2023 NBA Finals, The Last Stand: Heat @ Nuggets, 6/12 @ 8:30pm

[3ballbomber]

Not sure the point of this question, but last time Bam scored 30 was March 4, so fairly obvious answer here.

Without the 3-ball, Bam just isn't going to score 30 very often. That last game he scored 30 required him to go 10-12 from the field AND 10-12 from the ft line.

The point for the question is we can usually be confident heading into any game, vs anybody when we have Jimmy. But w/ our boy not being able to be himself this series, going into gm5, can we as Heat fans be confident we can take this back to Miami if we have no faith Jimmy can score in the high 20's-30+, which is what it'll take to get us back in this series.If he wasn't able to deliver the scoring in gm3 and then in a crucial gm4 how do we be confident moving forward.

Again, no knock on Jimbo. Just stating our reality right now. I'm still pulling for this team to win one more at the vry least.

That's why I wasn't sure what point you were trying to make. As pedestrian as Jimmy's been, gun to my head I'd still put money on him to score 30 instead of Bam, simply because scoring 30 just isn't something Bam does (nor do we ask that of him).

Yeah i'd prob still back Jimmy. Bam's fully healthy & can hardly get over 24-25pts

[HEATVols865]

The point for the question is we can usually be confident heading into any game, vs anybody when we have Jimmy. But w/ our boy not being able to be himself this series, going into gm5, can we as Heat fans be confident we can take this back to Miami if we have no faith Jimmy can score in the high 20's-30+, which is what it'll take to get us back in this series.If he wasn't able to deliver the scoring in gm3 and then in a crucial gm4 how do we be confident moving forward.

Again, no knock on Jimbo. Just stating our reality right now. I'm still pulling for this team to win one more at the vry least.

That's why I wasn't sure what point you were trying to make. As pedestrian as Jimmy's been, gun to my head I'd still put money on him to score 30 instead of Bam, simply because scoring 30 just isn't something Bam does (nor do we ask that of him).

Yeah i'd prob still back Jimmy. Bam's fully healthy & can hardly get over 24-25pts

Bam should stop handling the goddamn ball. Dude sucks dribbling the ball and his defense hasn’t been that good. You trade him for an elite big any day of the week.


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[HEATVols865]

Come on now. Why is he somehow the only one off limits now? This is so bizarre. Idk how he became the most protected player on the team, but it’s pathetic. We can’t even ask him to be a THREAT to score 30 a night (without somebody stepping in to post defensive stats to excuse him), let alone do it. But we can ask Jimmy to score 40 a night over 3 months, or he quit and checked out. We can’t ask him to not turn the ball over once every four times he touches it, but I have to hear everybody else called trash every time they make a mistake. It’s ridic.

Me “putting down Bam” is not even that. I have nothing against him. I would trade him now for a star when his value is highest yes, but I’d just as happily keep him if the trade doesn’t make sense or he massively improves. The only thing I’m giving him is the same type of critique we give everyone else

Yes bam hasn’t been perfect, he’s missing easy middys and bunnies and he’s turning over the ball, we get that. But he has by far been our best player in this series and it’s not even close. Bam is literally imposing his will and being aggressive because he wants to win BAD. We rarely see an aggresive bam at this altitude and it actually makes me smile because of how dedicated he is to getting a ring. Adding onto the fact that he is our best defender by far. So if he’s leading the team on offense and defense don’t you think he deserves some slack too? When have we seen bam try this hard on both ends?

I disagree that he’s been far and away the best player this series (but nobody, Jimmy included, has separated themselves and been good enough to argue against it so I can see your viewpoint). It’s just the standards are higher for Jimmy. Rightfully of course, he’s a much better player.

But when we get off the rails where were railing on our best player while protecting from criticism a player who has far less of a load, it should be okay to say something. If everyone was **** on Bam and letting Jimmy off the hook, I’d speak up then. Of course that’d never happen since Bam literally has paid fans to do whatever to push him. But still. It doesn’t sit right with me how the conversation is turning on Jimmy, especially questioning his heart and will. Any criticism I have for Bam is far less harsh than that, and the same for any other player on this team. It’s just we suddenly can’t critique him anymore, just everyone else.

Jimmy brought on and deserves every ounce of criticism and thrashing he gets. He talks so much chit and now he can’t back it up. Twice in the finals he crumbles, which shows that Jimmy is a #2 and never a #1. He will entertain you, carry the team but when the team needs him to carry them over the last and hardest hurdle, he’s as soft as butter. His defense last game when he WALKED on a defensive switch and left Jokic wide open; was disgusting and showed me all I needed to know about Jimmy: soft mentally; selfish, self-centered and when things do go his way, he pouts and won’t help the team. He hides and hopes no one notices he’s missing.


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[dolphinatik]

In for epic night. Either a new champ is crowned or another page in our story gets written.

[HEATVols865]

In for epic night. Either a new champ is crowned or another page in our story gets written.

Another epic Finals failure in the book of Spoelstra.
2 of 6 in NBA Finals, that’s hot garbage.


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[Wiltside]

Yes bam hasn’t been perfect, he’s missing easy middys and bunnies and he’s turning over the ball, we get that. But he has by far been our best player in this series and it’s not even close. Bam is literally imposing his will and being aggressive because he wants to win BAD. We rarely see an aggresive bam at this altitude and it actually makes me smile because of how dedicated he is to getting a ring. Adding onto the fact that he is our best defender by far. So if he’s leading the team on offense and defense don’t you think he deserves some slack too? When have we seen bam try this hard on both ends?

I disagree that he’s been far and away the best player this series (but nobody, Jimmy included, has separated themselves and been good enough to argue against it so I can see your viewpoint). It’s just the standards are higher for Jimmy. Rightfully of course, he’s a much better player.

But when we get off the rails where were railing on our best player while protecting from criticism a player who has far less of a load, it should be okay to say something. If everyone was **** on Bam and letting Jimmy off the hook, I’d speak up then. Of course that’d never happen since Bam literally has paid fans to do whatever to push him. But still. It doesn’t sit right with me how the conversation is turning on Jimmy, especially questioning his heart and will. Any criticism I have for Bam is far less harsh than that, and the same for any other player on this team. It’s just we suddenly can’t critique him anymore, just everyone else.

Jimmy brought on and deserves every ounce of criticism and thrashing he gets. He talks so much chit and now he can’t back it up. Twice in the finals he crumbles, which shows that Jimmy is a #2 and never a #1. He will entertain you, carry the team but when the team needs him to carry them over the last and hardest hurdle, he’s as soft as butter. His defense last game when he WALKED on a defensive switch and left Jokic wide open; was disgusting and showed me all I needed to know about Jimmy: soft mentally; selfish, self-centered and when things do go his way, he pouts and won’t help the team. He hides and hopes no one notices he’s missing.


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Jimmy averaged 26.2 points, 8.3 rebounds and 9.6 assists per game in the NBA Finals. He played Lebron to a stand still. Yeah he flamed out in game 6 after carrying us without Bam and Dragic majority of the series, but he was Herculean in that series for us against a team that was heavily favored.

He’s had a tough time in these finals but he’s still been OK. Our problem has been that everyone else outside of Bam hasn’t.

[Spacely]

Come on now. Why is he somehow the only one off limits now? This is so bizarre. Idk how he became the most protected player on the team, but it’s pathetic. We can’t even ask him to be a THREAT to score 30 a night (without somebody stepping in to post defensive stats to excuse him), let alone do it. But we can ask Jimmy to score 40 a night over 3 months, or he quit and checked out. We can’t ask him to not turn the ball over once every four times he touches it, but I have to hear everybody else called trash every time they make a mistake. It’s ridic.

Me “putting down Bam” is not even that. I have nothing against him. I would trade him now for a star when his value is highest yes, but I’d just as happily keep him if the trade doesn’t make sense or he massively improves. The only thing I’m giving him is the same type of critique we give everyone else

Yes bam hasn’t been perfect, he’s missing easy middys and bunnies and he’s turning over the ball, we get that. But he has by far been our best player in this series and it’s not even close. Bam is literally imposing his will and being aggressive because he wants to win BAD. We rarely see an aggresive bam at this altitude and it actually makes me smile because of how dedicated he is to getting a ring. Adding onto the fact that he is our best defender by far. So if he’s leading the team on offense and defense don’t you think he deserves some slack too? When have we seen bam try this hard on both ends?

I disagree that he’s been far and away the best player this series (but nobody, Jimmy included, has separated themselves and been good enough to argue against it so I can see your viewpoint). It’s just the standards are higher for Jimmy. Rightfully of course, he’s a much better player.

But when we get off the rails where were railing on our best player while protecting from criticism a player who has far less of a load, it should be okay to say something. If everyone was **** on Bam and letting Jimmy off the hook, I’d speak up then. Of course that’d never happen since Bam literally has paid fans to do whatever to push him. But still. It doesn’t sit right with me how the conversation is turning on Jimmy, especially questioning his heart and will. Any criticism I have for Bam is far less harsh than that, and the same for any other player on this team. It’s just we suddenly can’t critique him anymore, just everyone else.

So who has been the best Heat player in the series then if you disagree? Far less of a load? You realize bam has to play elite defense every night or we are cooked? It’s clear that Jimmy is either hurt or his head isn’t fully into the game, I get that; and there is nothing we can do about it. I’m not really giving too much flak to Jimmy because I understand the circumstances but like I said don’t discredit bam; because he’s been giving it his all. Actually though, bam did have an injury this playoffs too.

[Kobewade11]

Fwiw Jimmy’s numbers for the series are right around his season averages. Its not that he’s been horrible but more is needed with a chip on the line. Denver’s best players have risen to the occasion, ours have not..that includes Bam, he hasn’t played with the consistent force needed to win a title. What I would like to see tonight is some sort of fire from Jimmy, and for the majority of Bam’s Fg attempts to come at the rim in attacking fashion. If the leaders lead we just might be able to extend this thing.

[Spacely]

Bam had 8 turnovers last game. Let's not applaud too much.

Duncan Robinson has been the best player in the Finals. Yes, that's how bad it's been.

Lets not troll here, he’s been great but no.

[QUIZ]

We’re most likely not going to win tonight and after the last two games it’d probably be unrealistic to expect us to win, but man… would it be awesome and hilarious if we managed to pull it off.

It’s happened before, in the 2020 finals we looked dead in the water and Jimmy pulled out that game for us with an absolute masterclass performance. Maybe Jimmy can’t summon that level of play right now but our team is better than that 2020 team was after all the injuries.

Just get one. Keep the season alive

[QUIZ]

Fwiw Jimmy’s numbers for the series are right around his season averages. Its not that he’s been horrible but more is needed with a chip on the line. Denver’s best players have risen to the occasion, ours have not..that includes Bam, he hasn’t played with the consistent force needed to win a title. What I would like to see tonight is some sort of fire from Jimmy, and for the majority of Bam’s Fg attempts to come at the rim in attacking fashion. If the leaders lead we just might be able to extend this thing.

The biggest difference between pre injury Jimmy and post injury has been the efficiency.

Jimmy has a TS% of 52.5% in the finals, that’s far below league average. By contrast in the regular season he was one of the most efficient players in the league at around 65%. Obviously in the bucks series he was even better than that.

[iamoti]

Don't let us get one lol

Honestly i just want to get it back to Miami, even if we lose in 6. Just win this one.

[HEATVols865]

Realistically: say we win tonight and somehow manage to win game 6. There is no way in hell we can win a game 7 in Denver is there?

I want us to win tonight but I’m also sick and tired of seeing teams hoisting trophies on our home court.


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[3ammy3uck3ts]

Bam had 8 turnovers last game. Let's not applaud too much.

Duncan Robinson has been the best player in the Finals. Yes, that's how bad it's been.

[3ammy3uck3ts]

Did I just read Bam is fully healthy?

Shoulder, hamstring, and hip injuries in these playoffs. He’s still wearing the shoulder sleeve.

Man, people just make **** up lol

[3ammy3uck3ts]

That's why I wasn't sure what point you were trying to make. As pedestrian as Jimmy's been, gun to my head I'd still put money on him to score 30 instead of Bam, simply because scoring 30 just isn't something Bam does (nor do we ask that of him).

Yeah i'd prob still back Jimmy. Bam's fully healthy & can hardly get over 24-25pts

Bam should stop handling the goddamn ball. Dude sucks dribbling the ball and his defense hasn’t been that good. You trade him for an elite big any day of the week.


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His defense has been about as good as it gets, name every big in the league clearly better than Bam that also impacts winning more and gives the team a better chance at the championship.

We’re playing 1 right now and then you have 1 other that’s arguable but that’s it. I’m curious to see your list though

[IceColdCubano]

Nothing this series has shown me that we will win this game, sorry its just not happening. We don't have the horses to keep up, doubtful we have another 50% shooting night out of our guys. Denver smells blood, they just went into our house and smoked us twice. These guys aren't the Celtics or Bucks, they aren't magically dropping the ball in the 4th quarter and just gifting us a run to let us win it. They will continue to score easy uninterrupted baskets all game long, from under the basket, from the three point line, from mid range they will score all around the court without much restraint from us. On the other hand, our baskets will be hard, difficult, and brutally earned every time down the lane. We will go in cold streaks that will kill us, but Denver will keep chugging along with easy scores at the basket during their cold spells of shooting which negate their scoring droughts unlike us.

I feel like either one of Jimmy or Bam will have a high scoring game going out in a loss tonight, but neither one will be efficient. Both Jokic & Murray will have amazing games, very efficient games. It will get away from us middle of the third quarter, and they won't ever look back. Miami will be sitting their starters early in the fourth quarter.

[3ammy3uck3ts]

Nothing this series has shown me that we will win this game, sorry its just not happening. We don't have the horses to keep up, doubtful we have another 50% shooting night out of our guys. Denver smells blood, they just went into our house and smoked us twice. These guys aren't the Celtics or Bucks, they aren't magically dropping the ball in the 4th quarter and just gifting us a run to let us win it. They will continue to score easy uninterrupted baskets all game long, from under the basket, from the three point line, from mid range they will score all around the court without much restraint from us. On the other hand, our baskets will be hard, difficult, and brutally earned every time down the lane. We will go in cold streaks that will kill us, but Denver will keep chugging along with easy scores at the basket during their cold spells of shooting which negate their scoring droughts unlike us.

We’re going to lose by double digits

[SA37]

Fwiw Jimmy’s numbers for the series are right around his season averages. Its not that he’s been horrible but more is needed with a chip on the line. Denver’s best players have risen to the occasion, ours have not..that includes Bam, he hasn’t played with the consistent force needed to win a title. What I would like to see tonight is some sort of fire from Jimmy, and for the majority of Bam’s Fg attempts to come at the rim in attacking fashion. If the leaders lead we just might be able to extend this thing.

This.

Butler's numbers have been "quiet"; he just hasn't been able to impact the game in ways we've seen him do so in other series or other years.

[3ballbomber]

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