**NBA Draft Discussion 2025**

[MettaWorldPanda]

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Scoping out some 2nd rd potentials. Maybe we have a trade in store that brings back a 2nd rd pick before draft. Or could just be a 2 way possibility.

[MettaWorldPanda]

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[MettaWorldPanda]

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[lastb1ckman]

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Multiple guards, they really replenishing their 2 way and g league pipe line. Good!

[MettaWorldPanda]

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Multiple guards, they really replenishing their 2 way and g league pipe line. Good!

Think we are going to clean house and get a fresh set of two way contracts this year. Josh Christopher was too up and down with lots of low IQ mistakes and Isaiah Stevens didn't show very much either and was too small. Not sure if Dru Smith is still eligible for 2 way contracts

[MettaWorldPanda]

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Sick pass after sick pass from Ben Saraf. Who’s cares if he’s not super fast. The vision and craftiness is on another level. The passing is special

[arusinov]

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Sick pass after sick pass from Ben Saraf. Who’s cares if he’s not super fast. The vision and craftiness is on another level. The passing is special

Saraf is not slow when he needs to take quick step, and can dunk with ease (unlike Jakucionis for example) - something like this for example:

https://streamable.com/psh220

[twix2500]

Watch on YouTube

I really do like Proctor as a fit for the Heat. His shooting has really grown into something special. He can fit in multiple lineup for the Heat. He also develop enough to likely contribute right away

It wouldn’t be too difficult to argue that nobody has boosted their draft stock more in the tournament to this point than Tyrese Proctor. The Duke junior has been absolutely torching the nets in the tournament so far, knocking down 13-of-16 three-pointers through Duke’s first two games.

I’ve written about Tyrese Proctor before in a previous edition of Editor’s Notes, and it’s been fascinating to me to follow his evolution as a player since then. He’s continued his upward trajectory as a jump shooter, ranking in the 94th percentile on jump shots per Synergy, and he’s mostly maintained the steps forward he took as a finisher (shooting 51% inside the arc this season after finishing last season at 52% on two-pointers). The shot, once a swing skill for Proctor, has become his main selling point:


Interestingly enough, though, Proctor has stepped into more of an off-ball role this season despite his passing chops being the main selling point of his prospect hype heading into his college career. After Proctor led Duke in assists in each of his first two seasons, it seemed like all but a given to me that he would be Duke’s primary point guard in Year Three. Instead, Proctor took a backseat to Duke’s star freshmen Cooper Flagg and Kon Knueppel in that department—Proctor finished fourth on the team in assists behind those two and Tulane transfer Sion James.

It’s not like Proctor’s passing abandoned him by any means. He still finished the year with an assist-to-turnover ratio of 2.2, and he can still sling the ball all over the court when it comes his way. Proctor’s offensive growth outside of his point guard skills, though, makes him an easier fit. With his size at 6’5”, Proctor was always big enough to play at either guard spot. Now, though, he has the complementary offensive game to match. He might not reach the heights of his pre-college lottery projections, but his game now is more versatile than it has ever been before. If he plays at even an average level for the rest of the tournament, he will get looks in the 2025 NBA Draft. If he maintains a little heat after the first two rounds, though, Tyrese Proctor could be the next prospect in a long line of players to ride a March Madness hot streak into the first round of the draft.

https://www.noceilingsnba.com/p/2025-nba-draft-editors-notes-volume-e76

[MettaWorldPanda]

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Sick pass after sick pass from Ben Saraf. Who’s cares if he’s not super fast. The vision and craftiness is on another level. The passing is special

Saraf is not slow when he needs to take quick step, and can dunk with ease (unlike Jakucionis for example) - something like this for example:

https://streamable.com/psh220

I’ve seen plenty of footage of him exploding to the basket and dunking. We have a 6’10 player in Jovic who’s allergic to dunking lol.

[twix2500]

So I wasnt going to analyze too much on the foreign players, because there is too much I do not know about many of the international leagues. Meaning I do not know what the epectations are of players at his age, and not sure how stats may differ because of how they are used. But since many in here really intrigued by Saraf I took a dive.

He is an intriging prospect because his size and the position he plays. Great height and length and shows a lot of potential with crafty ball hanlding skills. However, he looks to be very raw. He is a flashy player. So yes his highlights can look good. But that is also one of his problems, he tries to over do the flashiness and many times he cant finish and gets himself in bad position. He is not a great finisher or shooter, and his lack of shooting makes it tougher for him to finish. He shot 28% from three last year and 22% this season from 3. He shot 48% from twos this season. His free throws did improve from last season to this season from 69% to 78% on 3 fga a game. His passing is incouraging because of his flashiness (tough passes that he make) but it also a concern because of his decision making (tough passes he TRIES to take). His assist to turnover ratio is 4.1 ast to 2.5 turnovers (1.64 translate to fraction). You want your assist to turnover ration to be 3 to 1 or higher (3.0 in fractions form) anything below 2 is considered bad. And these are the major flags with him along with not being an elite athlete to overcome his deficiencies (He is an ok athlete, not bad, but not elite). He is going to have to become a much better all around skilled player. He is going to have to improve on his shooting everywhere on the court. His subpar shooting is going to really look bad vs the big athletes in the NBA.

I noticed a lot he is matched up on a bigger player, and i am not sure if that is the defensive strategy or the matchups the offense is trying to get. A lot of context i do not know yet.

No one in the NBA is going to defend him way out here to allow him the space to beat you off the dribble and screen. They are going to sit back, help off of him and dare him to score.




Now that being said I am not advocating not to draft him, but you will have to look at him like the Heat did Jovic. Saraf will likely not be player ready to play for a year or two. The player that fits his profile ceiling would be SGA type of player (not saying quality but type). It is going to take him TIME to hopefully figure things out. He is likely not a plug and play player. He would be a project. And this is likely why he remains a 2nd round prospect.

And here are the goods so I do not seem like I am just harping on him. He has good size and frame. His best skills seems to be in the fullcourt. He looks like he has a good knack for steals 1.3 steals a game. Shows he has potential to be a good defender. I praise him for what he tries to do, because in order to get good, gotta try and do it. But he does need to learn what he can and can not do and work on what his advantages he truly has like his size and length. I would highly suggest he look at Luka and SGA players who know how to his size and leverage instead of speed. His shooting form doesnt look bad, so there should be a path on him learning how to shoot. But HE HAS to learn how to shoot to make him a threat anywhere else.

[greg4012]

So I wasnt going to analyze too much on the foreign players, because there is too much I do not know about many of the international leagues. Meaning I do not know what the epectations are of players at his age, and not sure how stats may differ because of how they are used. But since many in here really intrigued by Saraf I took a dive.

He is an intriging prospect because his size and the position he plays. Great height and length and shows a lot of potential with crafty ball hanlding skills. However, he looks to be very raw. He is a flashy player. So yes his highlights can look good. But that is also one of his problems, he tries to over do the flashiness and many times he cant finish and gets himself in bad position. He is not a great finisher or shooter, and his lack of shooting makes it tougher for him to finish. He shot 28% from three last year and 22% this season from 3. He shot 48% from twos this season. His free throws did improve from last season to this season from 69% to 78% on 3 fga a game. His passing is incouraging because of his flashiness (tough passes that he make) but it also a concern because of his decision making (tough passes he TRIES to take). His assist to turnover ratio is 4.1 ast to 2.5 turnovers (1.64 translate to fraction). You want your assist to turnover ration to be 3 to 1 or higher (3.0 in fractions form) anything below 2 is considered bad. And these are the major flags with him along with not being an elite athlete to overcome his deficiencies (He is an ok athlete, not bad, but not elite). He is going to have to become a much better all around skilled player. He is going to have to improve on his shooting everywhere on the court. His subpar shooting is going to really look bad vs the big athletes in the NBA.

I noticed a lot he is matched up on a bigger player, and i am not sure if that is the defensive strategy or the matchups the offense is trying to get. A lot of context i do not know yet.

No one in the NBA is going to defend him way out here to allow him the space to beat you off the dribble and screen. They are going to sit back, help off of him and dare him to score.




Now that being said I am not advocating not to draft him, but you will have to look at him like the Heat did Jovic. Saraf will likely not be player ready to play for a year or two. The player that fits his profile ceiling would be SGA type of player (not saying quality but type). It is going to take him TIME to hopefully figure things out. He is likely not a plug and play player. He would be a project. And this is likely why he remains a 2nd round prospect.

And here are the goods so I do not seem like I am just harping on him. He has good size and frame. His best skills seems to be in the fullcourt. He looks like he has a good knack for steals 1.3 steals a game. Shows he has potential to be a good defender. I praise him for what he tries to do, because in order to get good, gotta try and do it. But he does need to learn what he can and can not do and work on what his advantages he truly has like his size and length. I would highly suggest he look at Luka and SGA players who know how to his size and leverage instead of speed. His shooting form doesnt look bad, so there should be a path on him learning how to shoot. But HE HAS to learn how to shoot to make him a threat anywhere else.

Can't recall the last 19 year old PG prospect that had a 3:1 a:to ratio entering the NBA draft

As a sophomore, James Harden was at 4.2 apg to 3.4 topg (1.23 ratio)

As a freshman, Trae Young was at 8.7:5.2 (1.67)

SGA was at 5.1:2.7 (1.89)

Luka was at 5:2.1 (2.38)

Haliburton, as a sophomore, was at 6.5:2.8 (2.32)

As a junior, Curry was at 5.6:3.7 (1.5)--freshman season at 2.8:2.8 (1.0)

Fox was at 4.6:2.4 (1.9)

Ja as a sophomore was at 10:5.2 (1.9)

Cade Cunningham was at 3.5:4 (0.88)

Point God himself, Chris Paul, was at 2.26 as a freshman and 2.35 as a soph

[MettaWorldPanda]

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I’m willing to wait on Saraf to develop. Sign or trade for a vet guard one year deal or expiring. Sign Mitchell. Bring Dragic on coaching staff.

[twix2500]

So I wasnt going to analyze too much on the foreign players, because there is too much I do not know about many of the international leagues. Meaning I do not know what the epectations are of players at his age, and not sure how stats may differ because of how they are used. But since many in here really intrigued by Saraf I took a dive.

He is an intriging prospect because his size and the position he plays. Great height and length and shows a lot of potential with crafty ball hanlding skills. However, he looks to be very raw. He is a flashy player. So yes his highlights can look good. But that is also one of his problems, he tries to over do the flashiness and many times he cant finish and gets himself in bad position. He is not a great finisher or shooter, and his lack of shooting makes it tougher for him to finish. He shot 28% from three last year and 22% this season from 3. He shot 48% from twos this season. His free throws did improve from last season to this season from 69% to 78% on 3 fga a game. His passing is incouraging because of his flashiness (tough passes that he make) but it also a concern because of his decision making (tough passes he TRIES to take). His assist to turnover ratio is 4.1 ast to 2.5 turnovers (1.64 translate to fraction). You want your assist to turnover ration to be 3 to 1 or higher (3.0 in fractions form) anything below 2 is considered bad. And these are the major flags with him along with not being an elite athlete to overcome his deficiencies (He is an ok athlete, not bad, but not elite). He is going to have to become a much better all around skilled player. He is going to have to improve on his shooting everywhere on the court. His subpar shooting is going to really look bad vs the big athletes in the NBA.

I noticed a lot he is matched up on a bigger player, and i am not sure if that is the defensive strategy or the matchups the offense is trying to get. A lot of context i do not know yet.

No one in the NBA is going to defend him way out here to allow him the space to beat you off the dribble and screen. They are going to sit back, help off of him and dare him to score.




Now that being said I am not advocating not to draft him, but you will have to look at him like the Heat did Jovic. Saraf will likely not be player ready to play for a year or two. The player that fits his profile ceiling would be SGA type of player (not saying quality but type). It is going to take him TIME to hopefully figure things out. He is likely not a plug and play player. He would be a project. And this is likely why he remains a 2nd round prospect.

And here are the goods so I do not seem like I am just harping on him. He has good size and frame. His best skills seems to be in the fullcourt. He looks like he has a good knack for steals 1.3 steals a game. Shows he has potential to be a good defender. I praise him for what he tries to do, because in order to get good, gotta try and do it. But he does need to learn what he can and can not do and work on what his advantages he truly has like his size and length. I would highly suggest he look at Luka and SGA players who know how to his size and leverage instead of speed. His shooting form doesnt look bad, so there should be a path on him learning how to shoot. But HE HAS to learn how to shoot to make him a threat anywhere else.

Can't recall the last 19 year old PG prospect that had a 3:1 a:to ratio entering the NBA draft

As a sophomore, James Harden was at 4.2 apg to 3.4 topg (1.23 ratio)

As a freshman, Trae Young was at 8.7:5.2 (1.67)

SGA was at 5.1:2.7 (1.89)

Luka was at 5:2.1 (2.38)

Haliburton, as a sophomore, was at 6.5:2.8 (2.32)

As a junior, Curry was at 5.6:3.7 (1.5)--freshman season at 2.8:2.8 (1.0)

Fox was at 4.6:2.4 (1.9)

Ja as a sophomore was at 10:5.2 (1.9)

Cade Cunningham was at 3.5:4 (0.88)

Point God himself, Chris Paul, was at 2.26 as a freshman and 2.35 as a soph

Did I say he couldn't become a good passer? Pointing out what he is good and not good at. Most of these player were scorers in college. Sarah best skill is his passing which is below everyone you mentioned except Cade

Trae Young's college scouting report,

A significant point of discussion was his high number of turnovers. He led the NCAA in turnovers per game (5.2) during his freshman year at the University of Oklahoma. This was attributed to his risk-taking nature and tendency to force passes. While his passing vision and court creativity were highly praised, the turnovers were seen as a potential area for improvement.

[greg4012]

So I wasnt going to analyze too much on the foreign players, because there is too much I do not know about many of the international leagues. Meaning I do not know what the epectations are of players at his age, and not sure how stats may differ because of how they are used. But since many in here really intrigued by Saraf I took a dive.

He is an intriging prospect because his size and the position he plays. Great height and length and shows a lot of potential with crafty ball hanlding skills. However, he looks to be very raw. He is a flashy player. So yes his highlights can look good. But that is also one of his problems, he tries to over do the flashiness and many times he cant finish and gets himself in bad position. He is not a great finisher or shooter, and his lack of shooting makes it tougher for him to finish. He shot 28% from three last year and 22% this season from 3. He shot 48% from twos this season. His free throws did improve from last season to this season from 69% to 78% on 3 fga a game. His passing is incouraging because of his flashiness (tough passes that he make) but it also a concern because of his decision making (tough passes he TRIES to take). His assist to turnover ratio is 4.1 ast to 2.5 turnovers (1.64 translate to fraction). You want your assist to turnover ration to be 3 to 1 or higher (3.0 in fractions form) anything below 2 is considered bad. And these are the major flags with him along with not being an elite athlete to overcome his deficiencies (He is an ok athlete, not bad, but not elite). He is going to have to become a much better all around skilled player. He is going to have to improve on his shooting everywhere on the court. His subpar shooting is going to really look bad vs the big athletes in the NBA.

I noticed a lot he is matched up on a bigger player, and i am not sure if that is the defensive strategy or the matchups the offense is trying to get. A lot of context i do not know yet.

No one in the NBA is going to defend him way out here to allow him the space to beat you off the dribble and screen. They are going to sit back, help off of him and dare him to score.




Now that being said I am not advocating not to draft him, but you will have to look at him like the Heat did Jovic. Saraf will likely not be player ready to play for a year or two. The player that fits his profile ceiling would be SGA type of player (not saying quality but type). It is going to take him TIME to hopefully figure things out. He is likely not a plug and play player. He would be a project. And this is likely why he remains a 2nd round prospect.

And here are the goods so I do not seem like I am just harping on him. He has good size and frame. His best skills seems to be in the fullcourt. He looks like he has a good knack for steals 1.3 steals a game. Shows he has potential to be a good defender. I praise him for what he tries to do, because in order to get good, gotta try and do it. But he does need to learn what he can and can not do and work on what his advantages he truly has like his size and length. I would highly suggest he look at Luka and SGA players who know how to his size and leverage instead of speed. His shooting form doesnt look bad, so there should be a path on him learning how to shoot. But HE HAS to learn how to shoot to make him a threat anywhere else.

Can't recall the last 19 year old PG prospect that had a 3:1 a:to ratio entering the NBA draft

As a sophomore, James Harden was at 4.2 apg to 3.4 topg (1.23 ratio)

As a freshman, Trae Young was at 8.7:5.2 (1.67)

SGA was at 5.1:2.7 (1.89)

Luka was at 5:2.1 (2.38)

Haliburton, as a sophomore, was at 6.5:2.8 (2.32)

As a junior, Curry was at 5.6:3.7 (1.5)--freshman season at 2.8:2.8 (1.0)

Fox was at 4.6:2.4 (1.9)

Ja as a sophomore was at 10:5.2 (1.9)

Cade Cunningham was at 3.5:4 (0.88)

Point God himself, Chris Paul, was at 2.26 as a freshman and 2.35 as a soph

Did I say he couldn't become a good passer? Pointing out what he is good and not good at. Most of these player were scorers in college. Sarah best skill is his passing which is below everyone you mentioned except Cade

Trae Young's college scouting report,

A significant point of discussion was his high number of turnovers. He led the NCAA in turnovers per game (5.2) during his freshman year at the University of Oklahoma. This was attributed to his risk-taking nature and tendency to force passes. While his passing vision and court creativity were highly praised, the turnovers were seen as a potential area for improvement.

Just providing context to the standard for good passers to go from prospects to players in NBA. Obviously a lot goes into it. But, a 3:1 a:to ratio among 18-19 year old NBA prospects is nearly unprecedented regardless of league or competition level.

Also, Saraf is not below everyone mentioned (you'll notice I solely mentioned the premier passing star guards in the NBA, so not exactly a low bar to meet).

His 1.6 ato ratio is actually above Cade, junior year Curry (and fresh-soph curry), James Harden (soph and fresh). It's comparable with SGA, Ja and Fox (higher assist percentage than SGA and Fox). Also has a better ato ratio than freshman Brunson, fresh-junior Lillard, Maxey, Jamal Murray, etc.

He's a pretty damn legit passing prospect. Still plenty prove and improve both as a facilitator, scorer and defender. Just had to chime in to characterize that he is not lacking relative to a standard met by other top guard prospects.

[twix2500]

Can't recall the last 19 year old PG prospect that had a 3:1 a:to ratio entering the NBA draft

As a sophomore, James Harden was at 4.2 apg to 3.4 topg (1.23 ratio)

As a freshman, Trae Young was at 8.7:5.2 (1.67)

SGA was at 5.1:2.7 (1.89)

Luka was at 5:2.1 (2.38)

Haliburton, as a sophomore, was at 6.5:2.8 (2.32)

As a junior, Curry was at 5.6:3.7 (1.5)--freshman season at 2.8:2.8 (1.0)

Fox was at 4.6:2.4 (1.9)

Ja as a sophomore was at 10:5.2 (1.9)

Cade Cunningham was at 3.5:4 (0.88)

Point God himself, Chris Paul, was at 2.26 as a freshman and 2.35 as a soph

Did I say he couldn't become a good passer? Pointing out what he is good and not good at. Most of these player were scorers in college. Sarah best skill is his passing which is below everyone you mentioned except Cade

Trae Young's college scouting report,

A significant point of discussion was his high number of turnovers. He led the NCAA in turnovers per game (5.2) during his freshman year at the University of Oklahoma. This was attributed to his risk-taking nature and tendency to force passes. While his passing vision and court creativity were highly praised, the turnovers were seen as a potential area for improvement.

Just providing context to the standard for good passers to go from prospects to players in NBA. Obviously a lot goes into it. But, a 3:1 a:to ratio among 18-19 year old NBA prospects is nearly unprecedented regardless of league or competition level.

You are not providing context because you are comparing players whos games and even positions were different. On here Saraf is on people radar specifically because of his passing. His passing is not good. Its not even in the okay range, its well below bad.

When you grading a player passing as a true point guard to provide better context because many do not understand the assist to turnover ratio.

2 > Bad
2< Ok <3
3< Good

[greg4012]

Read on Twitter

I’m willing to wait on Saraf to develop. Sign or trade for a vet guard one year deal or expiring. Sign Mitchell. Bring Dragic on coaching staff.

Def appears to see the whole court. I usually like seeing young guard prospects pushing the limits a little

[greg4012]

Did I say he couldn't become a good passer? Pointing out what he is good and not good at. Most of these player were scorers in college. Sarah best skill is his passing which is below everyone you mentioned except Cade

Just providing context to the standard for good passers to go from prospects to players in NBA. Obviously a lot goes into it. But, a 3:1 a:to ratio among 18-19 year old NBA prospects is nearly unprecedented regardless of league or competition level.

You are not providing context because you are comparing players whos games and even positions were different. On here Saraf is on people radar specifically because of his passing. His passing is not good. Its not even in the okay range, its well below bad.

When you grading a player passing as a true point guard to provide better context because many do not understand the assist to turnover ratio.

Bad 2 >
Ok 2<3
Good 3<

Objectively wrong. Unless no young PG prospect is ever good. Is it your contention that there hasn't been a "Good" young passing guard prospect enter the draft in years? Or that Luka, Harden, Trae, Lamelo were not "Good" passing PG prospects?

You should never be assessing 18-19 year old guard prospects as if their stats are what will translate apples to apples. It's identifying traits and applying projection of scalability and progress to the NBA game in conjunction with the sort of development typical for players in early 20s.

I def appreciate your point about looking at a prospect thru the lens of what are the skillsets they provide. Saraf is actually a pretty high rate scorer tho. Shooting needs to continue on his current progression for any real NBA viability. His C&S numbers are promising, his pull-up 3 ball needs to catch up.

[twix2500]

Lets compare players who roles and profile to Ben Saraf are similar coming to the NBA.

Ben Saraf 6'5 ht,
12.8 pts, 48% 2p%, 22% 3p%, 2.2 rbs, 1.3 stls, 4.6 ast to 2.5 to (1.64)

Shai Gilgous-Alexander 6'4.5 ht
14.4 pts, 50% 2p%, 40% 3p%, 4.1 rbs, 1.6 stls, 5.1 ast to 2.7 to (1.84)

Lamelo Ball 6'6 ht
17.0 pts, 45% 2p%, 25% 3p%, 7.6 rbs, 1.6 stls, 6.8 ast to 2.5 to (2.72)

Lonzo Ball 6'6 ht
14.6 pts, 73% 2p%, 41% 3p%, 6.0 rbs, 1.8 stls, 7.6 ast to 2.5 to (3.04)



Assist to Turnover Ratio grading.
2 > Bad
2< Ok <3
3< Good

[twix2500]

Just providing context to the standard for good passers to go from prospects to players in NBA. Obviously a lot goes into it. But, a 3:1 a:to ratio among 18-19 year old NBA prospects is nearly unprecedented regardless of league or competition level.

You are not providing context because you are comparing players whos games and even positions were different. On here Saraf is on people radar specifically because of his passing. His passing is not good. Its not even in the okay range, its well below bad.

When you grading a player passing as a true point guard to provide better context because many do not understand the assist to turnover ratio.

Bad 2 >
Ok 2<3
Good 3<

Objectively wrong. Unless no young PG prospect is ever good. Is it your contention that there hasn't been a "Good" young passing guard prospect enter the draft in years? Or that Luka, Harden, Trae, Lamelo were not "Good" passing PG prospects?

You should never be assessing 18-19 year old guard prospects as if their stats are what will translate apples to apples. It's identifying traits and applying projection of scalability and progress to the NBA game in conjunction with the sort of development typical for players in early 20s.

I def appreciate your point about looking at a prospect thru the lens of what are the skillsets they provide. Saraf is actually a pretty high rate scorer tho. Shooting needs to continue on his current progression for any real NBA viability. His C&S numbers are promising, his pull-up 3 ball needs to catch up.

Anything below 2 is bad. The range from bad to good is 2 to 3. The closer you get to 2 the more of a concern your passing becomes, the closer you get to 3 the less concer of you passing becomes. Saraf is WELL below 2. Two is the point of concern, not 3.

So I wasnt going to analyze too much on the foreign players, because there is too much I do not know about many of the international leagues. Meaning I do not know what the epectations are of players at his age, and not sure how stats may differ because of how they are used. But since many in here really intrigued by Saraf I took a dive.

He is an intriging prospect because his size and the position he plays. Great height and length and shows a lot of potential with crafty ball hanlding skills. However, he looks to be very raw. He is a flashy player. So yes his highlights can look good. But that is also one of his problems, he tries to over do the flashiness and many times he cant finish and gets himself in bad position. He is not a great finisher or shooter, and his lack of shooting makes it tougher for him to finish. He shot 28% from three last year and 22% this season from 3. He shot 48% from twos this season. His free throws did improve from last season to this season from 69% to 78% on 3 fga a game. His passing is incouraging because of his flashiness (tough passes that he make) but it also a concern because of his decision making (tough passes he TRIES to take). His assist to turnover ratio is 4.1 ast to 2.5 turnovers (1.64 translate to fraction). You want your assist to turnover ration to be 3 to 1 or higher (3.0 in fractions form) anything below 2 is considered bad. And these are the major flags with him along with not being an elite athlete to overcome his deficiencies (He is an ok athlete, not bad, but not elite). He is going to have to become a much better all around skilled player. He is going to have to improve on his shooting everywhere on the court. His subpar shooting is going to really look bad vs the big athletes in the NBA.

[greg4012]

Lets compare players who roles and profile to Ben Saraf are similar coming to the NBA.

Ben Saraf 6'5 ht,
12.8 pts, 48% 2p%, 22% 3p%, 2.2 rbs, 1.3 stls, 4.6 ast to 2.5 to (1.64)

Shai Gilgous-Alexander 6'4.5 ht
14.4 pts, 50% 2p%, 40% 3p%, 4.1 rbs, 1.6 stls, 5.1 ast to 2.7 to (1.84)

Lonzo Ball 6'6 ht
14.6 pts, 73% 2p%, 41% 3p%, 6.0 rbs, 1.8 stls, 7.6 ast to 2.5 to (3.04)

Lamelo Ball 6'6 ht
17.0 pts, 45% 2p%, 25% 3p%, 7.6 rbs, 1.6 stls, 6.8 ast to 2.5 to (2.72)

Assist to Turnover Ratio grading.
2 > Bad
2< Ok <3
3< Good

Yup Lonzo Ball (a player 8 drafted ago) is virtually the only 18-19 year old first round guard prospect on record meeting your threshold to be a "good" passing prospect. And everything about Lonzo Ball's analytic profile was top tier. He was pretty much 1 of 1 in that regard.

Seems like a very flawed lens unless you truly believe there havent been any good passing prospects since then. And then, it's still flawed bc that's simply not true.

You mentioned previously the difficulty of assessing international prospects due to not having good gauge on context of league's/competition. Thats definitely an important qualifier. For instance, Lamelo played in the Australian NBL prior to the draft. THat league is FAR inferior to the German leage and Eurocup competition in which Saraf played this past season. Here's a good way to contextualize that with a player Heat fans should be familiar with:

After Miami drafted James Ennis in the 2nd round of the 2013 NBA draft, they sent him overseas to play in the Australian NBL for a season. In that season, he came in 3rd in NBL MVP voting while putting up 21.5 ppg, 7 rpg, 2 apg, and 2.3 stocks per game. After flaming out of the NBA a few seasons later, Ennis went to a Russian pro league that is lower tier than the German league and averaged 13 ppg.

In raw stat comparison, it's pretty important to account for minutes per game. In these euro leagues, it's typical for players to be part of a deeper rotation and thus not usually push 30+ mpg. Saraf averages under 24 mpg for Ratiopharm. His per 36 numbers are actually very similar to Lamelo Ball's season in the NBL playing against far worse competition. Check out the per 36 stat comparison for pre-draft seasons of Saraf, Lamelo, and Luka (for elite tier context--Luka played in even better comp than Saraf, and WAY better than Lamelo).

https://www.tankathon.com/players/compare?players=ben-saraf--lamelo-ball--luka-doncic