Will anyone take Deng and his Ugly contract?

[THROWBACK_91]

im a bulls fan and im wondering is there anyway we can dump deng and his contract? Especially if salmons opts in in the offseason.

[N.O.R.E.]

Short answer, yes IMO. I doubt the Bulls will look to deal him for whatever reason.

[tbg]

Yes. I think there are several teams who would trade expirings for Deng. Not sure you'd get much in the way of talent back, though. And I'm not sure Chicago wants to trade Deng given that he's playing better than anyone else on the team.

[boogydown]

TBG/Nore summed it up. Deng is playing 18/8 with solid defense and is shooting pretty well as unlike a couple of the guys on the team.

Though I truly don't think Deng fits in Chicago, unless you get another starter long term back for him, he will be a Chicago Bull next season which is not necessarily a bad thing if he remains healthy and continues to improve and hopefully develop a consistent long range shot.

He really is a good 3rd or 4th option guy and though he is being paid quite a lot, it will be worth it if you're contending.

[Kyben36]

Please, Deng is playing good ball as of late, sure somebody will take him, and his contract isnt that bad for a 3rd option.

[WiscoKing13]

Please, Deng is playing good ball as of late, sure somebody will take him, and his contract isnt that bad for a 3rd option.

i'm really hoping your kidding

[Slackerr]

I know who will take Deng's "ugly" contract! The Bulls will. Now since he's been playing good ball as of late, can we stop making dumping trades for him?

[WiscoKing13]

I know who will take Deng's "ugly" contract! The Bulls will. Now since he's been playing good ball as of late, can we stop making dumping trades for him?

see this type of thinking always makes me scratch my head. Just in general when a guy is horrible that teams fans will be looking to move him for expirings for some type of shorter contracts. Than something changes and he improves and than the fan base figures they either should keep him or should get one hell of a deal if they trade him. Your also factoring in that the team your trading him to completely forgot how badly the guy played and theirs almost no risk in trading him. Its just kind of odd in my book

[inrapscity]

didn't CHI not want to deal Deng in a deal for Kobe 2 years ago or so? look at CHI now lol.

toronto gives you all expirings. deng for amir johnson+wright+rasho+pob.

[Norm2953]

It's unlikely Portland would be interested in Deng even if Martell Webster were
included in the deal for we don't have any other crappy contracts that
can be included.

[Slackerr]

I know who will take Deng's "ugly" contract! The Bulls will. Now since he's been playing good ball as of late, can we stop making dumping trades for him?

see this type of thinking always makes me scratch my head. Just in general when a guy is horrible that teams fans will be looking to move him for expirings for some type of shorter contracts. Than something changes and he improves and than the fan base figures they either should keep him or should get one hell of a deal if they trade him. Your also factoring in that the team your trading him to completely forgot how badly the guy played and theirs almost no risk in trading him. Its just kind of odd in my book

I've been on the "Keep Deng" bandwagon throughout all of last year and this year. I think he's overpaid but he's still a very solid player nonetheless. IMO, when healthy, his contract isn't really a problem.

[Slackerr]

didn't CHI not want to deal Deng in a deal for Kobe 2 years ago or so? look at CHI now lol.

toronto gives you all expirings. deng for amir johnson+wright+rasho+pob.

Sigh. Chicago wanted Kobe. LAL said give us Deng. We said okay. Kobe didn't want to come to Chicago if Deng wasn't there. Thus, Kobe refused to waive his no-trade clause since he wanted to play with Deng and LAL didn't want to part with Kobe without Deng.

No to that offer btw.

[DanTown8587]

I know who will take Deng's "ugly" contract! The Bulls will. Now since he's been playing good ball as of late, can we stop making dumping trades for him?

see this type of thinking always makes me scratch my head. Just in general when a guy is horrible that teams fans will be looking to move him for expirings for some type of shorter contracts. Than something changes and he improves and than the fan base figures they either should keep him or should get one hell of a deal if they trade him. Your also factoring in that the team your trading him to completely forgot how badly the guy played and theirs almost no risk in trading him. Its just kind of odd in my book

The guy speaks for the minority. i think a lot of people want to move Deng because he doesn't fit with a drive and kick PG like Rose, not because of in-effectiveness. There aren't many SF that are better than Deng that are available. And his contract isn't some albatross that kills you. He gives you 18-8 while not directing the offense to him and playing good defense. There are a lot of teams that would be better with Luol Deng at the 3.

[moocow007]

Please, Deng is playing good ball as of late, sure somebody will take him, and his contract isnt that bad for a 3rd option.

Deng the player aside, IF he's a 3rd option most definitely his contract is bad.

Here's his contract

2009-2010 - $10.37 million
2010-2011 - $11.36 million
2011-2012 - $12.34 million
2012-2013 - $13.33 million
2013-2014 - $14.31 million

An average of $12.5 million for a 3rd option is bad.

[moocow007]

I know who will take Deng's "ugly" contract! The Bulls will. Now since he's been playing good ball as of late, can we stop making dumping trades for him?

see this type of thinking always makes me scratch my head. Just in general when a guy is horrible that teams fans will be looking to move him for expirings for some type of shorter contracts. Than something changes and he improves and than the fan base figures they either should keep him or should get one hell of a deal if they trade him. Your also factoring in that the team your trading him to completely forgot how badly the guy played and theirs almost no risk in trading him. Its just kind of odd in my book

Yeah agreed. But this is the typical general everyday fan thinking.

[BadWolf]

If Chicago gets Wade, they must move Deng. You can't have Rose, Wade, Deng as your 1,2,3 as they provide no spacing.
Deng (and pick) for Martin, or Deng, Hinrich, pick for Martin, Nocioni (or Udrih) might benefit both teams if MArtin can play SF (big if probably). it brings a lot of shooting to the Bulls, while Deng improves Kings biggest weakness.

[Telfaire]

Perfect fit for the Blazers - Webster and Miller/Blake/Outlaw with a 3rd team perhaps?

[Friend_Of_Haley]

I can see why some posters want to move Deng because he isn't a perfect fit, and I'm alright with that reasoning.

I personally think he isn't that far off from a perfect fit. The biggest thing is to extend his range, which he has slowly made some progress in this year, and of late, and despite the small sample size he's shot the 3 ball effectively. The biggest problem is getting him to shoot it enough to make him a legitimate threat from there. Considering he is just still 24 years old, I think he could realistically improve in this aspect, and if he does, he is suddenly a great fit.

Some others want to move him because of injury concerns, and I can appreciate that too. I'm personally willing to roll the ball and take a risk on that one. Its not like his game is dependent on athleticism.

But even if you want to move him for those two legitimate reasons, I don't understand why you would do it for expiring contracts. Sure it opens up cap space, but as long as Salmons opts out, the Bulls have enough space for a max FA. Anything extra is probably not really necessary. Remember, to attract a FA, the thing we need besides money is a supporting cast that is better than the team they are leaving. If it is about money, they'll just stay.

So with that being the case, we can't just deplete all of our depth for cap room. We need guys who are catered to fitting around an superstar. Guys like Luol Deng, Joakim Noah, and Derrick Rose all scream awesome supporting cast, especially Deng. Thats why Kobe supposedly vetoed the trade that included Deng. He's the kind of player a star will want to play with.

So if you are trading Deng, it should be for one of a few things:

- A player of equal value who is a better fit : ie- Shoots the 3 pt effectively and high quantity
- A player of equal value at a different position : We could use a good post player and SF is a relatively deep position, so I can see this argument
- A couple players of slightly lesser value, but better fit: Maybe you pick up a starting caliber PF and SF that are fits for Rose/Superstar, but not as good as Deng
- An upgrade to a better player : Package Deng with other assets and get a better player, ie- Bosh

Any other type of trade, like for expiring contracts? Crazy talk. If you are worried about clearing enough salary the simple solution is to ship out Salmons for expiring contracts. Maybe Hinrich too, but while I'm ranting about bad suggestions, forget all this stuff about dumping Hinrich for nothing. When did we all of the sudden want to dump players at their lowest value. We've already planned our 2010 plan with Hinrich fitting in. We probably don't need to move him. And his contract expires as Rose needs to be extended. I don't think Hinrich can lower his value much so unless we are meeting the criteria that I set out for Deng, whats the point? The only way you do that is if you are worried the cap will drop even more than its predicted and/or you can't move Salmons, and/or you think Salmons will opt in.

As far as Deng being an expensive third option here are some third options "types"around the league :

Jamal Crawford: $9,360,000 $10,080,000
Josh Howard: $10,890,000 $11,835,000
Corey Maggette $8,937,931 $9,600,000 $10,262,069 $10,924,138
Mike Dunleavy $9,780,992 $10,561,984
Andrew Bynum $12,500,000 $13,700,000 $14,900,000 $16,100,000
Peja Stojakovic $13,392,000 $14,256,000
Emeka Okafor $10,797,500 $11,795,000 $12,792,500 $13,790,000 $14,787,500
Jameer Nelson $8,100,000 $8,100,000 $8,100,000 $8,100,000
Jason Richardson $13,333,332 $14,444,443
Richard Jefferson $14,200,000 $15,200,000
Mehmet Okur $9,000,000 $9,945,000 $10,890,000

Those players vary. Some are 3rd options playing as second options on their team. Some are 3rd options playing as 4th options, etc. Based on that list is Deng overpaid? Absolutely. But outrageously so, probably not. Also of note though, only a handful of those players offer defense at the same level or better than Deng. And even if he is outrageously overpaid, its worth it to at least keep him on for now, unless a trade meets one of the criteria I specified before.

[Slackerr]

I can see why some posters want to move Deng because he isn't a perfect fit, and I'm alright with that reasoning.

I personally think he isn't that far off from a perfect fit. The biggest thing is to extend his range, which he has slowly made some progress in this year, and of late, and despite the small sample size he's shot the 3 ball effectively. The biggest problem is getting him to shoot it enough to make him a legitimate threat from there. Considering he is just still 24 years old, I think he could realistically improve in this aspect, and if he does, he is suddenly a great fit.

Some others want to move him because of injury concerns, and I can appreciate that too. I'm personally willing to roll the ball and take a risk on that one. Its not like his game is dependent on athleticism.

But even if you want to move him for those two legitimate reasons, I don't understand why you would do it for expiring contracts. Sure it opens up cap space, but as long as Salmons opts out, the Bulls have enough space for a max FA. Anything extra is probably not really necessary. Remember, to attract a FA, the thing we need besides money is a supporting cast that is better than the team they are leaving. If it is about money, they'll just stay.

So with that being the case, we can't just deplete all of our depth for cap room. We need guys who are catered to fitting around an superstar. Guys like Luol Deng, Joakim Noah, and Derrick Rose all scream awesome supporting cast, especially Deng. Thats why Kobe supposedly vetoed the trade that included Deng. He's the kind of player a star will want to play with.

So if you are trading Deng, it should be for one of a few things:

- A player of equal value who is a better fit : ie- Shoots the 3 pt effectively and high quantity
- A player of equal value at a different position : We could use a good post player and SF is a relatively deep position, so I can see this argument
- A couple players of slightly lesser value, but better fit: Maybe you pick up a starting caliber PF and SF that are fits for Rose/Superstar, but not as good as Deng
- An upgrade to a better player : Package Deng with other assets and get a better player, ie- Bosh

Any other type of trade, like for expiring contracts? Crazy talk. If you are worried about clearing enough salary the simple solution is to ship out Salmons for expiring contracts. Maybe Hinrich too, but while I'm ranting about bad suggestions, forget all this stuff about dumping Hinrich for nothing. When did we all of the sudden want to dump players at their lowest value. We've already planned our 2010 plan with Hinrich fitting in. We probably don't need to move him. And his contract expires as Rose needs to be extended. I don't think Hinrich can lower his value much so unless we are meeting the criteria that I set out for Deng, whats the point? The only way you do that is if you are worried the cap will drop even more than its predicted and/or you can't move Salmons, and/or you think Salmons will opt in.

As far as Deng being an expensive third option here are some third options "types"around the league :

Jamal Crawford: $9,360,000 $10,080,000
Josh Howard: $10,890,000 $11,835,000
Corey Maggette $8,937,931 $9,600,000 $10,262,069 $10,924,138
Mike Dunleavy $9,780,992 $10,561,984
Andrew Bynum $12,500,000 $13,700,000 $14,900,000 $16,100,000
Peja Stojakovic $13,392,000 $14,256,000
Emeka Okafor $10,797,500 $11,795,000 $12,792,500 $13,790,000 $14,787,500
Jameer Nelson $8,100,000 $8,100,000 $8,100,000 $8,100,000
Jason Richardson $13,333,332 $14,444,443
Richard Jefferson $14,200,000 $15,200,000
Mehmet Okur $9,000,000 $9,945,000 $10,890,000

Those players vary. Some are 3rd options playing as second options on their team. Some are 3rd options playing as 4th options, etc. Based on that list is Deng overpaid? Absolutely. But outrageously so, probably not. Also of note though, only a handful of those players offer defense at the same level or better than Deng. And even if he is outrageously overpaid, its worth it to at least keep him on for now, unless a trade meets one of the criteria I specified before.

+10000 Great post. I think that's pretty much on point with what Chicago management is thinking.

[ecuhus1981]

An average of $12.5 million for a 3rd option is bad.

What about for a 12th option?

I don't think this thread needs any feedback from NYK fans...