What's the price for Kurt Thomas?

[Cowology]

The Pistons right now have a solid 3 man rotation with Sheed, Dice & Maxiell but we could use 1 more end of the bench big. While some people may feel Webber is that piece I'd rather add a veteran defender/enforcer who knows his role. Somebody in that Dale Davis, PJ Brown, Kurt Thomas mold.

So...just how much would it cost to get Kurt Thomas?

The Sonics aren't going anywhere obviously and they wouldn't want to take back any long term salary, but the Pistons could put together enough expirings to make it an even swap (or even save them a pro-rated share of the $1.5 mil difference in salary between Kurt & Hermann, Brezec & Flip). I certainly wouldn't give up a 1st and probably not the Minny 2nd (which is practically a late 1st rounder), but would the Pistons 2nd rounder or the Pistons 2nd + one of the Toronto 2nds owed to us be enough incentive?

Primoz Brezec ($2.8 mil expiring)
Flip Murray ($1.9 mil expiring)
Walter Hermann ($1.9 mil expiring)
Pistons '08 2nd (and possibly '09 Toronto 2nd)

Kurt Thomas ($8.1 mil expiring)

I can't imagine they'd be able to get much better for the guy and if they are just going to let him go after the season anyway they might as well pick up a free 2nd rounder (or two).

From the Pistons perspective it's probably overpaying, but w/ 3 future 2nd rounders owed to us and only so many available roster spots I wouldn't have much of a problem adding 1 more lil piece to the puzzle. If we aren't rebuilding might as well go for it and Kurt showed last year he can still have a defensive impact.

[VintaGe36]

I think that SEA would swap their high 2nd rounder(#35 at the moment IIRC) for a pick in the 20-24 range.

Basically, KT for moving up 10-15 spots or so.

[Cowology]

I think that SEA would swap their high 2nd rounder(#35 at the moment IIRC) for a pick in the 20-24 range.

Basically, KT for moving up 10-15 spots or so.

I really can't see anybody doing that.

And keep in mind the Sonics won't want to take back any salary, so that should limit whatever other teams might be bidding against the Pistons. Who else has $6.5-$8.0 mil worth of expirings and a 2nd rounder they'd be willing to part w/ for Kurt? That's a serious question btw - I really wanna know.

And if you really think there is a team willing to move out of a 1st round pick for the guy I'd love to hear who you think that might be.

[nuke the whales]

I can't imagine they'd be able to get much better for the guy

Depends on how many other teams have the same idea. Seattle has a bunch of 2nd rounders already in the next few years. I'm not sure how much value another one would have.

[Cowology]

Depends on how many other teams have the same idea. Seattle has a bunch of 2nd rounders already in the next few years. I'm not sure how much value another one would have.

Yep, that's just it. I honestly can't see Seattle turning down a free 2nd rounder (whether they need it or not). At worst it's a trade chip they can use down the line or sell off.

The question is who else might potentially get into the action and drive the price up a lil.

[sonictecture]

It is my belief that it has always been the Sonics intent to give Thomas the opportunity to play for a playoff team this year. One way of course is to take advantage of his production and trade him to improve the franchise. The other is to buy him out of his contract and allow him to pick his own team. From a Sonic perspective it is in their best interest to improve the team.

Cowology is willing to give players the Sonics don't need or want and couple of second round picks in a draft where the Sonics will already have (2) first round picks and multiple second round picks.

Playing the role of Sonics GM I would give Orlando a call and let them know of Detroit's interest and see if they would like to counter.

In the end if the offers didn't improve significantly I'd buy Thomas out and let Detroit fight with Boston, Orlando, Cleveland and the Western Conference for Thomas.

Cowology, any willingness to sweeten your offer to keep Thomas away from your competition?

I would be looking for some combination of-

A first round pick or promising prospect. My preference would be a 2009 or later pick. I'm open to the negotiation of protection and the return of a second round pick, but one of my choosing.

The inclusion of an unwanted contract. Watson or Ridnour are at the top of the list.

Cash to cover the buyout of any players that would never suit up for the Sonics this season. For example Flip Murray.

[Cowology]

Cowology, any willingness to sweeten your offer to keep Thomas away from your competition?

Nope.

I don't understand at all why you'd rather buy out Thomas than take back $6.5 in salary (for his $8.0 mil) and a 2nd rounder. The names of the players are meaningless - they are just expirings. And whether you need the 2nd or not they hold value that otherwise would be lost. Nothing is lost by taking them and something is potentially gained.

Frankly I don't understand your position at all, with the exception of contacting other organizations to see what their interest level is. But I wouldn't go higher regardless. IF somebody wants to overpay that is their prerogative. I'd be content enough to roll w/ what we have or give Dale Davis a call.

We're talking about renting an end of the bench bigman for half a season. Nobody is gonna take back a bad contract or give up a 1st for that. It's just not realistic.

[loserX]

Seattle has no reason to move Kurt unless it's worth their while. Taking back crappy expirings and another 2nd rounder (they currently have EIGHT over the next 3 drafts) isn't worth their while.

[Cowology]

Ah well. Guess I'm the only person here who doesn't think that way. To bad.

Time to give Dale a call.

[sonictecture]

Well let's look at what Presti did in 2007 with the Sonics top of the second round picks. He traded them both. A team only has so many resources for player development and the Sonics are already very young.

If the best offer is unwanted players and unwanted picks then the Sonics lose very little by buying Thomas out. They get great PR, make room for younger prospects. And Thomas gets to choose where he wants to play. Boston has a lot of history. Where is Presti from again?

I can envision Thomas as a difference maker for Boston against the Pistons in the playoffs.

[nuke the whales]

Who else has $6.5-$8.0 mil worth of expirings

A quick search brings up Orlando, New Jersey, and Dallas (according to hoopshype Shawn Bradley is still on the books for $5.2 mil this season.) Golden state also has a TPE that could do the job.

And keep in mind the Sonics won't want to take back any salary

I'm not so sure about that. Seattle's big FA push will be in 2009 when Wally Z's contract ends, not this summer. I wouldn't be suprised if they were willing to take a contract that runs through then if the bait was good enough, especially if it meant shipping out Earl Watson.

[Cowology]

Well let's look at what Presti did in 2007 with the Sonics top of the second round picks. He traded them both. A team only has so many resources for player development and the Sonics are already very young.

If the best offer is unwanted players and unwanted picks then the Sonics lose very little by buying Thomas out. They get great PR, make room for younger prospects. And Thomas gets to choose where he wants to play. Boston has a lot of history. Where is Presti from again?

I can envision Thomas as a difference maker for Boston against the Pistons in the playoffs.

I actually think Detroit is the team he'd about the least effective against. We don't have a KG/TD type player for him to match up against defensively. Our bigs are primarily perimeter oriented jump shooters. And even if he did limit Sheed or whoever the Pistons are so balanced I don't think it would particularly matter.

To me he is most valuable against the likes of Boston & SA.

But no biggy; if that is the asking price not really interested. If he wants to sign w/ another team he can knock himself out.

[roc]

Brezec/Murray/Hunter/09 1st/$3 mil for Thomas and the agreement to waive Hunter

I think we wouldn't miss that draft pick much (it will be almost like a 2nd rounder but guaranteed $) and it would help keep him away from a team like Boston that could really give him minutes.

We keep Herrmann and get Hunter back a month later. Just have to cross fingers that an injury doesn't befall Billups and/or Stuckey in the meantime (or at all for that matter).

[Cowology]

Brezec/Murray/Hunter/09 1st/$3 mil for Thomas and the agreement to waive Hunter

I think we wouldn't miss that draft pick much (it will be almost like a 2nd rounder but guaranteed $) and it would help keep him away from a team like Boston that could really give him minutes.

We keep Herrmann and get Hunter back a month later. Just have to cross fingers that an injury doesn't befall Billups and/or Stuckey in the meantime (or at all for that matter).

You want to give up a 1st round pick to rent for 3 months a guy who would be 9th or 10th in our rotation?

That's like giving a Maxiell or Afflalo away. No thank you.

[roc]

You want to give up a 1st round pick to rent for 3 months a guy who would be 9th or 10th in our rotation?

Hell no, just playing 'Devil's Advocate' and running with the keep him away from Boston what would you pay idea.

Joe ain't that dumb as to dish out goods for Big Ben err I mean KT to keep him away from a division rival.

I don't really think we need him at all though, I said a couple months back that I would like Davis back way over Webber. He won't cost squat other than waving Murray or shipping him off for a 2nd rounder if lucky.

[amb1ent]

Lakers need a defensive PF. Haslem would be nice, Thomas is realistic.

Kwame + Crittenton for Thomas and Wilkins has been hashed out over and over again, and seems pretty fair.

[Downtown]

It's been hashed out many times. It boils down to how badly a playoff team values a smart veteran that can defin9itely help them in the playoffs now verus valueing a mid to low twenties first round pick, plain and simple.

You know unless there is a player that Seattle sees as a future piece of their rebuilding team they will hang onto Thomas. So if we're talking about expiring contracts, a first round pick needs to be included otherwise they keep what they have( a buyout so Thomas can pick his team is a classy manner to treat the vet).

There hasn't been any indication that the Sonics want to bail out of some salary immediately, so the Warriors would have to include their first round pick along with the TPE.

The Lakers fans offer of Brown and their first round pick is about as good as I've seen so far.

Like Sonictecture said, the Magic have a number of expiring contracts as well so what makes this Pistons offer special?

[shagadelic45]

Seattle has 14 players under contract, so any 3 or 4 for 1 deals don't work.

The best deal (as mentioned) and originated by myself (patting self on back)
is with the Lakers:

kwame Brown, Sasha Vujacic, #1

for

Kurt Thomas and Damien Wilkins.


Seattle cuts salary and gets a #1, the Lakers upgrade at 2 positions.

[HotSpurs21]

I don't think Kurt will be moved. He'll stay until the end of the season and then he can go anywhere to chase his ring

[HotSpurs21]

Seattle has 14 players under contract, so any 3 or 4 for 1 deals don't work.

The best deal (as mentioned) and originated by myself (patting self on back)
is with the Lakers:

kwame Brown, Sasha Vujacic, #1

for

Kurt Thomas and Damien Wilkins.


Seattle cuts salary and gets a #1, the Lakers upgrade at 2 positions.

Again, I don't see any team willing to give up a #1 for Kurt's rental unless they think Kurt can propel them to win the NBA Finals. It's not like Kurt will be the ONE missing piece to get the Lakers the championship here. Wilkins is a bad fit for the Lakers IMO as well.