Question: Trade #2 Pick to the Bulls?

[TheGreatPooter]

meh, we could probably still get a better package of players. We really need a second guy who we can count of to shoot 50 percent and get us 20 ppg. And more importantly he needs to be able to pass. From the outside, out the double teams from the post, whatever. hej ust needs to be able to pass. Our interior game is so unskilled, beasley could probably easily come right away and get us 2 0 points. we need a second killer. wade needs help.


BEASLEY BEASLEY

(PLZ PROVE YOU CAN PASS AND PLAY DEFENSE OR ELSE YOULL NEVER PLAY FOR MIAMI)

BEASLEY BEASTLY

[Heat3]

we aren't trading our pick! if it was #3 or lower then maybe, but no way to top 2. we sure as hell won't take other people's garbage for our #2.

[Miami's Finest]

It's funny, every fan comes up with trades where they give up a bunch of good assets for a great asset.

In basketball, you win because of your stars. Depth is something you fill in later once you have a core in place. It's easier to convince good veterans and role players to sign to a team with proven stars.

Everyone does this. I do it in my fantasy football league every year, offer someone a bunch of good players for a star. 9 times out of 10, the team that walks away from the deal with the single best player ends up better off.

This is obviously all true. I viewed this as a more unique scenario in which the general rule might not apply because:

(a) The Heat already have the coveted superstar in Wade;

(b) The Heat already have an allstar in Marion;

(c) The Heat's roster, other than a decent Haslem, is otherwise very poor from top to bottom with multiple starters roles to fills as well as practically the entire bench;

(d) If they don't get back to contender status very quickly, Wade might leave;

(e) The Bulls don't just have standard role players to offer, they have very high quality role players in great numbers and diversity that other teams just can't offer;

(f) The trade would result in a Miami roster that, in my opinion, would be right at the top of the East along with Boston next season with a legit shot to immediately return to the Finals.

I viewed it as a unique scenario where the standard "don't accept a collection of lesser assets for a potential star asset" rule of thumb might not apply.

In my opinion, if Miami does a version of my trade, they are instant contenders and still relatively young. If they don't, then they are going to be decent next year, but nothing special even in the East, and will be as thin and hole-y as a slice of Kraft swiss.

3-4 years from now would it pay off for Miami if they kept the pick? I'd wager it would. But thats only if Wade sticks around to find out.

Why would any team trade a 19 year old franchise type player for a bunch of role players? Bulls fans and reporters make no sense. Every great team has 3 all-star type players, finding the role players is easy. B/c Chad Ford thinks Riley doesn't like Beasley means nothing, in fact it means Riley probably wants him. Also taking on the Bulls role players greatly increases the chances of Wade leaving, pairing him up with a young star like Beasley would make him stay.

[Heat11114]

The trade would result in a Miami roster that, in my opinion, would be right at the top of the East along with Boston next season with a legit shot to immediately return to the Finals.

So a bunch of role players from a 30 win team and Marion+Wade make the Heat contenders? Interesting...

[Flash3]

It's funny, every fan comes up with trades where they give up a bunch of good assets for a great asset.

In basketball, you win because of your stars. Depth is something you fill in later once you have a core in place. It's easier to convince good veterans and role players to sign to a team with proven stars.

Everyone does this. I do it in my fantasy football league every year, offer someone a bunch of good players for a star. 9 times out of 10, the team that walks away from the deal with the single best player ends up better off.

This is obviously all true. I viewed this as a more unique scenario in which the general rule might not apply because:

(a) The Heat already have the coveted superstar in Wade;

(b) The Heat already have an allstar in Marion;

(c) The Heat's roster, other than a decent Haslem, is otherwise very poor from top to bottom with multiple starters roles to fills as well as practically the entire bench;

(d) If they don't get back to contender status very quickly, Wade might leave;

(e) The Bulls don't just have standard role players to offer, they have very high quality role players in great numbers and diversity that other teams just can't offer;

(f) The trade would result in a Miami roster that, in my opinion, would be right at the top of the East along with Boston next season with a legit shot to immediately return to the Finals.

I viewed it as a unique scenario where the standard "don't accept a collection of lesser assets for a potential star asset" rule of thumb might not apply.

In my opinion, if Miami does a version of my trade, they are instant contenders and still relatively young. If they don't, then they are going to be decent next year, but nothing special even in the East, and will be as thin and hole-y as a slice of Kraft swiss.

3-4 years from now would it pay off for Miami if they kept the pick? I'd wager it would. But thats only if Wade sticks around to find out.

if he doesn't, miami would potentially have a franchise player to replace him, in the same manner they would have one in his prime when wade retires.

[D'Lo]

I see us trading the pick with the Clippers for Brand if we dont get whoever Riley wants.

[Rodrizzle]

I just dont see why the Heat would trade away a potential 19 year old superstar on a rookie salary for role players making that much more and ruining our FA chances down the road. Id rather stick with the draft pick and build around that.
Players swarm to play with stars. Just look at the celtics this year, would Posey have signed for a couple of million or PJ Brown or Cassell for the minimum unless they had the stars there?
Heck would Zo have wanted a buy out and sign here for the minimum if we werent a contender with Wade and Shaq here?

Id rather stick with the pick and a "cheap" potential superstar.

[mxgreen]

The only way the heat trade the 2 overall pick is because they get a Allstar and late lotto. Brand and 7# would do the trick but it seems like LA is not willing to talk. Beasley-Wade-Marion for a season and next year go after A Max player.

I like your third sentence, your second not so much.

[perz260]

Agree u pick Beasley and team him up with Wade. Brand is coming off major surgery and hasn't proved he can stay healthy for a whole year. Plus he is going to be 30 and i would think that after trading shaq we are trying to get younger and more athletic.

[DuckIII]

The trade would result in a Miami roster that, in my opinion, would be right at the top of the East along with Boston next season with a legit shot to immediately return to the Finals.

So a bunch of role players from a 30 win team and Marion+Wade make the Heat contenders? Interesting...

As a Miami fan, you know as well as anyone that the Bulls players are far better than their 33 win anomaly last year.

[dflash3]

-= original quote snipped =-



As a Miami fan, you know as well as anyone that the Bulls players are far better than their 33 win anomaly last year.

It will be a new season with several new additions as well as the elimination of others. The Heat aren't going to throw away a franchise player in Wade for a bunch of role players to improve from a horrible team to a mediocre one.

Not to mention that the trade proposal made by the Bulls writer has the Heat giving up our pick as well as Wade, so the Heat team will be even worse than the current Bulls team. It'll be the new role players minus any players that approaches the talent level of players like Deng or Gordan.

Also the rebuilding process is an attempt to move a team back into contention and not a quick fix that will make the team slightly better.

And the Heat could trade their pick for the Bulls role players and surround them around Wade and Marion, but they would be better off taking the risk on their draft pick. After all, he could turn out to be a stud who would contribute to the team while being on a cheap rookie contract.

[Miami's Finest]

-= original quote snipped =-



As a Miami fan, you know as well as anyone that the Bulls players are far better than their 33 win anomaly last year.

They are still role players, Riley has shown he can find the complimentary pieces easy but finding legit all-stars like we hope Beasley can be is what will make us contenders. Bulls fan and reporters are way too hyperactive and annoying with their crazy trades, be happy you got the #1 pick hope your new coach is good and stop dreaming that Riley is going to turn into a fool GM and help you guys out.

[CoolD]

I could see Riley trading the pick, but not with Chicago. For one, they play in the Eastern Conference. Why would Riley want to potentially give Chicago another Superstar potential talent, to play along Rose or Beasley? Or vice versa, but in the end, Chicago end's up with both.

I could see Beasley being traded to a team like Memphis if all the stars align. If Mayo is still around. I could see him dumping Blount, receiving Mike Miller, and one of their young points.

Or something to that effect.

Riley would still like to have another young asset, that he thinks has All Star potential(Mayo) while dumping Blount on a team, that plays in the West.

[LEIF]

depends on how much Riley likes Mike Miller and Kyle Lowry really, does he like them enough to swap Beasley for Mayo AND will Mayo even be available at 5? (he could go as high as 3 to Minnesota)


that is the most interesting scenario and would also require us spending $$ on our frontcourt to have success. Alexander Johnson, Earl Barron and Joel Anthony wont cut it but might have to do for one more year if we decide NOT to spend our MLE this offseason.

Wade-Marion-Mayo-MMiller-Haslem is a nice core though

[Heat11114]

Mike Miller? Eh, i'd rather include Blount and get back an expiring contract+ one of their young players. That would leave us with roughly 20 mil in cap space for 09.

[CoolD]

depends on how much Riley likes Mike Miller and Kyle Lowry really, does he like them enough to swap Beasley for Mayo AND will Mayo even be available at 5? (he could go as high as 3 to Minnesota)


that is the most interesting scenario and would also require us spending $$ on our frontcourt to have success. Alexander Johnson, Earl Barron and Joel Anthony wont cut it but might have to do for one more year if we decide NOT to spend our MLE this offseason.

Wade-Marion-Mayo-MMiller-Haslem is a nice core though

I think the key part to that trade. Is getting rid of Blount.

Mayo for Beasley alone is not good enough. Mayo and Mike Miller for Beasley, might be closer, but would still hesitate. But getting rid of Blount, while getting Mayo and Mike Miller, might just do it for Beasley.

[DuckIII]

It will be a new season with several new additions as well as the elimination of others. The Heat aren't going to throw away a franchise player in Wade for a bunch of role players to improve from a horrible team to a mediocre one.

Not to mention that the trade proposal made by the Bulls writer has the Heat giving up our pick as well as Wade, so the Heat team will be even worse than the current Bulls team. It'll be the new role players minus any players that approaches the talent level of players like Deng or Gordan.

Also the rebuilding process is an attempt to move a team back into contention and not a quick fix that will make the team slightly better.

And the Heat could trade their pick for the Bulls role players and surround them around Wade and Marion, but they would be better off taking the risk on their draft pick. After all, he could turn out to be a stud who would contribute to the team while being on a cheap rookie contract.

Just to clarify, you realize I'm not talking about trading Wade, right? I'm only talking about your #2 pick and bad contracts.

As to the last paragraph, if you look at my post at the top of page 2 of this thread you'll see that I basically agree with you. I think Beasley is a terrific fit with Wade.

The only reason I'm bringing any of this up is that a perception exists that Riley isn't thrilled with Beasley and is considering trading out. Maybe that is all misdirection and he, in fact, loves Beasley. But for the purposes of what I've asked here, we are assuming that Riley is not interested in keeping that pick. If he's not, then I think what I've proposed is as good or better than anything you are going to find.

[DuckIII]

-= original quote snipped =-



They are still role players, Riley has shown he can find the complimentary pieces easy but finding legit all-stars like we hope Beasley can be is what will make us contenders. Bulls fan and reporters are way too hyperactive and annoying with their crazy trades, be happy you got the #1 pick hope your new coach is good and stop dreaming that Riley is going to turn into a fool GM and help you guys out.

This reminds me why I rarely post on other teams' boards. The entire premise of my thread is based on the idea that Riley does, in fact, want to trade the pick according to multiple media reports - including some from Miami. If he does want to trade down or out(thats called a premise), then I've offered - politely and rationally - what I think might be a great deal for Miami and Chicago and given detailed explanations as to the thinking behind it.

Spare me the "hyperactive/annoying/crazy/dreaming/fool" rhetoric. I was just looking to discuss it, which some of you have been nice enough to do.

[unowen85]

I don't think it's a great deal for Chicago. Rebuilding through the draft hasn't worked for Chicago. And now you want the first two picks in this draft. How many lottery picks do the Bulls have on their roster? It's time to start taking things serious and trade away those assets for a real player.

[DuckIII]

I don't think it's a great deal for Chicago. Rebuilding through the draft hasn't worked for Chicago. And now you want the first two picks in this draft. How many lottery picks do the Bulls have on their roster? It's time to start taking things serious and trade away those assets for a real player.

I would normally agree. But the Bulls have been trying to accomplish a consolidation trade for 2 straight years now and have been unable to do so. In a two player draft, if you can get both players, then maybe you go for it. Its a risk.

But the Bulls have so many high quality, though not star level, players that they can afford to take that risk moreso than most teams:

Hinrich
Gordon
Deng
Thabo Sefolosha (don't sleep on this guy, he's going to be damn good)
Tyrus Thomas
Joakim Noah
Andres Nocioni
Drew Gooden
#1 pick in draft

That is 9 pieces (I didn't even mention Larry Hughes due to his contract, or 10-12 minute role players like Aaron Gray). Normally I wouldn't offer multiple quality, established, young veteran lottery picks for 1 guy who isn't even a Shaq-like lock for superstardom, but I think the Bulls are in a position to roll those dice due to the ridiculous depth of the roster.

Believe me, when I wrote that trade idea post on the Bulls board, a good number of fans said I was out of my mind (a good number agreed with me though, as well).