Trey is no creator either.

If you want to see Cade's life made easier on offense, you'd need to replace Ausar.

If I am Detroit, perhaps I just say f-it and fork over Robinson, Holland, and 2 FRP for Murphy? Add in a swap and 2 SRP if it's absolutely needed?

You don't say screw it and make that trade unless Murphy is going to put you over the top, and he won't for the Pistons. He's a chiefly off-ball third option, and they don't have even a viable #2. This trade would leave them with one tradeable pick, so it would effectively lock them out of any opportunity for trading for that #2 until at least the draft.

They've got no business making this sort of trade right now.

It's really a hedge-your-bet type of trade (my iteration). two picks are within 3 years, Holland is a minor prospect. Right now by not getting better, Pistons risk regressing. Getting Trey solidifies the roster a bit and of course during the season, there will be flexibility to add elsewhere.

[Crymson]

It's really a hedge-your-bet type of trade (my iteration). two picks are within 3 years, Holland is a minor prospect. Right now by not getting better, Pistons risk regressing. Getting Trey solidifies the roster a bit and of course during the season, there will be flexibility to add elsewhere.

I'm pretty sure we'd be looking at three firsts here. Holland is still one of the worst shooters in the league after two seasons. If that hasn't substantively changed after a third season, then he's probably toast in the NBA, and the odds are (speaking in terms of general outcomes) at this point very against him becoming a reliable shooter. I'd wager that other front offices would be hesitant to bet on it from a trade value perspective.

Pistons FO doesn't care about regressing in the standings. This isn't a team that's built to contend right now. It won 60 games last season on the strength of an extremely high compete level, excellent health, a weak schedule, and a style of play that was never going to translate into the postseason, then came a Franz Wagner injury away from probably going out in the first round against a mediocre opponent. It's just not there yet. It was never a 60-win team in the sense of postseason capability.

The FO's moves this summer emphasized systemic improvement (particularly in shooting), development (in maintaining ample opportunities for the youth), and maintenance of flexibility. I know there are plenty of Pistons fans who would prefer that the team just try to win as many games as possible; that's their prerogative, but the FO is focused upon building a contender.

[nykballa2k4]

It's really a hedge-your-bet type of trade (my iteration). two picks are within 3 years, Holland is a minor prospect. Right now by not getting better, Pistons risk regressing. Getting Trey solidifies the roster a bit and of course during the season, there will be flexibility to add elsewhere.

I'm pretty sure we'd be looking at three firsts here. Holland is still one of the worst shooters in the league after two seasons. If that hasn't substantively changed after a third season, then he's probably toast in the NBA, and the odds are (speaking in terms of general outcomes) at this point very against him becoming a reliable shooter. I'd wager that other front offices would be hesitant to bet on it from a trade value perspective.

Pistons FO doesn't care about regressing in the standings. This isn't a team that's built to contend right now. It won 60 games last season on the strength of an extremely high compete level, excellent health, a weak schedule, and a style of play that was never going to translate into the postseason, then came a Franz Wagner injury away from probably going out in the first round against a mediocre opponent. It's just not there yet. It was never a 60-win team in the sense of postseason capability.

The FO's moves this summer emphasized systemic improvement (particularly in shooting), development (in maintaining ample opportunities for the youth), and maintenance of flexibility. I know there are plenty of Pistons fans who would prefer that the team just try to win as many games as possible; that's their prerogative, but the FO is focused upon building a contender.

I don't think I agree with any of your points here.
Maybe agree that Pels could hold for the sake of holding. Wait for a delusional/desperate team to pay Bane/Bridges money for Trey.
I see Holland as a useful POA defender and those have value all over the place. Yes better if they also shoot well, but GPII is doing just that job on the min at age 30 something. If he is able to give Hali, Brunson, Maxey headaches and use 6 smart fouls, there is a role for him. Same is true regarding the guards in the west.

[Crymson]

I don't think I agree with any of your points here.
Maybe agree that Pels could hold for the sake of holding. Wait for a delusional/desperate team to pay Bane/Bridges money for Trey.
I see Holland as a useful POA defender and those have value all over the place. Yes better if they also shoot well, but GPII is doing just that job on the min at age 30 something. If he is able to give Hali, Brunson, Maxey headaches and use 6 smart fouls, there is a role for him. Same is true regarding the guards in the west.

By all accounts, they're just fine keeping him if their price isn't met.

Holland is an excellent PoA defender. But he loses that value, and then some, back on offense. I get your viewpoint, but the game is played on both ends and he's a major negative there. He can't shoot, he can't drive because defenders sag far back and pack the paint, and he makes life harder for his teammates, and that weakness gets more damaging in the postseason. GPII is still in the league, yes, but he's a minimum player for a reason. I'd wager his trade value is somewhere in the realm of nothing. We're talking here about Holland filling in for a FRP.

I get the notion that a player could provide value by being a really good defender, but fact is that non-shooting defensive specialists are almost extinct in today's league because of how much they cost on offense.