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Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC

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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1601 » by RexBoyWonder » Sun Nov 22, 2020 7:31 am

Wiltside wrote:I feel like a deal including Olynyk and Nunn is likely, but hey, could be mistaken.

If not, I don’t think we have much left in us for 2021.

PG - Herro / Dragic / Vincent
SG - Butler / Bradley / Nunn
SF - Robinson / Harkless / Okpala
PF - Adebayo / Achiuwa
C - Leonard / Olynyk / Haslem

Still looks thin at the 5. I’d expect a lot of players to play up a position too (eg Harkless mostly at the 4, Bradley may scarily play some 3).



That's not the Center rotation of a true contender. huge hole right there next to Bam.

To me it's all about the Rooks. If KZ and Precious come out balling, great. And I want to give them a lot of chances.

But if they're not ready, we have a super weak position next to Bam.
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1602 » by oreon » Sun Nov 22, 2020 7:38 am

RexBoyWonder wrote:
Beenie wrote:
Read on Twitter


2 years - 19m

Meyers Leonard $$


Anybody still think losing Crowder and adding Harkless + Bradley is a good offseason?


Overall it's a net loss. There is no way to spin another way. To improve the Heat are counting on Herro, Bam and Duncan to take another leap. They are also counting on Precious or KZ to be able to play some minutes at the 3/4 spot well defensively. It's a bit of a risk, so maybe they go for another long wing. Or they could go for a center i.e. Aron Bynes who is good defensively and will allow Bam to guard more wing players. I'd be concerned about over relying on Iggy when going against Giannis, Durant or Tatum.
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1603 » by RexBoyWonder » Sun Nov 22, 2020 7:48 am

oreon wrote:
RexBoyWonder wrote:
Beenie wrote:
Read on Twitter


2 years - 19m

Meyers Leonard $$


Anybody still think losing Crowder and adding Harkless + Bradley is a good offseason?


Overall it's a net loss. There is no way to spin another way. To improve the Heat are counting on Herro, Bam and Duncan to take another leap. They are also counting on Precious or KZ to be able to play some minutes at the 3/4 spot well defensively. It's a bit of a risk, so maybe they go for another long wing. Or they could go for a center i.e. Aron Bynes who is good defensively and will allow Bam to guard more wing players. I'd be concerned about over relying on Iggy when going against Giannis, Durant or Tatum.


Iggy is by no way a fit next to Bam as the second big, I don't get where this idea keeps coming up.

Iggy is too olds, too small, can't shoot enough, and just overall a bad fit at PF or C.

At the Moment, it looks like it's a KZ/Precious/Harkless battle for the position.

I know who I'm rooting for. The other option is disastee.
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1604 » by dean456 » Sun Nov 22, 2020 8:22 am

RexBoyWonder wrote:
oreon wrote:
RexBoyWonder wrote:
Anybody still think losing Crowder and adding Harkless + Bradley is a good offseason?


Overall it's a net loss. There is no way to spin another way. To improve the Heat are counting on Herro, Bam and Duncan to take another leap. They are also counting on Precious or KZ to be able to play some minutes at the 3/4 spot well defensively. It's a bit of a risk, so maybe they go for another long wing. Or they could go for a center i.e. Aron Bynes who is good defensively and will allow Bam to guard more wing players. I'd be concerned about over relying on Iggy when going against Giannis, Durant or Tatum.


Iggy is by no way a fit next to Bam as the second big, I don't get where this idea keeps coming up.

Iggy is too olds, too small, can't shoot enough, and just overall a bad fit at PF or C.

At the Moment, it looks like it's a KZ/Precious/Harkless battle for the position.

I know who I'm rooting for. The other option is disastee.


I'm pretty sure our target is flipping Olynyk, Iggy and maybe Nunn for Aldridge.

Herro/Dragic/Vincent
Butler/Bradley
Robinson/Harkless
Aldridge/KZ/Precious/UD
Bam/Leonard/Precious/Silva

Which would also leave a roster spot open to add another Vet Min SF/PF

I think that would be solid. Think it could also be a type of audition for how we'd like to implement Giannis in a few ways how we'd use Aldridge on the floor.
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1605 » by Zasterror » Sun Nov 22, 2020 8:36 am

RexBoyWonder wrote:
Beenie wrote:
Read on Twitter


2 years - 19m

Meyers Leonard $$


Anybody still think losing Crowder and adding Harkless + Bradley is a good offseason?

C'mon bro" you are vastly overrating Crowder in this instance. Say what you want about Harkless but he is a comparable defender if not better than Jae. Yes, we will miss Jae's shooting but as we saw later on the Playoffs he regressed back to the mean which is not all that better than Harkless.

Bradley fulfills a need that Crowder could never provide and was sorely needed for us to take the next level.

All of this while both players being more affordable and flexible into what we are trying to do next off-season. Adding more depth is always a good thing.
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1606 » by iamoti » Sun Nov 22, 2020 8:37 am

I like this offseason. None of the available players would have been a major upgrade. We kept the flexibility. A trade now or at the deadline is sure to happen just because there aren't enough minutes for what we got.

At the moment we have this depth chart:

Dragic/Herro/Nunn
Robinson/Bradley/Vincent
Butler/Iggy/Harkless
Adebayo/Achiuwa/Okpala
Leonard/Olynyk/Haslem

We definately need to trade a package of Nunn and Olynyk for a big who can complement Bam and defend. I suspect for the regular season we will go with Nunn/Robinson/Butler/Adebayo and Leonard as start 5 like last season. I would keep Herro as a 6th man for the whole season and move Dragic in the starting lineup close to the playoffs. Iggy may play very limited minutes in the regular season. I would love to see at least 10-15 min of KZ and Precious. Really high on both. Minutes will be hard to distribute. Outside of Haslem and Vincent everyone expects some. I could see Achiuwa not playing at all at the start of the season and the minutes distributed something like this:

Nunn 18/ Dragic 20/ Herro 10
Robinson 15/ Herro 18 / Bradley 15
Butler 32/ Robinson 10/ Harkless 6
Adebayo 18/ Okpala 12 / Iggy 10/ Harkless 8
Leonard 14/ Adebayo 14 / Olynyk 20
12 man rotation

For the playoffs i want

Dragic 32 / Herro 18
Robinson 16/ Bradley 18 / Herro 14
Butler 36 / Robinson 12
Bam 15 / Iggy 18 / Harkless 15
Insert that center 26 / Bam 22
9 man rotation
(wet dream is that center being Achiuwa)
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1607 » by zgope1 » Sun Nov 22, 2020 8:51 am

We’ve gotten worse but we’re still good.

If KZ or more likely Precious surprise and can lock down the 4 we might be better.

We’ll see though. Bradley is playable late game. Means the best guards on the night get the minutes.

Spo has heaps of options but fundamentally we are still too small to beat the Lakers. But they’re smaller now and no one else was too big for us so let’s just see.

Jimmy and Bam will close every night then a whole lot of handy players can have their shot at it any given night
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1608 » by 3ballbomber » Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:22 am

zgope1 wrote:We’ve gotten worse but we’re still good.

If KZ or more likely Precious surprise and can lock down the 4 we might be better.

We’ll see though. Bradley is playable late game. Means the best guards on the night get the minutes.

Spo has heaps of options but fundamentally we are still too small to beat the Lakers. But they’re smaller now and no one else was too big for us so let’s just see.

Jimmy and Bam will close every night then a whole lot of handy players can have their shot at it any given night

We did not get worse. We got better while not compromising 2021 plans. If by worse you mean losing Crowder & DJJ then you’re overestimating both of them.
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1609 » by zgope1 » Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:28 am

3ballbomber wrote:
zgope1 wrote:We’ve gotten worse but we’re still good.

If KZ or more likely Precious surprise and can lock down the 4 we might be better.

We’ll see though. Bradley is playable late game. Means the best guards on the night get the minutes.

Spo has heaps of options but fundamentally we are still too small to beat the Lakers. But they’re smaller now and no one else was too big for us so let’s just see.

Jimmy and Bam will close every night then a whole lot of handy players can have their shot at it any given night

We did not get worse. We got better while not compromising 2021 plans. If by worse you mean losing Crowder & DJJ then you’re overestimating both of them.

You're probably right actually. I said we got worse because Crowder at the 4 unlocked some of our best basketball. But i'm open to the idea that Herro, D Rob, Bam get better. Avery is a useful addition i'm sure us fans will like. And I'm tipping Precious will surprise us. I actually think he'll play meaningful minutes.


Wouldn't be surprised if we had some trades in us. Nunn, Dragic, Bradley and Herro is a lot of guys for 2 spots on the team. Spo can leverage that depth but you sense Nunn and the KO contract are expendable for an upgrade
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1610 » by 3ballbomber » Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:39 am

RexBoyWonder wrote:
Wiltside wrote:I feel like a deal including Olynyk and Nunn is likely, but hey, could be mistaken.

If not, I don’t think we have much left in us for 2021.

PG - Herro / Dragic / Vincent
SG - Butler / Bradley / Nunn
SF - Robinson / Harkless / Okpala
PF - Adebayo / Achiuwa
C - Leonard / Olynyk / Haslem

Still looks thin at the 5. I’d expect a lot of players to play up a position too (eg Harkless mostly at the 4, Bradley may scarily play some 3).



That's not the Center rotation of a true contender. huge hole right there next to Bam.

Nope it’s not & our true contending season is 2021. So you add the possibility of Giannis w/ this current roster surrounded w/ our snipers, jimmy & Bam - it auto makes us a true contender. That’s taking down everybody! I believe this is the plan.

Imagine an entire season of development of Herro, Bam, Duncan, Precious (if he ends up being useful & not included in a trade). Herro takes a significant leap, Duncan improves defense & Bam developing some range....come 21’, who ever Whale we land, we become that much dangerous.

I’ll roll w/ Internal development if it means significant improvements of our already vry talented young players leading to 21’. Riles then gets his generational team esp. once the Whale is added.

If Precious walks the same development path as Bam, WATCH OUT! but if not it’s a trade chip, no worries.

We also may not be done yet & also have trade deadline in Feb to anticipate movements that further improves the
team like we did last season w/ Iggy & Crowder.

We can only trust the process we’re on. We may even be surprised how well we do. This brotherhood stuff can prove to be powerful...as proven last season. We’ve gone to battle & gained scars - that builds chemistry that’s invaluable (If only Clips had a bit of that last season they may have gone to WCF)
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1611 » by dean456 » Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:58 am

3ballbomber wrote:
zgope1 wrote:We’ve gotten worse but we’re still good.

If KZ or more likely Precious surprise and can lock down the 4 we might be better.

We’ll see though. Bradley is playable late game. Means the best guards on the night get the minutes.

Spo has heaps of options but fundamentally we are still too small to beat the Lakers. But they’re smaller now and no one else was too big for us so let’s just see.

Jimmy and Bam will close every night then a whole lot of handy players can have their shot at it any given night

We did not get worse. We got better while not compromising 2021 plans. If by worse you mean losing Crowder & DJJ then you’re overestimating both of them.


I think the jury is still out on that. A lot is going to depend on the impact of KZ and Precious. Bradley definitely improves our guard depth and defense.

A lot of guys love saying that people are over rating Crowder a lot but I think it was pretty clear that we were a different team when we started him at the PF spot. Our teams success wasn't ever predicated on one or two players success it was always the due to the collective cohesion of our team as a whole.

The difference of having someone that can stretch the floor with a quick trigger 3 ball and shoot it at a high volume without losing anything on the defensive end was huge for guys like Butler, Dragic and Bam. It made them free to do work inside the paint without meeting much resistance.

Crowder attempted 6.4 3PAs per game for us and when you replace that with Olynyk's 3.5 3PA's or Leonards 2.5 3PA's or even Harkless' 2.1 3PA's its just not going to have the same effect on opposing defenses. This is why we targeted a guy like Gallinari so hard over the past year because he was an even higher volume 3 point shooter and releases from a higher release point which means defenses have to respect him even more so than Crowder.

At the end of the day losing Crowder is what it is and if him returning was going to effect our future moves then not bringing him back is the right move. But doesn't mean that his impact on this team wont be sorely missed.
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1612 » by wadenation305 » Sun Nov 22, 2020 10:00 am

Ibaka 2/19? That hurts. That's Myeres type money except I'd way prefer ibaka over that stump
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1613 » by RexBoyWonder » Sun Nov 22, 2020 10:29 am

dean456 wrote:
3ballbomber wrote:
zgope1 wrote:We’ve gotten worse but we’re still good.

If KZ or more likely Precious surprise and can lock down the 4 we might be better.

We’ll see though. Bradley is playable late game. Means the best guards on the night get the minutes.

Spo has heaps of options but fundamentally we are still too small to beat the Lakers. But they’re smaller now and no one else was too big for us so let’s just see.

Jimmy and Bam will close every night then a whole lot of handy players can have their shot at it any given night

We did not get worse. We got better while not compromising 2021 plans. If by worse you mean losing Crowder & DJJ then you’re overestimating both of them.


I think the jury is still out on that. A lot is going to depend on the impact of KZ and Precious. Bradley definitely improves our guard depth and defense.

A lot of guys love saying that people are over rating Crowder a lot but I think it was pretty clear that we were a different team when we started him at the PF spot. Our teams success wasn't ever predicated on one or two players success it was always the due to the collective cohesion of our team as a whole.

The difference of having someone that can stretch the floor with a quick trigger 3 ball and shoot it at a high volume without losing anything on the defensive end was huge for guys like Butler, Dragic and Bam. It made them free to do work inside the paint without meeting much resistance.

Crowder attempted 6.4 3PAs per game for us and when you replace that with Olynyk's 3.5 3PA's or Leonards 2.5 3PA's or even Harkless' 2.1 3PA's its just not going to have the same effect on opposing defenses. This is why we targeted a guy like Gallinari so hard over the past year because he was an even higher volume 3 point shooter and releases from a higher release point which means defenses have to respect him even more so than Crowder.

At the end of the day losing Crowder is what it is and if him returning was going to effect our future moves then not bringing him back is the right move. But doesn't mean that his impact on this team wont be sorely missed.


This +100

People are now quick to dismiss Crowder, but his fit was a big part of what made us click.

We lost him and didn't get a real replacement.

Sorry I'm not seeing Harkless becoming a starting level player at age 27 after being a marginal rotation player his all career.

It's KZ and Precious or bust for us I guess.
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Post#1614 » by 3ballbomber » Sun Nov 22, 2020 10:46 am

Btw nobody’s brought it up....We were regarded as the top destination for FA’s during our remarkable bubble run - then why no bigger names want to sign 1yr deals to be a part of the culture?

Makes me value somebody like Avery a whole lot more, esp coming frm a team that just beat us. He about that Heat culture baby!
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1615 » by 3ballbomber » Sun Nov 22, 2020 10:55 am

RexBoyWonder wrote:
Spoiler:
dean456 wrote:
3ballbomber wrote:We did not get worse. We got better while not compromising 2021 plans. If by worse you mean losing Crowder & DJJ then you’re overestimating both of them.


I think the jury is still out on that. A lot is going to depend on the impact of KZ and Precious. Bradley definitely improves our guard depth and defense.

A lot of guys love saying that people are over rating Crowder a lot but I think it was pretty clear that we were a different team when we started him at the PF spot. Our teams success wasn't ever predicated on one or two players success it was always the due to the collective cohesion of our team as a whole.

The difference of having someone that can stretch the floor with a quick trigger 3 ball and shoot it at a high volume without losing anything on the defensive end was huge for guys like Butler, Dragic and Bam. It made them free to do work inside the paint without meeting much resistance.

Crowder attempted 6.4 3PAs per game for us and when you replace that with Olynyk's 3.5 3PA's or Leonards 2.5 3PA's or even Harkless' 2.1 3PA's its just not going to have the same effect on opposing defenses. This is why we targeted a guy like Gallinari so hard over the past year because he was an even higher volume 3 point shooter and releases from a higher release point which means defenses have to respect him even more so than Crowder.

At the end of the day losing Crowder is what it is and if him returning was going to effect our future moves then not bringing him back is the right move. But doesn't mean that his impact on this team wont be sorely missed.


This +100

People are now quick to dismiss Crowder, but his fit was a big part of what made us click.

We lost him and didn't get a real replacement.

Sorry I'm not seeing Harkless becoming a starting level player at age 27 after being a marginal rotation player his all career.

It's KZ and Precious or bust for us I guess.

He was a big part of our success & that brotherhood & we may miss what he brings to the team. I appreciate him. But w/out seeing this current roster play we can only speculate on wether we’re better or worse. My opinion is i believe we’ll be better. We have a great coach in Spo & staff to make this thing work even more. & if we happen to acquire more pieces wether in the nxt few weeks or in Feb then Crowder may end up just being a memory. Esp. If we see the leap in Herro & the impact of Avery & Precious. Who knows Precious cld be even better than Bam. A lot if things can happen. I’m optimistic & excited & offseason not over yet...
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1616 » by SA37 » Sun Nov 22, 2020 11:08 am

RexBoyWonder wrote:
Beenie wrote:
Read on Twitter


2 years - 19m

Meyers Leonard $$


Anybody still think losing Crowder and adding Harkless + Bradley is a good offseason?


If the plan has been to improve the roster while maintaining enough cap room to sign Giannis, then yes, the offseason has been a success already.

In normal circumstances, Crowder would have been offered 2-3 years, but Miami has its priorities set on Giannis. Understanding Miami was offering 1 year and salaries well under the MLE, getting Harkless and Bradley -- guys who don't expect big minutes and won't complain about it -- is fantastic.

My only issue is several good players were acquired for basically a draft pick (Oubre and Schroeder) or signed for a discount (Ibaka). In theory, Miami could have acquired all 3 for Iguodala or Olynyk and 2-3 picks. (The catch here is, if Giannis doesn't sign with the Heat, Miami could potentially sign Oubre, Schroeder, and Ibaka next summer without having given up any assets to acquire them beforehand.)

Dragic - Schroeder - Nunn
Robinson - Herro
Butler - Oubre
Bam - Ibaka - Haslem - Precious
Olynyk -Ibaka - Leonard

Hoopshype is not completely up-to-date with Miami's roster, but based on the info available, it seems as if Miami could have still had enough space to sign Giannis.

The scary thing is, there aren't any great free agents next summer if Giannis signs his extension or doesn't sign with Miami. Miami will still have a promising roster and can make trades or sign Oubre and/or Schroeder (without having given up assets to get them) to improve the roster.

The offseason isn't over yet.
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1617 » by WHITE_HOT_HEAT » Sun Nov 22, 2020 12:07 pm

We need Gasol...
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1618 » by BIRDMAN BIRDMAN » Sun Nov 22, 2020 12:31 pm

To the guys sweating the Ibaka news, just because he went for that amount, DOESN'T mean he'd automatically take the same had we offered him the same deal, lol. Don't underestimate the Kawhi factor hence he chose LAC. Heck he chose Kawhi over KD

It sucks I know. Again, I still rather 1 more big. I'm not digging that Meyers/KO depth again since I also view Precious as a 4. But there's no other way but by a trade. I have no doubt in my mind that they plan to start Harkless at the 4 by the looks of the current makeup of the roster
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1619 » by Kobewade11 » Sun Nov 22, 2020 1:06 pm

Serge signing with the Clippers is a good thing. Toronto just got weaker. Stop overreacting.
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Post#1620 » by Kobewade11 » Sun Nov 22, 2020 1:20 pm

wadenation305 wrote:Ibaka 2/19? That hurts. That's Myeres type money except I'd way prefer ibaka over that stump

At some point you guys have to stop crying about the Leonard contract. He’s on a 2 year deal with a team option on the 2nd year, we maintain flexibility for next summer, what he is getting paid this year is irrelevant. Ibaka signed a 2 year deal with a player option on the 2nd year, we weren’t giving those contracts out and Ibaka was likely never considering us over playing with KD or Kawhi anyway.

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