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Lebron stops deferring to Wade in 4th quater. I borrowed this quote from another HEAT forum and decided to post it here.
After the Chicago game-
"From the comments, I understand where you guys are getting at but I honestly liked their effort, not that they get a pass since that's what other teams do every game.

As for the game itself, it came down to the last few minutes. We had a 10pt lead but we blew it, we just blew it. And then it was possession by possession. Wade was clutch but deferring to him like he's the only option was idiotic.

LeBron was amazing but what he did in the last 5 minutes pissed me off. He deferred way too much for a guy who was balling all game long. It was like dribble, dribble, stop, pass. Whether it was to Wade, Bosh, or even Battier. He was supposed to be the PG creating plays but it ended up being one player show by Wade. It's one thing to be unselfish and another to completely disappeared. The fact he let Wade take the ball from him every possession pissed me off more than the missed FT. Just refuse to give the ball and go with it. Attack the basket. Forget Wade for at least one or two possessions.

It can't always be Wade in the last moment. It gotta be a team effort because if Wade starts to struggle like he did tonight, who are they gonna go to? It has to be LeBron and I was pissed when they made Wade take the last shot. We all know Wade has the will to shoot it. Why not give LeBron a chance to get used to it? He needs that will more than we needed that game honestly. This team goes as far as LeBron goes and he can't deffer like that. No doubt he was amazing and carried them but the last 5 minutes wasn't LeBron. He didn't do anything negative and even shot a 3 but he didn't do anything helpful either. We need LeBron to be the man.

Spo or Wade gotta get in LeBron's face and say 'YOU TAKE THE BALL. YOU MAKE THE SHOT' in the last minutes because he's just passing it every time. Don't give me the LeBron aint clutch bs. If he actually tries to take the ball and make a play for himself, he can be that clutch player everybody wants him to be."
How do you guys feel about this? I think the guy is completely right because that's basically how the Finals was lost imo. This isn't a Lebron vs Wade thread and am not blaming Wade for being so competitive that he can't resist trying to do it all in 4th quaters but i think Wade has to think about the long run and realize that if Lebron is not more involved in the 4th the team can't win the championship

No.

There's a difference between deferring and not being aggressive due to fatigue.LeBron was clearly fatigued after carrying the load for the first 3 quarters.

What sense would it make for Lebron to take the game winner after Wade had made 10 straight points prior?The same way some people were saying Wade should have had the ball in his hands or take the game winner against Utah when LeBron was hot the whole game.

Personally I'd like to see them both be involved in the last shots, possibly create more decoys and cuts similar to the Minnesota game winner.Just be creative and not predictable.

Lebron does have an issue with being passive, he himself has admitted this at the beginning of the season.
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Our offense late in games is poor at best. A lot of standing around and watching.

Will SPO ever figure it out? Who knows.

Chosen01 wrote:No.

There's a difference between deferring and not being aggressive due to fatigue.LeBron was clearly fatigued after carrying the load for the first 3 quarters.

What sense would it make for Lebron to take the game winner after Wade had made 10 straight points prior?The same way some people were saying Wade should have had the ball in his hands or take the game winner against Utah when LeBron was hot the whole game.

Personally I'd like to see them both be involved in the last shots, possibly create more decoys and cuts similar to the Minnesota game winner.Just be creative and not predictable.

That wouldn't be the first time he's deferred though so i don't think fatigue is a legit excuse. Its a recurring issue with Lebron his mind can tell him sometimes that he shouldn't shoot in 4th quaters and instead let Wade do it all. The fact that he can be okay with not taking shots is very scary and needs to be addressed.

arsenic wrote:Lebron does have an issue with being passive, he himself has admitted this at the beginning of the season.
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Our offense late in games is poor at best. A lot of standing around and watching.

Will SPO ever figure it out? Who knows.

Part of it is on SPO because he just watches Lebron standing in corners and doesn't try to do a damn thing about.

Well he's proven he can close games consistently in the Boston and ECF series, I think he'll be fine in the playoffs.

Chosen01 wrote:Well he's proven he can close games consistently in the Boston and ECF series, I think he'll be fine in the playoffs.

Ye i don't question his ability to close but it will come down to whether he's willing to close and if the right plays are drawn up for him to be effective instead of just Wade gets it and everybody watches

When it comes to the 4th I expect it to be the LeBron and Wade show. There have been times where LeBron just absolutely kills everyone when he has it going, but then the last few mins does not have the ball.

To me it's about the match ups and what happens. LeBron admits when he's doubled, he passes the ball. Fundamentally there isn't anything wrong with that. There are plays who force shots and they don't get anything off. It would be the right play to pass toe Wade if he's doubled or even tripled team, to rather hit a ridiculous shot.

But yeah in the Finals LeBron was nowhere found in the 4th and we lost. But he sure as hell was there against Chicago and Boston, and we won those. It seems to be a pattern.

LeBron said something about how he would do things to get his team into the position to win. But this whole "WADE IS THE CLOSER" thing has gotten into LeBron's head I think. Now when the team is in the position to win, he gives it to Wade. Look Wade is clutch and has a tremendous will to win, but he doesn't win it all the time and same with LeBron. It has to be a collective effort with them BOTH. Then also the team doing the little things like defense and closing out.

It should be LeBron/Wade pick and roll all day the last few mins in the clutch IMO, unless someone else is WIDE OPEN. But I don't trust anyone else besides Wade/LBJ. Bosh maybe if he is having a good game. Battier and everyone else sucks (though anyone remember JJ being clutch last time? but he will never get the playing time).

The thing is, I think if LeBron made that FT or if CJ Watson didn't make that 3, we wouldn't be talking about this. LBJ had a great game, Wade was there in the 4th, but the bench sucked.

aww why not

Boss_ wrote:aww why not

LMAO!!!

Sometimes it's Lebron down the stretch, sometimes it's Wade. Though didn't Wade pitch a fit the last time we lost a game where Lebron had it a lot down the stretch? There was a 4th where Wade didn't get a shot and he was complaining about it afterward.

I think if Wade wants that role, he just needs to come through more often. Dude misses so many clutch shots these last two years.

I wish we'd just run the offense and get good looks for whoever is open.

I am sports fan, heat fan, and most all a realist to the sport I watch. The heat are not going to win without bron, and bosh down the stretch. Sometimes it feels like the coach, and the heat as a whole are taken advantage of lebron.

IMO, he keeps them in games more often then most, so if down the stretch he should continue to shoot, and live with the outcome period. He earn that right, and with all do respect wade is a oppturnist. Yes, he can thrive in pressure situation, but he often make that situation with his lazy playing. Bosh, need to share in his part, he is the best shooter on the team and he should get some of those last second shots. By the way, they all need to stop listening to the media. Wade really do think he's the closer of this team, why not he hear everyday. Lebron the chocker, and bosh the wimp. That's the closer of the heat, the media brainwash.

I just hate how they take turns

Just run the Wade-LeBron pick and roll and the wheel play. It makes them both be involved.

zogster wrote:Just run the Wade-LeBron pick and roll and the wheel play. It makes them both be involved.

Spoelstra does not compute.

To win a championship the ball needs to be in Wades' hands down the stretch period. I don't mind if Lebron takes the last shot, but the offense should be initiated by Wade, and even Bosh has said so himself. Lebron is a beast in the open court, but I think Wade is a better halfcourt player and his ability to slice up defenses are critical especially in the playoffs when the defenses become more congested. Also, he makes quicker decisions with the ball and he's more aggressive. On top of that he's also won a title in that role. I don't see why so many people balk at Wade being the closer since he's done it before and won a title doing it.

Lebron is the more complete player but I just trust the ball in Wade's hands more. Like I said, I have no problems with Lebron taking the last shot, or taking multiple shots down the stretch, but I do think Wade must have the ball in his hands.

http://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=64&t=1163399

Lebron's got a career playoff 4th quarter average of 9 points per game, which is the second highest of all time after Jordan. 31.8% of his playoff points have come in the 4th quarter or OT. He's only been under 7.0 points per game in two series, and under 5 points per game once, with 5.6 against Philadelphia last year and 3.0 against Dallas last year. In his first Finals appearance, he averaged 9.8 per game, despite only averaging 22 for the series, with each game being close.

The chances of him ever being that awful again are very low.

SideshowBob wrote:http://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=64&t=1163399

Lebron's got a career playoff 4th quarter average of 9 points per game, which is the second highest of all time after Jordan. 31.8% of his playoff points have come in the 4th quarter or OT. He's only been under 7.0 points per game in two series, and under 5 points per game once, with 5.6 against Philadelphia last year and 3.0 against Dallas last year. In his first Finals appearance, he averaged 9.8 per game, despite only averaging 22 for the series, with each game being close.

The chances of him ever being that awful again are very low.

If your position is, understandably, that Lebron has lost a good deal of athleticism/quickness, and that it shows in the half court(which it does), then shouldn't it be MORE likely that he has more of these performances because he can't just rely on driving by everyone.

In that context, doesn't the career average seem kind of moot?

That is unless he shoots the ball well and with confidence/balance (as he did in 2 series last year).