Miami Heat Offseason Thread Vol. 4: Fraudfather Snoozin 2.0

[Lilseb93]

I can handle a rebuild. I support teams that usually suck every year. Dolphins have been rebuilding for years. Marlins always suck. The Panthers used to be one of the worst organizations in pro sports. The Hurricanes have been irrelevant for over 2 decades now.

The problem I have is being mediocre with no assets. At least with a rebuild, there is hope for the future. It's just frustrating how short-sighted this front office has been after 2014. It's undoubtedly a good organization and could always be worse, but that doesn't excuse the bad decisions this FO has consistently made with contracts. I think Spo and the coaching staff are what keep the wheels turning. We make the Finals because Spo is a hell of a coach. There just have been too many crippling contracts given to average players.

[AirP.]

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Highsmith is a very good defender, and if he gets paid maybe he'll settle down on the offensive end instead of trying to create more than he should. He could end up being PJ Tucker 2.0 if he can start limiting himself on the offensive end.

[ZoStrong]

Constant goal post moving unfortunately. When the deadline gets here we’ll be talking about the moves we’re going to make in the summer lol

Such is life. Better to be forever optimistic n enjoy the ride than "the sky is falling" types like you.

Oh no I’m overly optimistic. I’d go as far as saying I’m the most delusional on this forum in terms of what moves I think Pat is going to make each summer/deadline because that’s the Pat I grew up accustomed to seeing which also probably leads to me being more disappointed than most and being critical of him as well.

Im one of the few that thinks we would’ve beat Boston if we were fully healthy because I just believe they’re soft and we have their number when it matters most when all hands are on deck.

That being said, knowing we’ve needed a big move for an all star guy to put us over the top for several years and not being able to get it done has been pretty deflating.

Read what u wrote. You are contradicting yourself, lol. Not all big trades work out. Sometimes it's a blessing that we dodged some big trades.

Also, the Big Three era is gone w the new apron economy. You get your two stars and you surround n add good talents

[AirP.]

I can handle a rebuild. I support teams that usually suck every year. Dolphins have been rebuilding for years. Marlins always suck. The Panthers used to be one of the worst organizations in pro sports. The Hurricanes have been irrelevant for over 2 decades now.

The problem I have is being mediocre with no assets. At least with a rebuild, there is hope for the future. It's just frustrating how short-sighted this front office has been after 2014. It's undoubtedly a good organization and could always be worse, but that doesn't excuse the bad decisions this FO has consistently made with contracts. I think Spo and the coaching staff are what keep the wheels turning. We make the Finals because Spo is a hell of a coach. There just have been too many crippling contracts given to average players.

Just think where this team would be had they drafted Maxey, Quickly or even Bane in 2020 instead of Precious. Maybe not overpay players like Robinson or Herro, let them go to RFA(at least Herro) and just match any 3+ year contract he can get, I highly doubt he(Herro, not sure Robinson was an UFA) would have gotten what Miami gave him.

Mistakes will always be made by all franchises, and I see rebuilds more like FOs buying time because they don't have to make any good decisions for years. Minnesota now has Edwards, but it took them missing the playoffs 14 straight years to even get close to building a good team again. Philly tanked so hard the league stepped in and it hasn't resulted in one ECF. Then there's Detroit, who knows when they'll be good enough to consider being a play-in game.

[Lilseb93]

I really want the Heat to start their rebuild, but based on how a lot of Heat reporters and Heat fans seem to be in the 7th circle of hell over just being mediocre (after years of playoff success and multiple rings in living memory) idk if they could handle it lol. Rebuilds often don't work as quickly as expected, more than 2 years of top of the lottery play might take Barry and those Five Reasons guys out lol.

I lived in NC for a long time, our sleepy pat offseasons would be PEAK years for the Hornets/Bobcats. Just TERRIBLE basketball year after year. Maybe getting a competitive season every 5 years or so, only for Gerald Wallace/Al Jefferson/Kemba/Lamelo to get hurt and sink the season. And if they're healthy, they end up getting sent packing by the Heat in the first round. On top of that, there's MJ's terrible/cheap ass ownership, usually terrible GMs, and a constant parade of mid to terrible coaches. THAT is a terrible organization.

I can only speak for myself. I just want them to pick a direction. I'm cool with a rebuild if they commit to it and stop crippling themselves with horrible contracts. They put themselves in the worst situation. Too good to rebuild, too bad to win anything. They have no draft picks, no space, and injury-prone players just to be a play-in team. We're not the Pistons or Hornets. There will always be worst franchises but this is literally the worst spot to be in. At least when you are horrible, you'll likely have a high lottery pick. We're too good of a franchise to rebuild 5 years. We just need a refresh. We just have to suck it up and wait for them to get out of this mess and hope they don't do it again.

[Lilseb93]

I can handle a rebuild. I support teams that usually suck every year. Dolphins have been rebuilding for years. Marlins always suck. The Panthers used to be one of the worst organizations in pro sports. The Hurricanes have been irrelevant for over 2 decades now.

The problem I have is being mediocre with no assets. At least with a rebuild, there is hope for the future. It's just frustrating how short-sighted this front office has been after 2014. It's undoubtedly a good organization and could always be worse, but that doesn't excuse the bad decisions this FO has consistently made with contracts. I think Spo and the coaching staff are what keep the wheels turning. We make the Finals because Spo is a hell of a coach. There just have been too many crippling contracts given to average players.

Just think where this team would be had they drafted Maxey, Quickly or even Bane in 2020 instead of Precious. Maybe not overpay players like Robinson or Herro, let them go to RFA(at least Herro) and just match any 3+ year contract he can get, I highly doubt he(Herro, not sure Robinson was an UFA) would have gotten what Miami gave him.

Mistakes will always be made by all franchises, and I see rebuilds more like FOs buying time because they don't have to make any good decisions for years. Minnesota now has Edwards, but it took them missing the playoffs 14 straight years to even get close to building a good team again. Philly tanked so hard the league stepped in and it hasn't resulted in one ECF. Then there's Detroit, who knows when they'll be good enough to consider being a play-in game.

We're too good of a franchise to go through long stretches of a rebuild like that. People just want a refresh. That's probably the better word.

[3ammy3uck3ts]

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[AirP.]

I can handle a rebuild. I support teams that usually suck every year. Dolphins have been rebuilding for years. Marlins always suck. The Panthers used to be one of the worst organizations in pro sports. The Hurricanes have been irrelevant for over 2 decades now.

The problem I have is being mediocre with no assets. At least with a rebuild, there is hope for the future. It's just frustrating how short-sighted this front office has been after 2014. It's undoubtedly a good organization and could always be worse, but that doesn't excuse the bad decisions this FO has consistently made with contracts. I think Spo and the coaching staff are what keep the wheels turning. We make the Finals because Spo is a hell of a coach. There just have been too many crippling contracts given to average players.

Just think where this team would be had they drafted Maxey, Quickly or even Bane in 2020 instead of Precious. Maybe not overpay players like Robinson or Herro, let them go to RFA(at least Herro) and just match any 3+ year contract he can get, I highly doubt he(Herro, not sure Robinson was an UFA) would have gotten what Miami gave him.

Mistakes will always be made by all franchises, and I see rebuilds more like FOs buying time because they don't have to make any good decisions for years. Minnesota now has Edwards, but it took them missing the playoffs 14 straight years to even get close to building a good team again. Philly tanked so hard the league stepped in and it hasn't resulted in one ECF. Then there's Detroit, who knows when they'll be good enough to consider being a play-in game.

We're too good of a franchise to go through long stretches of a rebuild like that. People just want a refresh. That's probably the better word.

Too good? All Miami's great seasons were because of Wade and his influence, either getting LeBron and Bosh to join him in Miami or sold Butler on Miami being the type of environment he was looking for, but that environment isn't for everyone. It's said Butler said he was sold 5 minutes into the meeting with Miami, kinda sounds like he just verified what he wanted to hear that Wade told him about. I'll give Riley a lot of credit for running the organization at a professional level and being able to jump on opportunities that Wade created for him.

I was a Bulls fan and had to come to the realization that wow, they've been NOTHING without Jordan. Who knows maybe they would have been if they didn't have the #1 pick D.Rose have a career changing injury or even #2 pick Jay Williams (another PG) have... a career ending injury. Chicago almost traded up to get D.Wade but #7 and Donyell Marshal was just too much to jump 3 spots for Toronto's pick to get local kid D.Wade.

Sadly, I've come to the conclusion that it's almost all about your best player in the NBA which I'm 99.999% all in on giving up everything for a top tier younger player but outside that, I'll stick with any high-level player until the wheels fall off because you never know when you'll find another one.

[ZoStrong]

I can handle a rebuild. I support teams that usually suck every year. Dolphins have been rebuilding for years. Marlins always suck. The Panthers used to be one of the worst organizations in pro sports. The Hurricanes have been irrelevant for over 2 decades now.

The problem I have is being mediocre with no assets. At least with a rebuild, there is hope for the future. It's just frustrating how short-sighted this front office has been after 2014. It's undoubtedly a good organization and could always be worse, but that doesn't excuse the bad decisions this FO has consistently made with contracts. I think Spo and the coaching staff are what keep the wheels turning. We make the Finals because Spo is a hell of a coach. There just have been too many crippling contracts given to average players.

Just think where this team would be had they drafted Maxey, Quickly or even Bane in 2020 instead of Precious. Maybe not overpay players like Robinson or Herro, let them go to RFA(at least Herro) and just match any 3+ year contract he can get, I highly doubt he(Herro, not sure Robinson was an UFA) would have gotten what Miami gave him.

Mistakes will always be made by all franchises, and I see rebuilds more like FOs buying time because they don't have to make any good decisions for years. Minnesota now has Edwards, but it took them missing the playoffs 14 straight years to even get close to building a good team again. Philly tanked so hard the league stepped in and it hasn't resulted in one ECF. Then there's Detroit, who knows when they'll be good enough to consider being a play-in game.

We're too good of a franchise to go through long stretches of a rebuild like that. People just want a refresh. That's probably the better word.

There's no such thing as a long rebuild. Those are just bottom feeders who hit a jackpot like Minnesota w Edwards

[ZoStrong]

Just think where this team would be had they drafted Maxey, Quickly or even Bane in 2020 instead of Precious. Maybe not overpay players like Robinson or Herro, let them go to RFA(at least Herro) and just match any 3+ year contract he can get, I highly doubt he(Herro, not sure Robinson was an UFA) would have gotten what Miami gave him.

Mistakes will always be made by all franchises, and I see rebuilds more like FOs buying time because they don't have to make any good decisions for years. Minnesota now has Edwards, but it took them missing the playoffs 14 straight years to even get close to building a good team again. Philly tanked so hard the league stepped in and it hasn't resulted in one ECF. Then there's Detroit, who knows when they'll be good enough to consider being a play-in game.

We're too good of a franchise to go through long stretches of a rebuild like that. People just want a refresh. That's probably the better word.

Too good? All Miami's great seasons were because of Wade and his influence, either getting LeBron and Bosh to join him in Miami or sold Butler on Miami being the type of environment he was looking for, but that environment isn't for everyone. It's said Butler said he was sold 5 minutes into the meeting with Miami, kinda sounds like he just verified what he wanted to hear that Wade told him about. I'll give Riley a lot of credit for running the organization at a professional level and being able to jump on opportunities that Wade created for him.

I was a Bulls fan and had to come to the realization that wow, they've been NOTHING without Jordan. Who knows maybe they would have been if they didn't have the #1 pick D.Rose have a career changing injury or even #2 pick Jay Williams (another PG) have... a career ending injury. Chicago almost traded up to get D.Wade but #7 and Donyell Marshal was just too much to jump 3 spots for Toronto's pick to get local kid D.Wade.

Sadly, I've come to the conclusion that it's almost all about your best player in the NBA which I'm 99.999% all in on giving up everything for a top tier younger player but outside that, I'll stick with any high-level player until the wheels fall off because you never know when you'll find another one.

Come on, Zo n Timmy years were great, even tho it ended prematurely due to his kidney issues. But, yes, it's all about players. BUT, the players must fall into the right system, environment to blossom

[MettaWorldPanda]

Highsmith is 6’5 220 who should be playing the two spot but has no where near the offensive game to handle the two spot. He undercuts the lineup by him having to start at the 4. Even if he’s a lock down defender he hurts the overall lineup especially here with Bam and Butler. He’s better off going to Philly for both himself and us.

[AirP.]

Just think where this team would be had they drafted Maxey, Quickly or even Bane in 2020 instead of Precious. Maybe not overpay players like Robinson or Herro, let them go to RFA(at least Herro) and just match any 3+ year contract he can get, I highly doubt he(Herro, not sure Robinson was an UFA) would have gotten what Miami gave him.

Mistakes will always be made by all franchises, and I see rebuilds more like FOs buying time because they don't have to make any good decisions for years. Minnesota now has Edwards, but it took them missing the playoffs 14 straight years to even get close to building a good team again. Philly tanked so hard the league stepped in and it hasn't resulted in one ECF. Then there's Detroit, who knows when they'll be good enough to consider being a play-in game.

We're too good of a franchise to go through long stretches of a rebuild like that. People just want a refresh. That's probably the better word.

There's no such thing as a long rebuild. Those are just bottom feeders who hit a jackpot like Minnesota w Edwards

Right... because of a single player they should be a top team for the next 10-12 years. Just think if they hit the jackpot more often and I'm sure, the bad high picks they made were debated greatly, someone, probably just one person in power just leaned a little the wrong way and picked the wrong guy. Minnesota taking back Rubio and Flynn back-to-back in 2009 at #5 and #6 is up there with Philly acquiring 3 top 10 centers in the draft in consecutive years.

Golden State talked a lot of **** saying they were lightyears ahead of everyone because they got lucky, Draymond didn't play much until Lee had his injury in multiple seasons, Curry had to find a fix for his glass ankles and took less on his extension because of his glass ankles and during this time of prosperity, they had 3 near the top of the draft picks and basically missed on all 3 of them.

[AirP.]

We're too good of a franchise to go through long stretches of a rebuild like that. People just want a refresh. That's probably the better word.

Too good? All Miami's great seasons were because of Wade and his influence, either getting LeBron and Bosh to join him in Miami or sold Butler on Miami being the type of environment he was looking for, but that environment isn't for everyone. It's said Butler said he was sold 5 minutes into the meeting with Miami, kinda sounds like he just verified what he wanted to hear that Wade told him about. I'll give Riley a lot of credit for running the organization at a professional level and being able to jump on opportunities that Wade created for him.

I was a Bulls fan and had to come to the realization that wow, they've been NOTHING without Jordan. Who knows maybe they would have been if they didn't have the #1 pick D.Rose have a career changing injury or even #2 pick Jay Williams (another PG) have... a career ending injury. Chicago almost traded up to get D.Wade but #7 and Donyell Marshal was just too much to jump 3 spots for Toronto's pick to get local kid D.Wade.

Sadly, I've come to the conclusion that it's almost all about your best player in the NBA which I'm 99.999% all in on giving up everything for a top tier younger player but outside that, I'll stick with any high-level player until the wheels fall off because you never know when you'll find another one.

Come on, Zo n Timmy years were great, even tho it ended prematurely due to his kidney issues. But, yes, it's all about players. BUT, the players must fall into the right system, environment to blossom

Sure, those years were good, and Miami got to the ECF once in that era and lost a lot of 1st round outs.

I consider Miami one of the top organizations in the NBA with Riley in charge, but it does take a lot of luck, even if you're consistently solid as an organization.

[3ammy3uck3ts]

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[ZoStrong]

We're too good of a franchise to go through long stretches of a rebuild like that. People just want a refresh. That's probably the better word.

There's no such thing as a long rebuild. Those are just bottom feeders who hit a jackpot like Minnesota w Edwards

Right... because of a single player they should be a top team for the next 10-12 years. Just think if they hit the jackpot more often and I'm sure, the bad high picks they made were debated greatly, someone, probably just one person in power just leaned a little the wrong way and picked the wrong guy. Minnesota taking back Rubio and Flynn back-to-back in 2009 at #5 and #6 is up there with Philly acquiring 3 top 10 centers in the draft in consecutive years.

Golden State talked a lot of **** saying they were lightyears ahead of everyone because they got lucky, Draymond didn't play much until Lee had his injury in multiple seasons, Curry had to find a fix for his glass ankles and took less on his extension because of his glass ankles and during this time of prosperity, they had 3 near the top of the draft picks and basically missed on all 3 of them.

Edwards is good, but I guarantee you they won't be a top team for next 10 to 12 years. See, if he fell to Celtics, Lakers or Heat, yes, the odds are much better. That's where the organization part comes in.

[AirP.]

Highsmith is 6’5 220 who should be playing the two spot but has no where near the offensive game to handle the two spot. He undercuts the lineup by him having to start at the 4. Even if he’s a lock down defender he hurts the overall lineup especially here with Bam and Butler. He’s better off going to Philly for both himself and us.

He's a player Spoelstra can put on the court to guard the other team's best player outside of the center position and is getting better at hitting 3s to be a spacer, he just needs to quit trying to do nearly anything else other than catch and shoot and pass on the offensive end.

Who knows, maybe he tried to do more on offense to try to up his value in FA, maybe he calms down on this next contract.

[Daffy]

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Let's seal the deal....without hurting our future or losing anymore assets.

[MettaWorldPanda]

Highsmith is 6’5 220 who should be playing the two spot but has no where near the offensive game to handle the two spot. He undercuts the lineup by him having to start at the 4. Even if he’s a lock down defender he hurts the overall lineup especially here with Bam and Butler. He’s better off going to Philly for both himself and us.

He's a player Spoelstra can put on the court to guard the other team's best player outside of the center position and is getting better at hitting 3s to be a spacer, he just needs to quit trying to do nearly anything else other than catch and shoot and pass on the offensive end.

Who knows, maybe he tried to do more on offense to try to up his value in FA, maybe he calms down on this next contract.

It would be a lot more helpful if he was playing the two spot doing that but unfortunately it was always at the small ball 4 spot and we didn't have the size and scoring elsewhere to compensate for the overall lineup deficiency.

[Daffy]

Highsmith is 6’5 220 who should be playing the two spot but has no where near the offensive game to handle the two spot. He undercuts the lineup by him having to start at the 4. Even if he’s a lock down defender he hurts the overall lineup especially here with Bam and Butler. He’s better off going to Philly for both himself and us.

He's a player Spoelstra can put on the court to guard the other team's best player outside of the center position and is getting better at hitting 3s to be a spacer, he just needs to quit trying to do nearly anything else other than catch and shoot and pass on the offensive end.

Who knows, maybe he tried to do more on offense to try to up his value in FA, maybe he calms down on this next contract.

I'm all for bringing him back at the right price. With so many talented offensive wings in the league there is always a need for elite defensive wings even if that's all they bring.

[twix2500]

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Has Mario Hezonja figured things out?