RealGM

I understand there's a new generation of NBA fans who put a lot of weight on stats and advance stats, especially the ones who love playing fantasy basketball.

Guys, the NBA isn't fantasy basketball. In an average game, for each team, there will only be about a 100pts to be had, about 40 rebounds to be had, about 20 dimes to be had, and so on and so forth.

When you guys think Bosh could be rebounding better or Wade should be scoring more, you're forgetting that it's impossible for them to put up the same stats that they did when they had a bigger role prior to teaming up.

A simple example: when you guys see Lebron grabbing double digit boards, you have to understand that came at the cost of Bosh not getting double digit rebounds. And when Wade and LBJ get their points, it came at the cost of Bosh not getting his points.

I think a lot of the complaints about our team stem from the fact that people expect our players to put up their pre-Big 3 numbers while not understanding that there is a limited amount of stats to be had.

People forget that when the Heat came together, they sacrificed their stats . They're not underperforming by any means. If you put them on scrub teams, they will go back to their original numbers.

How dumb would you feel saying that Team USA was full of underachievers or declining players because they weren't putting up the same stats that they did on their original team? Think about that.

Bosh doesnt get rebounds because He's rarely in position to get them or He doesn't work for them, He may let Lebron rebound the ball but sometimes the boards he should have become offensive rebounds cause he ball watches.

Beside the obvious criticism of Wade, and Chris Bosh lack of double doubles people still don`t realize how good they are. Wade is still somewhat recovering but he still the same elite player, maybe not as 100% explosive but you can only judge after he has fully recovered. Also Bosh is still also the same player (with a better shooting touch) capable of 24 and almost 11 boards, thing is he has adapted to having great rebounders at the 2 and 3, which basically meant a dip in his rebounding stats.

I don't think anyone cares about Wades scoring when it comes to PPG, the complaints have usually come down to those games where there's major inefficiency. If Wade's dropping 17ppg on 47+% and scoring is being handled elsewhere, then it's not a problem.

Bosh is not rebounding on a high level simply because he's not a great rebounder to begin with at his size. Still on nights where Bosh has as little as 4 or 5 rebounds, its inexcuseable for a 6'11 guy, and it's not because Lebron "took his away " it's because Bosh isn't putting himself in position to grab rebounds from the opponent. A lot of this seems to be just an effort issue for Bosh, he's been coasting a bit lately...which is not a real concern right now but I'd like to see him get up for games against decent to great bigs to test his will there.

Like the time the Heat big men had 3 total rebounds after the half? Or when Love out-rebounded all our bigs combined?

Bosh just doesn't always try very hard. He's shown he's capable of rebounding well (even when Bron and Wade rebound well). Just watch him on the court.

The misconception is that we are deep, we are not.

Personally I really feel like Haslem is messing up a lot of the roation.. They not have Haslem holding the ball at the top of the perimeter and passing to the wings. Also he is setting a lot of screens that Bosh should. Anytime Bosh just sits in the corner while haslem helps run the plays there is a problem.

Miami is not a big on offensive boards. It's a big part of why they are one of the best teams at transition defense and one of the best at gettin back and setting up their D. Where they suffer on D is on spot up defense. Defensive board wise they tend to switch everything so a lot of times their bigs tend to be out of rebounding position. Doesn't help that they are undersized, but on the plus side they have position elite rebounders in LeBron and Wade. They crash the hardest and are still able to leak out on fast breaks few times a game.

Guys, what if the reason Bosh got so many boards on the Raptors was because he played alongside a hilariously bad rebounding big in Bargnani and not alongside good rebounding wings in James and Wade?

TwentyOne920 wrote:Guys, what if the reason Bosh got so many boards on the Raptors was because he played alongside a hilariously bad rebounding big in Bargnani and not alongside good rebounding wings in James and Wade?

Thank You. Someone finally understands what i've been preaching about Bosh since coming to Miami.

Bosh was a weaker rebounder even in Toronto. It's not about raw stats, it's about what he does with what's available. People who pay to advanced stats would be aware that he's been an average or worse offensive rebounder his entire career and that he's mostly been a slightly above-average rebounder during that same span, apart from 07 and 2010. He's not a good rebounder. He plays away from the rim a lot and isn't as savvy as Love or Anderson on the offensive glass, he's not very physical and he doesn't put a ton of effort into rebounding. The Heat as a team aren't an amazing defensive rebounding team and Bosh could be doing a better job there, and they are the second-worst offensive rebounding team in the league (by proportion, not volume), so Bosh could DEFINITELY be doing a better job there and it has nothing to do with other guys taking away his opportunities, that's blatantly false.

He's just not that good at it. He's a career 8.4% ORB, 21.1% DRB, 10.1% TRB player. In Miami, he's posted 6.4/20.0/13.6, 5.8/20.5/13.5 and 8.4/19.1/14.0 rebounding lines so far. Not all that far off from his usual level, and looking a lot like 4 of his Toronto seasons. He's just not that good at it. He's not horrible, given that's he's typically played the 4 and likes to play out on the elbow and setting screens and what-not, so he's frequently away from the rim, but yeah, that's an ability/effort thing, not a team-stealing thing.

Bosh has his value: he finishes well at the rim and can stick set jumpers out to 20 feet or so, every now and again he will stick a 3 and he's bought into playing hustle defense. He's not phenomenal, but he puts in the effort and plays within his role. He's accepted a lesser role offensively and he's fitting in. That's all good stuff. He is what he is, and as a third player, he fits in marvelously. He doesn't need to be a miracle-worker for the Heat to be a very good team and we saw well enough that his return was a key part of the title run. So yeah, he fits in, he's good. He's just not a particularly amazing rebounder, and that's a really #epicfail excuse to try and use on his behalf.

There you go again. Bosh in Toronto was a Power FORWARD in Miami hes transitioned into being a center. bosh even said it's hard to transition into being a center. Coach Spo said bosh is doing well for transitioning superstar and Pat Riley said that Bosh will do now but they are trying to get a legit center so bosh can play PF and make miami's offense a bit better without jepordizing the heat's fundamental values of being a defensive team.

KingNith wrote:There you go again. Bosh in Toronto was a Power FORWARD in Miami hes transitioned into being a center. bosh even said it's hard to transition into being a center. Coach Spo said bosh is doing well for transitioning superstar and Pat Riley said that Bosh will do now but they are trying to get a legit center so bosh can play PF and make miami's offense a bit better without jepordizing the heat's fundamental values of being a defensive team.

He played some center here, found it difficult due to the strength and size of his defenders. Spo is being kind calling Bosh a superstar, of course, since he was never at that level of play. Certainly an All-Star, but we're seeing him in what is effectively his best role, that of third weapon on the floor (though he'd have done fine as #2 to a prime Wade; imagine what he'd have done with Bosh instead of Haslem...).

Obviously, it would be better for the Heat to have a little more viable depth (e.g. not Jamaal Magloire or Joel Anthony or whatever other veteran dregs are available on the scrap-heap), but I'd say it's less than they need to move Bosh back to the 4 and more that it'd be nice to continue enabling Lebron to PLAY the 4, which works out really well for the Heat. Anyway, you can't really give Bosh too much hell because he's generally done his job pretty well without complaining, and that's actually not that easy to find for an ensemble cast. He could be a better rebounder, but any player could stand to improve in one area or another and obviously it didn't hamstring the Heat in 2011 or 2012, so it's not exactly a weakness so much as an area for potential improvment.

Like OP said, it's hard to look at the game from a purely stats standpoint.

Bosh has never been a great rebounder but he has evolved into a very good defensive paint player.

Tien wrote:Like OP said, it's hard to look at the game from a purely stats standpoint.

Bosh has never been a great rebounder but he has evolved into a very good defensive paint player.

Of course he has value; he is having a phenomenal offensive season (in the middle of setting career-highs in TS% and ORTG, nearly matching his best WS/48 as well) at the moment, and of course even in more average years by his standards, he provides spacing and versatility to the Miami offense that makes him a valuable third star. In the role he fills, he's well-suited to Miami's purposes and isn't over-extended as he was in Toronto.

The OP is operating on a couple of false premises.

Rebounds aren't a fixed number. We give up tons of offensive rebounds so Bosh's lack of rebounds don't just go to Lebron, they go to the other team as well. We also aren't a good offensive rebounding team so there are other rebounds that a player could take from the other team instead of stealing from our own team.

By the same token points aren't fixed either. Sure a player can't take as big of a slice of the pie if he has to share with other star player but the size of the pie should get bigger with that much talent. Our offense is great but given our talent there is still room for improvement.