RealGM

You could get rid of every single contract on the team but who would we be signing in 2018 or 2019 that'd make us championship contenders? 2018 and 2019 are awful FA years. If you think about it, Riley set this team up to start contending in 2020 or 2021. 2021 will have multiple max contract worthy FAs.

1.Giannis
2.Lillard
3.Oladipo
4.Beal
5.Otto Porter

There's a couple others but they'll most likely resign with their teams.

Best FA in 2018 that would actually come to the Heat is KCP. Think about that. We want cap space to have a chance at signing KCP. 2019? It gets even better. We could sign Chandler Parsons.

We hate the contracts we have right now but it's not as if this team would've been better next season or the season after.

Feel_the_Heat15 wrote:You could get rid of every single contract on the team but who would we be signing in 2018 or 2019 that'd make us championship contenders? 2018 and 2019 are awful FA years. If you think about it, Riley set this team up to start contending in 2020 or 2021. 2021 will have multiple max contract worthy FAs.

1.Giannis
2.Lillard
3.Oladipo
4.Beal
5.Otto Porter

There's a couple others but they'll most likely resign with their teams.

Best FA in 2018 that would actually come to the Heat is KCP. Think about that. We want cap space to have a chance at signing KCP. 2019? It gets even better. We could sign Chandler Parsons.

We hate the contracts we have right now but it's not as if this team would've been better next season or the season after.

There's more to keeping your cap in order than having money to overpay free agents. It affects your ability to make trades too. We're not Apple. No one wants our overpriced ****.

Feel_the_Heat15 wrote:If you think about it, Riley set this team up to start contending in 2020 or 2021. 2021 will have multiple max contract worthy FAs.

1.Giannis
2.Lillard
3.Oladipo
4.Beal
5.Otto Porter

I'm not giving a max contract to any of those guys except Giannis, and only if he develops his outside shot.

contract wrote:

Feel_the_Heat15 wrote:You could get rid of every single contract on the team but who would we be signing in 2018 or 2019 that'd make us championship contenders? 2018 and 2019 are awful FA years. If you think about it, Riley set this team up to start contending in 2020 or 2021. 2021 will have multiple max contract worthy FAs.

1.Giannis
2.Lillard
3.Oladipo
4.Beal
5.Otto Porter

There's a couple others but they'll most likely resign with their teams.

Best FA in 2018 that would actually come to the Heat is KCP. Think about that. We want cap space to have a chance at signing KCP. 2019? It gets even better. We could sign Chandler Parsons.

We hate the contracts we have right now but it's not as if this team would've been better next season or the season after.

There's more to keeping your cap in order than having money to overpay free agents. It affects your ability to make trades too. We're not Apple. No one wants our overpriced ****.

Cheaper contracts=lower quality players though, and low quality players won't get you a superstar or good picks without adding something else. Also, if we needed more cap friendly contracts for a trade, we could just trade Hassan to acquire them. But what player could we and would trade for if we had cheaper deals?

I'm more interested in moving Hassan to give minutes to Bam
Moving TJ to get more minutes for Winslow and JRich
Moving Goran to capitalise on his peak worth by getting back some youth/picks, or to clear other players off earlier

Using our reduced depth from these trades to allow us to potentially sink to a lotto pick in the first year where the lotto is flattened a little - e.g an 8th slot goes from 2.3% to 6.0%, or, and I would still cheer for our success, allows these guys to fight for the playoffs.

I'm also hoping that as I'm not expecting equal return contribution wise, that we may be able to move 2 year contracts for 1 year contracts, meaning expirings that could be used to get a 'whale' type player - because there are none in FA.

Feel_the_Heat15 wrote:Cheaper contracts=lower quality players though, and low quality players won't get you a superstar or good picks without adding something else. Also, if we needed more cap friendly contracts for a trade, we could just trade Hassan to acquire them. But what player could we and would trade for if we had cheaper deals?

These guys aren't going to get you a superstar either. These guys are low quality players ... with fat contracts. Most of these guys were picked off the trashpile or from scratch and dent sales. We don't have much talent to trade, we have mostly contracts to trade, and the more toxic a contract, the harder it is to get anyone to take it with having to take back an even worse contract.

When a team trades away a star player, they are looking for draft picks, young talent, or cap relief. We're not in a position to offer any of those.

contract wrote:

Feel_the_Heat15 wrote:Cheaper contracts=lower quality players though, and low quality players won't get you a superstar or good picks without adding something else. Also, if we needed more cap friendly contracts for a trade, we could just trade Hassan to acquire them. But what player could we and would trade for if we had cheaper deals?

These guys aren't going to get you a superstar either. These guys are low quality players ... with fat contracts. Most of these guys were picked off the trashpile or from scratch and dent sales. We don't have much talent to trade, we have mostly contracts to trade, and the more toxic a contract, the harder it is to get anyone to take it with having to take back an even worse contract.

When a team trades away a star player, they are looking for draft picks, young talent, or cap relief. We're not in a position to offer any of those.

JJ is getting paid about $15,000,000 each year for the next 3 years. Players like Ibaka and Millsap are getting paid much more even though they do less. JJ is not overpaid, he's just not giving us great value like Olynyk. Also he's not a low quality player. Neither is TJ and the jury is still out on Waiters. Anyways, all of this doesn't really matter since we're talking about what we could've done with cap space. And the answer is nothing. We talk about having more cap space but it's not like we would've done anything with it.

If TJ's contract was $10,000,000 a year cheaper for the next 2 years and JJ signed for $5,000,000 a year less, we'd still be over the cap at the start of this year's free agency. So what's the point of bringing up these contracts? No one gives me a straight answer on who we could've/would've realistically traded for(that would've improved the team) if we owed $20,000,000 less to players this year.

Feel_the_Heat15 wrote:JJ is getting paid about $15,000,000 each year for the next 3 years. Players like Ibaka and Millsap are getting paid much more even though they do less. JJ is not overpaid, he's just not giving us great value like Olynyk.

Paul Millap's contract is awful. He's also a much better player than JJ. JJ is a bench quality player and is overpaid by at least $5 million to $6 million a year.

Also, we need to get out of the mindset that we're OK as long as some other team is making the same mistakes or worse. We're not. If Denver overpays and we over pay, and Denver is screwed and we're screwed, that doesn't make me feel any better. That doesn't improve our chances of winning.

JJ was a great bargain, not a great player. He was a great bargain when he was playing for $4,000,000. At $6 mil to $8 mil he'd still be worthwhile. At $10 million he'd be tolerable. At $14 million he's toxic. Especially since he regressed after re-signing. JJ simply isn't good enough at anything to justify that kind of money.

Feel_the_Heat15 wrote:Also he's not a low quality player. Neither is TJ and the jury is still out on Waiters.

They're not high quality players either.

Feel_the_Heat15 wrote:Anyways, all of this doesn't really matter since we're talking about what we could've done with cap space. And the answer is nothing. We talk about having more cap space but it's not like we would've done anything with it.

If TJ's contract was $10,000,000 a year cheaper for the next 2 years and JJ signed for $5,000,000 a year less, we'd still be over the cap at the start of this year's free agency. So what's the point of bringing up these contracts? No one gives me a straight answer on who we could've/would've realistically traded for(that would've improved the team) if we owed $20,000,000 less to players this year.

If they were earning that much less, they'd be fairly easy to trade. We can't trade TJ without giving up one of our young players. That's a problem.When you have to pay someone to haul away your players, that's a problem. When you have multiple contracts on your cap that you'd have to give up assets to get rid of, it's a big problem. Especially when you don't have many assets to begin with.

I don't care.

contract wrote:

Feel_the_Heat15 wrote:JJ is getting paid about $15,000,000 each year for the next 3 years. Players like Ibaka and Millsap are getting paid much more even though they do less. JJ is not overpaid, he's just not giving us great value like Olynyk.

Paul Millap's contract is awful. He's also a much better player than JJ. JJ is a bench quality player and is overpaid by at least $5 million to $6 million a year.

Also, we need to get out of the mindset that we're OK as long as some other team is making the same mistakes or worse. We're not. If Denver overpays and we over pay, and Denver is screwed and we're screwed, that doesn't make me feel any better. That doesn't improve our chances of winning.

JJ was a great bargain, not a great player. He was a great bargain when he was playing for $4,000,000. At $6 mil to $8 mil he'd still be worthwhile. At $10 million he'd be tolerable. At $14 million he's toxic. Especially since he regressed after re-signing. JJ simply isn't good enough at anything to justify that kind of money.

Feel_the_Heat15 wrote:Also he's not a low quality player. Neither is TJ and the jury is still out on Waiters.

They're not high quality players either.

Feel_the_Heat15 wrote:Anyways, all of this doesn't really matter since we're talking about what we could've done with cap space. And the answer is nothing. We talk about having more cap space but it's not like we would've done anything with it.

If TJ's contract was $10,000,000 a year cheaper for the next 2 years and JJ signed for $5,000,000 a year less, we'd still be over the cap at the start of this year's free agency. So what's the point of bringing up these contracts? No one gives me a straight answer on who we could've/would've realistically traded for(that would've improved the team) if we owed $20,000,000 less to players this year.

If they were earning that much less, they'd be fairly easy to trade. We can't trade TJ without giving up one of our young players. That's a problem.When you have to pay someone to haul away your players, that's a problem. When you have multiple contracts on your cap that you'd have to give up assets to get rid of, it's a big problem. Especially when you don't have many assets to begin with.

Name a player you are expecting between 14 and 18 mill per?

Sent from my SM-T550 using Tapatalk

twix2500 wrote:

Spoiler:

contract wrote:

Feel_the_Heat15 wrote:JJ is getting paid about $15,000,000 each year for the next 3 years. Players like Ibaka and Millsap are getting paid much more even though they do less. JJ is not overpaid, he's just not giving us great value like Olynyk.

Paul Millap's contract is awful. He's also a much better player than JJ. JJ is a bench quality player and is overpaid by at least $5 million to $6 million a year.

Also, we need to get out of the mindset that we're OK as long as some other team is making the same mistakes or worse. We're not. If Denver overpays and we over pay, and Denver is screwed and we're screwed, that doesn't make me feel any better. That doesn't improve our chances of winning.

JJ was a great bargain, not a great player. He was a great bargain when he was playing for $4,000,000. At $6 mil to $8 mil he'd still be worthwhile. At $10 million he'd be tolerable. At $14 million he's toxic. Especially since he regressed after re-signing. JJ simply isn't good enough at anything to justify that kind of money.

Feel_the_Heat15 wrote:Also he's not a low quality player. Neither is TJ and the jury is still out on Waiters.

They're not high quality players either.

Feel_the_Heat15 wrote:Anyways, all of this doesn't really matter since we're talking about what we could've done with cap space. And the answer is nothing. We talk about having more cap space but it's not like we would've done anything with it.

If TJ's contract was $10,000,000 a year cheaper for the next 2 years and JJ signed for $5,000,000 a year less, we'd still be over the cap at the start of this year's free agency. So what's the point of bringing up these contracts? No one gives me a straight answer on who we could've/would've realistically traded for(that would've improved the team) if we owed $20,000,000 less to players this year.

If they were earning that much less, they'd be fairly easy to trade. We can't trade TJ without giving up one of our young players. That's a problem.When you have to pay someone to haul away your players, that's a problem. When you have multiple contracts on your cap that you'd have to give up assets to get rid of, it's a big problem. Especially when you don't have many assets to begin with.

Name a player you are expecting between 14 and 18 mill per?

What difference does that make? I don't know that there's anyone I'd want to sign between $14 mil & $18 mil. Probably not since top players earn more, and lesser players are generally replaceable with cheaper talent.

I'm not sure how that changes the basic fact that we have a negative asset on our cap that we would have to pay to get hauled away. Usually when you have to pay to get something hauled away, you call it "trash". The player isn't necessarily trash, but the contract is.

I didn't hate the deal when we signed it. But I hate it now.

contract wrote:

twix2500 wrote:

Spoiler:

contract wrote:Paul Millap's contract is awful. He's also a much better player than JJ. JJ is a bench quality player and is overpaid by at least $5 million to $6 million a year.

Also, we need to get out of the mindset that we're OK as long as some other team is making the same mistakes or worse. We're not. If Denver overpays and we over pay, and Denver is screwed and we're screwed, that doesn't make me feel any better. That doesn't improve our chances of winning.

JJ was a great bargain, not a great player. He was a great bargain when he was playing for $4,000,000. At $6 mil to $8 mil he'd still be worthwhile. At $10 million he'd be tolerable. At $14 million he's toxic. Especially since he regressed after re-signing. JJ simply isn't good enough at anything to justify that kind of money.


They're not high quality players either.


If they were earning that much less, they'd be fairly easy to trade. We can't trade TJ without giving up one of our young players. That's a problem.When you have to pay someone to haul away your players, that's a problem. When you have multiple contracts on your cap that you'd have to give up assets to get rid of, it's a big problem. Especially when you don't have many assets to begin with.

Name a player you are expecting between 14 and 18 mill per?

What difference does that make? I don't know that there's anyone I'd want to sign between $14 mil & $18 mil. Probably not since top players earn more, and lesser players are generally replaceable with cheaper talent.

I'm not sure how that changes the basic fact that we have a negative asset on our cap that we would have to pay to get hauled away. Usually when you have to pay to get something hauled away, you call it "trash". The player isn't necessarily trash, but the contract is.

I didn't hate the deal when we signed it. But I hate it now.

How would our situation be different If some random scrub was getting paid about $5,000,000 a year?

Feel_the_Heat15 wrote:

contract wrote:

twix2500 wrote:

Spoiler:

Name a player you are expecting between 14 and 18 mill per?

What difference does that make? I don't know that there's anyone I'd want to sign between $14 mil & $18 mil. Probably not since top players earn more, and lesser players are generally replaceable with cheaper talent.

I'm not sure how that changes the basic fact that we have a negative asset on our cap that we would have to pay to get hauled away. Usually when you have to pay to get something hauled away, you call it "trash". The player isn't necessarily trash, but the contract is.

I didn't hate the deal when we signed it. But I hate it now.

How would our situation be different If some random scrub was getting paid about $5,000,000 a year?

That scrub would be easier to trade. We'd also have the ability to make a decision on whether to keep Ellington or not based on his talent and asset value and role on the team rather than on him pushing us into the luxury tax.

Every decision you make affects every other decision you make, and it affects the options you have moving forward.