lakers - pacers - suns all happy

[warren weel im]

In an eternal quest to add the much needed scorer in the post, LA decides to pitch for JO once more. It is a combo that will supposedly supplant Boston's trio as one of the league's best trios. Yet, the other players in this trade don't make out that bad, In fact, IMO, they get better as a whole as well.

So Indy won't accept Odom for JO. Even with the Lakers offering Kwame in the deal (to cut salary by 9m next year) the Pacers seem hesitant to pull the trigger on a deal that in their words a downgrade from JO to Odom. In all its practicality, Indy refuses to do the said downgrade in spite of Odom fitting the uptempo offense that JOB runs.

Then there's the Odom for Marion talk. Lakers are not interested in this deal since it involves division rivals. Besides, in the last 2 playoff series, Odom has owned Marion to a reasonable extent. However, the reality of it, Marion has fallen nothing short of an all-star (even in his discontent) and Odom has been, well, Odom.

On the ironic side, Odom fits Phoenix very well. He runs, he guns and he carries the ball as if he was 6'3. In this manner, he might just be able to relieve Nash's burdens while not commanding the attention that Marion seeks. Amare and Diaw will be utilized as PF and C interchangeably and Phoenix will have a more balanced team as supposed to this high-octane offense but leaving little on the bench.

The Proposal:

Since we'd have to make the salaries match, here is my shot at this ultra-super-mega deal.

Jermaine O'neal to the Lakers.
Jeff Foster to the Lakers.

Lamar Odom to Phoenix.
Sasha Vujacic to Phoenix.

Shawn Marion to Indiana.
Kwame Brown to Indiana.

The essence remains - contention for LA, balance and flexibility for Phoenix, re-tooling for a consistent uptempo main man. This time, I don't think Indiana can complain about such a downgrade. If anything, they're getting an upgrade from an overpaid FC that does not fit the system anymore.

[VintaGe36]

NOT.A.CHANCE LAL Gets Foster and Oneal for Odom and Brown.

Marion > Odom

WAYY Too good for LAL.

[Scoot McGroot]

Without judging this exact deal, I just have one thing.


The Pacers are more than ok with getting Odom. He's a solid player, could contribute in JO's absence, and would have some value around the league that we could trade him again for.

However, we are opposed to essentially a straight up trade of JO for Odom. To the Pacers, that's a huge downgrade. Odom can come somewhat close to replicating what JO does offensively, but JO anchors our defense, whereas Odom is simply serviceable on defense for the most part.

But, if you are willing to give other value along with Odom that would possibly convince the Pacers to downgrade at PF, then that's a different story.



Hope this helps explain us irrational Pacers fans thoughts on this a little better.

[Oomph]

I like Marion a lot but isn't he a SF too? And doesn't he have an opt out next season, leaving the Pacers with possibly nothing?

I might pull the trigger when we unload Murphy instead of JO. Besides I want to trade Tinsley too and won't mind getting back Banks.

So this is my trade proposal:

JO/Murphy to the Lakers

Odom/Snow/2008 #1 pick from LAL to the Suns

Marion/Kwame/Banks/2008 #1 pick from CLE to the Pacers

Tinsley to the Cavs

Foster is UNTOUCHABLE at this moment!

[Jordan45822]

I think Bird still wants Bynum and Odom. But he knows it is not happening. So it depends if there something with LA what is coming back with Odom. Probably Farmar or Crittenton and expiring like Sasha or Kwame (where they can add a bad contract).

[smoothdave1]

Pacers like Marion, but don't want to give up Foster for Kwame even though his contract comes off the books this year.

Pacers add Harrison and pull the trigger on this deal. They get Kwame's expiring deal and get value for JO in Marion for their new small ball lineup.

Phoenix adds Odom who seem like he'd fit well in their offense and Vujacic who provides depth in the backcourt

Lakers add a legit big in JO to help with Bynum gone and keeps Kobe happy while also adding another big in Harrison who needs a fresh start elsewhere.

[warren weel im]

Marion is an undersized PF but in an uptempo offense, it does not matter. I think Marion can be secured with an extension and he will be the MAIN MAN in Indy. That's 2 out of 2 of his demands.

Winning will be an altogether different story. If the Pacers can get it together with Tins, Dunleavy, Granger, Marion and Murphy, in the weak East, its a good shot.

[gswhoops]

Why would Phoenix trade Marion essentially straight up for LO? That's a bad deal for them on so many levels.

[loserX]

Your last deal had Odom + Kwame + 1st for JO and Foster, and most non-Lakers fans thought that was unfair in favour of LA. Now they get the same return WITHOUT giving the pick. Seems unlikely.

[Scoot McGroot]

Don't forget loserX, they also give up Sasha Vujacic!!!!!

[loserX]

Don't forget loserX, they also give up Sasha Vujacic!!!!!

I stand corrected. That guy's clearly worth a 1st round pick in anybody's money

[CableKC]

In all fairness, unless the Lakers FO thinks that they can't do without Bynum for 2 months and MUST therefore make a move to shore up the Frontline, I don't think that they need to make any huge move to acquire a Big Man unless it simply costs them Kwame, Sasha, VladRad and sweetner like Crittenton/future 1st.

In the Pacers case.....the likely cost of acquiring JONeal would either be Odom and/or Farmar. From a Trade POV....I think that a deal centered around Odom, Sasha and Crittenton for JONeal+filler would be fair ( at least from a Pacers POV ). But for the Lakers POV....this is one of those moves that would likely kill whatever chemistry that they have built.

Personally, I don't think they need to do anything. They can probably do better by renting a Big Man like CWebb to keep things going until Bynum returns and then pick up where they left off. They may lose more games then not......but this goes back to the Lakers FO belief that they can be a solid 2nd round Playoff team IF they are healthy. Unless the prognosis for Bynum is much worse then announced, there is no real need to mess with that now.

[warren weel im]

I think the negotiating wheel can turn on this one. The Lakers adding a 1st or taking back Sasha is not what the trade is about. I think the motivation to do the trade is to convince Indiana to send JO to LA and not be "robbed" in the process. Since Marion for Odom (while you think its unfair) has been reportedly proposed from the Phoenix camp, I was merely using it as a possible variant to the 1,000,967 kinds of JO to LA deals.

In my proposal, LA lands JO - someone they wanted alongside Kobe WITHOUT parting with the proverbial future in Bynum. Odom, meanwhile has lost his welcome in LA in his 4 years either by being injured or being a spectator of Kobe taking over the game. On the flip side, on games where Kobe does not play, Odom is all-star-like. That leads me to conclude that the TRIANGLE restrains Odom's skills and Kobe "allows" him to not be aggressive. Over-all, trading Odom might actually be good for Odom.

Phoenix has dealt with the Marion issue quite well. Better than the Kobe drama in fact. However, Marion's discontent is resounding in the locker and is affecting team chemistry. Over-all, given the choice of choosing between Amare and Shawn, I think the obvious choice is the former. Since Marion has to go (to some extent) why not trade him for somebody who could extend Steve Nash's rests in between games, and ultimately his career? This is the motivation I am looking at, wherein Sasha is a mere addition to their futile bench. Since Sasha can play some 1 or 2, his running game can be beneficial for Phoenix rather than sending them our 08 1st.

Lastly, Indiana. The team that holds the 3 teams together. If Indy says no deal, then there's no deal. But I cannot see them refusing this one. Marion only asks for the extension and I think giving it to him and trading JO means Indiana still has a more durable player and a consistently producing one for the same price. The JO trade will be justified as supposed to trading him just for scrubs. Then Marion can be the PF of the JOB uptempo. At the same time, Foster becomes an insurance policy for LA since with Drew down, we cannot afford to lose more big men, this time thru trades.

After the deadline, PJ Brown looks like more of a certainty than Webber within the week. I think doing this trade does not hinder LA from still signing CWebb or PJBrown.

[jeremy1215]

Pacers accept easily

Tinsley/Diener
Dunleavy/Daniels
Granger/Rush
Marion/Williams/Brown
Foster/Murphy/Brown

[jeremy1215]

I like Marion a lot but isn't he a SF too? And doesn't he have an opt out next season, leaving the Pacers with possibly nothing?

I might pull the trigger when we unload Murphy instead of JO. Besides I want to trade Tinsley too and won't mind getting back Banks.

So this is my trade proposal:

JO/Murphy to the Lakers

Odom/Snow/2008 #1 pick from LAL to the Suns

Marion/Kwame/Banks/2008 #1 pick from CLE to the Pacers

Tinsley to the Cavs

Foster is UNTOUCHABLE at this moment!

This works too, and our point guard play would get better because Banks and Diener would battle it out for the starting position.

[ahartleyvu]

-= original quote snipped =-

This works too, and our point guard play would get better because Banks and Diener would battle it out for the starting position.

stop kidding yourself