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Miami Heat Speculation Thread - 2020 and beyond...

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Re: Miami Heat Speculation Thread - 2020 and beyond... 

Post#41 » by puppa bear » Sun Sep 6, 2020 2:48 pm

DayofMourning wrote:Got to find a way to keep Jae and Goran. It's all fun and games to think about what top tier dude you can add, but Jae and Dragon are MAJOR reasons why we are doing what we're doing. You get cute, and lose those guys, and you're not making postseason runs. We need one more top ten guy, but we need to keep these ELITE level role players.

My thought is that Jae will be harder to keep than Goran. Goran has had a big pay day and having a balloon payment next year with a more market-friendly longer deal will allow him to get to his drop off point having made some serious cash, then take on the bench mentor roles we know and love our Heat lifers in.

Jae will be just topping $35m career earnings this season (compared to Dragic’s more that $115m), and can likely double that from a team that can convince themselves that he’s their missing starting piece. He will definitely get full MLE offers, but may get more from someone like the Hawks - wouldn’t be surprised if they offered something like 45/3. Even if we balloon him up to something like $15m, it’s then him banking on us definitely signing him with the room MLE - then possibly having less guaranteed $ over those same year.

Jae fits us like a glove, but we can’t afford to hamstring ourselves. Yes we’re one top-10 piece away, and yes we get further away if we don’t have Jae & Goran. But we get a higher floor with that top-10 piece & we saw with the big-3: players are willing to take less to be part of something, if they’ve already made big money.
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Re: Miami Heat Speculation Thread - 2020 and beyond... 

Post#42 » by al bondiga » Mon Sep 7, 2020 3:17 am

herro will be traded very soon, quite possibly for an All-Star has been like LaMarcus Aldridge
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Re: Miami Heat Speculation Thread - 2020 and beyond... 

Post#43 » by puppa bear » Mon Sep 7, 2020 3:40 am

al bondiga wrote:herro will be traded very soon, quite possibly for an All-Star has been like LaMarcus Aldridge

Nunn is getting traded before Herro, Jimmy loves Herro & so does the FO.

Nunn/KO for LMA is about the most weld be prepared to do, IMO.
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Re: Miami Heat Speculation Thread - 2020 and beyond... 

Post#44 » by HeatFanLifer » Mon Sep 7, 2020 4:06 am

puppa bear wrote:
al bondiga wrote:herro will be traded very soon, quite possibly for an All-Star has been like LaMarcus Aldridge

Nunn is getting traded before Herro, Jimmy loves Herro & so does the FO.

Nunn/KO for LMA is about the most weld be prepared to do, IMO.


I don’t see Herro going anywhere unless it him and other players for a top 15 player that can put the Heat in prime position to win a championship next year.
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Re: Miami Heat Speculation Thread - 2020 and beyond... 

Post#45 » by Wiltside » Mon Sep 7, 2020 5:01 am

It's an interesting situation that we find ourselves in.

Bam looks very much a 5 rather than a 4, and we seem to play our best with a shooter at the 4 spot. That puts us in a predicament when hunting Davis (in 2020) or Giannis (in 2021), given neither of them are elite distance shooters, and arguably should also be playing the 5.

If there was an All-Star calibre upgrade on Crowder that was out there that could be a volume 3pt shooter but also put the clamps on, that would be ideal longer term.

Kawhi still would be the ideal superstar guy to slot into the 4 slot in 2021, but still a huge reach.

Basically, My MO has been "if you can get an All-NBA talent - you take it - fit be damned". Although current day Sixers are basically the model of "what not to do" when chasing talent that doesn't fit. Conflicted.

For 2020-2021, I could see us taking a swing at Aldridge in a trade. Spo went big with Bam/Meyers for majority of the regular season, and LMA is clearly a significant upgrade over Meyers even at his advanced age.

LMA still averaged 18.9ppg, 7.4rpg, 2.5apg, 1.6bpg, 1.4tpg, 33.1mpg on 49.3%fg, 38.9% 3fg (1.2/3.0) and 82.7%ft.

Dude is 35 years old though, so the drop is coming. I'd be happy to take him and play him around the 26-28 minutes per night as our stretch big though. Get those attempts up to 5-6 per game.

By trading for him we'd have bird rights in 2021 when his contract expires, and we'll be looking for cheap veteran help around a (hopefully) competing roster. He should be willing to be a 6th man at that stage, backing up Bam/Giannis ;).

Getting the contracts to match-up would be the tricky part...we'll see what happens.
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Re: Miami Heat Speculation Thread - 2020 and beyond... 

Post#46 » by Bhut Jolokia » Mon Sep 7, 2020 4:22 pm

If the Heat get to the NBA Finals with Crowder and Dragic continuing to play well, I could see them being resigned due to being great fits already. But other than that I think it would be more valuable getting a max FA.
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Re: Miami Heat Speculation Thread - 2020 and beyond... 

Post#47 » by Mos_Heat » Wed Sep 9, 2020 2:27 pm

Bhut Jolokia wrote:Do you think Jae and Goran would accept 1 year $15 million contracts?

Dragic yes, Crowder no way.
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Re: Miami Heat Speculation Thread - 2020 and beyond... 

Post#48 » by DayofMourning » Wed Sep 9, 2020 11:45 pm

Mos_Heat wrote:
Bhut Jolokia wrote:Do you think Jae and Goran would accept 1 year $15 million contracts?

Dragic yes, Crowder no way.


Agree. Sadly, Crowder has played himself out of our price range. $15 million per year could be realistic, but not on a one year deal. I assume he'll get close to max years out of a deal. It's likely his first and last big deal.
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Re: Miami Heat Speculation Thread - 2020 and beyond... 

Post#49 » by Wiltside » Wed Sep 9, 2020 11:55 pm

DayofMourning wrote:
Mos_Heat wrote:
Bhut Jolokia wrote:Do you think Jae and Goran would accept 1 year $15 million contracts?

Dragic yes, Crowder no way.


Agree. Sadly, Crowder has played himself out of our price range. $15 million per year could be realistic, but not on a one year deal. I assume he'll get close to max years out of a deal. It's likely his first and last big deal.


Who in the FA market could we realistically sign on a 1yr deal that can provide some of what Crowder does for us?
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Re: Miami Heat Speculation Thread - 2020 and beyond... 

Post#50 » by DayofMourning » Thu Sep 10, 2020 12:02 am

Wiltside wrote:
DayofMourning wrote:
Mos_Heat wrote:Dragic yes, Crowder no way.


Agree. Sadly, Crowder has played himself out of our price range. $15 million per year could be realistic, but not on a one year deal. I assume he'll get close to max years out of a deal. It's likely his first and last big deal.


Who in the FA market could we realistically sign on a 1yr deal that can provide some of what Crowder does for us?


Nobody comes close unfortunately, especially when you talk about short term deals.

Would have to look at the draft, or internally (DJJ/KZ).

Free agents that would provide something, sort of, include Rondae Hollis Jefferson, Wilson Chandler, Denzel Valentine.
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Re: Miami Heat Speculation Thread - 2020 and beyond... 

Post#51 » by Seabass777 » Thu Sep 10, 2020 12:16 am

DayofMourning wrote:
Mos_Heat wrote:
Bhut Jolokia wrote:Do you think Jae and Goran would accept 1 year $15 million contracts?

Dragic yes, Crowder no way.


Agree. Sadly, Crowder has played himself out of our price range. $15 million per year could be realistic, but not on a one year deal. I assume he'll get close to max years out of a deal. It's likely his first and last big deal.


And if your Miami, I think your ok with that. You can just reup on DJJ on a more team friendly deal to take Crowder's minutes, and you can also sign cheap vet minimum talent in a guy like Josh Jackson??
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Re: Miami Heat Speculation Thread - 2020 and beyond... 

Post#52 » by Wiltside » Thu Sep 10, 2020 12:16 am

DayofMourning wrote:
Wiltside wrote:
DayofMourning wrote:
Agree. Sadly, Crowder has played himself out of our price range. $15 million per year could be realistic, but not on a one year deal. I assume he'll get close to max years out of a deal. It's likely his first and last big deal.


Who in the FA market could we realistically sign on a 1yr deal that can provide some of what Crowder does for us?


Nobody comes close unfortunately, especially when you talk about short term deals.

Would have to look at the draft, or internally (DJJ/KZ).

Free agents that would provide something, sort of, include Rondae Hollis Jefferson, Wilson Chandler, Denzel Valentine.


I always thought Valentine was bigger than 6'4". Weird.

Yeah, your options are likely the best out there. Jerami Grant would be one, but he's going to want multi-year you would think.

As much as he's fallen off a cliff the past couple years, DeMarre Carroll would be a guy who could potentially provide Crowder-like range and defense. Certainly not to the same level, but he did average 13/6 and 2 treys per game a couple years ago. If he's healthy, he could be a decent option.

Marcus Morris could also be an option, but it would probably make me physically sick to see him in a Heat jersey.

Juan Hernangomez if the Wolves didn't want to retain him would be a decent cheap option too. He's RFA, but if they pull the QO for whatever reason he'd be a solid choice. Doubt they do though, he was good for them - 13/7 and 2 treys per game in 14 games with Minny. No way they'll let him slide.

Chris Boucher is a guy I quite like on the Raptors, but also restricted. They're in a bit of a salary cap bind themselves though, so if you made a reasonable offer they may have to think about renouncing.

Davis Bertans would be a great choice, but he's likely to be way too expensive and get multi-year offers.

Hard to find much out there DoM. We may need to hope DJJ/KZ develop enough to play that spot if Jae gets too $$$. Will set us back a bit next szn though, for sure.
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Re: Miami Heat Speculation Thread - 2020 and beyond... 

Post#53 » by Wiltside » Thu Sep 10, 2020 12:21 am

CBS recently did a look at Giannis' top options for 2021 Free Agency.

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/giannis-antetokounmpo-free-agency-power-rankings-where-will-bucks-reigning-mvp-sign-in-2021/

They based their ranking on:
- Coaching
- Roster
- Money
- Market
- Relationships
- Accessibility (ease of getting there)

In their view...

SERIOUS CONTENDERS:

1. Milwaukee
2. Dallas
3. Toronto
4. Miami

Dallas is probably the dark horse in this race. Toronto and Miami are the ones getting all the press, but Dallas has a really good case. Playing with two elite Euro's in Doncic and KP? Hard to imagine a better basketball fit for him. Carlisle is also one of the best coaches in the game and always gets the most of his roster.

Not going to be an easy pitch for us, that's for sure. Basketball fit-wise, there's a lot of question marks on how a lineup with Butler, Bam and Giannis works at any rate.
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Re: Miami Heat Speculation Thread - 2020 and beyond... 

Post#54 » by Seabass777 » Thu Sep 10, 2020 12:21 am

DayofMourning wrote:
Wiltside wrote:
DayofMourning wrote:
Agree. Sadly, Crowder has played himself out of our price range. $15 million per year could be realistic, but not on a one year deal. I assume he'll get close to max years out of a deal. It's likely his first and last big deal.


Who in the FA market could we realistically sign on a 1yr deal that can provide some of what Crowder does for us?


Nobody comes close unfortunately, especially when you talk about short term deals.

Would have to look at the draft, or internally (DJJ/KZ).

Free agents that would provide something, sort of, include Rondae Hollis Jefferson, Wilson Chandler, Denzel Valentine.


Or you could give a nice 1 year balloon payment to a Danillo Gallanari, you don't get the tough defense, but you do get a really nice offensive punch to compliment BAM.
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Re: Miami Heat Speculation Thread - 2020 and beyond... 

Post#55 » by Seabass777 » Thu Sep 10, 2020 12:32 am

Wiltside wrote:
DayofMourning wrote:
Wiltside wrote:
Who in the FA market could we realistically sign on a 1yr deal that can provide some of what Crowder does for us?


Nobody comes close unfortunately, especially when you talk about short term deals.

Would have to look at the draft, or internally (DJJ/KZ).

Free agents that would provide something, sort of, include Rondae Hollis Jefferson, Wilson Chandler, Denzel Valentine.


I always thought Valentine was bigger than 6'4". Weird.

Yeah, your options are likely the best out there. Jerami Grant would be one, but he's going to want multi-year you would think.

As much as he's fallen off a cliff the past couple years, DeMarre Carroll would be a guy who could potentially provide Crowder-like range and defense. Certainly not to the same level, but he did average 13/6 and 2 treys per game a couple years ago. If he's healthy, he could be a decent option.

Marcus Morris could also be an option, but it would probably make me physically sick to see him in a Heat jersey.

Juan Hernangomez if the Wolves didn't want to retain him would be a decent cheap option too. He's RFA, but if they pull the QO for whatever reason he'd be a solid choice. Doubt they do though, he was good for them - 13/7 and 2 treys per game in 14 games with Minny. No way they'll let him slide.

Chris Boucher is a guy I quite like on the Raptors, but also restricted. They're in a bit of a salary cap bind themselves though, so if you made a reasonable offer they may have to think about renouncing.

Davis Bertans would be a great choice, but he's likely to be way too expensive and get multi-year offers.

Hard to find much out there DoM. We may need to hope DJJ/KZ develop enough to play that spot if Jae gets too $$$. Will set us back a bit next szn though, for sure.


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Re: Miami Heat Speculation Thread - 2020 and beyond... 

Post#56 » by DayofMourning » Thu Sep 10, 2020 12:55 am

Seabass777 wrote:
DayofMourning wrote:
Mos_Heat wrote:Dragic yes, Crowder no way.


Agree. Sadly, Crowder has played himself out of our price range. $15 million per year could be realistic, but not on a one year deal. I assume he'll get close to max years out of a deal. It's likely his first and last big deal.


And if your Miami, I think your ok with that. You can just reup on DJJ on a more team friendly deal to take Crowder's minutes, and you can also sign cheap vet minimum talent in a guy like Josh Jackson??


Wonder what Heat culture could do for Jackson. He was my guy in that draft.
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Re: Miami Heat Speculation Thread - 2020 and beyond... 

Post#57 » by Wiltside » Thu Sep 10, 2020 1:00 am

DayofMourning wrote:
Seabass777 wrote:
DayofMourning wrote:
Agree. Sadly, Crowder has played himself out of our price range. $15 million per year could be realistic, but not on a one year deal. I assume he'll get close to max years out of a deal. It's likely his first and last big deal.


And if your Miami, I think your ok with that. You can just reup on DJJ on a more team friendly deal to take Crowder's minutes, and you can also sign cheap vet minimum talent in a guy like Josh Jackson??


Wonder what Heat culture could do for Jackson. He was my guy in that draft.


I'd be happy to take a flyer on him, but I don't know if he's a "Heat guy". Feels like the type of guy personality wise who we wouldn't be interested in.
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Re: Miami Heat Speculation Thread - 2020 and beyond... 

Post#58 » by DayofMourning » Thu Sep 10, 2020 1:03 am

Wiltside wrote:
DayofMourning wrote:
Seabass777 wrote:
And if your Miami, I think your ok with that. You can just reup on DJJ on a more team friendly deal to take Crowder's minutes, and you can also sign cheap vet minimum talent in a guy like Josh Jackson??


Wonder what Heat culture could do for Jackson. He was my guy in that draft.


I'd be happy to take a flyer on him, but I don't know if he's a "Heat guy". Feels like the type of guy personality wise who we wouldn't be interested in.


Yeah, my speculation was more in theory, rather than reality.

Don't have the minutes for a project. We need a guy who can contribute right away.

Jaes been so darn good.
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Re: Miami Heat Speculation Thread - 2020 and beyond... 

Post#59 » by Wiltside » Thu Sep 10, 2020 1:57 am

Looking at the 2021 FA listing, there's quite a few nice options there. Gonna be a good offszn to have cap space.

- John Collins (RFA)
- Jayson Tatum (RFA)
- Gordon Hayward (assuming he takes his 2020 PO)
- Jarrett Allen (RFA)
- Spencer Dinwiddie (PO for 21-22)
- Devonte' Graham (RFA)
- Lauri Markkanen (RFA)
- Will Barton (PO for 21-22)
- Luke Kennard (RFA)
- Blake Griffin (PO for 21-22)
- PJ Tucker
- Victor Oladipo
- Paul George (PO for 21-22)
- Kawhi Leonard (PO for 21-22)
- Lou Williams
- Lebron James (PO for 21-22)
- Kyle Kuzma (RFA)
- Justise Winslow (TO for 21-22)
- Giannis Antetokounmpo
- Jrue Holiday (PO for 21-22)
- Lonzo Ball (PO for 21-22)
- Chris Paul (PO for 21-22)
- Steven Adams
- Dennis Schroder
- Markelle Fultz (RFA)
- Jonathan Isaac (RFA)
- Josh Richardson (PO for 21-22)
- Kelly Oubre Jr
- Zach Collins (RFA)
- Gary Trent Jr (RFA)
- De'Aaron Fox (RFA)
- Nemanja Bjelica
- Lamarcus Aldridge
- Rudy Gay
- Patty Mills
- Derrick White (RFA)
- Norman Powell (PO for 21-22)
- OG Anunoby (RFA)
- Rudy Gobert
- Donovan Mitchell (RFA - although it seems like he has agreed to an ext)

That's a lot of potential talent on the market place. A ton of RFA's too.
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Re: Miami Heat Speculation Thread - 2020 and beyond... 

Post#60 » by oreon » Thu Sep 10, 2020 2:19 am

Wiltside wrote:CBS recently did a look at Giannis' top options for 2021 Free Agency.

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/giannis-antetokounmpo-free-agency-power-rankings-where-will-bucks-reigning-mvp-sign-in-2021/

They based their ranking on:
- Coaching
- Roster
- Money
- Market
- Relationships
- Accessibility (ease of getting there)

In their view...

SERIOUS CONTENDERS:

1. Milwaukee
2. Dallas
3. Toronto
4. Miami

Dallas is probably the dark horse in this race. Toronto and Miami are the ones getting all the press, but Dallas has a really good case. Playing with two elite Euro's in Doncic and KP? Hard to imagine a better basketball fit for him. Carlisle is also one of the best coaches in the game and always gets the most of his roster.

Not going to be an easy pitch for us, that's for sure. Basketball fit-wise, there's a lot of question marks on how a lineup with Butler, Bam and Giannis works at any rate.


Dallas gotta be last at the list. Knowing Giannis he wouldn't want to go to place where he would be the 2nd guy. Giannis would put nice numbers at Dallas but Doncic would be the one running the offense and closing games.
If he leaves it will be either Raptors or Heat like most speculated. He has a relationship with Masai. And he's friends with Bam and share an agent. So both team have an inside track that Dallas does not. My guess he resigns for another shorter 2/3yr deal to give the Bucks another shot to build around him. This will also allow him to be FA when the cap goes back up.

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