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Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC

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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1761 » by batterybro42 » Mon Nov 23, 2020 2:09 am

IggieCC wrote:
insfo wrote:
DrHeat wrote:Most relevant events this off season.

Giannis did not sign the Supermax
Milwaukee only got marginally better
We are still competitive and possibly deeper
None of our competitors got significantly better. (Phila got different players and I believe they will be better but they did not acquire more talent)
Some of our competitors got worse: Boston, Toronto
Brooklyn did not get a third star (yet)


The first event in the list needs a (yet) too, since he has till Dec 21st.

I wonder if Giannis will consider it after he sees the new team in some kind of training camp?

I'd say Jrue Holiday is a massive upgrade over Bledsoe and the Bucks got better, no fancy adjective needed. Bledsoe was so bad and it really helped us.


The issue for the Bucks is that Miami can retain pretty much the entire core roster and add Giannis on top of it. If it’s a basketball decision he will be in a Heat uniform. The Bucks haven’t done anything to realistically move the needle, Giannis isn’t even playing among another true star, just some fringe all star game guys.

Jrue will be 31 by the time the 2021 offseason comes around, and the Bucks have little flexibility to improve the roster moving forward past this offseason. Miami has Butler but they have a roster of young players who can age alongside Giannis into the twilight of his career. The Bucks just didn’t play this right, and their roster moves tell a story of a desperate team that is scared of going back to the basement.
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1762 » by IggieCC » Mon Nov 23, 2020 2:13 am

batterybro42 wrote:
IggieCC wrote:
insfo wrote:
The first event in the list needs a (yet) too, since he has till Dec 21st.

I wonder if Giannis will consider it after he sees the new team in some kind of training camp?

I'd say Jrue Holiday is a massive upgrade over Bledsoe and the Bucks got better, no fancy adjective needed. Bledsoe was so bad and it really helped us.


The issue for the Bucks is that Miami can retain pretty much the entire core roster and add Giannis on top of it. If it’s a basketball decision he will be in a Heat uniform. The Bucks haven’t done anything to realistically move the needle, Giannis isn’t even playing among another true star, just some fringe all star game guys.

Jrue will be 31 by the time the 2021 offseason comes around, and the Bucks have little flexibility to improve the roster moving forward past this offseason. Miami has Butler but they have a roster of young players who can age alongside Giannis into the twilight of his career. The Bucks just didn’t play this right, and their roster moves tell a story of a desperate team that is scared of going back to the basement.

Yes, the moment the Bucks offers Giannis max and he doesn't sign, he's ours basically. :)
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1763 » by batterybro42 » Mon Nov 23, 2020 2:15 am

Big body Andy will walk into that free agency pitch in 2021 and elegantly display just how screwed the Bucks are, and how they are married to the current roster with little to no chance of meaningful improvement

“Show him the math Andy” Riley probably
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1764 » by batterybro42 » Mon Nov 23, 2020 2:20 am

IggieCC wrote:
batterybro42 wrote:
IggieCC wrote:I wonder if Giannis will consider it after he sees the new team in some kind of training camp?

I'd say Jrue Holiday is a massive upgrade over Bledsoe and the Bucks got better, no fancy adjective needed. Bledsoe was so bad and it really helped us.


The issue for the Bucks is that Miami can retain pretty much the entire core roster and add Giannis on top of it. If it’s a basketball decision he will be in a Heat uniform. The Bucks haven’t done anything to realistically move the needle, Giannis isn’t even playing among another true star, just some fringe all star game guys.

Jrue will be 31 by the time the 2021 offseason comes around, and the Bucks have little flexibility to improve the roster moving forward past this offseason. Miami has Butler but they have a roster of young players who can age alongside Giannis into the twilight of his career. The Bucks just didn’t play this right, and their roster moves tell a story of a desperate team that is scared of going back to the basement.

Yes, the moment the Bucks offers Giannis max and he doesn't sign, he's ours basically. :)


The Bucks have just straight up screwed up trades. Basic detail oriented stuff that should never happen. It smells heavily of a group over there in panic mode because they are scrambling to keep him, and also keep their jobs. It’s rushed, it’s frantic, and there is a more likely than not chance it won’t work. The fact he hasn’t signed clearly shows he’s monitoring the situation. When you talk about a 4-5 year contract it isn’t necessarily about the upcoming seasons roster, it’s also about the competency of the front office and the belief they can create a successful environment. Not sure how somebody could look at this circus, and say gee I trust these guys to put me in the best situation for success during the peak of my playing career
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1765 » by DrHeat » Mon Nov 23, 2020 3:24 am

From ESPN

Kevin Pelton
ESPN Senior Writer

With the biggest NBA free agents off the board, which of the league's "Elite Eight" teams have improved their chances of winning the 2021 championship?

The eight teams who advanced in the NBA playoffs have been unusually active trying to upgrade their rosters during this shortened offseason. Some are loading up to try to catch the defending champion Los Angeles Lakers, who have been very busy themselves, while others are trying to deal with the loss of key free agents.

One of the biggest moves involving eight conference semifinalists came Sunday when the Lakers won a battle with the 2019 champion Toronto Raptors to land former All-NBA center Marc Gasol.

Let's take a look at where the NBA's top contenders stand. Who's getting better, and who's getting worse?

MORE: NBA trade grades | Latest NBA free agency buzz

Helped their chances

1. Los Angeles Lakers


The Lakers managed to win the 2020 championship without beating any of the other five teams with a point differential of better than plus-4.0 in the 2019-20 regular season: the Boston Celtics, Dallas Mavericks, LA Clippers, Milwaukee Bucks and Raptors. That doesn't take away from the Lakers' title, as they had to overcome the same adversity in the bubble as the other contenders, but it does suggest merely running back the same squad might not have been enough.

To their credit, the Lakers' front office recognized that and has acted aggressively to reshape both their bench and their starting lineup. Getting Gasol (at the veteran minimum) and wing Wesley Matthews ($3.6 million) at below-market rates allowed the Lakers to deal starter Danny Green to the Oklahoma City Thunder for guard Dennis Schroder and use their non-taxpayer midlevel exception to land reigning Sixth Man Award winner Montrezl Harrell.

Adding Gasol answered a lot of my questions about what the Lakers would do to finish games if Harrell proved incapable defensively in that role.

There's still some work for the Lakers to do, including actually getting a signature from Anthony Davis on a new max-salary contract. Bringing back Markieff Morris using non-Bird rights would also improve their frontcourt depth. Either way, the Lakers have upgraded their bench -- and, if Gasol (36 soon) and Matthews (34) stave off aging, perhaps their starting lineup too.

2. LA Clippers


Losing Harrell doesn't look like such a bad thing for the Clippers, who were able to use their non-taxpayer midlevel exception to add the Raptors' other key center, Serge Ibaka. Though Gasol started, Ibaka played more minutes per game in the postseason and looks like a better complementary piece on a good team at this stage of his career because of his outside shooting.

The Clippers will also hope Luke Kennard is an upgrade on Landry Shamet as a sharpshooter off the bench. However, they haven't been able to add the desired playmaking help thus far, and it's unlikely to come with the minimum contracts they have to fill out the roster. For that, the Clippers will probably need a trade.

3. Milwaukee Bucks


Despite the failed attempt to complete a sign-and-trade for restricted free agent Bogdan Bogdanovic, the Bucks' starting five looks better with the addition of two-time All-Star Jrue Holiday from the New Orleans Pelicans via trade. Compared to Eric Bledsoe's ice-cold 24% 3-point shooting in the last two postseason runs, Holiday's league-average shooting should be a massive upgrade.

I'm less impressed by Milwaukee's bench makeover after the Bucks traded away George Hill as part of the Holiday deal and lost Matthews and Robin Lopez in free agency and Marvin Williams to retirement.

The Bucks haven't unearthed a more versatile defensive option to complement Giannis Antetokounmpo in smallball lineups (no, Bobby Portis doesn't qualify) and bargain wing additions Torrey Craig and Bryn Forbes may not have complete-enough skill sets to finish playoff games. So the strength of Milwaukee's finishing five might depend on the development of third-year guard Donte DiVincenzo, who would have been sent to Sacramento had the Bogdanovic trade happened.

Status quo

4. Miami Heat


After their surprising run to the NBA Finals, the Heat entered this offseason trying to balance the twin goals of building the strongest team possible for 2020-21 and doing so without committing any salary for 2021-22, preserving their chances at max cap space.

The latter requirement did cost Miami starting power forward Jae Crowder (headed to the Phoenix Suns) and reserve Derrick Jones Jr. (Portland Trail Blazers). But the Heat were able to bring back starting point guard Goran Dragic and center Meyers Leonard on two-year deals with team options for 2021-22, and added guard Avery Bradley and forward Maurice Harkless to replace Crowder and Jones.

Come playoff time, Miami might miss Crower's combination of quickness and strength, since Harkless is better suited to defend perimeter players rather than power forwards. But adding Bradley strengthens their backcourt rotation, and I think the net effect is basically a wash.

5. Houston Rockets


The Rockets' offseason moves have been overshadowed by speculation about the future of guards James Harden and Russell Westbrook, who reportedly want to follow head coach Mike D'Antoni and GM Daryl Morey out of Houston.

For now, I think flipping forward Robert Covington into center Christian Wood via a pair of trades keeps Houston on the fringe of contention in the Western Conference. That will surely not be the case if Harden gets his wish for a trade.

Hurt their chances

6. Denver Nuggets


In hindsight, it turns out Nuggets forward Jerami Grant played a little too well during the team's run to the Western Conference finals, where he averaged 34.4 mpg and served as the primary defender on Donovan Mitchell, Kawhi Leonard and LeBron James. That performance attracted the attention of the Detroit Pistons, who agreed to a three-year, $60 million deal with Grant.

Denver regrouped well by luring JaMychal Green away from the Clippers to complement veteran starter Paul Millsap, who came back for one year and $10 million. The Nuggets also have Michael Porter Jr. ready to step into a larger role in his second NBA season, and his development could yet make Denver a more dangerous team.

However, strictly in terms of offseason moves, the Nuggets have lost talent.

7. Toronto Raptors


Like the Heat, Toronto is balancing 2021 flexibility with 2020-21 competitiveness. Unlike the Heat, the Raptors suffered heavy losses with Gasol and Ibaka both heading for Los Angeles.

Toronto could realistically replace only one of the two centers in free agency, using the non-taxpayer midlevel exception to add veteran Aron Baynes. Barring another move, that will leave the Raptors counting on a bigger role for Chris Boucher, who will be back after re-signing as a restricted free agent.

On the plus side, Toronto was able to retain starting guard Fred VanVleet on a reasonable four-year, $85 million deal. As a result, the Raptors should remain competitive in what looks like a much deeper East in terms of contenders.

8. Boston Celtics


No contender suffered a single bigger loss in free agency than the Celtics, who saw Gordon Hayward decline a $34.2 million player option and then agree to a four-year, $120 million deal with the Charlotte Hornets. Because the market for perimeter players wasn't nearly as deep as the one for centers, Boston wasn't able to replace Hayward with an equivalent player. Instead, the Celtics added another center option with the non-taxpayer midlevel exception in Tristan Thompson.

Given the rapid development of young forwards Jaylen Brown and Jayson Tatum, Hayward's departure hardly dooms Boston. Still, the Celtics no longer look nearly as formidable as they did beating Toronto to reach last year's conference finals.
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1766 » by insfo » Mon Nov 23, 2020 3:47 am

We've apparently signed Ole Miss guard Breein Tyree. I'm assuming this is our second 2-way contract

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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1767 » by Bishop45 » Mon Nov 23, 2020 4:02 am

Losing Hayward hurts, but I feel like Teague and TT can be great additions to C's depth. Need some mo wings doe
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1768 » by Kobewade11 » Mon Nov 23, 2020 4:14 am

insfo wrote:We've apparently signed Ole Miss guard Breein Tyree. I'm assuming this is our second 2-way contract

Read on Twitter

Mans doesnt look half bad
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1769 » by Heatfan73 » Mon Nov 23, 2020 4:24 am

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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1770 » by Vertical Limit » Mon Nov 23, 2020 4:46 am

You guys already know Bam’s people are in his ear asking about that rookie max extension Donovan and Tatum got. They dont give a **** about Rileys 2021 plan nor should Bam care about it, taking care of your own is important.

We will see how Riley handles that.
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1771 » by Kobewade11 » Mon Nov 23, 2020 4:53 am

Vertical Limit wrote:You guys already know Bam’s people are in his ear asking about that rookie max extension Donovan and Tatum got. They dont give a **** about Rileys 2021 plan nor should Bam care about it, taking care of your own is important.

We will see how Riley handles that.

What people? :lol: He lives one floor up from his mom and he and Giannis share an agent. It’s no coincidence that both are quiet.
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1772 » by carnageta » Mon Nov 23, 2020 4:59 am

Vertical Limit wrote:You guys already know Bam’s people are in his ear asking about that rookie max extension Donovan and Tatum got. They dont give a **** about Rileys 2021 plan nor should Bam care about it, taking care of your own is important.

We will see how Riley handles that.


I’m just afraid people are going to rip on Bam if he wants to get paid right away. I just hope it wouldn’t make him less of a “Heat lifer”.

It is risky territory, especially for someone like him who has yet to earn a big pay day. What if he gets traded for a whale at the deadline and then proceeds to get a career altering injury before season’s end? (E.g torn ACL/achilles). Would he then receive a max in free agency..? Hard to say.

Chances are low but things like this need to be taken into consideration. We’ve seen it happen before (IT) and it will probably happen again.

I hope they have at least talked to him about it and made him a verbal offer.
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1773 » by HeatFanLifer » Mon Nov 23, 2020 5:05 am

IggieCC wrote:
HeatFanLifer wrote:
IggieCC wrote:I thought you are a big fan of this kind of player :-?

Spoiler:
Image
:-? :-? :-?


No. His ankle is done. He’s another Mion.

Bu but you liked Luke Babbitt :-?

Spoiler:
Image
:-? :-? :-?


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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1774 » by Kobewade11 » Mon Nov 23, 2020 5:09 am

carnageta wrote:I’m just afraid people are going to rip on Bam if he wants to get paid right away. I just hope it wouldn’t make him less of a “Heat lifer”.

It is risky territory, especially for someone like him who has yet to earn a big pay day. What if he gets traded for a whale at the deadline and then proceeds to get a career altering injury before season’s end? (E.g torn ACL/achilles). Would he then receive a max in free agency..? Hard to say.

Chances are low but things like this need to be taken into consideration. We’ve seen it happen before (IT) and it will probably happen again.

I hope they have at least talked to him about it and made him a verbal offer.

Bam’s definitely not going anywhere. If it was me I’d get the extension out of the way but I understand why they’d wait and there’s no doubt the organization and Bam’s agent are in cahoots. If he’s pressing to sign it now they’ll get it done, if he’s willing to wait to potentially team with Giannis then he’ll wait, but its his decision.
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1775 » by Mk613 » Mon Nov 23, 2020 8:00 am

carnageta wrote:Image

Damn, does this mean Harden and Griffin to Miami?!

Harden
Robinson
Butler
Blake
Meyers



This would be terrible..
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1776 » by SA37 » Mon Nov 23, 2020 9:35 am

RiverboatRiles wrote:
insfo wrote:We've apparently signed Ole Miss guard Breein Tyree. I'm assuming this is our second 2-way contract

Read on Twitter

Mans doesnt look half bad

I am watching these highlight wondering how this guy didn't go #1 overall :lol:

Looks like he has a skillset similar to Nunn's.
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1777 » by HIF » Mon Nov 23, 2020 10:07 am

wadenation305 wrote:Ibaka 2/19? That hurts. That's Myeres type money except I'd way prefer ibaka over that stump


Hasn't Ibaka got an option on the second year whereas with Myers we have the option?

That is an almighty difference.
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1778 » by HIF » Mon Nov 23, 2020 10:09 am

RexBoyWonder wrote:
dean456 wrote:
3ballbomber wrote:We did not get worse. We got better while not compromising 2021 plans. If by worse you mean losing Crowder & DJJ then you’re overestimating both of them.


I think the jury is still out on that. A lot is going to depend on the impact of KZ and Precious. Bradley definitely improves our guard depth and defense.

A lot of guys love saying that people are over rating Crowder a lot but I think it was pretty clear that we were a different team when we started him at the PF spot. Our teams success wasn't ever predicated on one or two players success it was always the due to the collective cohesion of our team as a whole.

The difference of having someone that can stretch the floor with a quick trigger 3 ball and shoot it at a high volume without losing anything on the defensive end was huge for guys like Butler, Dragic and Bam. It made them free to do work inside the paint without meeting much resistance.

Crowder attempted 6.4 3PAs per game for us and when you replace that with Olynyk's 3.5 3PA's or Leonards 2.5 3PA's or even Harkless' 2.1 3PA's its just not going to have the same effect on opposing defenses. This is why we targeted a guy like Gallinari so hard over the past year because he was an even higher volume 3 point shooter and releases from a higher release point which means defenses have to respect him even more so than Crowder.

At the end of the day losing Crowder is what it is and if him returning was going to effect our future moves then not bringing him back is the right move. But doesn't mean that his impact on this team wont be sorely missed.


This +100

People are now quick to dismiss Crowder, but his fit was a big part of what made us click.

We lost him and didn't get a real replacement.

Sorry I'm not seeing Harkless becoming a starting level player at age 27 after being a marginal rotation player his all career.

It's KZ and Precious or bust for us I guess.


He was but the year before he wasn't even here. Maybe it's the system that is making the men, not the men making the system. He can and will be replaced. 2 years ago would you have been lining up to sign Jae?
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1779 » by HIF » Mon Nov 23, 2020 10:10 am

WHITE_HOT_HEAT wrote:We need Gasol...


No we don't.

Gasol of 6 years ago perhaps but now he's too slow for the team system.
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Re: Official Miami Heat Off-Season GT - Saving you from IggieCC 

Post#1780 » by SA37 » Mon Nov 23, 2020 10:14 am

Vertical Limit wrote:You guys already know Bam’s people are in his ear asking about that rookie max extension Donovan and Tatum got. They dont give a **** about Rileys 2021 plan nor should Bam care about it, taking care of your own is important.

We will see how Riley handles that.


RIley has a history of taking care of his guys. The first person who will testify to that is Haslem, who took significantly less money in '10 to stay with Miami.


Haslem signed a five-year deal Monday worth around $20 million, roughly $14 million less than he could have received if he accepted more lucrative offers from the Dallas Mavericks and Denver Nuggets.


https://www.denverpost.com/2010/07/12/haslem-staying-put-agrees-to-deal-with-heat/

To put that deal in prespective, he earned half as much in 2010-2011 ($3.5M) as he did in 2009-2010 ($7M)

Since that contract ended, Miami has paid Haslem ~$16M for 143 games (7 seasons, including the coming one) -- essentially to be a practice player.

Miami gave Shaq $100M when nobody else would. Miami just gave Iguodala a massive extension upon arriving. Myers Leonard got paid. Goran Dragic got paid. They offered Crowder good money (same with Wade when he left for Chicago).

The list of former Riley/Heat players who have stayed on as coaches (Bob McAdoo -- from Riley's time in LA -- Anthony Carter, Caron Butler, Juwan Howard, Chris Quinn, Malik Allen, Ed Pinckney and others...)and who have come through the coaching ranks and become head coaches in the NBA or college is long (Alvin Gentry, Fizdale, Juwan Howard, Spoelstra, SVG...) is significant. Zo is in the front office.

Barring some catastrophic, career-ending injury, Bam will get his money.

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