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The other thread was getting messy, so I will let that one die and replace it with this cleaner version without Cleveland, and adding another prospect to Memphis.



Chicago Bulls

Incoming Players
Lamar Odom
Salary: $13,248,596 Years Remaining: 2

Brian Cardinal
Salary: $5,850,000 Years Remaining: 3

Pau Gasol
Salary: $13,735,000 Years Remaining: 4

Vladimir Radmanovic
Salary: $5,632,200 Years Remaining: 4

Juan Carlos Navarro
Salary: $538,090 Years Remaining: 1

Sasha Vujacic
Salary: $1,756,951 Years Remaining: 1

Draft Rights to Marc Gasol


Outgoing Players: Joakim Noah, Tyrus Thomas, Joe Smith, Ben Wallace, Ben Gordon, Thabo Sefolosha, Unprotected 08 first

Depth Chart:
PG- Hinrich / Duhon
SG- JCN / Vujacic / Duhon
SF- Deng / Nocioni / Radmanovic
PF- Odom / Nocioni / Radmanovic
C- Gasol / Gray

Summary: It's simple. Chicago gets their man along with a very nice complimentary player in Odom to form a solid front court to go with their solid guards. As a bonus they also get Pau's younger brother. They sacrifice some youth here, but they also unload Wallace. I would think Chicago would become a top 4 team in the East with this lineup, and we all know what can happen in the East come playoff time. I would think Chicago would have to do this deal.




Memphis Grizzlies

Incoming Players
Thabo Sefolosha
Salary: $1,805,160 Years Remaining: 2

Joakim Noah
Salary: $2,135,400 Years Remaining: 2

Tyrus Thomas
Salary: $3,505,320 Years Remaining: 2

Kwame Brown
Salary: $9,075,000 Years Remaining: 1

Ben Gordon
Salary: $4,881,669 Years Remaining: 1

08 Unprotected First (Chicago)


Outgoing Players: Brian Cardinal, Pau Gasol, Mike Miller, Juan Carlos Navarro, Stromile Swift

Depth Chart:
PG- Conley / Lowry
SG- Gordon / Sefolosha
SF- Gay / Warrick
PF- Thomas / Noah
C- Milicic / Noah

Summary: The Grizzlies definitely lose some talent here, but if you break it down they are getting the first back that they gave up for JCN. At that point it becomes Gasol/Miller/salary dump for Gordon / Thomas / Noah / Sefolosha and tons of cap room. Speaking of cap room, even Philadelphia will be jealous of Memphis' cap situation if they do this deal. Usually Memphis isn't a free agent player, but there will be a lot of big names available this off season, and if this trade goes down their choices will be stay where they are, Philly, Memphis, or a huge pay cut. I gotta think Memphis could convince a big name to come. Plus this trade will prevent any 2nd half hot streak that could hurt their position in the draft. Maybe not what fans want to hear, but it is the truth, at this point you should be looking towards the draft/off season.




Los Angeles Lakers

Incoming Players
Mike Miller
Salary: $8,376,194 Years Remaining: 3

Joe Smith
Salary: $5,205,000 Years Remaining: 2

Stromile Swift
Salary: $5,800,000 Years Remaining: 1

Ben Wallace
Salary: $15,500,000 Years Remaining: 3


Outgoing Players: Sasha Vujacic, Lamar Odom, Vladimir Radmanovic, Kwame Brown, Draft Rights to Marc Gasol

Depth Chart:
PG- Fisher / Farmar / Crittenton
SG- Miller / Bryant / Crittenton
SF- Bryant / Ariza / Walton
PF- Smith / Swift / Turiaf
C- Bynum / Wallace / Mihm

Summary: A deep team becomes even deeper. LA takes on the albatross that is Wallace, a very solid PF in Odom and a nice prospect in Gasol, but with Bynum out 2 months they can't say no to this added frontcourt depth and the extra scoring from Miller.





So this trade is on the big side, but I trimmed the fat to the point that I feel it is realistic. I feel every team accomplishes goals that help move them in the direction that they need to head. So what does everybody else think?

You should take Damon Stoudamire out of it - you still got him mentioned as outgoing for Memphis, but since he doesn't show up on either the Lakers or Bulls I guess you overlooked him and he's still supposed to go the Cleveland, right?

U-Borat wrote:Lakers will not and should not accept Ben Wallace unless we get super-dooper-wooper value...and we don't.

However...I would like the idea of something like....Odom/Rad/sweetners for Miller/joesmith....

good call on the not wanting wallace

JustMoe wrote:You should take Damon Stoudamire out of it - you still got him mentioned as outgoing for Memphis, but since he doesn't show up on either the Lakers or Bulls I guess you overlooked him and he's still supposed to go the Cleveland, right?

Good find, I still had him in the outgoing from the first one. It is fixed now.

U-Borat wrote:Lakers will not and should not accept Ben Wallace unless we get super-dooper-wooper value...and we don't.

However...I would like the idea of something like....Odom/Rad/sweetners for Miller/joesmith....

We will just have to agree to disagree here. Many Lakers fans wanted to do Kwame/Vladrad for Wallace straight up (even before the Bynum injury). This incorporates that swap, but adds Odom/Sasha/M Gasol for Miller/Smith/Swift. With Bynum's current status I would do this deal. The more that I look at it though, we should probably keep M Gasol, or get Chicago's 2010 first rounder and we add a 2nd to them. That would make more sense.

I just see Vlad Rad as almost as bad of a contract as Wallace.
This Year: Vlad 5.63 Kwame 9.05 / Wallace 15.5 =wash
Next Year: Vlad 6.05 / Wallace 14.5 = adding 8.45
Year 3: Vlad 6.47 / Wallace 14= adding 7.53
Year 4: Vlad 6.88 / Wallace Gone= saving 6.88

The difference is that Wallace could be a very solid contributor to this team still, and Vlad Rad just isn't going to help us at this point. I don't want to see Wallace logging 35 minutes a game once Bynum returns, but I would love to see him give us a solid 20 minutes of great help D and rebounding (including grabbing a lot of offensive boards). Now I know we are overpaying money wise for that production, but it is better than Vlad if Wallace comes through.

An alternative to Kwame/VladRad that has been mentioned multiple times around here is Kwame/Mihm/Ariza (or Vujacic, but he's already included in this deal anyway). I know many Lakers fans are against going for Big Ben in general, and I can see why, but what interests me is this: would you guys, hypothetically spoken, rather trade the latter package over Kwame/Radmanovic? Ok, Radman improved at the beginning of the season, but he still earns good money, while Mihm earns less and both Ariza and Sasha have expiring contracts.
So, if the Lakers would actually decide to go for Wallace (again: just hypothetically spoken), which is the package you guys would rather give up for him?

I know, read it before somewhere
Would getting a guy like Sefolosha or maybe a pick change that, or are Lakers fans so convinced about Wallace being a bad fit that they don't want anything to do with him?

JustMoe wrote:An alternative to Kwame/VladRad that has been mentioned multiple times around here is Kwame/Mihm/Ariza (or Vujacic, but he's already included in this deal anyway). I know many Lakers fans are against going for Big Ben in general, and I can see why, but what interests me is this: would you guys, hypothetically spoken, rather trade the latter package over Kwame/Radmanovic? Ok, Radman improved at the beginning of the season, but he still earns good money, while Mihm earns less and both Ariza and Sasha have expiring contracts.
So, if the Lakers would actually decide to go for Wallace (again: just hypothetically spoken), which is the package you guys would rather give up for him?

Version 2 of the "isolated" Wallace deal is so bad that it might make trading Butler for Kwame look good, seriously no way we touch that. Assuming we would do the first deal (debatable), why on earth would we replace trading away a bad 4 year contract on a one dimensional player with 2 expirings (one of whom is a pretty good prospect)?

That's what I've been wondering about, as well. I just saw it mentioned by Lakers fans before who prefered keeping Radmanovic since he did well before getting injured. Looking at the contracts, I'd absolutely agree that Radmanovic would have to go if the Lakers (hypothetically spoken) actually would consider this deal.

I started a seperate thread for this, but since it's the same team constellation I guess putting it in here makes more sense:


I'd like to try another version I've been thinking about for quite a while now. Previous responds have shown that the Lakers aren't too crazy about this deal, but I still included the Wallace - Kwame/Radman part since at least it makes a little sense and Wallace, who has to be included, just doesn't make much sense in Memphis. The things I'm interested about the most are:

1. do Chicago and/or Memphis consider this fair value? If not - why?
and
2. would the Bulls rather trade Gordon or Hinrich? I read diverse statements regarding this question on the Bulls board.

Chicago Trade Breakdown
Change in Team Outlook: +22.5 ppg, -0.1 rpg, and +1.2 apg.
Incoming Players
Juan Carlos Navarro
6-3 SG from Spain (Foreign)
10.3 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 2.1 apg in 23.3 minutes
Damon Stoudamire
5-10 PG from Arizona
7.3 ppg, 2.4 rpg, 3.8 apg in 21.3 minutes
Brian Cardinal
6-8 SF / PF from Purdue
2.4 ppg, 2.1 rpg, 0.9 apg in 7.8 minutes
Pau Gasol
7-0 PF from Spain (Foreign)
18.8 ppg, 8.7 rpg, 2.9 apg in 36.8 minutes
Vladimir Radmanovic
6-10 PF / SF from Serbia-Montenegro (Foreign)
7.4 ppg, 2.7 rpg, 1.6 apg in 19.3 minutes
Outgoing Players
Thabo Sefolosha
6-5 SG from Switzerland (Foreign)
3.3 ppg, 2.1 rpg, 1.1 apg in 12.1 minutes
Joakim Noah
6-11 PF from Florida
4.5 ppg, 3.5 rpg, 0.9 apg in 12.8 minutes
Kirk Hinrich
6-3 PG from Kansas
11.4 ppg, 3.6 rpg, 6.1 apg in 33.7 minutes
Ben Wallace
6-9 C from Virginia Union
4.5 ppg, 8.8 rpg, 2.0 apg in 32.8 minutes

Memphis Trade Breakdown
Change in Team Outlook: -14.5 ppg, -0.9 rpg, and -0.4 apg.
Incoming Players
Thabo Sefolosha
6-5 SG from Switzerland (Foreign)
3.3 ppg, 2.1 rpg, 1.1 apg in 12.1 minutes
Joakim Noah
6-11 PF from Florida
4.5 ppg, 3.5 rpg, 0.9 apg in 12.8 minutes
Kirk Hinrich
6-3 PG from Kansas
11.4 ppg, 3.6 rpg, 6.1 apg in 33.7 minutes
Kwame Brown
6-11 PF / C from Glynn Academy (HS)
5.1 ppg, 5.1 rpg, 1.2 apg in 20.4 minutes
Outgoing Players
Juan Carlos Navarro
6-3 SG from Spain (Foreign)
10.3 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 2.1 apg in 23.3 minutes
Damon Stoudamire
5-10 PG from Arizona
7.3 ppg, 2.4 rpg, 3.8 apg in 21.3 minutes
Brian Cardinal
6-8 SF / PF from Purdue
2.4 ppg, 2.1 rpg, 0.9 apg in 7.8 minutes
Pau Gasol
7-0 PF from Spain (Foreign)
18.8 ppg, 8.7 rpg, 2.9 apg in 36.8 minutes

L.A. Lakers Trade Breakdown
Change in Team Outlook: -8.0 ppg, +1.0 rpg, and -0.8 apg.
Incoming Players
Ben Wallace
6-9 C from Virginia Union
4.5 ppg, 8.8 rpg, 2.0 apg in 32.8 minutes
Outgoing Players
Vladimir Radmanovic
6-10 PF / SF from Serbia-Montenegro (Foreign)
7.4 ppg, 2.7 rpg, 1.6 apg in 19.3 minutes
Kwame Brown
6-11 PF / C from Glynn Academy (HS)
5.1 ppg, 5.1 rpg, 1.2 apg in 20.4 minutes

Why for Chicago? They get Gasol and his buddy Navarro while only giving up one of their young bigmen. They furthermore add another combo guard to replace Hinrich. Trading Kirk's and Wallace's contract saves the a good amount of money, including immediate cap relief thanks to Hinrichs BYC status, they can use in order to resign Deng and Gordon next summer. They also add another PG to share PT with Duhon in Stoudamire, who's contract would come off the books after next season.
The obvious negatives: they have to take on both Cardinal and Radmanovic, but at least the latter looked improved at the start of the season, while Cardinal is from Illinois (HEY! )

Why for Memphis? I realize this isn't a total rebuilding move since they add Kirk's contract, but they add some nice talent in Noah and Sefolosha. Hinrich can play both the 1 and 2, so if Conley starts Miller would come off the bench. Thanks to Kwame's expiring contract 9 millions come off the books after the season.

Why for the Lakers? Well, as I mentioned before: this is most likely the deal-breaker. I can see that after Wallace's recent play there aren't too many Lakers fans who'd love to have him on their team, but on the other hand he might actually be a nice fit playing next to Bynum. I included Vladimir due to his contract. Would sending a pick or Sefolosha to the Lakers instead of to Memphis make this proposal more appealing?

solid for l.a

I really like this deal for the Lakers.