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Heat vs Thunder Nov.7 8:00 PM

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Re: Heat vs Thunder Nov.7 8:00 PM 

Post#721 » by Shewasfly » Tue Nov 8, 2016 10:28 pm

KingDavid wrote:
Shewasfly wrote:
dolphinatik wrote:We got to the rim many times and couldn't finish. Also Whiteside was not assertive and very careless around the ball. Thunder was bush league with Adams and canter and it worked. We lost composure. Whiteside and Dragic have a problem together. We left that horrid lineup in there too long no adjustments, then we score twice when they are up 20 and thunder call immediate time out. I like James Johnson and Tyler Johnson. Willie Reed add him to the plays hard list. This is the year we have to give Winslow freedom to see if he can figure it out out not. He has to find his scoring game or we have to move on. We have to live with that.

Lineups I want to see
Jrich, Winslow, tj, Whiteside, Reed or jj

That is all


Can you say why you think Whiteside and Dragic have a problem together? I see something too but I can't quite put my finger on it..

Dragic needs a center that can pop when they set screens so they can draw defenders out of the paint on his drives. Hassan needs a point guard with elite vision and driving skills to set him up on rolls like cp3 to DeAndre. Not unlike John Wall.

The easiest way to pinpoint the issue is watch highlights of Dragic and Frye and then highlights of cp3 & deandre. That's the problem.


But there is no reason why a PG shouldn't be able to still get the ball to a roll man. You're telling me the only way Dragic can effectively pass the ball is if its to shooters? Yes Dragic's vision sucks, but it doesn't take vision in that situation it just takes passing ability.
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Re: Heat vs Thunder Nov.7 8:00 PM 

Post#722 » by KingDavid » Tue Nov 8, 2016 10:39 pm

Shewasfly wrote:
KingDavid wrote:
Shewasfly wrote:
Can you say why you think Whiteside and Dragic have a problem together? I see something too but I can't quite put my finger on it..

Dragic needs a center that can pop when they set screens so they can draw defenders out of the paint on his drives. Hassan needs a point guard with elite vision and driving skills to set him up on rolls like cp3 to DeAndre. Not unlike John Wall.

The easiest way to pinpoint the issue is watch highlights of Dragic and Frye and then highlights of cp3 & deandre. That's the problem.


But there is no reason why a PG shouldn't be able to still get the ball to a roll man. You're telling me the only way Dragic can effectively pass the ball is if its to shooters? Yes Dragic's vision sucks, but it doesn't take vision in that situation it just takes passing ability.

I wish I could tell you it's easy, but it isn't. It takes vision and passing ability. Dragic can pass, but his vision is quite poor at times. He's more of a sg in skill than a PG...but has the size of a PG. :/
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Re: Heat vs Thunder Nov.7 8:00 PM 

Post#723 » by BaDaBo » Tue Nov 8, 2016 11:27 pm

KingDavid wrote:
Shewasfly wrote:
KingDavid wrote:Dragic needs a center that can pop when they set screens so they can draw defenders out of the paint on his drives. Hassan needs a point guard with elite vision and driving skills to set him up on rolls like cp3 to DeAndre. Not unlike John Wall.

The easiest way to pinpoint the issue is watch highlights of Dragic and Frye and then highlights of cp3 & deandre. That's the problem.


But there is no reason why a PG shouldn't be able to still get the ball to a roll man. You're telling me the only way Dragic can effectively pass the ball is if its to shooters? Yes Dragic's vision sucks, but it doesn't take vision in that situation it just takes passing ability.

I wish I could tell you it's easy, but it isn't. It takes vision and passing ability. Dragic can pass, but his vision is quite poor at times. He's more of a sg in skill than a PG...but has the size of a PG. :/


Not answering to anyone in particular just jumping in the convo.

Dragic and Whiteside seemed to had great chemistry in the second half of last season and with more shooters this year, there should be more space for Dragic drives and Hassans rolls to the basket. I'm not sure, what the issue is tho ( yes Dragics vision is not on par with the best in this league, but honestly it's not as bad as some here make it to be ) but here are my educated guesses.

On one hand, Hassans effort has been suspect in the last few games, especially when setting screens, and don't remember any that would let Dragic go downhill ( meaning the angle of the screen).

On the other, teams are clogging the paint more, since we haven't really shown we can beat teams with our three point shot. That happens when one of your three best three point shooters is the guy that drives the most ( Dragic ), the other needs a full minute to actually shoot ( Babbit ) and the other is TJ who doesn't opt for three pointers often enough (!). Even with the boost in volume of three pointer taken this year and a space oriented team we are still a bottom half in 3PA. And while our 3P% is okay, is not good enough to open things up in the paint. Especially against the better teams. I'm hoping with JRich back and Ellington later, this may force teams to defend the 3pt more and open the paint for our two main guys.

Two other things I noticed. Not that hard to notice and you've all been saying it.

One - Winslows shooting is hurting us. Yes it's good that he has the confidence to shoot even when it's not falling and yes in the long run it's probably going to pay off. But right now his man is clogging the paint on our drives and Hassans rolls. In one of our two wins he hit 2 three pointers, and in the other he shoot 48% from the floor. This is not a coincidence.

Two - Apart from Dragic, we've been bad on drives and kick outs. Winslow, Waiters, Johnson J.have all refused to pass to an open man on the three point line in favor of a bad layup over two defenders. If we don't pass to open player, defenders won't bother to even give them notice, much less defend them.

Sorry this rant has gone on longer than I thought it would. Here's a gif for your trouble.

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Re: Heat vs Thunder Nov.7 8:00 PM 

Post#724 » by HIF » Thu Nov 10, 2016 7:22 am

Only got to watch the game in full last night.

Much as expected - we were never in it after a poor start by the starting 5.

Not so many positive points from this

JJ had a better game than we can expect most weeks - great heart and effort with good skill but that's his limit.
JRich had a much better game than his first one back - as expected - which can only give hope.

A couple of surprise/disappointing negative points that I didn't expect even for a lottery team

Goran and Hassan have no chemistry at all whereas I thought their 2 man game would feed well off each other
Winslow's loss of confidence caused by his shooting is starting to affect the rest of his game, even his defence.

Overall it was a sad game to watch. (Adams outplays Hassan)
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