Smallball failed again. ( Dantoni/Spobotti legacy )

[harlem_ball]

I think it’s not a matter of small ball sucks always or small ball is great always. There’s a nuance to the argument. That nuance being small ball is great in the playoffs, but figure out a way to not burn your players out before then.

Spoball is more than just smallball tho. It’s also constant lineup changes and ever-shifting roles. All these variables combine to leave players oftentimes lost and/or at increased injury risk. Look no further than Bam getting lost on offense in many games to see what I’m talking about.

Yeah that's the kicker. We constantly wimper to the finish line and our shooters are dead.

Boston's slow start seems to have helped them stay fresh. They are also younger.

Failing to win the championship doesn't mean that you are doing anything wrong or not playing the right way. It may just mean that another team was better. Maybe instead of underachieving in the playoffs we overachieved in the regular season.

Well we are definitely doing something right. But the pattern is there and hard to ignore on high pace and sputtering to the finish.

Boston is built more like the traditional Jordan/Pippen teams than smallball actually.

The lines are blurry... with Boston. The fact they are successful with defense is interesting.

Our shooting got us to the finals in the bubble. Now defense but not shooting?

[AirP.]

Well we are definitely doing something right. But the pattern is there and hard to ignore on high pace and sputtering to the finish.

Boston is built more like the traditional Jordan/Pippen teams than smallball actually.

The lines are blurry... with Boston. The fact they are successful with defense is interesting.

Our shooting got us to the finals in the bubble. Now defense but not shooting?

Miami gave up 108 ppg in 2020 playoffs, that was 5th best in the playoffs, they scored 110 which was 6th best in the playoffs.
This year Miami gave up 100.4 ppg in the playoffs which was #1, they scored 104.2 pts which was 11th with a huge negative in scoring with PJ Tucker at PF while Bam wasn't being offensive. Just upgrading the starting 4 while allowing Tucker to come off the bench and even play in crunch time if necessary would have gotten this team in the finals and real shot at winning a championship this year. The refusal to give up an asset(to probably go whale hunting) for PF may have cost this franchise a championship, just like hoarding assets and cap space cost this team a possible championship in 2020 when they said no to trading for CP3 a month after acquiring Butler... CP3 would have ruined the 2021 plan(which I think was stupid with Giannis being able to sign a super max that offseason).

For as many good things as this franchise does, it's hoarding some small assets for a "whale" may have cost this franchise 2 titles, it at least cost them a better roster to make those runs which ended in 6 games in the finals and 7 games in the ECF.

[HeatFanLifer]

I think it’s not a matter of small ball sucks always or small ball is great always. There’s a nuance to the argument. That nuance being small ball is great in the playoffs, but figure out a way to not burn your players out before then.

Spoball is more than just smallball tho. It’s also constant lineup changes and ever-shifting roles. All these variables combine to leave players oftentimes lost and/or at increased injury risk. Look no further than Bam getting lost on offense in many games to see what I’m talking about.

Yeah that's the kicker. We constantly wimper to the finish line and our shooters are dead.

Boston's slow start seems to have helped them stay fresh. They are also younger.

Failing to win the championship doesn't mean that you are doing anything wrong or not playing the right way. It may just mean that another team was better. Maybe instead of underachieving in the playoffs we overachieved in the regular season.

I said at the start of the season that if the team made the ECFs, it would be a successful year. However, seeing this team and in particular Jimmy Butler play, I realized they had a shot to win it all. Spo just needs to factor in late season fatigue and become more consistent with his expectations of players. Not much for him to tweak, but it needs to be done.

[harlem_ball]

Yeah that's the kicker. We constantly wimper to the finish line and our shooters are dead.

Boston's slow start seems to have helped them stay fresh. They are also younger.

Failing to win the championship doesn't mean that you are doing anything wrong or not playing the right way. It may just mean that another team was better. Maybe instead of underachieving in the playoffs we overachieved in the regular season.

I said at the start of the season that if the team made the ECFs, it would be a successful year. However, seeing this team and in particular Jimmy Butler play, I realized they had a shot to win it all. Spo just needs to factor in late season fatigue and become more consistent with his expectations of players. Not much for him to tweak, but it needs to be done.

Im pessimistic about it because this was the exact same situation last season and he did rest players this season. A lot of players were out. No, this is systemic failure at worst, age of personnel at best.

[AirP.]

Failing to win the championship doesn't mean that you are doing anything wrong or not playing the right way. It may just mean that another team was better. Maybe instead of underachieving in the playoffs we overachieved in the regular season.

I said at the start of the season that if the team made the ECFs, it would be a successful year. However, seeing this team and in particular Jimmy Butler play, I realized they had a shot to win it all. Spo just needs to factor in late season fatigue and become more consistent with his expectations of players. Not much for him to tweak, but it needs to be done.

Im pessimistic about it because this was the exact same situation last season and he did rest players this season. A lot of players were out. No, this is systemic failure at worst, age of personnel at best.

Age was and still is huge but the biggest issue to me which does tie in with age is that for some reason this FO has decided to fill the PF position with vets they could get very low asset cost. During the Jimmy Butler era where Miami has had a legit chance at a championship Miami has went with Leonard, Iggy, Crowder, Ariza and now Tucker at PF. To me the PF position being as weak as it wask for 3 straight years is inexcusable. At the best the 2 top PFs so far in Crowder and Tucker brought tough defense, some 3pt shooting ability and really nothing else. If Miami really wants to fix this team's offense while keeping the defense really good, how about fixing the PF situation. At least the other old spot... PG with Lowry has Vincent or even Oladipo who can cover for him, Spoelstra had his pick between a SG/SF in Martin or the bad Morris brother. I am still in awe that the FO hasn't addressed the PF position through FA or through a trade.

[3ammy3uck3ts]

Smallballs Spobotto

[dolphinatik]

As much as I criticize Spo he has proven to be one the the current best coaches and has a chance to be in the conversation of best coaches all time.

People can't asteric season after season of overachievement from after-thought players. Like it or not he has gotten to within seconds of winning it all on multiple occasions and the last two times significant injuries derailed our momentum. I'll continue to hate his decisions but respect is due and earned the man is one of the best.

[harlem_ball]

As much as I criticize Spo he has proven to be one the the current best coaches and has a chance to be in the conversation of best coaches all time.

People can't asteric season after season of overachievement from after-thought players. Like it or not he has gotten to within seconds of winning it all on multiple occasions and the last two times significant injuries derailed our momentum. I'll continue to hate his decisions but respect is due and earned the man is one of the best.

I agree, that's why it maddens me to see us get close to the ship and then lose due to the same factors repeatedly.

[BBallFreak]

Small ball was a shot away from the Finals this year, has been to the Conference finals twice in the last three years, has appeared in the finals five times since Spo took over, and has brought two championships to the city.

That's the definition of success.

What in the actual hell are you talking about?

[harlem_ball]

Small ball was a shot away from the Finals this year, has been to the Conference finals twice in the last three years, has appeared in the finals five times since Spo took over, and has brought two championships to the city.

That's the definition of success.

What in the actual hell are you talking about?

Ask Dantoni. It's a legacy of great regular season records and playoff flameouts. A fugazi style.

Size wins championships. This years Celtics team is built like the Jordan Bulls more than any small ball team. Tatum as Pipp, Jaylen as MJ, Horford as a 3 ball shooting Cartwright.

Those Bulls teams are the exception to size. This is the smallest finals yet but there are patterns that there are similarities to past title teams.

[BBallFreak]

Small ball was a shot away from the Finals this year, has been to the Conference finals twice in the last three years, has appeared in the finals five times since Spo took over, and has brought two championships to the city.

That's the definition of success.

What in the actual hell are you talking about?

Ask Dantoni. It's a legacy of great regular season records and playoff flameouts. A fugazi style.

Size wins championships. This years Celtics team is built like the Jordan Bulls more than any small ball team. Tatum as Pipp, Jaylen as MJ, Horford as a 3 ball shooting Cartwright.

Those Bulls teams are the exception to size. This is the smallest finals yet but there are patterns that there are similarities to past title teams.

We won two rings!!!! We've been one of the most successful franchises in the league since Spo took over. Are we really having this discussion?

[harlem_ball]

Small ball was a shot away from the Finals this year, has been to the Conference finals twice in the last three years, has appeared in the finals five times since Spo took over, and has brought two championships to the city.

That's the definition of success.

What in the actual hell are you talking about?

Ask Dantoni. It's a legacy of great regular season records and playoff flameouts. A fugazi style.

Size wins championships. This years Celtics team is built like the Jordan Bulls more than any small ball team. Tatum as Pipp, Jaylen as MJ, Horford as a 3 ball shooting Cartwright.

Those Bulls teams are the exception to size. This is the smallest finals yet but there are patterns that there are similarities to past title teams.

We won two rings!!!! We've been one of the most successful franchises in the league since Spo took over. Are we really having this discussion?

Are you seriously bringing me these low iq responses? Please see yourself out of this thread.

[BBallFreak]

Ask Dantoni. It's a legacy of great regular season records and playoff flameouts. A fugazi style.

Size wins championships. This years Celtics team is built like the Jordan Bulls more than any small ball team. Tatum as Pipp, Jaylen as MJ, Horford as a 3 ball shooting Cartwright.

Those Bulls teams are the exception to size. This is the smallest finals yet but there are patterns that there are similarities to past title teams.

We won two rings!!!! We've been one of the most successful franchises in the league since Spo took over. Are we really having this discussion?

Are you seriously bringing me these low iq responses? Please see yourself out of this thread.

This is, perhaps, one of the most preposterous responses I've seen here in years. You accuse me of a low IQ response, but you clearly are the one lacking in knowledge. I've been here since day1, not just on RealGM, but with the Heat. I've seen EVERY iteration of this team, and the low IQ answer to this manufactured problem is to change the coach recognized by his peers as the best in the league, period.

The idea that we've failed by coming within a shot of the Finals is so beyond the pale that I cannot even describe how ridiculous it is. Do you know how many crappy teams we've put on the court since 1989? I do. Let me tell you something, son, you damn well better enjoy this because when Riley and Spo leave, we could be looking at some very dark times. We were the damned Sacramento Kings before this group took over...

[harlem_ball]

We won two rings!!!! We've been one of the most successful franchises in the league since Spo took over. Are we really having this discussion?

Are you seriously bringing me these low iq responses? Please see yourself out of this thread.

This is, perhaps, one of the most preposterous responses I've seen here in years. You accuse me of a low IQ response, but you clearly are the one lacking in knowledge. I've been here since day1, not just on RealGM, but with the Heat. I've seen EVERY iteration of this team, and the low IQ answer to this manufactured problem is to change the coach recognized by his peers as the best in the league, period.

The idea that we've failed by coming within a shot of the Finals is so beyond the pale that I cannot even describe how ridiculous it is. Do you know how many crappy teams we've put on the court since 1989? I do. Let me tell you something, son, you damn well better enjoy this because when Riley and Spo leave, we could be looking at some very dark times. We were the damned Sacramento Kings before this group took over...

You silly responder! Who is asking for Spos head? The history of the franchise means little to the problems we are trying to tackle here. Your cheerleading means nothing so chill out.

[BBallFreak]

Are you seriously bringing me these low iq responses? Please see yourself out of this thread.

This is, perhaps, one of the most preposterous responses I've seen here in years. You accuse me of a low IQ response, but you clearly are the one lacking in knowledge. I've been here since day1, not just on RealGM, but with the Heat. I've seen EVERY iteration of this team, and the low IQ answer to this manufactured problem is to change the coach recognized by his peers as the best in the league, period.

The idea that we've failed by coming within a shot of the Finals is so beyond the pale that I cannot even describe how ridiculous it is. Do you know how many crappy teams we've put on the court since 1989? I do. Let me tell you something, son, you damn well better enjoy this because when Riley and Spo leave, we could be looking at some very dark times. We were the damned Sacramento Kings before this group took over...

You silly responder! Who is asking for Spos head? The history of the franchise means little to the problems we are trying to tackle here. Your cheerleading means nothing so chill out.

Wow, guess you told me! LOL!

Of all the nonsense...

You don't deserve a franchise this well run. You're calling me a cheerleader when all you do is clamber for an undrafted big who's not ready yet? Pathetic...

[harlem_ball]

This is, perhaps, one of the most preposterous responses I've seen here in years. You accuse me of a low IQ response, but you clearly are the one lacking in knowledge. I've been here since day1, not just on RealGM, but with the Heat. I've seen EVERY iteration of this team, and the low IQ answer to this manufactured problem is to change the coach recognized by his peers as the best in the league, period.

The idea that we've failed by coming within a shot of the Finals is so beyond the pale that I cannot even describe how ridiculous it is. Do you know how many crappy teams we've put on the court since 1989? I do. Let me tell you something, son, you damn well better enjoy this because when Riley and Spo leave, we could be looking at some very dark times. We were the damned Sacramento Kings before this group took over...

You silly responder! Who is asking for Spos head? The history of the franchise means little to the problems we are trying to tackle here. Your cheerleading means nothing so chill out.

Wow, guess you told me! LOL!

Of all the nonsense...

You don't deserve a franchise this well run. You're calling me a cheerleader when all you do is clamber for an undrafted big who's not ready yet? Pathetic...

What are you talking about?

[BBallFreak]

What are you talking about?

Better question is what are you talking about? This thread is all nonsense...

[harlem_ball]

What are you talking about?

Better question is what are you talking about? This thread is all nonsense...

You're trolling. Good job.