Miami Heat 2016 Offseason Thread; "It will be fun in July"- July-er(Part XIII)

[BBallFreak]

[/b]

Revisionist history? The question was simple, "did Gerald Green take minutes from Jrich and Tyler early on before Tyler got hurt". And both revisionist and ACTUAL history agree with the facts.

One of the points Rex was making is that there is a chance that Spo pulls another vet over the future(hasleem/Beasley..amare/Hassan..green/Jrich TJ) and that in the end it will be all be for nothing cause we wont keep Waiters if he fails and won't pay him if he succeeds. The only thing we do know is that he'll be taking away developmental minutes.

Had you considered that J-Rich and Tyler don't get where they are WITHOUT Green? Had you considered that maybe they needed to progress, to show how hungry they were, to earn time, rather than having it handed to them? Maybe they had to beat him before they could beat anyone else.

Revisionist history, perhaps, but how many countless prospects have been thrown in before they were ready, only to busy completely because their confidence was shattered?

Unless you're behind the scenes and have a sense for what those guys did in practice, you're just being ridiculous...

The only thing ridiculous is the lack of reading comprehension by you and those who gave you an and+1.

Again... I will say this as slow and as elementary as I can. The only question was whether or not Gerald Green.... Nevermind screw this, if you're gonna bash people with your strong opinions, you might wanna follow along better.

So, basically, let the kids play even if they don't earn it...

[orphicwhip]

So many guys on one year deals wanting to shine to increase their market value for next offseason....when the only focus this year should be to develop Winslow/Jrich/TJ/Hassan etc

I give it until December until someone starts complaining about minutes and then we have to worry about the locker room not turning to ****...


sigh

[BBallFreak]

Maybe if they were better vets.

Hey, if you can't beat out Gerald Green, how are you going to beat out a better vet?

If you can't beat out Waiters we have bigger problems

Agreed. So what's the harm in looking?

Pg: Dragic / Johnson / Weber
Sg: Richardson / Waiters / McGruder
Sf: Winslow / J. Johnson / Ellington
Pf: Bosh / Williams / Haslem
Cc: Whiteside / Reed

Let them fight it out, and may the best 8-10 men win time...

[CanesHeatFins]

How many minutes did Gerald Green steal from Rich and pre-injury Tyler last season?

Alot actually. So much so that Jrich was in the Dleague and tyler was seeing less time than Chalmers and Green.

Rich himself said he was in over his head to start the season and wasn't ready... specifically when it came to backing up at point guard. Said the best thing that happened to him was that early stint in the D-League.

You seemed to conveniently forget that the express purpose of Riley trading Chalmers was to free up minutes for Tyler who averaged 22.2 min per game in December before his first injury (pre-Chalmers trade) and 28.2 min per game in January before his shoulder injury forced him to have surgery.

LOL you're the one who posed the question, as if Green didn't take any minutes, when in fact he did take minutes. No one here stated Spo messed up by playing Green over JRich or Tyler, everyone here understands why the Green over Jrich decision was made early on last year. You guys might wanna dial back that straw man argument anytime now.

P.s.
Jrich is a high character guy what's he gonna say? "Spo really screwed the pooch by giving my p.t. to a weedhead".

[contract]

Had you considered that J-Rich and Tyler don't get where they are WITHOUT Green?

No. There's no reason why they couldn't have competed with each other for time.

And if neither was ready? Then what? just throw one of them out there, anyway?

I'm sorry, but I want my young players to have to beat out vets for playing time. I don't care if you're Tyler Johnson or Karl Anthony-Towns, earn it!

I will never understand why some people choose to coddle youth. Earn your time. This is the NBA, not Pop Warner, where everyone gets a trophy. You want to play? Prove you deserve to...

Was GG ready?

[contract]

How many minutes did Gerald Green steal from Rich and pre-injury Tyler last season?

You seemed to conveniently forget that the express purpose of Riley trading Chalmers was to free up minutes for Tyler who averaged 22.2 min per game in December before his first injury (pre-Chalmers trade) and 28.2 min per game in January before his shoulder injury forced him to have surgery.

That's not accurate. Chalmers was dumped to help avoid the repeater tax.

[CanesHeatFins]

Had you considered that J-Rich and Tyler don't get where they are WITHOUT Green? Had you considered that maybe they needed to progress, to show how hungry they were, to earn time, rather than having it handed to them? Maybe they had to beat him before they could beat anyone else.

Revisionist history, perhaps, but how many countless prospects have been thrown in before they were ready, only to busy completely because their confidence was shattered?

Unless you're behind the scenes and have a sense for what those guys did in practice, you're just being ridiculous...

The only thing ridiculous is the lack of reading comprehension by you and those who gave you an and+1.

Again... I will say this as slow and as elementary as I can. The only question was whether or not Gerald Green.... Nevermind screw this, if you're gonna bash people with your strong opinions, you might wanna follow along better.

So, basically, let the kids play even if they don't earn it...

Instead of doubling down, you might wanna go back and read.

Not that I implied it or even gave a single opinion on this "not letting the kids earn it" thing you've made up in your head. But I guess that I'll play along a little. You do realize that's part of developing young talent sometimes means giving "unearned" p.t. right?

[BBallFreak]

No. There's no reason why they couldn't have competed with each other for time.

And if neither was ready? Then what? just throw one of them out there, anyway?

I'm sorry, but I want my young players to have to beat out vets for playing time. I don't care if you're Tyler Johnson or Karl Anthony-Towns, earn it!

I will never understand why some people choose to coddle youth. Earn your time. This is the NBA, not Pop Warner, where everyone gets a trophy. You want to play? Prove you deserve to...

Was GG ready?

Clearly, at the beginning, he was more ready than them. Again, they got better (thankfully), he got worse. Nothing wrong with healthy competition to bring the youngsters on...

[BBallFreak]

The only thing ridiculous is the lack of reading comprehension by you and those who gave you an and+1.

Again... I will say this as slow and as elementary as I can. The only question was whether or not Gerald Green.... Nevermind screw this, if you're gonna bash people with your strong opinions, you might wanna follow along better.

So, basically, let the kids play even if they don't earn it...

Instead of doubling down, you might wanna go back and read.

Not that I implied it or even gave a single opinion on this "not letting the kids earn it" thing you've made up in your head. But I guess that I'll play along a little. You do realize that's part of developing young talent sometimes means giving "unearned" p.t. right?

No, I don't. I absolutely do not agree with that. Make them earn it. If they can't beat out an inferior player like Green, what business do they have stepping on the court?

[PizzaLord305]

Lets not forget one other fact: waiters has never played for a coach anywhere near as good as Spo. If he can get through to Hassan, manage the big three experience, and deal with some of the other stuff he's had to deal with, I'm sure he can carve out a nice place for waiters this season.

[contract]

And if neither was ready? Then what? just throw one of them out there, anyway?

I'm sorry, but I want my young players to have to beat out vets for playing time. I don't care if you're Tyler Johnson or Karl Anthony-Towns, earn it!

I will never understand why some people choose to coddle youth. Earn your time. This is the NBA, not Pop Warner, where everyone gets a trophy. You want to play? Prove you deserve to...

Was GG ready?

Clearly, at the beginning, he was more ready than them. Again, they got better (thankfully), he got worse. Nothing wrong with healthy competition to bring the youngsters on...

I've been hearing that nonsense in several sports for decades. The reality is that undeserving veterans get playing time over better young players because of that very mindset. You have to make them earn it. If the young players are better, they HAVE earned it.

[contract]

No, I don't. I absolutely do not agree with that. Make them earn it. If they can't beat out an inferior player like Green, what business do they have stepping on the court?

They aren't allowed to beat out the crappy vet. That's part of the process.

[Cmon_Son-_-]

Jrich and Winslow played a ton of minutes with Iso Joe, Deng and D-Wade on the team. Waiters and Ellington aren't going to stunt any development.

[QUIZ]

No, I don't. I absolutely do not agree with that. Make them earn it. If they can't beat out an inferior player like Green, what business do they have stepping on the court?

They aren't allowed to beat out the crappy vet. That's part of the process.

Why is that exactly? TJ and Waiters are the same age and TJ is making more money. I don't see why you're assuming that Spo will give Dion priority.

[Prince Ali]

Jrich and Winslow played a ton of minutes with Iso Joe, Deng and D-Wade on the team. Waiters and Ellington aren't going to stunt any development.

Some people just want something to complain about

[Mos_Heat]

Lets not forget one other fact: waiters has never played for a coach anywhere near as good as Spo. If he can get through to Hassan, manage the big three experience, and deal with some of the other stuff he's had to deal with, I'm sure he can carve out a nice place for waiters this season.

Not sure that Spo is better than Donovan. Even so, i don't think there is a huge gap between them

[BBallFreak]

I've been hearing that nonsense in several sports for decades. The reality is that undeserving veterans get playing time over better young players because of that very mindset. You have to make them earn it. If the young players are better, they HAVE earned it.

How do they prove their better, though? On the practice floor.

If they're earning it there, I agree, they should be on the court. But that's not what is being said. What's being said is stuff like, "We never should have signed Green. Those two guys (Johnson and Richardson) should have competed against each other for time." Bull! I don't want crap competing against crap. I want a guy who can beat out Gerald Green and prove he deserves court time.

PRACTICE! WE'RE TALKING ABOUT PRACTICE!

It's a real thing, folks! It tells coaches a lot. It's like the vetting process in running for President. The coaches film it, study it, and make decisions on playing time based on what they see from the players. They vet them - carefully - because their jobs depend on it. That's not to say a coach can't overthink things, or rely too much on veterans, but that wasn't the case last year. Those two guys played a lot. And this year? We signed a 24 year old to a bargain basement deal in hopes of polishing him off and turning him into an NBA player. He'll either earn his opportunities playing against some good young players, or he'll fall by the way side.

Either way, we'll be better because these guys will push each other...

[contract]

No, I don't. I absolutely do not agree with that. Make them earn it. If they can't beat out an inferior player like Green, what business do they have stepping on the court?

They aren't allowed to beat out the crappy vet. That's part of the process.

Why is that exactly? TJ and Waiters are the same age and TJ is making more money. I don't see why you're assuming that Spo will give Dion priority.

Good question. I don't know, but it happens all the time.

I don't assume that Waiters will get priority. I'm just speaking in general about the way coaches like to screw with young players.

[BFRESH44]

Jrich and Winslow played a ton of minutes with Iso Joe, Deng and D-Wade on the team. Waiters and Ellington aren't going to stunt any development.

Say it again.

[PizzaLord305]

Lets not forget one other fact: waiters has never played for a coach anywhere near as good as Spo. If he can get through to Hassan, manage the big three experience, and deal with some of the other stuff he's had to deal with, I'm sure he can carve out a nice place for waiters this season.

Not sure that Spo is better than Donovan. Even so, i don't think there is a huge gap between them

Woah, no way? Really lol? I don't think Donovan is anywhere near Spo. I actually thought Donovan was pretty dreadful except for that San Antonio series. Spo is one of the leagues best, man. We're lucky to have him.