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Heat Hoops: Keeping Our Pick This Year Will Have Long Term Consequences

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Heat Hoops: Keeping Our Pick This Year Will Have Long Term Consequences 

Post#1 » by Game6 » Fri Apr 10, 2015 8:22 pm


The Heat traded away two first round draft picks as part of the compensation package in exchange for Dragic:

Miami will send Phoenix the first of its two first round picks two years after its obligation to the Cavs is satisfied. The pick is top-seven protected in 2017 and 2018, and becomes unprotected in 2019 if not previously conveyed.

Miami will send Phoenix the second of its two first round picks in 2021. This pick has no protections whatsoever.

Riley creatively structured these pick trades in order to preserve the flexibility to trade the Heat’s 2019 first round pick in any future trade, if the situation calls for it. He wasn’t about to let what he let happen to him in 2010 happen to him again. This time around, he will continue to maintain a valuable trade tool in case any future trade scenarios emerge. That, however, is only true on condition that that the Heat’s first pick obligation to the Suns is fulfilled in 2017.

But if the Heat were to tank in order to secure its 2015 first round pick, it would set off a chain of events that would destroy all the work Riley did in preserving such flexibility by making the 2019 pick impossible to trade.

Why?

If Miami were to tank in order to keep its 2015 first round pick, it would cause the Heat’s pick obligation to the Cavs to shift from 2015 to 2016. That, in turn, would cause the first of its two first round pick obligations to the Suns to shift from 2017 to 2018, in order to comply with the Stepien Rule. And since the second of its pick obligations to the Suns is guaranteed to be delivered in 2021, there simply wouldn’t be enough of a gap between the years 2018 and 2021 to trade any picks in between – trading the 2019 pick would only leave a one year gap (not the required two years) from 2018, and trading he 2020 pick would only leave a one year gap (not the required two years) from 2021.

In fact, if the Heat were to keep its 2015 pick, the next pick eligible for trade would be two years after its final pick obligation to the Suns is satisfied, in 2023. And, because of the Seven Year Rule, even that pick couldn’t be traded until after the 2016 draft!

What does it all mean?

If the Heat don’t wind up with a top 10 pick this season, they would need to surrender their 2015 first round pick to the Cavs, they would get to keep their 2016 first round pick, and their next first round pick available for trade would almost certainly be in 2019.

If the Heat do wind up with a top 10 pick this season, they would keep their 2015 first round pick, they would need to surrender a future first round pick to the Cavs (in either 2016 or 2017), and the next pick available for trade would be subject to a great many restrictions. Here is a description of what those restrictions would be:

From now until before the 2016 draft: The Heat would not be allowed to trade any first round picks, no matter how far into the future.

From after the 2016 draft until before the 2018 draft: The earliest first round pick the Heat would be eligible to trade is its 2023 pick.

From after the 2018 draft until before the 2019 draft: The earliest first round pick the Heat would be eligible to trade is its 2019 pick, but only if the first pick obligation to the Suns is satisfied in 2018.

From after the 2019 draft until before the 2021 draft: The earliest first round pick the Heat would be eligible to trade is its 2023 pick.

From after the 2021 onward: The Heat would be eligible to trade all of its future first round picks (including its 2022 pick) without restriction.

So… By wanting the Heat to tank in order to keep its 2015 first round pick, you’re essentially saying that you’d be willing to cause the Heat to not be able to trade a single first round pick for more than a year and, after that year has expired, you’re okay with the first pick eligible for trade being in the year 2023!

Is keeping the first round pick this year really that important to you?

Who would you be targeting (for whom you’d have a realistic chance to get), and would he be worth the Heat giving up the flexibility to trade its 2019 first round pick if the situation calls for it?

Would you be willing to go through what you went through during the Big Three era, when the Heat couldn’t complete a single trade because it didn’t have the necessary assets to do so, to get him?

If you want the Heat to tank, you’d need to be.


The point of this post, essentially, is that the Heat will lose the ability to trade its 2019 draft pick for the next three plus years if they tank to get their 2015 first round pick back. Because they’ve already given away so many other picks, that could wind up being very important. But this is a subjective point. Dissenting opinions – that a top 10 first round pick in the 2015 draft is more important than instead retaining the team’s 2016 first round pick and having the flexibility to trade the teams’ 2019 first round pick – are no less valid. It’s personal preference. The reason I wrote the post was not to convince you of anything, only to make you aware of the consequences of all perspectives. That’s why, when I pose the question as to whether the Heat should tank above, I don’t actually answer it. There is no right answer.

(1) If the Heat were to miss the playoffs, they would not necessarily be guaranteed a top 10 pick — since 14 teams miss the playoffs every year and, obviously, only 10 of them get a top 10 pick. The first three picks in the draft are determined by a weighted lottery system in which all 14 teams who miss the playoffs are included, but those with the worst records have a higher chance to win. The final 11 lottery picks are determined based on the inverse of each team’s final record.

These rules have three primary implications:

In order to be absolutely guaranteed a top 10 pick, the Heat would need to finish with the seventh worst record in the NBA.
As long as the Heat misses the playoffs, they would have a chance, however minuscule, to get either the first, second or third overall picks in the draft.

If the Heat were to finish the regular season with the eighth, ninth or tenth worst record in the NBA, the overwhelming odds would suggest that they’d secure a top 10 pick.

If the Heat, for example, were to finish the regular season with the tenth worst record in the NBA, they’d have a 4% chance of securing one of the first three picks in the draft, an 87% chance of securing the tenth overall pick in the draft, and a 9% chance of not receiving a top 10 pick at all.


http://heathoops.com/2015/04/with-injur ... more-24828
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Re: Heat Hoops: Keeping Our Pick This Year Will Have Long Term Consequences 

Post#2 » by DefenseWins » Fri Apr 10, 2015 8:27 pm

Im glad you posted this, cause I was too lazy to

I saw this and it did change my thoughts on the tank. Thing is this team tanks without us wanting them to tank, no one here wants to really lose (until they saw this team sucked).

Riley def needs those picks to trade for us to get some players, we dont know who will be a disgruntled star player in the future again, as long as Riley is here anyway
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Re: Heat Hoops: Keeping Our Pick This Year Will Have Long Term Consequences 

Post#3 » by DayofMourning » Fri Apr 10, 2015 8:27 pm

Yuck. I've already half read this drama story once. We aren't looking to have a pick a year in the late twenties who magically comes in and resurrects this franchise. Having a top ten pick, and a chance at the top three isn't something this team is going to see much of. Cash. In.
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Re: Heat Hoops: Keeping Our Pick This Year Will Have Long Term Consequences 

Post#4 » by Slot Machine » Fri Apr 10, 2015 8:32 pm

Why is there this desperation to have the ability to trade future picks? Trading picks is unwise in most situations (I liked the Dragic trade however) and I think we've seen the situations it can put a team in. As much as I love Riley too, I'm not really interested in seeing him mortgage the future of this team by trading every possible pick just because he won't be around for it.
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Re: Heat Hoops: Keeping Our Pick This Year Will Have Long Term Consequences 

Post#5 » by Seabass777 » Fri Apr 10, 2015 8:33 pm

In this case I would say stay in the moment worry about the long term consequences later.

Anyways the D-League has become a great resource now to get some decent bench players,if we have a chance at a top 10 pick this year, you take it, ask questions later.
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Re: Heat Hoops: Keeping Our Pick This Year Will Have Long Term Consequences 

Post#6 » by DefenseWins » Fri Apr 10, 2015 8:34 pm

DayofMourning wrote:Yuck. I've already half read this drama story once. We aren't looking to have a pick a year in the late twenties who magically comes in and resurrects this franchise. Having a top ten pick, and a chance at the top three isn't something this team is going to see much of. Cash. In.



What if we dont pick that dude though? We are all throwing out names but we dont know what they will pick or if that guy truly is going to alter this franchise.

I dont think our core who is in their 30s may want to wait for a rookie to grow while we want to win now. We are talking about incredible odds for our what... 3-4 year window?

If someone big time is available and we dont have picks, thats when it will hurt, while our rookie may be a bust or suffer an injury

Im not completely on board to miss the pick, but this other side does make sense.
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Re: Heat Hoops: Keeping Our Pick This Year Will Have Long Term Consequences 

Post#7 » by DefenseWins » Fri Apr 10, 2015 8:37 pm

Slot Machine wrote:Why is there this desperation to have the ability to trade future picks? Trading picks is unwise in most situations (I liked the Dragic trade however) and I think we've seen the situations it can put a team in. As much as I love Riley too, I'm not really interested in seeing him mortgage the future of this team by trading every possible pick just because he won't be around for it.



Riley would want to do it again. He doesnt care much for the draft we all know that. He is 70 now, he isnt thinking of the future, he is thinking now. He would mortgage our future for us to have some good years under him before he retires.

Is it unwise? Yes. Does Riley care? No
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Re: Heat Hoops: Keeping Our Pick This Year Will Have Long Term Consequences 

Post#8 » by DayofMourning » Fri Apr 10, 2015 8:40 pm

DefenseWins wrote:
DayofMourning wrote:Yuck. I've already half read this drama story once. We aren't looking to have a pick a year in the late twenties who magically comes in and resurrects this franchise. Having a top ten pick, and a chance at the top three isn't something this team is going to see much of. Cash. In.



What if we dont pick that dude though? We are all throwing out names but we dont know what they will pick or if that guy truly is going to alter this franchise.

I dont think our core who is in their 30s may want to wait for a rookie to grow while we want to win now. We are talking about incredible odds for our what... 3-4 year window?

If someone big time is available and we dont have picks, thats when it will hurt, while our rookie may be a bust or suffer an injury

Im not completely on board to miss the pick, but this other side does make sense.


That's okay too. How about trading the pick away for a proven player then? Just having those options is better than not having them. Having capital is better than not having it right? Prospective picks doesn't mean much when right now we have a legit starting center, legit starting PF, above average SF, 11 time all star at SG, and a legit starting point. We could add to THAT right now with either a pick, or a player acquired through trade for that pick. I don't want to miss out on this for some pick in the twenties a few years from now.
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Re: Heat Hoops: Keeping Our Pick This Year Will Have Long Term Consequences 

Post#9 » by Slot Machine » Fri Apr 10, 2015 8:44 pm

DefenseWins wrote:
Slot Machine wrote:Why is there this desperation to have the ability to trade future picks? Trading picks is unwise in most situations (I liked the Dragic trade however) and I think we've seen the situations it can put a team in. As much as I love Riley too, I'm not really interested in seeing him mortgage the future of this team by trading every possible pick just because he won't be around for it.



Riley would want to do it again. He doesnt care much for the draft we all know that. He is 70 now, he isnt thinking of the future, he is thinking now. He would mortgage our future for us to have some good years under him before he retires.

Is it unwise? Yes. Does Riley care? No

Exactly. The draft is more important than ever, not sure if the Heat FO has grasped that yet. This article is basically encouraging us to remove the built-in safeguards that ensure a team doesn't mortgage its future too much. As much as I love Riley, I don't want him to have the ability to trade any more of our future picks.
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Re: Heat Hoops: Keeping Our Pick This Year Will Have Long Term Consequences 

Post#10 » by RexBoyWonder » Fri Apr 10, 2015 8:47 pm

It's a valid point, drafting this year will somewhat hurt the our future trading flexibility.

The counter argument is you never know what tomorrow brings in the NBA and if you have a chance to capitalize on an asset this year, might as well take it, next year might be too late (meaning our pick might be in the #22 range instead of the 9# range like this year).

Not to mention we have a window while Wade and Bosh are still not too old, so adding a good rookie sooner is better then later (Think about the Spurs adding Kawhi Leonardto the old core of Parker Mano Timmy before they got too old, Kawhi developed right in time for them to win).
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Re: Heat Hoops: Keeping Our Pick This Year Will Have Long Term Consequences 

Post#11 » by King_Supreme » Fri Apr 10, 2015 9:13 pm

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Re: Heat Hoops: Keeping Our Pick This Year Will Have Long Term Consequences 

Post#12 » by dolphinatik » Fri Apr 10, 2015 9:17 pm

draft is always important. We could have drafted Whiteside straight up and could have had him alongside Lebron, Wade, Bosh

We could have drafted Parsons, Batum, Marc Gasol, Gortat, Lance Stephenson, Rondo, Pekovic, Lowry, Affalo, DeAndre Jordan, all possibilities. You never know until you pick and develop. I doubt we would have developed any of them but Draft is important. Cant always wait for another teams discards or a disgruntled star to trade for. Our drafts have been mostly misses with Wade and Chalmers being ok. Dorell Wright was the one good reach we did because we drafted a guy that is a potential mismatch problem instead of drafting undersized like we tend to do. Picks 1-12 there is very good talent in this draft and if we dont mess it up we are poised to get a great addition whoever it might be. Wade is approaching Marino territory its time to start looking towards the future.
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Re: Heat Hoops: Keeping Our Pick This Year Will Have Long Term Consequences 

Post#13 » by DayofMourning » Fri Apr 10, 2015 9:20 pm

dolphinatik wrote:draft is always important. We could have drafted Whiteside straight up and could have had him alongside Lebron, Wade, Bosh


Wouldn't have worked. Hassan needed to crash and burn so he could turn into this. We pounced at the right time.
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Re: Heat Hoops: Keeping Our Pick This Year Will Have Long Term Consequences 

Post#14 » by JLop » Fri Apr 10, 2015 9:21 pm

If Miami goes in tank-mode, the Heat loses the ability to negotiate one single first round draft pick. On the other hand, if we tank, how many future first round draft pick do we receive in a trade for a player like Karl-Anthony Towns, Emmanuel Mudiay, Jahlil Okafor or D'Angelo Russell?, perhaps three future first round draft picks?
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Re: Heat Hoops: Keeping Our Pick This Year Will Have Long Term Consequences 

Post#15 » by DefenseWins » Fri Apr 10, 2015 11:13 pm

Slot Machine wrote:
DefenseWins wrote:
Slot Machine wrote:Why is there this desperation to have the ability to trade future picks? Trading picks is unwise in most situations (I liked the Dragic trade however) and I think we've seen the situations it can put a team in. As much as I love Riley too, I'm not really interested in seeing him mortgage the future of this team by trading every possible pick just because he won't be around for it.



Riley would want to do it again. He doesnt care much for the draft we all know that. He is 70 now, he isnt thinking of the future, he is thinking now. He would mortgage our future for us to have some good years under him before he retires.

Is it unwise? Yes. Does Riley care? No

Exactly. The draft is more important than ever, not sure if the Heat FO has grasped that yet. This article is basically encouraging us to remove the built-in safeguards that ensure a team doesn't mortgage its future too much. As much as I love Riley, I don't want him to have the ability to trade any more of our future picks.


Yeah I know what you mean. In hindsight, that being in the lotto helped us back when it was one of the best draft classes ever, and getting Wade.

We got our superstar, and without him Shaq doesnt want to come here and same with Lebron. One player really can change a franchise, and this is our one shot since that year. Looking back we blew 2008 (not rileys fault, he was the popular pick) when Beas was the consensus #2 pick, or could have been #1, and its things like that which has deterred Riley (due to him being a bust when he wanted to pick Lopez) even though Beas still haunts us lmao.


And right now I feel we are comparable to the Spurs in terms of an aging core, and that draft is what helped revitalize them in getting Kawhi. Whats funny is Green is a guy they signed after he was waived his rookie year I believe (a 2nd rounder at that), but he kept going to the d league and he has developed into one of the most feared shooters and a decent defender. Heat definitely trying to find diamonds in the rough in the dleague, one with Whiteside so far and still time to find another.
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Re: Heat Hoops: Keeping Our Pick This Year Will Have Long Term Consequences 

Post#16 » by contract » Fri Apr 10, 2015 11:34 pm

Slot Machine wrote:Why is there this desperation to have the ability to trade future picks? Trading picks is unwise in most situations (I liked the Dragic trade however) ...

Assuming we can re-sign him. Otherwise that trade was a train wreck.
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Re: Heat Hoops: Keeping Our Pick This Year Will Have Long Term Consequences 

Post#17 » by 3ballbomber » Sat Apr 11, 2015 12:13 am

DayofMourning wrote:
dolphinatik wrote:draft is always important. We could have drafted Whiteside straight up and could have had him alongside Lebron, Wade, Bosh


Wouldn't have worked. Hassan needed to crash and burn so he could turn into this. We pounced at the right time.

yup, Whiteside's hardships has made him the player we see today. The snubs, rejections, doubts and lack of belief in him as a player has not only helped to improve his game but has strengthened his character & increased his hunger. What we currently have is the best possible version of the player & person known as Hassan Whiteside.
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Re: Heat Hoops: Keeping Our Pick This Year Will Have Long Term Consequences 

Post#18 » by SlowPaced » Sat Apr 11, 2015 1:29 am

I'd honestly rather see us keep the pick, being aware of the consequences and all.
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Re: Heat Hoops: Keeping Our Pick This Year Will Have Long Term Consequences 

Post#19 » by DefenseWins » Sat Apr 11, 2015 1:39 am

If we get our next best player who can succeed Wade, it wont be too bad.

But boy will this guy have to have the trust of Spo and Riley. Napier had Spo's trust then suddenly something happened, being sent to the d league and in the dog house back in december I think it was. Just cant have **** like that happen, or an airhead like Beas, though I dont see any of that in this draft.
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Re: Heat Hoops: Keeping Our Pick This Year Will Have Long Term Consequences 

Post#20 » by Sc0pe92 » Sat Apr 11, 2015 1:56 am

Picks are overrated.

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