Offseason thread vol 9 - RUN IT BYK

[AirP.]

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[3ammy3uck3ts]

Jimmys such a wild card that it wouldn’t surprise me if he shot near 40% from 3 on solid volume. I’m very encouraged by his workout videos this summer. His shot looks great and he’s letting it fly with confidence. Already looking for the next pass because he knows it’s going in. I realize it’s an empty gym but it’s encouraging. These summer workouts are usually him getting in mid range work, 95% of this summer has been 3 point shooting.

[3ammy3uck3ts]

If Jimmy becomes a good shooter there’s a solid chance he’s good value over the course of his entire contract. I think he knows this too

[3ammy3uck3ts]

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I need some Big Face attire

[KingDavid]

yo, can someone take Victor Oladipo away from this before he get himself in trouble?

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Lmao it does kinda look like him ngl

[Hallstar]

A lot of posters here have a bit of a Jay Bilas complex and can't deal with Herro's T-Rex arms, hence all the love for KZ.

In all seriousness, I think there is a mix of fear Herro won't end up being a star and a fear that not trading him for a proven vet will prove to have been a mistake. In other words, lots of FOMO and YOLO.

To a point I get it, but Herro has turned out to be better than advertised. He's WAY better than Winslow, Okpala, or Yurt, but you'd never know it reading this forum sometimes. I don't know if Herro will become an all-star or a perennial All-NBA guy -- honestly, I doubt it -- but 21-5-4 on 45-40-87 is outstanding and on par with Darius Garland, Jordan Poole, or Cj McCollum. Herro is as good of a prospect as you could possibly ask for at 22 years old.

Also it’s not like he will get paid crazy money, 30 mil is what Lowry is making. The Heat felt Lowry at what 36 years old, over weight and under sized is worth 30 million, using that logic, Herro for 30 mil at 22 years old is a bargain.

Lowry isn't a 30-million-dollar value, it was the cost to sign what available upgrade there was that summer since this franchise held back signing longer extensions (which cost them talent) for multiple years for the 2021 plan to get Giannis (which they were never going to get).

Unless Herro is giving up money to stay in Miami, LET THE MARKET DICTATE HIS PRICE BY LETTING HIM HIT RESTRICTED FREE AGENCY, if he does better next season cool, pay him, if he doesn't then that's something to think about without being locked in long term. It's actually quite possible nobody offers him a large amount with how much interest there was with him this season trying to get draft picks to acquire Mitchell or KD. Miami can match any offer Herro accepts, and the minimum length offer has to be 3 years so at the minimum Miami can have Herro 4 more season if they want without extending him early.

So now if we were trying to trade Herro for picks that he's not worth apparently, who was the main piece going out? Gabe Vincent? Herro not only had to be worth himself, but extra picks AND tell a team take on Duncan or Lowry. That's some heavy lifting.

KD was NEVER on the trade market, just like I predicted, and Riley/Ainge beef is long standing...we would have to overpay just on that. At the end of the day Herro was clearly the only player worth a damn on the market outside Jimmy and Bam since nobody else gets mentioned. Pay him 30 now or 35 later, but somebody will pay.

[AirP.]

Also it’s not like he will get paid crazy money, 30 mil is what Lowry is making. The Heat felt Lowry at what 36 years old, over weight and under sized is worth 30 million, using that logic, Herro for 30 mil at 22 years old is a bargain.

Lowry isn't a 30-million-dollar value, it was the cost to sign what available upgrade there was that summer since this franchise held back signing longer extensions (which cost them talent) for multiple years for the 2021 plan to get Giannis (which they were never going to get).

Unless Herro is giving up money to stay in Miami, LET THE MARKET DICTATE HIS PRICE BY LETTING HIM HIT RESTRICTED FREE AGENCY, if he does better next season cool, pay him, if he doesn't then that's something to think about without being locked in long term. It's actually quite possible nobody offers him a large amount with how much interest there was with him this season trying to get draft picks to acquire Mitchell or KD. Miami can match any offer Herro accepts, and the minimum length offer has to be 3 years so at the minimum Miami can have Herro 4 more season if they want without extending him early.

So now if we were trying to trade Herro for picks that he's not worth apparently, who was the main piece going out? Gabe Vincent? Herro not only had to be worth himself, but extra picks AND tell a team take on Duncan or Lowry. That's some heavy lifting.

KD was NEVER on the trade market, just like I predicted, and Riley/Ainge beef is long standing...we would have to overpay just on that. At the end of the day Herro was clearly the only player worth a damn on the market outside Jimmy and Bam since nobody else gets mentioned. Pay him 30 now or 35 later, but somebody will pay.

That's your opinion, I won't consider giving him anywhere near that amount, but I said the same exact thing last year about Duncan and Miami gave him the money and now he's a negative asset, this franchise LOVES to overpay its own players vs find out what the market value is (well, minus T.Johnson and they shouldn't have matched that). If it's about trying to win a championship, I'd rather go against Herro then have him on my team to win a playoff game, if a team has a decent iso scorer they'd pick whatever time they want to score by searching out Herro or Duncan, possibly Strus also but he seems to give better effort on that end of the court.

If he gets paid a lot by Miami hopefully he becomes a good long-term player for the franchise.

[Hallstar]

Lowry isn't a 30-million-dollar value, it was the cost to sign what available upgrade there was that summer since this franchise held back signing longer extensions (which cost them talent) for multiple years for the 2021 plan to get Giannis (which they were never going to get).

Unless Herro is giving up money to stay in Miami, LET THE MARKET DICTATE HIS PRICE BY LETTING HIM HIT RESTRICTED FREE AGENCY, if he does better next season cool, pay him, if he doesn't then that's something to think about without being locked in long term. It's actually quite possible nobody offers him a large amount with how much interest there was with him this season trying to get draft picks to acquire Mitchell or KD. Miami can match any offer Herro accepts, and the minimum length offer has to be 3 years so at the minimum Miami can have Herro 4 more season if they want without extending him early.

So now if we were trying to trade Herro for picks that he's not worth apparently, who was the main piece going out? Gabe Vincent? Herro not only had to be worth himself, but extra picks AND tell a team take on Duncan or Lowry. That's some heavy lifting.

KD was NEVER on the trade market, just like I predicted, and Riley/Ainge beef is long standing...we would have to overpay just on that. At the end of the day Herro was clearly the only player worth a damn on the market outside Jimmy and Bam since nobody else gets mentioned. Pay him 30 now or 35 later, but somebody will pay.

That's your opinion, I won't consider giving him anywhere near that amount, but I said the same exact thing last year about Duncan and Miami gave him the money and now he's a negative asset, this franchise LOVES to overpay its own players vs find out what the market value is (well, minus T.Johnson and they shouldn't have matched that). If it's about trying to win a championship, I'd rather go against Herro then have him on my team to win a playoff game, if a team has a decent iso scorer they'd pick whatever time they want to score by searching out Herro or Duncan, possibly Strus also but he seems to give better effort on that end of the court.

If he gets paid a lot by Miami hopefully he becomes a good long-term player for the franchise.

I'm not grading our draft picks against our polished turds, that's where we differ. Duncan, Tyler Johnson and whoever else put together couldn't trade for Herro. We still managed to get the first seed despite Bam and Jimmy missing significant time, and that wasn't by accident.

We didn't do so hot scoring 90 in the ECF either...TWICE. No defense is that good.

[AirP.]

So now if we were trying to trade Herro for picks that he's not worth apparently, who was the main piece going out? Gabe Vincent? Herro not only had to be worth himself, but extra picks AND tell a team take on Duncan or Lowry. That's some heavy lifting.

KD was NEVER on the trade market, just like I predicted, and Riley/Ainge beef is long standing...we would have to overpay just on that. At the end of the day Herro was clearly the only player worth a damn on the market outside Jimmy and Bam since nobody else gets mentioned. Pay him 30 now or 35 later, but somebody will pay.

That's your opinion, I won't consider giving him anywhere near that amount, but I said the same exact thing last year about Duncan and Miami gave him the money and now he's a negative asset, this franchise LOVES to overpay its own players vs find out what the market value is (well, minus T.Johnson and they shouldn't have matched that). If it's about trying to win a championship, I'd rather go against Herro then have him on my team to win a playoff game, if a team has a decent iso scorer they'd pick whatever time they want to score by searching out Herro or Duncan, possibly Strus also but he seems to give better effort on that end of the court.

If he gets paid a lot by Miami hopefully he becomes a good long-term player for the franchise.

I'm not grading our draft picks against our polished turds, that's where we differ. Duncan, Tyler Johnson and whoever else put together couldn't trade for Herro. We still managed to get the first seed despite Bam and Jimmy missing significant time, and that wasn't by accident.

We didn't do so hot scoring 90 in the ECF either...TWICE. No defense is that good.

Sure, and Miami did no favors for themselves offensively having Tucker at PF (he would have been an incredible backup PF or small ball center), it was nearly 4 on 5 most of the time with him on the court, PJs best attribute is something anyone can give... effort. If Miami can get solid defense and more diversified offensive play from a PF it'll help greatly.

[AirP.]

Spoiler:

[contract]

Some Heat fans have entered the realm of delusional...

Exactly.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/awards/smoy.html

Some guys (stars) you pay a ton of money to. Some guys (role players) you pay < DRob money. Some guys you sit back and watch as they sign with another team for ~ the veteran minimum. That 6th man award should not be a ticket to a huge contract regardless. 6th men don't break the bank and are frequently signed/re-signed to bargain deals and passed around the league like a fruit cake at Christmas.

Clarkson earned $12 mil last season, is earning $13 mil this season, and is owed $14 mil next season if he picks up his player option.

Harrell earned $6 mil for the Clippers his 6th man season, $9 mil the season after that from the Lakers, < $10 mil last season from Wizards/Hornets, and he just signed with the 76ers for peanuts.

Lou Williams earned $7 mil & $8 mil from the Clippers in the two seasons he won 6th man for them, then he earned $8 mil, $8 mil, and $5 mil last season.

Eric Gordon earned $12 mil his 6th man season, and then earned $13 mil, $13.5 mil, $14 mil, $17 mil, $18 mil, and is owed $20 mil & $21 mil these next two seasons.

Unless the Heat determine that Herro is a star player, he should not get a huge contract. He can heat up, but he has significant holes in his game. Giving Herro more than ~ $20 mil to $25 mil per will make him a neutral to negative asset. More than that range would just make it worse. Unless the Heat determine that Herro is a star player in the making, they need to hold the line on his salary or trade him.

[contract]

Don't tell me it's about money because you have a million aholes making a lot of it

You can't fit a million holes under the luxury tax line, so you need to be careful who you pay and how much.

[contract]

For the life of me, I don't know if I will ever be able to understand, all the herro hate

Help me... is it found within his name ... because he is white or Hispanic?
or is it in his game because he's a youth , not a good Defender or dribbler?

A lot of posters here have a bit of a Jay Bilas complex and can't deal with Herro's T-Rex arms, hence all the love for KZ.

In all seriousness, I think there is a mix of fear Herro won't end up being a star and a fear that not trading him for a proven vet will prove to have been a mistake. In other words, lots of FOMO and YOLO.

To a point I get it, but Herro has turned out to be better than advertised. He's WAY better than Winslow, Okpala, or Yurt, but you'd never know it reading this forum sometimes. I don't know if Herro will become an all-star or a perennial All-NBA guy -- honestly, I doubt it -- but 21-5-4 on 45-40-87 is outstanding and on par with Darius Garland, Jordan Poole, or Cj McCollum. Herro is as good of a prospect as you could possibly ask for at 22 years old.

Also it’s not like he will get paid crazy money, 30 mil is what Lowry is making. The Heat felt Lowry at what 36 years old, over weight and under sized is worth 30 million, using that logic, Herro for 30 mil at 22 years old is a bargain.

One bad contract is a poor excuse to make it two ... and we've already got that many. Also the Kyle Lowry we were hoping to get was a better player than Herro is.

[contract]

Also it’s not like he will get paid crazy money, 30 mil is what Lowry is making. The Heat felt Lowry at what 36 years old, over weight and under sized is worth 30 million, using that logic, Herro for 30 mil at 22 years old is a bargain.

Lowry isn't a 30-million-dollar value, it was the cost to sign what available upgrade there was that summer since this franchise held back signing longer extensions (which cost them talent) for multiple years for the 2021 plan to get Giannis (which they were never going to get).

Unless Herro is giving up money to stay in Miami, LET THE MARKET DICTATE HIS PRICE BY LETTING HIM HIT RESTRICTED FREE AGENCY, if he does better next season cool, pay him, if he doesn't then that's something to think about without being locked in long term. It's actually quite possible nobody offers him a large amount with how much interest there was with him this season trying to get draft picks to acquire Mitchell or KD. Miami can match any offer Herro accepts, and the minimum length offer has to be 3 years so at the minimum Miami can have Herro 4 more season if they want without extending him early.

So now if we were trying to trade Herro for picks that he's not worth apparently, who was the main piece going out? Gabe Vincent? Herro not only had to be worth himself, but extra picks AND tell a team take on Duncan or Lowry. That's some heavy lifting.

KD was NEVER on the trade market, just like I predicted, and Riley/Ainge beef is long standing...we would have to overpay just on that. At the end of the day Herro was clearly the only player worth a damn on the market outside Jimmy and Bam since nobody else gets mentioned. Pay him 30 now or 35 later, but somebody will pay.

There isn't a reason in the world to extend him now. There isn't a reason in the world to keep making the same dumb mistake over and over again. We need to quit paying role players coming off their best season, based on their best season, and assuming that they are just going to keep rising from there.

[Flash4thewin]

Some Heat fans have entered the realm of delusional...

Exactly.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/awards/smoy.html

Some guys (stars) you pay a ton of money to. Some guys (role players) you pay < DRob money. Some guys you sit back and watch as they sign with another team for ~ the veteran minimum. That 6th man award should not be a ticket to a huge contract regardless. 6th men don't break the bank and are frequently signed/re-signed to bargain deals and passed around the league like a fruit cake at Christmas.

Clarkson earned $12 mil last season, is earning $13 mil this season, and is owed $14 mil next season if he picks up his player option.

Harrell earned $6 mil for the Clippers his 6th man season, $9 mil the season after that from the Lakers, < $10 mil last season from Wizards/Hornets, and he just signed with the 76ers for peanuts.

Lou Williams earned $7 mil & $8 mil from the Clippers in the two seasons he won 6th man for them, then he earned $8 mil, $8 mil, and $5 mil last season.

Eric Gordon earned $12 mil his 6th man season, and then earned $13 mil, $13.5 mil, $14 mil, $17 mil, $18 mil, and is owed $20 mil & $21 mil these next two seasons.

Unless the Heat determine that Herro is a star player, he should not get a huge contract. He can heat up, but he has significant holes in his game. Giving Herro more than ~ $20 mil to $25 mil per will make him a neutral to negative asset. More than that range would just make it worse. Unless the Heat determine that Herro is a star player in the making, they need to hold the line on his salary or trade him.

I’m not sure these are fair comparisons. Lou William won 6th man in his 14th years in the league, Herro won in his 3rd year. Eric Gordon got hurt and that was reflected in his salary and on court production. It’s a lot easier to say hey i just dont like Herro than to compare him and his production to a 14 year old vet player, that’s just ridiculous when one thinks about it.

[Hallstar]

We can't compare decade old salaries to now....Gordon signed a max or near max deal to leave the Clippers and head to New Orleans.

My point is pay him or trade him. Watching one of our only 2 20 ppg scorers walk out the door because we paid Duncan Robinson isn't an argument I intend on having. Especially with the likelihood that Jimmy's game isn't going to age well. And frankly he should ask for a trade if that's how it's lining up. What's the point of playing company man and "Oh you're the sixth starter that closes games" if it's used against you come contract time.

[Kobewade11]

One week away from training camp, I think this is going to be the most important season in Bam’s career and its going to dictate the trajectory for the rest of his career. If he takes open jumpers consistently, attacks the rim with force consistently, and attempts the occasional 3 I think there is still potential for exponential growth. If its more of the same passive stuff then I think he’s at his ceiling.

[Hallstar]

One week away from training camp, I think this is going to be the most important season in Bam’s career and its going to dictate the trajectory for the rest of his career. If he takes open jumpers consistently, attacks the rim with force consistently, and attempts the occasional 3 I think there is still potential for exponential growth. If its more of the same passive stuff then I think he’s at his ceiling.

Bam's game is limited by mindset. If he's still standing at the freethrow line with the ball looking around for 5 seconds, we're in trouble.

I wish he could train with GArnett.

[contract]

Exactly.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/awards/smoy.html

Some guys (stars) you pay a ton of money to. Some guys (role players) you pay < DRob money. Some guys you sit back and watch as they sign with another team for ~ the veteran minimum. That 6th man award should not be a ticket to a huge contract regardless. 6th men don't break the bank and are frequently signed/re-signed to bargain deals and passed around the league like a fruit cake at Christmas.

Clarkson earned $12 mil last season, is earning $13 mil this season, and is owed $14 mil next season if he picks up his player option.

Harrell earned $6 mil for the Clippers his 6th man season, $9 mil the season after that from the Lakers, < $10 mil last season from Wizards/Hornets, and he just signed with the 76ers for peanuts.

Lou Williams earned $7 mil & $8 mil from the Clippers in the two seasons he won 6th man for them, then he earned $8 mil, $8 mil, and $5 mil last season.

Eric Gordon earned $12 mil his 6th man season, and then earned $13 mil, $13.5 mil, $14 mil, $17 mil, $18 mil, and is owed $20 mil & $21 mil these next two seasons.

Unless the Heat determine that Herro is a star player, he should not get a huge contract. He can heat up, but he has significant holes in his game. Giving Herro more than ~ $20 mil to $25 mil per will make him a neutral to negative asset. More than that range would just make it worse. Unless the Heat determine that Herro is a star player in the making, they need to hold the line on his salary or trade him.

I’m not sure these are fair comparisons. Lou William won 6th man in his 14th years in the league, Herro won in his 3rd year. Eric Gordon got hurt and that was reflected in his salary and on court production. It’s a lot easier to say hey i just dont like Herro than to compare him and his production to a 14 year old vet player, that’s just ridiculous when one thinks about it.

What does his age matter? Unless the Heat determines that he's going to become a star player ... THIS is his level whether he's 22 or 42.

[_GH0ST_]

Yurt instead of playing with the national team in the Eurobasket, he chose to stay in Miami and prepare for the new season individually. I expect a lot from him in the new season.